The Sopranos - Season Five

[TheMojoPin]

I didn't want the FBI thing wrapped up quickly but it was really gaining some steam and things have just seemed to have come to a halt. I know there is the element of surprise but there is only what, 11 Episodes? How many left, 4?

http://pleaseforgetme.com/SIGS/wafflesigy.gif

And?

There's still one more season.

Nothing should be considered "dropped" until the last minute of the last episode.

But there will always be people latching onto things...there are people who don't get the storyline with Melfi getting raped is done. Now there are people who think there was something "dropped" when Tony got the skin tag-thing chopped off his head. People cry about, "what's gonna happen to Furio?" You even have people demanding to know what happened to the lesbian tennis instructor from God-knows how long ago!

Melfi chose not to use Tony for revenge against the rapist...done. Tony got the cancer lopped off...done. Furio realized he wanted to save his ass and took off back home for Italy...DONE. Adrianna and the tennis lesbian didn't lick the clam...DONE.

Why is this so hard?!?

And I'm not venting this stuff right at you, Waffle...just in general.

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2% << December boys got it BAD >> "You can tell some lies about the good times we've had, but I've kissed your mother twice...and now I'm working on your dad..."

This message was edited by TheMojoPin on 5-3-04 @ 2:04 PM

[Furtherman]

I'm sick of hearing from those people too Mojo.

I think they are perfectionists. Everything has to be done right - from their point of view - when they don't realize they will never have any say and their complaints will always go unheard.

They can't accept it for what it is.



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...with thanks to JustJon

[FMJeff]

cmon furtherman...could it be people were just invested in those storylines and wanted to see them resolved out of curiosity?

sopranos IS one of the few shows that throws storylines up in the air that are really engaging and completely abandons them...

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<br>
It made my heart sing.

[Furtherman]

I don't see it as storylines being left unresolved - I just see it as a more realistic portrayl of life. How many of us have "unresolved" story lines? We all do. There is always a potential for something new, big, life-changing or tragic to happen to us. Sometimes things happen, sometime things don't.

What it comes down is that, for example, the Russian that escaped in the woods... I don't care what happened to him. Maybe he is gone for good, but I can appreciate that story coming to a close right there.

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...with thanks to JustJon

[Iamnotatool]

Fat guy "Your strong, thats good. That helps."

Finn "Gulp"



Fat gay guy = gross.


Meet me under the bat!

<img src=http://thereisnogod.faithweb.com/images/iamnotatool.gif>
Please don't hold my huge nutbag against me, or I'll hold it against you that you have flapjack tits

[Furtherman]

Vito really is a parade float. At least one parade I can think of.

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...with thanks to JustJon

[schmega]

geez, the writing on the show this season's been phenomenal. i cant believe how much smarter meadow sounds now that she's had ample time away from jersey. and tony with his slurs on some made-up perps, hysterical.

http://gilseed.home.acedsl.com/sig.jpg

[FMJeff]

I don't see it as storylines being left unresolved - I just see it as a more realistic portrayl of life. How many of us have "unresolved" story lines? We all do. There is always a potential for something new, big, life-changing or tragic to happen to us. Sometimes things happen, sometime things don't.


But it isn't real life. it's a dramatic narrative...and like any dramatic narratives, when you start off on a tangent and leave the tangent unresolved the audience will wonder why....

its like telling a story about your dog and you go "i was walking the dog and i saw this chick giving this guy a blowjob, anyway the dog kept skipping and it was so silly...we went to the store, etc."

of course people are going to ask about the chick and the bj...its just human nature...



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<br>
It made my heart sing.

[Furtherman]

I see your point. But from my point, I just don't see why people get worked up about it. I'm just more lenient that way. I've gotten tired of people I know saying they hated an episode because "nothing happened". I want to throw them on a short bus and send them away.


cant believe how much smarter meadow sounds now that she's had ample time away from jersey.


I loved that little fact she spouted out about la cosa nostra and how they've helped people all the way back to the old country. She's proud of her dad.

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...with thanks to JustJon

[TheMojoPin]

its like telling a story about your dog and you go "i was walking the dog and i saw this chick giving this guy a blowjob, anyway the dog kept skipping and it was so silly...we went to the store, etc."

It's more like, "I was walking the dog, I came across a chick blowing a guy, but I had to keep going, so I finished walking the dog." You saw the blowing, but you don't more than that. It happened, you kept moving, it's over. Nobody else can know more because you don't know more.

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2% << December boys got it BAD >> "You can tell some lies about the good times we've had, but I've kissed your mother twice...and now I'm working on your dad..."

[waffle]

Sorry about that....

I just kind of wonder out loud sometimes and I really should take the show just at face value of what it is. There are good parts, don't get me wrong, I think it is just cause I love this show, I want more. I want the suspense and edge of your seat kind of stuff but then I want it over in a minute casue I know it will just be great.

Then again maybe after 5 years I don't really know what I am talking about and the whole series just confuses me.

http://pleaseforgetme.com/SIGS/wafflesigy.gif

[42nd-delay]

I thought it was a great episode. Meadow and her boyfriend getting
married is wrong in so many ways, from not asking Tony to the fact
he was all into the chick at the consturction site, to the fact that he
might have done it so that Vito won't kill him.

A bunch of great two person scenes too - Tony and Carmela at the
restaurant (with Artie coming over twice), Tony and Johnny Sack in
the car, Vito and Meadow's boyfriend, and Meadow and the bf's fight.
Plus the whole Melfi scene.

I think a lot of the stuff people are seeing as unfinished story lines
aren't meant to be lines as much as shaping of characters and
sometimes foreshadowing. For example, Tony and the cancer was a
reminder of his mortality, and maybe it's why that whole episode he
was doing coke and almost banged Arianna. And her calling the FBI
woman in this episode - seemed to me she did that as soon as she
realized Chris might not end up on top of the family.

Oh, and I thouht the Joey Peeps gravestone thing was hilarious.

------------------------------
"42nd-delay is the only person who's making sense." - Ron, 3-12-02

This message was edited by 42nd-delay on 5-3-04 @ 10:48 PM

[Uncle Smokey]

Fantastic episode all around, but Tony and Carm in Vesuvio's was fucking sublime. I love how she came to the table reeking of soccer mom delusions about seeking an equitable distribution of marital assets and vigorously pursuing custody of AJ, as if she'd been married to a Westchester dentist for all these years. Best moment was where she was getting on roll and threatened him with her lawyers who "live for this shit" and he threw up a fast sinister glance and said something like, "Oh, and I don't" then proceeded to take over the conversation. As long as they're not fucking, I can watch those two forever.

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[TheKnicks23]

Nice episode, Tony S, Tony B, and Christopher work really nicely together on screen.

I felt bad for Christopher, he's been taking a lot of shit lately. Plus since Tony fucked up that guy at the Bing, messed with Janice, and is always mean towards Carmela something HAS to happen. I'll be really pissed if they drop this, he's gotten to be a terrible Boss.

Is this the last season or is there another? If its the last Tony has got to go.

<center><img src="http://theknicks23.8k.com/images/papermariosig2.jpg"></center>

[Lumber]

I dig the show myself... I just wish they would film alot of their stuff elsewhere. I live in the Town where they do alot of shooting... It screws up traffic.

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[JPMNICK]

there is one more after this one.

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Thanks to Monsterone for my first sig.

[curtoid]

Really well done episode all the way around. Nice parallels with many of the different characters all sort of at the same crossroads, etc.

Interesting that Tony got pissed at Janice for basically doing what he ordered her to do - not to mention, biting Christopher's head off for being sober, something else he had ordered his cousin to do. You really thought that all of this would have culminated in him coming to a moment of clarity and getting his shit together, but instead he went in the opposite direction - I can't believe I actually felt sympathy for Janice!!

The stuff at the soccer game was hysterical, and then later Janice's rantings at the anger managment class. She really is a creature of whatever is new in her life.

I thought the promos at the end of the show said there were 3 more episodes left for this season.



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[b][i]Much thanks to M1 for the siggie...!i][b]

[Crippler]

I thought this was a great episode. Funniest one in a long time...jars of peaches, the guy in between Janice & the black lady at anger management, "This is fucking priceless", Janice being tackled by the cop in the TV news clip. Good stuff.

And the kicker was Tony baiting his sister on, knowing she's no where near as shiny & happy as she was pretending to be, right into trying to stab him at the dinner table. What a funny, but miserable fuck he is.

http://pic5.picturetrail.com/VOL77/857148/1548180/50299178.jpg
Let's get Sirius...
I plead the FiF!

[Shecky]

YOU KNOW WHAT THEY SAY ABOUT REVENGE, IT'S LIKE SERVING COLD CUTS!!!!!

Genius!!!!

Just Brilliant!

[Crippler]

Just when you start to think he's pretty smart, the show always finds a great way to remind you that Tony's just an idiot & a thug. That one was just classic.

Then Melfi corrects him, and goes on to another cliche, which went way over Tony's head....that whole exchange was just great.

http://pic5.picturetrail.com/VOL77/857148/1548180/50299178.jpg
Let's get Sirius...
I plead the FiF!

This message was edited by Crippler on 5-10-04 @ 12:18 PM

[DeltaPin]

I think it's all showing that Tony is becoming more like his mother was. Whenever Janice, Chris, or whoever starts showing a little happiness, he just sucks the life right out of it and turns them back into angry miserable fucks.

Wasn't Joey Pants' head buried on that farm? Wonder if it was left on purpose.

"The human body is 86% water, when they checked Tony's blood it was 65% zeppoli(sp)."



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[ozzie]

Do you all want to list product placements in here? Or would you rather let those who noticed them have a better chance at Fezzie's game?

Personally, I've never called the show, so it's not like I'm gonna win anyway. I just noticed about 5 spoken product names in the show last night, so I'm sure Fez will have plenty of material to work with.

Other than that, I thought it was a Great Episode, and I can't wait for the last three to see where these plot lines go. I'm nervous, but enjoying the new tension with the NY crew.

