View Full Version : When will you accept that the Giants stink?
blakjeezis
11-13-2003, 10:18 AM
I've said this since the beginning of the season. Of course it's not on record anywhere but my brother's ears so take it for what you will. The Giants are the most overrated team I've ever seen. I said that they would lose a couple of games and the wheels would come off. Listening to the radio, everyone from the hosts to the callers have a thousand and one reasons why they're losing except the fact that they're not that good. I don't know why no one will admit it. Let's break it down.
"The Good":
1. Kerry Collins - People talk about him like he's Joe Montana. When he can stand still and isn't under pressure he can make a good pass. Yeah, well done. So can I. As soon as he has to move, or even thinks a pass rush is coming, he's terrible.
2. Tiki Barber - At best, he's a 1,000 yard rusher, that's pretty damn good. But he has hands like wet soap. I actually heard, I think it was Richard Neer, saying the reason he fumbles so much is because unlike other running backs, he keeps pushing for more yardage after he's tackled instead of falling down. What the fuck!?!? What kinda bullshit is that? Tell Priest Holmes or Ricky Williams that they fall down in the face of an opponent and watch what happens. Don't make excuses, he's a good runner, but he can't hold onto the ball.
3. Jeremy Shockey - He's got talent, there is absolutely no doubt about that. He can't be covered by most linebackers, so he can punch holes in the defense. But people talk about him like he's the second coming. He makes some great catches, but he also has some terrible drops. He can't block for shit, and his attitude and antics are a detriment not only to himself but the team as a whole. At best, he's inconsistent. It also looks like he might be a bit injury prone.
4. Michael Strahan - The epitome of overrated. Paid too well, performs too poorly. He got the sack record in dubious fashion and has yet to show me anything special since. As the supposed defensive leader, he pretty much brings nothing to the table. He's selfish, and brings up the level of no one else on the field. Is it possible for him to, one time, lead a great defensive stand when there's money on the line? Do that and maybe I'll reconsider.
"The Bad":
Offensive Line - They are as useful as the Maginot Line, and about as mobile. Kerry Collins needs protection to function at any level even remotely resembling a professional QB. My four elderly aunts, one of whom is dead, could pass block better than them.
Defensive Secondary - I chalk these guys' troubles up to skill level and inexperience. They're just not very good, that's all. But it's accepted that they're not, so I can't bitch too much. No one makes excuses for them.
That's the whole point, it seems people are going out of their way to not say the Giants aren't good. I don't know where this idea that they are some kind of offensive juggernaut came from. Sure they get yardage out the ass, but if you can't convert that into scores, what's the point? They are a mediocre team, held up to be better, much better, than they actually are and they've crumbleed under the pressure. Isn't it time we just called a spade a spade. The Giants stink! End of story.
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shamus mcfitzy
11-13-2003, 10:29 AM
The Giants don't stink. For the last few years the Giants and Jets (and MY RAVENS are getting close to it) have seemed to get stuck in permanent mediocrety. Unless either team has a big signing (the Jets with TO?) they won't be able to win a Super Bowl. The NFL today is a league where there are usually 4 really great teams, 4 really bad teams, and 24 mediocre teams. The Giants may still make the playoffs because nothing is ever definite in the NFL. I think the only major obstacle to them may be the Eagles because the Packers, Bucs, and Redskins are in the same exact position as them or worse.
This message was edited by shamus mcfitzy on 11-13-03 @ 2:32 PM
zoom2457
11-13-2003, 10:37 AM
Hmmmm. Here we go again...
The reason people are so hesitant to say that the Giants stink is because they have a lot of talent on that team. Talent that hasn't performed since opening day against the Rams.
Kerry Collins has been sitting in the pocket in the face of tacklers more this year than last year. But that's not saying much. The kid does have an arm, but he still makes some bad decisions.
Overall, as much as I hate to admit it, you're right. Yes, I said it, YOU BLAKJEEZIS ARE RIGHT!!!!
:p
Save this post, I might not ever agree again.
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I question your title of "good" to anything related to the Giants. If I was the Giants I would trade Barber for a box of feminine napkins.
Shockey is great if the game's not on the line or if it is the preseason. Every other time he sucks.
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shamus mcfitzy
11-13-2003, 11:00 AM
Tiki Barber is definitely the biggest problem. As much as any Giant fan may like to pretend every year that him fumbling is a new thing, it's not. He's been a consistent fumbler for at least the last 4 years now. The extra yardage that the Giants get by putting him in instead of even Dayne does not outweigh the fact that you can't depend on Tiki to not lose the ball. Luckily the Giants have Kerry Collins who just so happens to be a very good quarterback. Sure he's absolutely not Michael Vick in mobility, but I don't think that a QB has to run around the field in order to be good. Obviously the Giants have had misfortunes on the O-Line, but ultimately the line isn't doing so bad a job considering. The Giants can probably beat at least 20 teams on any given day though.
