View Full Version : EDUCATION
JOEBIALEK
10-31-2003, 04:31 PM
As students return to schools all across the country, perhaps a discussion about education would be appropriate. From a capitalist point of view, some would argue that the purpose of public education is to provide training to enter the work force. The basics of reading, writing and arithmetic are taught to provide a foundation of which to build on once a person graduates to on-the-job training. However, the democratic argument suggests that the purpose is to promote an informed citizenry. Therefore, an exposure to history, sociology etc benefits society as a whole because people learn about their roles and responsibilities. Obviously, both arguments merit equal consideration and should continue to be pursued. Further, no one can dispute that each and every child in this country should receive the educational services provided by the public. The most pressing question today, however, is how does government ensure the quality of educational services?
The public school system today continues to fail at educating our children both in terms of job training and citizen awareness. The most powerful country to ever exist on planet earth continues to lag behind other countries when it comes the very basics expected of this institution. The reason for this is because of the bureaucratic non-incentives consistent with government waste. Teachers are not held accountable as a unit manager would be held accountable for their unit achieving objectives in a private corporation. They are also not rewarded financially for the success of their students when it comes to test results. And the biggest benefactor of all, private enterprise is not required to reinvest in an educational system that provides free training to future employees. The time for privatization of public education is long overdue. We as a country need to finally get serious about training and educating our future citizens. It is time to use corporate property tax along with personal property tax as a means of funding schools. Educational facilities from pre-schools to colleges and universities need to be converted to entities of private enterprise whereby an education is crafted as the finest product available to United States citizens. Along with this transition would be the disciplinary environment so desperately needed in our schools today. If a co-worker or boss were struck by an employee, they would be fired and possibly jailed. The same code needs to exist in schools today. Furthermore, a greater effort needs to be made in determining where one fits in the skills and abilities matrix. Spending more time and attention to the criss-cross of what one enjoys doing with what one is good at doing would make a profound difference on our society. Education is a public good no less or important than national defense, environmental quality etc but it is the means of providing that good that most importantly needs to change.
ChrisTheCop
10-31-2003, 04:35 PM
Wait a minute...1st posts arent ever supposed to be this intelligent. Youre supposed to pick a fight with someone, or say how much you like some other radio show better...or something. Cmon man, you can do better than this.
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Susiehl02
10-31-2003, 04:40 PM
NO one cares what the topic is when the reading is that extensive. Whatever it is.. Either You are wrong or the thing you are trying to change is FINE.
reeshy
10-31-2003, 04:40 PM
Yea, what he said....you're to talk about how much better you are than us or how much you batch or the girl your gonna steal from your best friend...What the hell kind of board do you think this is?? No body thinks here!!!!
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ChrisTheCop
10-31-2003, 04:52 PM
See? SusieH has got it down just fine. (thanx reeshy)
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DarkHippie
10-31-2003, 05:09 PM
This is a good topic, and one that I am looking forward to debating. Unfortunately, i'm running a nasty-ass fever right now, so you'll have to wait for my argument as to why I disagree.
I want to see bated breath people!!
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TheMojoPin
10-31-2003, 06:31 PM
I like Joe.
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TooCute
11-03-2003, 09:22 AM
Okay.
I just googled that post and <a href="http://www.google.com/search?q=As+students+return+to+schools+all+across+ the+country,+perhaps+a+discussion+about+education+ would+be+appropriate.+From+a+capitalist+point+of+v iew,+some+would+argue+that+the+purpose+of+public+e ducation+is+to+provide+training+to+enter+the+work+ force.+The+basics+of+reading,+writing+and+arithmet ic+are+taught+to+provide+a+foundation+of+which+to+ build+on+once+a+person+graduates+to+on-the-job+training.+However,+the+democratic+argument+sug gests+that+the+purpose+is+to+promote+an+informed+c itizenry.+Therefore,+an+exposure+to+history,+socio logy+etc+benefits+society+as+a+whole+because+peopl e+learn+about+their+roles+and+responsibilities.+Ob viously,+both+arguments+merit+equal+consideration+ and+should+continue+to+be+pursued.+Further,+no+one +can+dispute+that+each+and+every+child+in+this+cou ntry+should+receive+the+educational+services+provi ded+by+the+public.+The+most+pressing+question+toda y,&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8">here</a> are the results that I came up with. Holy shit dude, how many places did you make that post?!
I think something is a little screwy...
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zoom2457
11-03-2003, 09:31 AM
Me like Ron and Fez.
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JustJon
11-03-2003, 09:37 AM
But your entire claim is spurrious due to "As students return to schools all across the country," as all students have returned 2-3 months ago, depending on geography and educational level.