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[TheMojoPin]

I think it's all showing that Tony is becoming more like his mother was. Whenever Janice, Chris, or whoever starts showing a little happiness, he just sucks the life right out of it and turns them back into angry miserable fucks.

Bingo.

It's no coincidence Tony's not only be acting more like his mother this season, but saying some of her "catchphrases," too...

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2% << December boys got it BAD >> "You can tell some lies about the good times we've had, but I've kissed your mother twice...and now I'm working on your dad..."

[Shecky]

Do you all want to list product placements in here?


Vespa must be creaming after last nights show.

[TheKnicks23]

Do you all want to list product placements in here?


Yeah, can they go threw 1 f'n episode without mentioning or seeing a Mac? Jesus Christ. Last night Bobby Jr. ranted on about how great the G5's are "ohh well you know they have a 64 bit architecture." Few episodes back it showed that AJ has a iBook in his room. A few seasons back Janice IMed Bobby Jr. on a G3 iBook and I'm pretty sure Bobby Jr. was also using a Mac.

Whores.

EDIT: Oh and I just remembered that the 1 legged Russian was using a Mac to build her website. Godamn.

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This message was edited by TheKnicks23 on 5-10-04 @ 4:11 PM

[Fallon]

Seems like everyone has a Phillips television.

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[schmega]

that whole thing with georgie, i expected. everytime he talks, tony kicks his ass.

but janice, come on. she was trying her best, and he had to go and hit her in a really sensitive area. AWFUL. my opinion of the both of them flip-flopped right there at the end.

tony was right about chris being all high and holy. he had been spouting off some annoying lines he learned from rehab all season.

http://gilseed.home.acedsl.com/sig.jpg

[Iamnotatool]

Janice deserves everything she gets. What a cunt!

<img src=http://thereisnogod.faithweb.com/images/iamnotatool.gif>
Please don't hold my huge nutbag against me, or I'll hold it against you that you have flapjack tits

[DESERTEAGLE.50]

Janice deserves everything she gets. What a cunt!


I hope to GOD youre referencing the way she is acting and not that youve seen "it".

In my mind, her cunt would look like a honeycomb, or something really pretty like that, w/ webbing and dust in it.

FINGA FONGA FINGA FONGA MOTHER FAH
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[Doctor Manhattan]

Yeah, can they go threw 1 f'n episode without mentioning or seeing a Mac?
Seems like everyone has a Phillips television.

Just about every Computer or TV you see in a movie or TV show is a Mac or Sony. It is funny to see that GIANT Phillips logo on this show. I like it when they use a Sony Trinitron but cover up the Sony Logo with electical tape.

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[A.J.]

that whole thing with georgie, i expected. everytime he talks, tony kicks his ass.

And didn't Ralphie crack him in the face with a chain while acting out some scene from "Gladiator"?

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A Skidmark/canofsoup15 production.

Red Sox Nation

[DeltaPin]

that whole thing with georgie, i expected. everytime he talks, tony kicks his ass.

And didn't Ralphie crack him in the face with a chain while acting out some scene from "Gladiator"?


Tony also beat up Georgie with the singing fish.

<img src=http://groups.yahoo.com/group/ktk7439/files/potch.JPG>

[schmega]

Tony also beat up Georgie with the singing fish.

did he? ok, so we've got a phone, a fish, a bucket of ice(Conserve!), and i guess this time with his bare meatfists. i'm gonna miss georgie.

i'm having a tough time watching this week's episode again just because tony turning into such a huge asshole seemed sudden. i think what Melfi said about depression being rage turned inward had an affect on him. maybe he's trying not to get depressed so he's venting all his frustrations outward. i really dont wanna think Tony's turning into his mother, just because Livia's the kinda person that would kill her children.

http://gilseed.home.acedsl.com/sig.jpg

[JustJon]

Seems like everyone has a Phillips television.
Might have somethign to do with a truck full of them that were stored in a garage that the parole officer was tipped off on.

<img src="http://www.chaoticconcepts.com/bans/rfjustjon11.gif"><BR><A href="http://www.chaoticconcepts.com">Chaotic Concepts</a>

[KERMIT]

[quote]that whole thing with georgie, i expected. everytime he talks, tony kicks his ass.

And didn't Ralphie crack him in the face with a chain while acting out some scene from "Gladiator"?


Tony also beat up Georgie with the singing fish.

Do not forget the ice and the bucket also.

http://img39.photobucket.com/albums/v121/Arod13/kermitparis.jpg
Your so stupid. that i do not know why i not dating you.

[Doctor Manhattan]

It's great to see Big Pussy and Gloria again, but these Dream/Hallucination episodes are just too weird.

Wasn't that the cop from Season 1? Annette Benning as "herself" is too much

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[JustJon]

dream episodes suck.

<img src="http://www.chaoticconcepts.com/bans/rfjustjon11.gif"><BR><A href="http://www.chaoticconcepts.com">Chaotic Concepts</a>

[DESERTEAGLE.50]

crazy

I loved it

"you cant have your horse in here"

FINGA FONGA FINGA FONGA MOTHER FAH
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[Alice S. Fuzzybutt]

I liked the episode a lot, but felt ripped off after learning there are only 2 episodes left.

Am I alone in this?

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It's a cat house! A CAT HOUSE! Thanks M1!

[HBox]

<font size= "20">WHAT THE FUCK?</font size>

http://www.myimgs.com/random/hbox/sig

[Teenweek]

This episode fucking sucked.

[TheKnicks23]

Uh...what the fuck. We had to watch 40 minutes of a dream sequence to hear from Chris that Tony B took him out and not even see the hit? Weak.

I'm not against dream episodes, the finale to Season 2 where Tony had food poisening is my favorite episode ever, but this one was weak. And stop all these 48 minute episodes, they should all be an hour like last season.

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[Reephdweller]

I'm not a big fan of dream episodes, though this one wasn't so bad. I agree that with three episodes left it sucks to have this kind of thing. Though as someone who is fascinated by the meanings of dreams I liked it somewhat. The whole losing teeth symbolism to the melting bullets, to Tony B firing with his finger. You come to see lots of people he's encountered over the years who are dead or have been wronged by Tony. I think that ultimately it means on some level he has tremendous guilt for his actions, as well is the realization on a subconcious level that things are spiraling out of control for him. He wants to go home to his wife in the dream, to feel like it used to. To be free of all the turmoil in his life. In the dream he's in the car with the dead and I think he's envisioning his own demise as a result of everything that is going on in his life.

Seeing John Heard the crooked cop from the first season was great, it was odd to see him as Finn's dad though. Even weirder to hear him sing "Once Twice, Three Times a Lady" at the dinner table.

Also it was kind've odd how in some scenes Meadow is in the restaurant next to Finn, and then the next shot back at her has AJ next to her. That plus Tony in the living room on the horse...weird and funny.

I liked it. I just wish that it wouldn't have been at this point in the season.

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[Doctor Manhattan]

I did like the horse in the house and Tong fucking Artie's wife

"I told you he was the best" That was funny!

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[HBox]

A couple of parts made me laugh. "Hey, you're Annette Bening!" And when he looks at the camera and says, "Yeah, I know I'm dreaming," it was almost like David Chase saying "Yeah, this gonna be the whole episode, deal with it!" Ballsy, but that dream went way too long and the most significant part of the episode was only mentioned.

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[Recyclerz]

C'mon folks, the reason why we love The Sopranos is that Chase is always subverting our expectations and never gives us more than a small taste of what we want as viewers. We love to be teased.

That said, he probably is a little too old to be experimenting with the acid.






[b]There ain't no asylum here.
King Solomon he never lived 'round here.[b]

[TheMojoPin]

That was fucking genius.

"Is it light where you are?"

Bra-fucking-vo. This is, by far, my favorite season overall, even before it's finished.

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1979 << December boys got it BAD >> "You can tell some lies about the good times we've had, but I've kissed your mother twice...and now I'm working on your dad..."

[TheKnicks23]

Mojo, are you kidding? Sure this season is better than last season but nothing compares to Season 1 and 2.

Get the DVDs and watch the the ends of Season 1 and 2, nothing in Season 5 even comes close. Tonight's episode was nothing more than wasting time and putting off to the finale of the last 2 episodes, thats it. Instead of showing and developing the hit, they took the easy way out and showed various scenes that make no sense and are not relevant. Not genius in my book.



<center><img src="http://theknicks23.8k.com/images/papermariosig2.jpg"></center>

[TheMojoPin]

Well, it's clear you and I were watching for different reasons.

I love season 1 and 2...but 1 ultimately is really just a spin on ye olde "mafia" stuff we've seen at least a dozen times in movies in the last 20 years. And 2 was just a continuation of what was done in 1. It was with 3 where they really started to branch out and cover new territory. I couldn't give a flying fuck how a supporting character gets killed if it's just another "whack." Nine times out of ten these guys walk up on someone and shoot them. Whoop-dee-doo. I've seen that at least 20 times already on this show.

The psychological stuff, the family stuff, the emotional stuff...I need that 50/50 with the mob stuff...and to me, that's how the show has been from season 3 onwards.

Like I said...bra-fucking-vo. If they're not going to kill a major character, I don't need to see a "whacking" waste another 5-10 minutes of screentime.

The killing of Phil's kid is important, but we don't need to see it. How would it have been any different from Tony B. killing his lieutenant a couple episodes back? The show still progresses, and we managed to get a little more variety and creativity.

If people are expecting the NYC vs. NJ thing to be wrapped up by the end of this season, stop watching now. You'll probably kill yourselves.

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1979 << December boys got it BAD >> "You can tell some lies about the good times we've had, but I've kissed your mother twice...and now I'm working on your dad..."

This message was edited by TheMojoPin on 5-16-04 @ 11:26 PM

[TheKnicks23]

I don't buy that. Its a Mafia show, therefore the Mafia situation should ALWAYS be the lead in the story. Seasons 4 and 5 have taken the emphasis off of the Mafia and put it on Tony's real family. I could give 2 shits if Carmela died, its not interesting.