Justice4all
11-13-2003, 11:25 AM
I've said this since the beginning of the season. Of course it's not on record anywhere but my brother's ears so take it for what you will. The Giants are the most overrated team I've ever seen. I would not say the most overrated team but yes....as a fan and a season ticket holder I am inclined to agree. How they are still favored in games after that Atalanta game is beyond me. Kerry Collins - People talk about him like he's Joe Montana. When he can stand still and isn't under pressure he can make a good pass. Yeah, well done. So can I. As soon as he has to move, or even thinks a pass rush is coming, he's terrible. Well he has shown inconsistancy in his trows that is for DAMN sure! We keep seeing flashes of brilliance in between the interceptions. he is ALWAYS throwing in multiple coverage. Or making mistakes that a seasoned vet should not. (remember the sidline pass in Arizona that got run back for a touchdown at the end if the 1st half??)
Tiki Barber - At best, he's a 1,000 yard rusher, that's pretty damn good. But he has hands like wet soap. I actually heard, I think it was Richard Neer, saying the reason he fumbles so much is because unlike other running backs, he keeps pushing for more yardage after he's tackled instead of falling down. What the fuck!?!? What kinda bullshit is that? Tell Priest Holmes or Ricky Williams that they fall down in the face of an opponent and watch what happens. Don't make excuses, he's a good runner, but he can't hold onto the ball.
Yes...he hs a very bad case of fumble-itis. One of the best games of his career and he fumbled the ball 4 times! (against Philly last year...last game of the season) I say Dorsey levens should step up now and take over. besides...I am SICK AND FUCKING TIRED of seeing Tiki on a 3rd and 4/5 and he runs for like 2 yards.
Jeremy Shockey - He's got talent, there is absolutely no doubt about that. He can't be covered by most linebackers, so he can punch holes in the defense. But people talk about him like he's the second coming. He makes some great catches, but he also has some terrible drops. He can't block for shit, and his attitude and antics are a detriment not only to himself but the team as a whole. At best, he's inconsistent. It also looks like he might be a bit injury prone.
I have to stop you there...he has the same attitude that Dion Sanders and *gulp* Mike irvin brought to the cowboys and I HATE to say it but it did boost morale in some ways...made them feel invincble. And I do not think he is injury prone. This guy took some AWSOME shots and still held onto the ball and got right back up and into the next play. Yes he made some drops but overall I would rather have him as my tight end then 95% of the others from the NFL. If he was so injury prone he would have been out last season in November.
Michael Strahan - The epitome of overrated. Paid too well, performs too poorly. He got the sack record in dubious fashion and has yet to show me anything special since. As the supposed defensive leader, he pretty much brings nothing to the table. He's selfish, and brings up the level of no one else on the field. Is it possible for him to, one time, lead a great defensive stand when there's money on the line? Do that and maybe I'll reconsider
Sorry BJ...Strahan (and the defense) is the ONLY reason we are not 2-7 or 3-6. Strahan has been trying like hell to do ANYTHING to boost the team.
He still makes big plays when they are needed...the problem is the offense gets SHIT done...so even if the defense lets up say...17 or more points (which is awsome to have a 17 ppg. against you) we STILL lose! I cannot blame strahan...I say he is the keeper of the team if most had to go.
Offensive Line - They are as useful as the Maginot Line, and about as mobile. Kerry Collins needs protection to function at any level even remotely resembling a professional QB. My four elderly aunts, one of whom is dead, could pass block better than them.
That was FUCKING FUNNY....yet
keithy_19
11-13-2003, 11:25 AM
The giants could be good, but its a big coup to get fassel fired. And besides, I still got my BENGALS! Can you say superbowl?!
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JohnnyCash
11-13-2003, 11:29 AM
I wouldnt say they totally stink. They could be alot better. But Im a Jets fan and they stink on ice.
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Heavy
11-13-2003, 11:51 AM
Collins is a ok QB. Tiki Barbera, ok plus many fumbles. Hilliard and Tommer blow. Shockeys the most overrated player in sports. They suck. Yea and Fassel blows too.
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Patches
11-13-2003, 11:57 AM
The Giants probably are overrated, but they certainly have more talent than their record and the last game indicates. They'll probably pull their usual 6-1 and save Fassel's job, only to pull the same shit next season.