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Bill From Yorktown
11-03-2003, 09:40 AM
NO one cares what the topic is when the reading is that extensive. Whatever it is.. Either You are wrong or the thing you are trying to change is FINE.
have to agree. yes the topic is important, but if it's over 8 lines long, I'm not going to wade through it.
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mdr55
11-03-2003, 06:04 PM
Wow!! Good job of cutting and pasting.
I always thought of school as an expensive form of child care. And college was an option of postponig entering the work force until a postion opened up due to attrition. But what do I know.
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JohnnyCash
11-03-2003, 06:50 PM
Okay.
I just googled that post and <a href="http://www.google.com/search?q=As+students+return+to+schools+all+across+ the+country,+perhaps+a+discussion+about+education+ would+be+appropriate.+From+a+capitalist+point+of+v iew,+some+would+argue+that+the+purpose+of+public+e ducation+is+to+provide+training+to+enter+the+work+ force.+The+basics+of+reading,+writing+and+arithmet ic+are+taught+to+provide+a+foundation+of+which+to+ build+on+once+a+person+graduates+to+on-the-job+training.+However,+the+democratic+argument+sug gests+that+the+purpose+is+to+promote+an+informed+c itizenry.+Therefore,+an+exposure+to+history,+socio logy+etc+benefits+society+as+a+whole+because+peopl e+learn+about+their+roles+and+responsibilities.+Ob viously,+both+arguments+merit+equal+consideration+ and+should+continue+to+be+pursued.+Further,+no+one +can+dispute+that+each+and+every+child+in+this+cou ntry+should+receive+the+educational+services+provi ded+by+the+public.+The+most+pressing+question+toda y,&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8">here</a> are the results that I came up with. Holy shit dude, how many places did you make that post?!
I think something is a little screwy...
This one post is like when a band writes their one great song. He wrote a good post and took it on the road. He may be a one hit wonder poster.
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canofsoup15
11-03-2003, 07:16 PM
The way the government see's education is in the way that you go in, learn the basics, keep everyone at the same intelligence level oin the same subjects, and then get the hell out. It fails to keep kids informed of topics going on in the present world and focuses on its one cirriculum, offering little offset of the main cirriculum. While this sounds good in theory it doesnt translate well into the real world when kids have no idea what to expect, this is caused by schools offering little information on present times, sure kids can know who the leader of mesopotamia in 1953, but they have no idea how our government works. I don't know what it is with kids these days but they don't know alot, alot of them are airheads. I know this because I am still in school myself. Now I'm nowhere even close to a genious, but these kids dont even know american history, or anything about the government nowadays. They don't pay attention to it, they have no idea of their surroundings except for the false world MTV gives them. When you go to a High School and ask kids there when Pearl Harbor was and who the president was at the time, an adult would assume that these kids would know it because of its importance, that's not that case. I don't know what the hell it is, but I hope it stops, by which i mean the stupidity and ignorance of the kids nowadays. I hope that they stop worrying about their so called "egos" and more about their future, but im dubious that they will.
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mikeyboy
11-03-2003, 07:30 PM
This one post is like when a band writes their one great song. He wrote a good post and took it on the road. He may be a one hit wonder poster.
If he plays "As students return to schools all across the country...", I'm putting up my lighter.
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monsterone
11-03-2003, 07:31 PM
This one post is like when a band writes their one great song. He wrote a good post and took it on the road. He may be a one hit wonder poster.
if you're going to compare this post to a one hit wonder, the song you're referring to could be i'm too sexy. sure it shook things up for a minute but then everyone realized what exactly it is - crap.
state run anything stinks on ice. it's just the way it is, and the only reason things aren't run better, is b/c no one has stepped up to make it better. so come on brainiac, stop posting on 50 different message boards and do something.
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SatCam
11-04-2003, 09:47 AM
I was about to debate, and then TooCute posted that link. Douche
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high fly
11-05-2003, 03:36 PM
Interesting first post, but built on a false premise:
From a capitalist point of veiw, the purpose of education is to provide training to enter the work force
You have noted the disconnect between academic performance and the way we kick ass economically.
The reason why is there is no link.
Not many jobs require graduates to diagram a sentence or do a still life in pastels.
Education and job training are two different things.
Education provides exposure to events, writings, and currents in history and literature to provide the student a better understanding of his place in society and the world at large.
Grammar of course helps the student to better express himself ( an increasingly important skill in an age relying more and more on communication).
Math and science give important computation skills as well as a basic understanding of the natural world and it's processes.
All of these things help the student also to think logically, to be better organized, and to see the process of 'work-reward-work-reward...
They help the individual develope as a person, not as a laborer.
This is what your basic liberal arts education provides.
You'll notice that in most schools, shop class, Distributive Education, Home Ec., etc, are elective classes.
Oh, and by the way, this is not something just done in capitalist countries.
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This message was edited by high fly on 11-5-03 @ 7:37 PM
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