Its a damn shame that we have seen so little of Tony's crew in the last few seasons. Silvio and Paulie have gotten a combined air time of about 30 minutes this whole season. Thats what I miss the most about the show. In the first 2 seasons you would see Silvio, Paulie, Chris, and even Pussy all the time. Now we have to put up with Carmela banging another guy, yeah thats better than having "the Crew" on the whole episode.

And how could you say you don't like the whacking scenes. Jimmy and Mikey in Season 1, and Pussy in Season 2 finale was awesome.

I will be extremely disapointed if Chris doesn't take the action in the next 2 episodes like the previews show. F Buscemi, I'll take Chris as the 2nd main character any day.

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This message was edited by TheKnicks23 on 5-16-04 @ 11:41 PM

[TheMojoPin]

This was NEVER "just a mafia show."

Ever.

FOR A SECOND.

Paulie and Silvio are fun characters, but they're so fucking one-note. You need guys like Richie, Ralphie, Chris, Junior and Tony to REALLY carry this show and make it what it is.

And you the two "cool whackings" you named were of two significant characters that functioned as the climaxes of their seasons. The killing of Phil's kid is not even close to being the turning point Pussy's death was...not even close to Mikey's!

To you, a war with NYC is the biggest thing this show could possibly offer. I don't think so. Tony's most dangerous enemy is always going to be himself. But like I said, we're clearly watching the show for two different reasons. The show always said it was how Tony's TWO "families" run his life. You need one to have the other. Otherwise, "The Sopranos" wouldn't be "The Sopranos." It sounds like you would have been happier watching "Oz" instead.

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1979 << December boys got it BAD >> "You can tell some lies about the good times we've had, but I've kissed your mother twice...and now I'm working on your dad..."

This message was edited by TheMojoPin on 5-16-04 @ 11:49 PM

[Iamnotatool]

I thought he was gonna wack Carmela. Maybe he still will. He has to.

<img src=http://thereisnogod.faithweb.com/images/iamnotatool.gif>
Please don't hold my huge nutbag against me, or I'll hold it against you that you have flapjack tits

[Iamnotatool]

I thought he was gonna wack Carmela. Maybe he still will. He has to.

<img src=http://thereisnogod.faithweb.com/images/iamnotatool.gif>
Please don't hold my huge nutbag against me, or I'll hold it against you that you have flapjack tits

[TheKnicks23]

OK, I understand your reasoning behind the complexity of the show and having the 2 families involved in it. Thats been the basis since it started, however what I'm saying is the 1 family is being overdone so much that the crew is not even showing up. Besides Buscemi and ocassionly Chris we rarely see the mafia family.

For me atleast, Chris really made The Sopranos so fantastic. Every episode this season is way behind the one where Chris went nuts after the Adriana incident. So I'm suggesting maybe theres too much of basis on Tony only. Not that its a bad thing, maybe just a tad too much. Did we really need to see Tony fuck 5 people tonight, walk around in his slippers for 5 minutes, then eat for another 10.

The way you're describing the show, you would be satisfied with some lackluster finale. The Sopranos MUST have a whacking of a major character for a Finale, otherwise the whole season feels anti-climatic and a let down.

I don't want to show to be so single layer that its "bang you're dead, bang he's dead" etc. But something has to be resolved with NYC in the last 2 episodes or the whole season will feel like a let down. I can already tell by the previews that Chris will go nuts, almost kill someone, then it will be resolved. Thats anti-climatic and no good.

Whack off Johnny Sac, Little Carmine, Tony B, SOMETHING!

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This message was edited by TheKnicks23 on 5-17-04 @ 12:03 AM

[RocOutWithYACockOUT]

What does losing your teeth in a dream mean?

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[TheMojoPin]

OK, I understand your reasoning behind the complexity of the show and having the 2 families involved in it. Thats been the basis since it started, however what I'm saying is the 1 family is being overdone so much that the crew is not even showing up. Besides Buscemi and ocassionly Chris we rarely see the mafia family.

For me atleast, Chris really made The Sopranos so fantastic. Every episode this season is way behind the one where Chris went nuts after the Adriana incident. So I'm suggesting maybe theres too much of basis on Tony only. Not that its a bad thing, maybe just a tad too much. Did we really need to see Tony fuck 5 people tonight, walk around in his slippers for 5 minutes, then eat for another 10.

The way you're describing the show, you would be satisfied with some lackluster finale. The Sopranos MUST have a whacking of a major character for a Finale, otherwise the whole season feels anti-climatic and a let down.

I don't want to show to be so single layer that its "bang you're dead, bang he's dead" etc. But something has to be resolved with NYC in the last 2 episodes or the whole season will feel like a let down. I can already tell by the previews that Chris will go nuts, almost kill someone, then it will be resolved. Thats anti-climatic and no good.

Whack off Johnny Sac, Little Carmine, Tony B, SOMETHING!

<center><img src="http://theknicks23.8k.com/images/papermariosig2.jpg"></center>

This message was edited by TheKnicks23 on 5-17-04 @ 12:03 AM

So you want a war between NJ and NYC...but wrapped up in two episodes? Or you want Carmine or Johnny whacked, potentially nipping any "war" in the bud even before it happens? At this point, the only character that can be killed and you can have a war next season (Having the war stretched out then is much a better option than smashing it into two episodes is something I'd prefer) is Tony B. You could kill Phil, but it's pretty redundant at this point, and would only be satisfying if you REALLY just get your jollies seeing middleaged Italian guys getting their brains splattered all over the TV screen.

Basically, Phil will probably die, but it's not necessary for the war to go on. If you want a "main character" to die and have it make sense, the only logical bet is Tony B.. Of course, I'd prfer it if they finally bucked the trend and didn't rely on the "big death" as one of the climaxes. Not that that always happened...Mikey was really a glorified supporting character at best. They key with season 1 is the likely and most deserving victims DIDN'T die...Tony's mom and Uncle Junior. Season 2 had Richie and Big Pussy getting plugged...but season 3 only had Jackie, jr. getting knocked off. Season 4 had Ralphie, but that happened BEFORE the final couple of episodes, and really wasn't that huge a deal in the grand scheme of things.

And I've yet to see a lackluster finale. The only season that had somewhat of a "wrap up" was season 1, and that was just because nobody knew if the show would be back for a second go-around. Everything else has been incredibly open-ended, with the very clear message that until the last second of the last minute of the very last show of the SERIES, consider nothing finished. They've yet to have a "real" finale except in the most technical sense of the word.

And how can there be "too much of a basis" on Tony?!? The show is above all about HIM!

<img src="http://scripts.cgispy.com/image.cgi?u=TheMojoPin">
1979 << December boys got it BAD >> "You can tell some lies about the good times we've had, but I've kissed your mother twice...and now I'm working on your dad..."

[Reephdweller]

What does losing your teeth in a dream mean?


Losing teeth in a dream usually means that the person is experiencing some form of anxiety. There are several different meanings that are associated with it, though I believe in this case what we're seeing is that Tony's subconcious is revealing that he has a fear that he's losing control of his world. That things are on a course that will ultimately spiral out of control. Which pretty much sums up his situation.

I found this on a dream analysis website and it pretty much sums it up....

For a dreamer who has thought about these things, losing your teeth may signify a loss of control - that things are failing and you have no way of stopping them. That as much as you might wish for things to just "work well", nature has other plans and you have to learn to cope with them.

--------------

Granted I believe the main flaw with this show is that it really ran the gamut in scenarios for dreams. There was so many different meanings happening at once that generally most folks wake up in a cold sweat after just a few different things that happen. You would have to think that something extremely bad is about to happen to him.

I also remember reading something about people who generally drive cars who dreaming about being driven places while riding in the backseats of cars has a negative message as well. I think it had something along the lines of that person thinking they were going to die and that when they die they will be in a coffin in the back of a hearse. In the dream sequence Tony is in the back of a car filled with dead guys. Except for Artie though, who he feels some level of guilt for wanting to fuck his wife. That hurting his childhood friend like that would be really bad (even though his burned his restaurant down in season one with no trouble).

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[TheMojoPin]

Wasn't there a dream sequence last season where Tony was riding in the backseat of a car? I seem to recall that car was out driving in the countryside, Tony was in the back, with the girl from the car dealership who he had the affair with next to him, Ralphie was driving, and then in the passenger seat was someone whose face we couldn't see, but I remember the implication was that it was Tony's mother.

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1979 << December boys got it BAD >> "You can tell some lies about the good times we've had, but I've kissed your mother twice...and now I'm working on your dad..."

[Servo]

Mojo, the dream you're thinking of had Tony sitting in the back seat of his father's car with Gloria. Ralphie was sitting in the front passenger seat with the caterpillar on his head that turns into a butterfly. Carmela is driving the car, which Tony tells Dr. Melfi his father never would have stood for.

[TheMojoPin]

Dammit, it was Carmella?

I gotta go back and watch that episode again. I could have sworn there was a dream sequence like that that involved a female figure being in the front seat whose back was turned to Tony (And us) the entire time, and the implication was that it was his mother.

Eh, I'll figure it out...thanks Tom.

<img src="http://scripts.cgispy.com/image.cgi?u=TheMojoPin">
1979 << December boys got it BAD >> "You can tell some lies about the good times we've had, but I've kissed your mother twice...and now I'm working on your dad..."

[DeltaPin]

Dammit, it was Carmella?

I gotta go back and watch that episode again. I could have sworn there was a dream sequence like that that involved a female figure being in the front seat whose back was turned to Tony (And us) the entire time, and the implication was that it was his mother.

Eh, I'll figure it out...thanks Tom.


Mojo, I think the dream sequence you're thinking about is at the end of the same episode with the car. Tony walks up to a house, starts knocking on the door & talking through the screen. I can't remember the details of what he said, but I remember there was a female figure in the house that you couldn't really make out who it was.

I liked this episode, though the dream sequence may have been dragged out. As I think back, there's so many clues & symbols it's going to take several watches to comprehend them all.