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shamus mcfitzy
11-13-2003, 11:59 AM
maybe the Giants should trade coaches with the Dolphins. Fassel's ability to have his team win in December might help the Dolphins and maybe Wannstedt will be able to do something with the Giants. Either both teams will suceed or they'll both go like 5-11.
Justice4all
11-13-2003, 12:41 PM
Hilliard and Tommer blow.
oh you mean TOOMER....sorry!
And uh...they are one hell of a one-two punch as far as a receiving core goes. Both are outstanding...and when one does'nt get you..the other does!
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shamus mcfitzy
11-13-2003, 12:52 PM
The WR's might be the most under-rated in the league. Fuck, I'm a Ravens fan, don't you tell me about wide recievers sucking. Give me Toomer and I'd be happy.
blakjeezis
11-13-2003, 05:39 PM
he has the same attitude that Dion Sanders and *gulp* Mike irvin brought to the cowboys and I HATE to say it but it did boost morale in some ways...made them feel invincble
The Cowboys would have been invincible with or without the shit talking. Sanders and Irvin had Troy Aikman, Emmitt Smith, Jay Novacek, Charles Haley, Ken Norton Jr., Leon Lett, Russell Maryland, Moose Johnston, etc . . . backing them up, and Jimmy Johnson coaching them( Not to mention the O Line whose names escape me right now). From that list alone there's at least 4 Hall of Famers. The Giants aren't good enough to backup Shockey's antics, and to be honest neither is he (not yet anyway, that I will concede). All he does is get the other team riled up and ready to stomp a mudhole in their collective, Big Blue asses. The fact that in the past few weeks he has toned it down a bit is evidence that even the Giants don't like his silly shit.
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This message was edited by blakjeezis on 11-13-03 @ 9:46 PM
Snoogans
11-13-2003, 05:55 PM
im a giants fan, and they suck, no doubt. first thing, they will beat philly this weekend, thats the giants way, its fucked up
just to point out a few things and take them for what you will:
People talk about him like he's Joe Montana. When he can stand still and isn't under pressure he can make a good pass
yes, he does have some troubles throwing under pressure. but he has made plays on the run at times. no QB gets enough protection to throw for over 4000 yards without making some plays himself
At best, he's a 1,000 yard rusher, that's pretty damn good. But he has hands like wet soap. I actually heard, I think it was Richard Neer, saying the reason he fumbles so much is because unlike other running backs, he keeps pushing for more yardage after he's tackled instead of falling down
that was funny. hes over a thousand yards rushing every year and remember he also catches about 600 yards of passes. on the other point, what neer meant was when holmes and williams and that get wrapped up, they cover the ball and drive the people foward. when tiki gets wrapped up, he tries to stretch the ball as he is goin down instead of protecting it cause he cant just push the guy foward like other backs. thats what it meant to be clear, he still shoulda learned long ago the fuckin idiot
people talk about him like he's the second coming. He makes some great catches, but he also has some terrible drops. He can't block for shit, and his attitude and antics are a detriment not only to himself but the team as a whole
thats about dead on except for the attitude. it seems detrimental, but everyone on the team loves his fire, and they dont really care what he says. there are far bigger problems with this team than shockey, cause they know he is all business when the wistle blows
Michael Strahan - The epitome of overrated. Paid too well, performs too poorly. He got the sack record in dubious fashion and has yet to show me anything special since.
did you play football? over payed, well yea, thats what records do. but he has a sack in like 6 straight, he has 10 on the year, and just the extra pressure he takes up allows holmes to get pressure on the QB and has allowed Griffin to become a pretty solid DT. remember that he is tripled teamed most plays, and that means other guys should have space to make plays. strahan is overpayed, but he does a hell of alot of damage
Defensive Secondary - I chalk these guys' troubles up to skill level and inexperience. They're just not very good, that's all. But it's accepted that they're not, so I can't bitch too much. No one makes excuses for them.
how bout attributing that to the fact that only 2 starters are active in the secondary. peterson is gone and has been for most of the year, now brown is hurt. we have allen who has been playing better than people see because of guys like frank walker and serwanga gettin lit up. the only guy in the secondary who has dissapointed me from what i thought they should be is stoutmire. he had a good year last year and he is awful now. plus losing sehorn gives them a free pass
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Justice4all
11-17-2003, 05:12 AM
Ok boys and girls....I watched the first five minutes of the Giants game....when it was First and 25 they RAN THE FUCKING BALL!!!!!!! That is when I turned off the TV and decided to play video games instead!
This team truely sucks!
Nothing will change....nothing. Until that waste of space they call a head coach gets his ass canned!
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