<img src=http://groups.yahoo.com/group/ktk7439/files/potch.JPG>

[schmega]

Little Carmine's gotta go. i'm sick of his Lorraine Bracco School of Acting delivery. he STINKS.

http://gilseed.home.acedsl.com/sig.jpg

[TheMojoPin]

THANK YOU, DELTA.

Always count on a Pin.

And if we're killing based on bad acting, Little Carmine is indeed at the top of the list. But, at least he's brought out the psycho on Johnny Sac...that's been entertaining as hell.

<img src="http://scripts.cgispy.com/image.cgi?u=TheMojoPin">
1979 << December boys got it BAD >> "You can tell some lies about the good times we've had, but I've kissed your mother twice...and now I'm working on your dad..."

[SamoanWoman]

This episode was so David Lynch! Poor Valentina, I knew when she started to bitch that Tony would have given her the heave ho! But I was horrified by what happened next! But in true Tony fashion, she's lying in bed all burnt up and he's complaining about why do these things happen to him! Did anyone else get the thing about horse-whores?
I wish this episode had come along earlier in the season but it was a good one.

[Doctor Manhattan]

Aide's gone and ready to start filming "Joey" before that gets cancelled.

So Little Carmine was killed? I missed seeing that.

<a href="http://www.televisionwithoutpity.com/show.cgi?show=73"><img src="http://members.cox.net/nicksporsche/KillBillv205.jpg" border=0></a>

[TheKnicks23]

Wow, that was such an amazing episode. I'm still in shock about Adriana, I didn't see that coming AT ALL. I should've suspected it but I really thought Chris had tried to kill himself, I didn't have any clue that it was setup. It was so ruthless when Silvio took her out...

I don't see how Chris is going to deal with the fact once it hits home. His drug and alcohol adiction is coming back big time and I wouldn't be surprised if he takes out Silvio or someone for doing it.

And the war is now officially on.

<center><img src="http://theknicks23.8k.com/images/papermariosig2.jpg"></center>

[42nd-delay]

This episode just made me ill. I don't think there's a character on that show that I don't find repulsive at this point. I think I need two weeks to want to watch again.

------------------------------
"42nd-delay is the only person who's making sense." - Ron, 3-12-02

[TheMojoPin]

Little Carmine wasn't killed. He basically pussed out and ran back to Florida.

Great, great episode. Like I said before, this is easily my favorite season thus far. Lots of loose ends tied up or brought MUCH closer to conclusion tonight. Personally, I was more into Tony and Carmella getting back together (Though the set up of Adrianna was brilliantly written and acted. I kept waiting for Christopher to kill her, then I thought they were honestly taking off, then I thought Christopher would be killed, and then SHE actually got it.), but the rest of the stuff was great.

Great, great foreshadowing of the war that's going to be the brunt of the final season. I was glad to see Buscemi not just get sold out to that prick Phil.

I'm so jaded to violence in almost everything I see, but something about this show does it so "well," that I'm usually left disgusted afterwards. In a GOOD way...if that makes sense.

Oh, and for all of you gore junkies who were griping about not seeing Phil's brother killed last week...stop being bitches, bitches. You happy now?

<img src="http://scripts.cgispy.com/image.cgi?u=TheMojoPin">
1979 << December boys got it BAD >> "You can tell some lies about the good times we've had, but I've kissed your mother twice...and now I'm working on your dad..."

[TheKnicks23]

Yeah, theres something about the violence in the show that gets to me even though no other movies or shows can. Between Adriana getting punched, choked, and eventually whacked I was actually a bit queasy by the end of the show. Even without showing Adriana getting shot, the whole situation was extremely surreal.

I think because for the last 2 seasons we saw her whole situation. She was picked right off the street, tortured by the FBI, had to deal with shattering her loyalty to Chris, and the constant health problems that were caused by it. Then, she did EVERYTHING she could to help out Chris and then gets setup, tricked and killed by someone she knew.

Silvio calling her a "fucking cunt" and killing her reminds you that all these guys are heartless killers. For a while you really start to like the characters and then the writers remind you how they really are. Sick situation with Adriana, but it made for a fantastic episode (probably the best this season).

I also thought that Tony and Carmela getting back together was great. It felt real since it was so gradual. Also felt right with the 3 of them sitting at the dinner table.

Waiting 2 weeks is gonna be tough.

<center><img src="http://theknicks23.8k.com/images/papermariosig2.jpg"></center>

[TheMojoPin]

Exactly, TK. Just when you think these guys are OK, the show kicks you in the brain and reminds just how scummy they really are.

And why the two week wait? What's going to be on next week?

<img src="http://scripts.cgispy.com/image.cgi?u=TheMojoPin">
1979 << December boys got it BAD >> "You can tell some lies about the good times we've had, but I've kissed your mother twice...and now I'm working on your dad..."

[walking joint]

my guess for the 2 week wait is Memorial Day weekend.

[JustJon]

My biggest prob with the ep. was the geography...

I went to Ramapo, so I know that was the Rt 17 South exit onto Route 202. If you take 202 away from teh college (like they did), it takes you into the heart of Suffern, NY. There are no woods like that in that direction. If you want woods, you need to go towards the Ramapo Indian Reservation, in the other direction, but there still aren't woods that deep close to the college. But they did go in the right direction towards the nearest hospital, Good Samaritan, which is in Suffern, NY.

And as soon as "Silvio will pick you" is said on the phone, she should have run the fuck out of there!

<img src="http://www.chaoticconcepts.com/bans/rfjustjon11.gif"><BR><A href="http://www.chaoticconcepts.com">Chaotic Concepts</a>

[TheKnicks23]

I'm pretty sure the 2 week wait is to sync up the finales of "The Sopranos" with that pice of crap show "Deadwood". Before tonights episode I saw a preview that said 3 episodes left, so giving "The Sopranos" a week off will have "Deadwood's" finale on the same day.

<center><img src="http://theknicks23.8k.com/images/papermariosig2.jpg"></center>

[yarpwizard]

Great episode tonight....Tony quoting Popeye, " I am what I am" and Christoher quoting Bruce, "The highway's jammed with broken heroes on a last chance power drive." I laughed my ass off.

I looks like a NJ/NY bloodbath in the future. Let's all hope for an explosive finale in 2 weeks.


<img src=http://yarpwizard.50megs.com/images/kill_bill.gif>

A mind is a terrible thing to dyworf.

[curtoid]

Yeah, there is no doubt these characters are scum bags. Sil was maybe the last one that I didn't associate with being a thug - Paulie last season with the old lady he robbed and murdered; Chris this season with the friend of his with the gambling problem; Tony B. with the Korean; and Tony S. with his sister, and more - REALLY tough to find any sympathy for them any more, the longer we really get to know them.

And yet - they switch to scenes of Tony with Carm and Anthony, or scenes with Meadow, and in a weird way you are rooting for them. But you know there's only one way for all of this to end, and that's very badly.

Speaking of Carm - is she going to roll him?! It seems a little sudden, her willingness to let Tony back. I'd like to think that it was more than simply she felt she could do nothing else but that - what with him tainting the lawyer pool.

Jon - maybe Sil never went there, and Ade was too freaked out to notice, or think to herself that there were no trees there. In any event, I can give you a list of about a dozen movies set in Washington or the DC area that drive me fucking nuts - everything from "No Way Out" and their fictional Georgetown Metro stop, to the tv series "The X Files" which constantly referred to "Silver Spring, Maryland" and "Silver Springs." Lazy Hollywood types!

The Springsteen quote was a riot, especially with Sil sitting right there. When do you think one of them is going to realize Little Steven has been working with them all this time?! haha.

I REALLY like how they have taken their time over the last couple of seasons to establish John's character, so that now that they are at this point - with the threat of an all out war between NY & NJ - that there is some real back story between Tony and John.

(Christ - will it ever come out that Paulie was John's patsy there last season?!)

What a brilliant, heartbreaking, tragic episode. You knew Ade would get it at some time, and in traditional Sopranos fashion, the big stars of the show get memorable exits. I'm really going to miss her - there was something about her being there, right on the edge of the madness and danger for the first three seasons, then being pinched by the FBI to do their work, and wondering then when they would find out (hell, they were all so fucking stupid they only found out because SHE told them!), that you REALLY rooted for her.

Hell, I was convinced they were going to take it right up to their wedding, before finally dealing with her. It seems a little bit of incompetence on the FBI's part; they actually HAD someone who was basically a member of the Sopranos family! Didn't they learn they only way to get what they needed was through patience????

PAH!

Great episode - can't wait for two weeks.





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[b][i]Much thanks to M1 for the siggie...!i][b]

[zoom2457]

Carmela is just using Tony. She knows she won't get any big amount of money from him and she has nowhere else to go. What, she's gonna go out and get a job now??? Carmela's a user and so is Tony. He'll still cheat.

Did anyone notice that Adrianna scene where she was heading to Baltimore alone with her suitcase? Then it morphs into her in the car with Sil and her looking out at all the woods. She's looking at the woods thinking, I should have ran when I had the chance.

And, that Johnny Sac is one crazy bastard. I can see him ordering a hit on Meadow, AJ or Carmela. That would really be an interesting storyline. I think Tony would recover easier if someone in the mob family died. Because those people knew what they were getting into. I have this idea because when Tony, AJ, and Carm were eating dinner and he made that toast about them being the people he loves. And the fact that Johnny threatened his family.



"Excuse me, excuse me I believe you have my stapler"

[DreamWeaver]

Do you think Christopher had ANY intention of going into the witness protection program? Or was his breaking point seeing the white trash family?

http://blakjeezis.homestead.com/files/ginani.gif

[blakjeezis]

I cannot state and restate enough the absolute brilliance of this show. Just like Lex Luger, it's the total package; acting, directing, writing, everything, is absolutely perfect. Watching Christopher's facial expressions, right before he choked Adriana, as he took in what she was saying and slowly went from confusion, to understanding, and finally to that great psycho face he has, without saying a word, was just awesome.

A close second was the scene between Tony and Johnny Sac. Tony is so fucked. The division of his life and the rules that govern each side are finally gonna come into real conflict, and he's gonna go down in flames.

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[JustJon]

I think it was the white trash family that threw him over the edge. The power of the mullet was just too much for him.

<img src="http://www.chaoticconcepts.com/bans/rfjustjon11.gif"><BR><A href="http://www.chaoticconcepts.com">Chaotic Concepts</a>

[Reephdweller]

Do you think Christopher had ANY intention of going into the witness protection program? Or was his breaking point seeing the white trash family?


I took it less about seing a white trash family, but rather a family. At the time you have to wonder what's happening. But later when I thought about it I was thinking that he was probably thinking about the fact that he just threw away any chance at a family and kids with Adriana. I think he loved her way too much to kill her on his own. I think what he did was let her talk to him and then get up and go when he could find the right time and then tell Tony and have the hit made.

I have to wonder if she realized she was on her way to her death in a way. Or did it not dawn on her until the pulled up in the woods.

Overall it was an excellent episode.

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[badorties]

Did anyone notice that Adrianna scene where she was heading to Baltimore alone with her suitcase? Then it morphs into her in the car with Sil and her looking out at all the woods. She's looking at the woods thinking, I should have ran when I had the chance.


i absolutely loved that scene ... it reminded me of the ending of the '25th hour' ...



I think it was the white trash family that threw him over the edge. The power of the mullet was just too much for him.


i took that scene more for the family that adriana could never give him and how much he loved his h2, they way he 'petted' the front bumper was interesting ...


+|+|+|+|+|+|+|+|+|+|+|+|+|+|+

This message was edited by badorties on 5-24-04 @ 12:24 PM

[Reephdweller]

Also, I have to think that in the real world both Ade and Chris would have been wacked. Regardless of anything.

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[TheMojoPin]

Well, Chris is part of Tony's "family" AND his real family, so I think that goes a long way. I mean, in "real life," Chris probably would have been killed over the whole heroin mess.

Sil was maybe the last one that I didn't associate with being a thug

Eh, he showed his true colors a while back? Remember the episode where Ralphie beat the stripper to death? Sil smacked her around pretty bad himself when she didn't show up for work. That pretty much sank him for me.

I can give you a list of about a dozen movies set in Washington or the DC area that drive me fucking nuts -

No kidding. ESPECIALLY movies that show DC with some kind of "skyline" that's not Crystal City, completely ignoring the fact DC itself doesn't have any buildings higher than the Washington Monument.

<img src="http://scripts.cgispy.com/image.cgi?u=TheMojoPin">
1979 << December boys got it BAD >> "You can tell some lies about the good times we've had, but I've kissed your mother twice...and now I'm working on your dad..."

[EQ]

Christopher always reminded Ade that he was first a " Soldier", whenever she mentioned moving, or just 'getting away from all this'.
( most recently in the episode where he's packing for the farm, and asks her for the Tinactic )

Even when he was hurt ( driving back from the farm ), or all messed up, he remained loyal to Tony.

However, he has as many demons to contend with as Tony in many ways.

( I still think something will happen between Christopher and Tony B. Perhaps driven by childhood resentment, but under the guise of it being business-related )

And yeah! Even though there wasn't actual bloodshed, watching Christopher choke Ade ( for about the hundredth time ), with that intense look in his eyes was more frightening than a shooting.

Watching his panic, his fear, he's choking her, and trying to decide what HE should do..while almost killing her (again ).

..and I was just thinking that Silvio never seems to do much, except pacify Tony. He's like the group troubleshooter ( no pun intended ).

When he's driving her "to the hospital", he is still trying to calm her down ( so she doesn't bolt ), talk her down..even though he is moments away from killing her. Pacifying people until the end.

Great show.. I agree with Mojo - this has been my favorite season.

[blakjeezis]

Silvio never seems to do much, except pacify Tony. He's like the group troubleshooter

As consiglieri, that's kind of his job. He counsels Tony, helps him rule over conflicts betwen his captains according to 'the law', and does whatever is necessary to keep things operating smoothly.

As an aside, and I know it sounds cheesey, but for some great insights into the show I highly recommend a book called "Philosophy and The Soprano's". It's a collection of essays written by various academics. You get some wonderful interpretations of the show, Tony and the rest of the characters. For any fan of the show, it's well worth reading.

<IMG SRC =http://www.blakjeezis.homestead.com/files/bloodjeez.gif>
If I were any better, I'd have to be twins!!
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This message was edited by blakjeezis on 5-24-04 @ 1:43 PM

[TheMojoPin]

Great show.. I agree with Mojo - this has been my favorite season.

Fo' sheezy.

And you're right about the choking scene...it reminded me when Tony killed the snitch while he was touring colleges with Meadow, or when Ralphie took out the stripper, or when Melfi was raped...it's totally different from the "usual" type of movie/TV violence, and it's almost like it's forcing what you're seeing at you.

<img src="http://scripts.cgispy.com/image.cgi?u=TheMojoPin">
1979 << December boys got it BAD >> "You can tell some lies about the good times we've had, but I've kissed your mother twice...and now I'm working on your dad..."

[DreamWeaver]

I imagined this was playing in Christopher's head over and over as he stoked his H2.....

"Today everything is different. There's no action. I have to wait around like everyone else. Can't even get decent food. Right after I got here I ordered some spaghetti with marinara sauce and I got egg noodles and ketchup. I'm an average nobody. I get to live the rest of my life like a schnook."

http://blakjeezis.homestead.com/files/ginani.gif

[TheKnicks23]

I forgot to say that I'm surprised that Silvio did the hit on Adriana. Being consiglieri he rarely does anything, if you notice all hits are normally done by Christopher, Paulie, or someone lower down.

Of course Chris couldn't do it but I'm surprised that Silvio did it being so high up.

<center><img src="http://theknicks23.8k.com/images/papermariosig2.jpg"></center>

[blakjeezis]

I figure Sil's involvement in 2 ways. First, it was something that would have had to be done quickly. Christopher knew that any delay would have meant the Feds contacting and possibly coming to get Adriana.

Second, I'm sure there's a certain decree of secrecy that needs to be kept, especially with things being the way they are with NY. Tony wouldn't want this leak to be known about too far down the ladder. Christopher obviously couldn't or didn't want to do it. (If he was one of Johnny Sac's men, Johnny probably would have made him, but that's pure conjecture.) Tony needs to stay as clean as possible. Even the captains aren't all trustworthy, Tony knows about shit between Christopher and Paulie etc. So that kinda just leaves Sil.

<IMG SRC =http://www.blakjeezis.homestead.com/files/bloodjeez.gif>
If I were any better, I'd have to be twins!!
<marquee><font color=red>INRI</font> White people are so scared of blakjeezis<font color=red> INRI</font></marquee>
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This message was edited by blakjeezis on 5-24-04 @ 2:07 PM

[Crippler]

"Today everything is different. There's no action. I have to wait around like everyone else. Can't even get decent food. Right after I got here I ordered some spaghetti with marinara sauce and I got egg noodles and ketchup. I'm an average nobody. I get to live the rest of my life like a schnook."
That's the first thing I thought about when Chris started wiping at the front of his H2. Then when he turned & saw the mess of a white trash family pour itself into that broken down car, I said, "Oh shit, Adrianna's dead."

http://pic5.picturetrail.com/VOL77/857148/1548180/50299178.jpg
Let's get Sirius...
I plead the FiF!

[fiestygal]

i came home last night after work and my mom told me that they wacked adriana- NOW THERE ARE NO HOT PEOPLE ON THE SHOW NOW!!!! i looooved drea d'mateo! she was an underrated character though- cant wait to see the whole show tues or wed night

What did the 5 fingers say to the face..

SLAP! I'm Rick James BITCH!

<IMG SRC="http://tenbatsuzen.homestead.com/files/fiestysig1.jpg">
THANX TENB

[schmega]

tony got himself into quite a 'stagmire'. i'm glad lil' carmine's out. i was getting sick of his 2 buddies too.

poor ade. she's better off dead. its either that, getting beaten by chris, or fucked in every way by the feds. she's way to stupid to be a mobster's wife. i just wish the woman on the show didnt have to die on all fours.

tony beating up chris was great. i'll bet he was regretting his decision for a moment there on the floor.



http://gilseed.home.acedsl.com/sig.jpg

[Teenweek]

Johnny Sac to be on espnradio 1050am sometime between 6 and 6:30pm with Wally and the Keeg

[Fallon]

From the Worldwide Pants newsletter:

"Tonight enjoy some genuine mob humor when James Gandolfini, Edie Falco, Michael Imperioli, Drea de Matteo, Steve Van Zandt, Jamie-Lynn Discala, Tony Sirico, Robert Iler, Dominic Chianese and Aida Turturro present the "Top Ten Things Never Before Said on 'The Sopranos'."

<center>
<img border=1 src="http://home.comcast.net/~rmfallon/RFnetMaggie.jpg"><br></center><font color=white>

This message was edited by WWFallon on 5-24-04 @ 7:49 PM

[TheMojoPin]

Fuck, I missed that on Letterman...anyone have a clip? Or a link to a clip?

<img src="http://scripts.cgispy.com/image.cgi?u=TheMojoPin">
1979 << December boys got it BAD >> "You can tell some lies about the good times we've had, but I've kissed your mother twice...and now I'm working on your dad..."

[zoom2457]

All the shit that the FBI put Andrianna through, when they find out she's most likely dead, they weren't upset in the least. They were kinda like, "oh well".

It is an interesting parallel with the mob family. The mob family can kill people and get people killed and their life goes on as if nothing happened. The same can be said for the FBI. When you come right down to it, the FBI is really responsible for her death because they pushed too hard.





"Excuse me, excuse me I believe you have my stapler"

[zoom2457]

Top Ten Things Never Before Said on "The Sopranos"


10. "You don't have any money? That's cool"
(Dominic Chianese)

9. "Screw this home cooking -- I'm going to the Olive Garden"
(Aida Turturro)

8. "In addition to disposing of bodies, you'll need to know how to use Powerpoint and Excel"
(Steven Van Zandt)

7. "Wasn't that the guy from Springsteen's E Street Band?"
(Robert Iler)

6. "I just hooked up an illegal cable box. Now I'm getting free HBO"
(Jamie-Lynn Discala)

5. "Tony, I'm gonna need to leave early today for Rosh Hashanah"
(Tony Sirico)

4. "I want a bigger part -- what are you gonna do, kill my character?"
(Drea de Matteo)

3. "Hey Paulie, how about you and me going up to Massachusetts and getting married?"
(Michael Imperioli)

2. "I can't go to prison -- Martha Stewart will eat me alive!"
(Edie Falco)

1. "I just whacked myself"
(James Gandolfini)



"Excuse me, excuse me I believe you have my stapler"

[waffle]

Right before the episode last week I read Mojo's one post and gave things some serious thought. This has NOT always been a mafia show. I think it has been a combo of BOTH families. Just like they said in the first Season and even on the front of the Season One box set. Not just because the mob action has been on the rise a bit but the last two weeks were absolutely brilliant. When I can mentally fall into an episode and feel like some of the shit that is going down is a bit too real, then I know I am viewing a good show.

That being said, I really want to go back and watch Season 4 because I want to watch it from a different angle. Pretty much not thinking that because there is a lack of mob action, it is a bad show or Season for that matter.

http://pleaseforgetme.com/SIGS/wafflesigy.gif

[Doctor Manhattan]

And why the two week wait? What's going to be on next week?


I think this is the very first time there has been a break in the middle of a season, they usually just play them 13 weeks straight (12 weeks straight during the 3rd season when they showed the first two episodes on the first night)

<a href="http://www.televisionwithoutpity.com/show.cgi?show=73"><img src="http://members.cox.net/nicksporsche/KillBillv205.jpg" border=0></a>

[fluffernutter]

Doesn't Six Feet Under start next week? If so, I better get crackin' on a thread...

http://scripts.cgispy.com/image.cgi?u=fluffernutter
Link me and make me feel loved! (http://www.pleaseforgetme.com)
http://www.pleaseforgetme.com/SIGS/antiyanks.gif

[Furtherman]

Did I hear correctly that it will be 15 MONTHS before the last 10 episodes are shown?!!?!?

<IMG SRC="http://www.chaoticconcepts.com/randomizer/random.php?uid=7">
...with thanks to JustJon

[Crippler]

No...it will likely be that long before the final 10 episodes are written & the filming begins. You're looking at April 2006 before we get to see them.

http://pic5.picturetrail.com/VOL77/857148/1548180/50299178.jpg
Let's get Sirius...
I plead the FiF!

[badorties]

Right before the episode last week I read Mojo's one post and gave things some serious thought. This has NOT always been a mafia show. I think it has been a combo of BOTH families.


i've always viewed this show as a family drama with the mafia serving as a background and poetic device to illustrate the ills of the modern family ...

as the show has progressed we see tony's inability to maintain the integrity of both his personal and business families ... each season is punctuated with tony's efforts to remain in control while both families try to undermine his authority ...

the problem's at work: uncle junior's power plays ... big pussy's/aide's betrayal ... chris' chronic insubordination ... paulie being lured by johnny sac ... the handful of rogue annoyances: ralphie, richie, feech and tony b ... and the almost constant attack form new york (both the feds & now johnny sac) ... mirror tony's fading personal family: the horror and betrayal of his mother/uncle ... the usual teenage rebellion of anthony/meadow ... the severe complications caused by his sister and cousins ... and his fragile, combustive marriage to carmella ...

last season i thought the more telling scene was not jackie jr. getting whacked (which was not in the series finale), but the luncheon after the funeral ... you had uncle junior's swipe at tony's reign about how little fanfare/turnout there was for the kid's funeral coupled with potential touching/sentimental family moment (tony basking in a time of old as junior sang) ruined by the drunken antics of meadow ... i wouldn't be surprised if this season ends with meadow's engagement party .

now it seems tony has come to a turning point: his rage and self loathing seems to echo his mother ... his reign is threatened by loyalties to his cousin ... it appears tony's marriage is, at best a happy medium, of convenience . and in a scene from the season finale, tony going to his uncle for advice with his new york problems, maybe tony has capitulated a bit more than we thought was possible .

as sexy and exciting as the mob stuff is, it's only a plot device for the further 'destruction' of the modern family ...

last week tony staring at his empty pool puffing a cigar was not unlike michael ruefully pining away at the end of godfather II .



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[jeffdwright2001]

Maybe I overlooked it if someone else mentioned it, but the actress Alison Bartlett who plays Tony B's girlfriend is the same person who has played Gina on Sesame Street. (I think she's been on there for about 20 years).
http://i.a.cnn.net/cnn/2004/SHOWBIZ/TV/04/26/tv.sesametosopranos.ap/story.bartlett.ap.jpg

The CNN story (although I caught the info on TVguide.com) (http://www.cnn.com/2004/SHOWBIZ/TV/04/26/tv.sesametosopranos.ap/)

[Doctor Manhattan]

No...it will likely be that long before the final 10 episodes are written & the filming begins. You're looking at April 2006 before we get to see them.


I'm surprised there hasn't been more real life accidents/deaths that affected the show with their long breaks. Aside from Nancy Marchand dying between seasons 2 and 3 the biggest change to the cast has been Meadows last name!

<a href="http://www.televisionwithoutpity.com/show.cgi?show=73"><img src="http://members.cox.net/nicksporsche/KillBillv205.jpg" border=0></a>

[Fallon]

Fuck, I missed that on Letterman...anyone have a clip? Or a link to a clip?

CBS.com (http://www.cbs.com/latenight/lateshow/) has it up. Click on Big Show Highlight.

<center>
<img border=1 src="http://home.comcast.net/~rmfallon/RFnetMaggie.jpg"><br></center><font color=white>

[TheMojoPin]

Waffle, I'll be curious to see what you'll think when you re-watch it. I went through something similar with a completely different HBO show...the first season of "The Wire." When I watched it the second time, something just clicked, and it's now my favorite HBO show outside of Tony and company.

Fallon, thanks.

Badorites...EXACTLY.

Now, if only they'd put out a third collection of music from the series...it's been over three years since volume two came out!

<img src="http://scripts.cgispy.com/image.cgi?u=TheMojoPin">
1979 << December boys got it BAD >> "You can tell some lies about the good times we've had, but I've kissed your mother twice...and now I'm working on your dad..."

[AFRO]

If anybody did see that top ten list last night.... We all new that carmela had the most ugly face in the world, but seeing her last night with a crew cut brings undue attention to what is an already busted up face..... OOFAH

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/OA_Austin/files/XFilesPics/penguin.gif

"White people are so Scared of Black people"

This message was edited by AFRO on 5-25-04 @ 3:36 PM

[Marist Mike]

The reason there's no episode next week is because their showing some movie about the first open heart surgery with Alan Rickman and Mos Def

[Spoil-Sport]

<a href=http://www.spoil-sports.com/Adriana.htm>Adriana Parody</a>



<IMG SRC="http://www.spoil-sports.com/SigPic.gif">
<a href=http://www.spoil-sports.com>www.spoil-sports.com</a>

[TheKnicks23]

Bravo! That was great!

<center><img src="http://theknicks23.8k.com/images/papermariosig2.jpg"></center>

[Furtherman]

That was hilarious!

Of course now the Captain Jean-Luc Picard song is out of my head and that one just settled in.

<IMG SRC="http://www.chaoticconcepts.com/randomizer/random.php?uid=7">
...with thanks to JustJon

[A.J.]

Silvio calling her a "fucking cunt" and killing her reminds you that all these guys are heartless killers.

The scene where Tony smacks Christopher for being "in pain" shows that perfectly. Earlier in the episode he was the only one who didn't make fun of her for her stomach ailment and tried to cheer her up. Yet he had no qualms about arranging her death.

And Tony was "in pain" himself over Tony B. -- even admitting to him why he never showed up that night and later sticking up for his cousin by telling off Johnny Sac.

<img src=http://img40.photobucket.com/albums/v124/Canofsoup15/Sigs/AJinDC-Sig.jpg>

A Skidmark/canofsoup15 production.

Red Sox Nation

[WindowSill]

Chris' Springsteen reference was good but I thought the best line of the whole show was Chris saying "Theres my smelly valentine" when Adriana walked in.

http://img30.photobucket.com/albums/v89/metalsat666/lindsaysig.bmp
Mad props to the King of Sigs Monsterone

[TheMojoPin]

I love that Tony's two biggest (potential) mistakes were made over what this show has always been about...the struggle over his life between his two "families."

If Adrianna had been the longtime girlfriend of ANY other guy in the crew, the guy would have been dead too...but Chris obviously got the pass because he's "family" AND family. Tony only has one thing to go on if Chris is saying he didn't know Adrianna flipped...Chris' word. That didn't work out too well for Big Pussy, but Chris is still walking.

And then Tony's picking his side with Tony B. over doing the "smart" business move and giving him up to Johnny Sac...would Tony have been so ballsy if he was only be asked to give up, say, Paulie Walnuts? I don't think so.

Both decisions show that Tony's almost guarenteed to end up in jail or dead, not because of one family or the other...but because of both.

<img src="http://scripts.cgispy.com/image.cgi?u=TheMojoPin">
1979 << December boys got it BAD >> "You can tell some lies about the good times we've had, but I've kissed your mother twice...and now I'm working on your dad..."

This message was edited by TheMojoPin on 5-26-04 @ 8:43 PM

[Fallon]

Jamie-Lynn is on Kimmel now. Said filming doesn't begin until April 2005. Ugh.

<center>
<img border=1 src="http://home.comcast.net/~rmfallon/RFnetMaggie.jpg"><br></center><font color=white>

[TheMojoPin]

Yeah, the wait sucks...but I guess I'd rather suffer through that if it means they'll take the time to get the show done right instead of rushing it along.

<img src="http://scripts.cgispy.com/image.cgi?u=TheMojoPin">
1979 << December boys got it BAD >> "You can tell some lies about the good times we've had, but I've kissed your mother twice...and now I'm working on your dad..."

[blakjeezis]

This is gonna sound reaaaally dumb, I know. I think it has something to do with the Emmys, maybe that's not the whole reason, but I think it's part of it. By taking the year off, it allows other shows to get rcognized. If The Sopranos was nominated every year, there is no reason it shouldn't win every category it's nominated for every year. I think Chiklis beat out Gandolfini that one time, but I don't care what anyone says there is no better actor on television than Gandolfini, maybe ever. I think you have Carroll O'Connor, Alan Alda and James Gandolfini. Those are your top 3, Mikey. I'm not trying to start a top list thread, just giving my opinion.

<IMG SRC =http://www.blakjeezis.homestead.com/files/bloodjeez.gif>
If I were any better, I'd have to be twins!!
<marquee><font color=red>INRI</font> White people are so scared of blakjeezis<font color=red> INRI</font></marquee>
I'm Rick James, bitch!

[schmega]

this season's been so good i almost forgot we had to wait 15 months for it. they can take all the time they need to close it right.

http://gilseed.home.acedsl.com/sig.jpg

[A.J.]

I think Chiklis beat out Gandolfini that one time, but I don't care what anyone says there is no better actor on television than Gandolfini, maybe ever. I think you have Carroll O'Connor, Alan Alda and James Gandolfini.

BJ I agree with you and I actually once thought about posting a comparison between Gandolfini and O'Connor. Both of them can hold your interest in a scene even without speaking -- just with a facial expression or their body language.

<img src=http://img40.photobucket.com/albums/v124/Canofsoup15/Sigs/AJinDC-Sig.jpg>

A Skidmark/canofsoup15 production.

Red Sox Nation

[badorties]

i won't post it here, and i'm not proud, but i came across some spoilers for this season's finale ... i was gonna miss it anyway (catching a sonic youth show) and my girlfriend probably would've ruined it anyway ... but damn, i need to see how it plays out ...

below, in 'invisotext', are my vague, nondescript reations to the spoilers ...

... one is fairly obvious with an interesting twist based on the events of the second (which i never saw coming) ...



+|+|+|+|+|+|+|+|+|+|+|+|+|+|+

[JustJon]

For those who want to see those spoilers, they're on AICN. I'm sorry I read them, they spoil the ending of the season.

<img src="http://www.chaoticconcepts.com/bans/rfjustjon11.gif"><BR><A href="http://www.chaoticconcepts.com">Chaotic Concepts</a>

[Teenweek]

Tonight is the finale. i am not reading any spoilers. From that I am probably totally wrong, but I think Chrissy gets whacked.

[HBox]

OK, was I the only one cracking up when they were running away from the FBI?

http://www.myimgs.com/random/hbox/sig

This message was edited by HBox on 6-6-04 @ 9:59 PM

[TheMojoPin]

Oh man, I was laughing my ass off...suck it, Johnny!

Though at first, I completely thought that was Phil and his buddy coming out of the woods to whack Tony and John both.

But man, Tony B. got it cold-blooded. Ouch.

And I'm sorry, but Paulie can only be pushed too far. Tony might have sent him over the edge this time...

<img src="http://scripts.cgispy.com/image.cgi?u=TheMojoPin">
1979 << December boys got it BAD >> "You can tell some lies about the good times we've had, but I've kissed your mother twice...and now I'm working on your dad..."

[Marist Mike]

What a good episode tonight....that was great how Buscemi got ambushed.....although considering John got busted by Jimmy Patrile with 18 years worth of shit that whacking was for nothing.....now Little Carmine can take over New York....that was hilarious how Johnny was covered in snow...and then Tony walking back to the house looking like he was homeless...too bad we have to wait 2 years to see what happens next

[TheKnicks23]

How could you NOT laugh when Johnny Sac fell on his face in the snow and got took away?

The only problem I had with the Finale is that it didn't seem to wrap things up completely, but obviously thats because the next season will wrap up the whole show with court cases and such. I was actually happy when Tony B. got it in the face. It was tough for Tony to do it, but Phil was going to get him eventually and this way Tony knew he didn't suffer.

It was a great finale all in all though, but I did feel bad about the way Paulie was treated.

<center><img src="http://theknicks23.8k.com/images/papermariosig2.jpg"></center>

[TheMojoPin]

Man, fuck Phil. I want him dead SO bad next season.

<img src="http://scripts.cgispy.com/image.cgi?u=TheMojoPin">
1979 << December boys got it BAD >> "You can tell some lies about the good times we've had, but I've kissed your mother twice...and now I'm working on your dad..."

[Doctor Manhattan]

I don't remember who Jimmy Patrile is. Can anyone help me out?

<a href="http://www.televisionwithoutpity.com/show.cgi?show=73"><img src="http://members.cox.net/nicksporsche/KillBillv205.jpg" border=0></a>

[JohnnyCash]

I was kinda disappointed with this season but I thought tonights finale was great.

<img src=http://img18.photobucket.com/albums/v53/monster6sixty6/guests/cash_sig.jpg>
Big thanks to Monsterone.

[TheMojoPin]

Jimmy is the old guy who's been diming out to the Feds all of the current and last season. He's a Jersey capo.

I said it before and I say it again...this was my favorite season.

<img src="http://scripts.cgispy.com/image.cgi?u=TheMojoPin">
1979 << December boys got it BAD >> "You can tell some lies about the good times we've had, but I've kissed your mother twice...and now I'm working on your dad..."

[AFRO]

Was Jimmy at the birthday party that tony made his speech at? If its the same guy I'm thinking about has also been at the club with Tony and the guys before also.

Overall Great episode. Question, Why was Christopher on the run and hiding out? Was it because if they couldn't kill Tony B. they would kill another cousin or family member?

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/OA_Austin/files/XFilesPics/penguin.gif

"White people are so Scared of Black people"

[Recyclerz]

Nice, subtle cliffhanger to ponder for the next year and a half - which Tony do we see in the last season? - the mob boss who finally stepped up to the Machiavellian requirements of the job by blowing away his "problem" and who backed Johnny Sac the fuck up? or a guy having guilt induced panic attacks for having killed his cousin for, in retrospect, no reason?

My Radio Psychic - probably both.

Nice call back to the first episode of the season where the bear came out of the woods into the yard; this time he made it into the house. ;)



<IMG SRC="http://www.hometown.aol.com/recyclerz/myhomepage/sigpic1.gif?mtbrand=AOL_US">
[b]There ain't no asylum here.
King Solomon he never lived 'round here.[b]

[TheGameHHH]

they finally gave a shout out to my hometown this week, that was nice to see in the finale.

"hey, where those kids from?"

"um, Montville"


hell yea!

<IMG SRC="http://home.comcast.net/~rmfallon/RFnetHHH.jpg">

[TheKnicks23]

Overall, this was a good season. It beats the hell out of Season 4, but I still like the first 3 seasons more. My biggest complaint with Season 4 and 5 is the loss of importance in the family's rank.

Looking at Raymond's birthday party there was only 1 or 2 guys who WEREN'T capo's, now that just doesn't make sense. The pyramid of rank just isn't there anymore, Season 1 (which I have made quite clear is my favorite) has such a clear pyramid, with Jackie-then Junior at the top, then the 5 capos and each of them have their own squad. Now Tony's crew alone has a consigileiri and a capo. For me, the struggle for power and rank in the family is part of what made the first few seasons so magical.

This season the rank doesn't even matter. If the writer's would get off their ass they would realize Tony B. (who wasn't even a made guy) would not have been such an important person. He gets his own Casino and is a major factor in the family decisions, sorry that doesn't happen.

Also, the fact that Tony is not even the boss of the family is never brought up anymore. Its little things like this that are important to me and have been forgotten.

Now I know I'm really geeking out and over analyzing the show, but its simply not as fun to be a fan when all the ranks are thrown away. It also takes away from it being a mafia show.

<center><img src="http://theknicks23.8k.com/images/papermariosig2.jpg"></center>

[Shecky]

Jimmy Petrille(Vinny Vella Sr) is that fat fuck at the beginning of the episode who was at the morgue/funeral home with Johnny Sacks and Philly Leotardo.
He was also in the "Little Ceaser" Bar-b-que scene with Anthony Lapaglia in Analyze That
He was a New York/Brooklyn Capo who the FEDS were originally after but he sold out Johnny Sacks.

Raymond is the old guy they had a party for who also is working for the FEDS. He's from Jersey.

[Shecky]

How about Pauly with the sweatpants Guinea tee and suspenders.

[FMJeff]

watching fat gandolfini flee from the cops was the best 5 min of television so far...

<center><img src="http://thereisnogod.faithweb.com/images/fmjeff.gif">
<br>
It made my heart sing.

[Jack_Doff]

I'm trying to figure out how you have all these FBI guys coming and they don't notice this 6'3", 320 pound dude running away. I know they weren't looking for him, but if they took down the guy doing the snow removal, they would have grabbed Tony. How did they not see him?

[badorties]

i loved this season, and the final was amazing -- albeit a tad understated ....

i loved the metaphor of the house: tony making a long, unbecoming trek home to close out the season with carmela doting over him (i wouldn't be surprised if the next sesason opens with a move or the family established in the new home); with uncle junior's fade into oblivion, tony is the undisputed boss now and seemed to finally affirm it with himself and confirm it with his crew; tony came to terms with NY and with johnny sacks' impending doom the house of soprano is finalized -- poised for greatness or tragedy ...

and tony's use of the word 'irregardless' was just classic ...


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[Doctor Manhattan]

I'm trying to figure out how you have all these FBI guys coming and they don't notice this 6'3", 320 pound dude running away. I know they weren't looking for him, but if they took down the guy doing the snow removal, they would have grabbed Tony. How did they not see him?

He ran off before they got there, They were after Johnny and since they got him they didn't feel like running off in the snow after him. The snow removal guy didn't run.

They don't have enough on Tony (Remember the FBI was demanding Aide to wear a wire, they wanted Tony on tape, they need more on him to bring him down)

Jimmy is the old guy who's been diming out to the Feds all of the current and last season. He's a Jersey capo

Jimmy Petrille(Vinny Vella Sr) is that fat fuck at the beginning of the episode who was at the morgue/funeral home with Johnny Sacks and Philly Leotardo.

Make more sense for him to be a NY captain that gave the FBI info on Johnny. If it was the NJ captain we've seen giving the FBI info (for 3 seasons now! I remember him taking to the Feds right after Liva's Funeral)

What is the name of the NJ captian who flipped?



<a href="http://www.televisionwithoutpity.com/show.cgi?show=73"><img src="http://members.cox.net/nicksporsche/KillBillv205.jpg" border=0></a>

[TheMojoPin]

with Jackie-then Junior at the top, then the 5 capos and each of them have their own squad. Now Tony's crew alone has a consigileiri and a capo. For me, the struggle for power and rank in the family is part of what made the first few seasons so magical.

I must be missing something. "Now" there's a consiglieiri? In the first season, you basically had TWO between Hesh and Sil. Now it's just Sil. But he's been in that role since the first episode. And you talk about "Tony's crew" like he's not the boss of NJ. When we see all those guys, it's because Tony runs everything. They were always there...but they didn't pop up before because Tony hadn't taken power yet like he did in the (end of) 2nd/3rd seasons. And you still have guys griping about not getting theri fare share, young guys wanting to rise up, older guys getting pushed out...if anything, there's too much of that power struggle shit, and it's sometimes the dullest part of the show.

And how do we know Tony B wasn't a made guy? They just said Phil's brother wasn't. The show seemed to be presenting that Tony B was a made guy. The guy went away when he was in his mid to late 20's...how old was Christopher when he was made? 30? And wasn't he griping about how old it was before he was FINALLY made?

<img src="http://scripts.cgispy.com/image.cgi?u=TheMojoPin">
1979 << December boys got it BAD >> "You can tell some lies about the good times we've had, but I've kissed your mother twice...and now I'm working on your dad..."

[Furtherman]

Just a great ending all around last night. Some tense moments there... I thought they were going to whack Jimmy at his own birthday party. Tony going to Paulie's place - I figured he would have beat the shit out of him when he saw that painting.

Awesome ending. I loved the gardner yelling, "I'm jus the gardner!" That guy hasn't caught a break all season. Hilarious. Tony coming home through the backyard like the bear was a great touch.

<IMG SRC="http://www.chaoticconcepts.com/randomizer/random.php?uid=7">
...with thanks to JustJon

[TheKnicks23]

We know Tony B. wasn't a made guy because when Tony Soprano gave him the casino he said "We'll see about opening up the books for you." So I didn't understand taking advice from someone who wasn't even made, cousin or not.

Chris deserved to be made for a long time but didn't get it until the 3rd Season. I still don't get Bacala getting made a Capo over Chris, even if he has the senority. I thought Chris would have gotten it since he was acting Capo while Paulie was in the can.

I'm saying it still seems like Chris, Paulie, and Sil are "Tony's Crew" like they were when only Tony was the Capo. It should be that Paulie and the rest of the captains have their OWN set of guys but we never see them or even know if they exist. It almost seems like it caried over instead of each of the Captains having their own guys. Hell, what does Bacala have 5 guys who all are under him?

I'm saying theres too much confusion and its too hard to follow the ranks now.

<center><img src="http://theknicks23.8k.com/images/papermariosig2.jpg"></center>

[TheMojoPin]

I'm not sure what's really changed...we've seen guys reporting to and bumping stuff up to Paulie, Chris and Sil now that Tony's taken the top spot. They don't have "capos" of their own...but it was never implied that they did have them or would get them. Everything just basically "slid" up when Tony took over. He took his crew to the top with him, but that just meant they get more money-wise...not that they get their own crews. They get pay-bumps...but not rank bumps. They're still "his" guys until they want to break out on their own as capos. They've opted to stick to flocking around Tony.

And I took the "opening the books" comment to just mean they'd find more stuff for him to run. I had no idea that had anything to do with a guy being made or not. Where's the origin of that phrase in that context?

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1979 << December boys got it BAD >> "You can tell some lies about the good times we've had, but I've kissed your mother twice...and now I'm working on your dad..."

This message was edited by TheMojoPin on 6-7-04 @ 2:31 PM

[blakjeezis]

Oh man, what a way to end the season. Tony has no one left. Meadow's getting married, AJ's doing his thing, not playing football, and going off to college (great line, "Kinda gay isn't it?"), Carmela has taken him back but she's only there for the money, Christopher has proven somewhat unworthy, Junior's cracked, Paulie's no good, Sil's challenging his decisions, the rest of the family aren't happy (Even to the point of Vito suggesting he should be whacked), his cousin come brother is dead, murdered by his own hand, and his once and future allies, Johnny Sac and his whole crew, are going to jail. He is a man with no one left to turn to, nowhere left to go. He is figuratively homeless, and that's exactly how he looked at the end of the season.

Sure we could have had the last season be a huge mob war. It would have been violent, it would have been bloody, it would have been exciting, and it would have been completely unsatisfying. We can get all the other stuff on any Thursday night on Cinemax or Showtime. We got what we have always gotten. A show that isn't about the mob, but about a man.

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This message was edited by blakjeezis on 6-7-04 @ 2:43 PM

[Shecky]

What is the name of the NJ captian who flipped?

Raymond.

The guy they ere throwing the party for.

[Crippler]

For just a few seconds there, when Tony didn't warn Johnny about what he saw, I really thought it was Johnny's guys coming for Tony. Then once I saw the windbreakers & Johnny finally reacted, I finally exhaled. Great episode, to cap off a really good season.

So, does Carmine even have enough guys with him to take over NY for Johnny & all his boys once they all wind up in jail?

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This message was edited by Crippler on 6-7-04 @ 2:55 PM

[Jack_Doff]

He ran off before they got there, They were after Johnny and since they got him they didn't feel like running off in the snow after him. The snow removal guy didn't run.

They don't have enough on Tony (Remember the FBI was demanding Aide to wear a wire, they wanted Tony on tape, they need more on him to bring him down)

They didn't feel like running off? The guys were coming in the back yard. There were guys in the front yard. Tony can't be moving that fast. Plus, how many times have you seen on Cops people getting taken into custody, or at least questioned, fleeing a crime area. And I'm not saying that they would "bring him down", but he certainly would have been taken into custody. Everyone present was most likely, and a search warrant executed on the house. I can't imagine they had much on the gardener either. Tony got away so the writers could do the coming home scene at the end, plain and simple.

My favorite part was Johnny Sack falling face first into the snow and being led away with slush all over his grill.

With regards to opening the books, Tony's been using that phrase for years, even before Chris was made. The excuse that he always made to Chris was "the books are closed". I don't know exactly where it came from back in the old country.

[TheKnicks23]

I'm unsure of the origin but I'm positive the phrase "opening up the books" describes when a guy gets made. Also, if the family is not excepting any new members they say "The books are closed".

Traditionally in the mafia doesn't each Capo have a crew of guys? Thats why I'd assume that Paulie would have his own crew of guys like Tony did when he was one of the 5 capos.

You're incorrect when you say they didn't get rank bumps. When it was officially Tony's "crew" in Season 1 and 2 Paulie was just made, not a Capo and Chris wasn't made at all. Down the line Paulie got bumped up to Capo and Chris got made. Now EVERYBODY is Tony's guys since they all report back to him, though the show is shot in a way that the same guys that were with Tony when he was just a capo are still with him.

So its untraditional for guys so high up in a family to all stay in 1 group, right?


<center><img src="http://theknicks23.8k.com/images/papermariosig2.jpg"></center>

[badorties]

the term "opening the books" is a (fairly) commonly term for getting made (in pop culture): chrissy used it a lot eariler in the show's run; they might have used it in 'goodfellas' to refer to tommy getting made and it was used in 'donnie brasco' ...

i thought vito's reference to whacking tony was in defense of tony's actions: that if tony was to go off and kill phil to retaliate for vinnie delpino's attack, tony deserved to get his head served ... vito's remark was to give the other guys at the hospital bed some perspective for tony's actions ...



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[schmega]

winter came REALLY fast. wasnt it still fall when Ade bought it last week? now we've got a ton of snow?

i HATE phil, and i hate the actor that plays him. god forbid we ever see him play another role. i'd much rather have seen HIS face in the snow, not that johnny's wasnt hysterical. how's that for undignified?

its a shame tony b had to go considering the last 5 minutes of the show. to think none of it would've happened had he never found that bag of money.

its sad Junior's nearly all gone up there.

fuck chris for hating tony b. besides being his cousin, blundetto saved chris from tony's wrath in the car accident episode.

tony s is one helluva(cut pan flute)... SUR-FI-VER. seeing the look of panic on his face and watching him run is great television.

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[Doctor Manhattan]

They didn't feel like running off? The guys were coming in the back yard. There were guys in the front yard. Tony can't be moving that fast. Plus, how many times have you seen on Cops people getting taken into custody, or at least questioned, fleeing a crime area. And I'm not saying that they would "bring him down", but he certainly would have been taken into custody.


Tony isn't in hiding. If the FBI wanted to bring Tony in they could do so anytime. They don't have anything on him, nothing big enough for them. They don't want to being him in only to let him go in a few months.

I'm sure they knew Tony was there before running through Johnny's back yard.

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[A.J.]

Though at first, I completely thought that was Phil and his buddy coming out of the woods to whack Tony and John both.

I was thinking the same thing -- I thought Johnny Sack had set up Tony.

On a similar note, I thought Christopher was going get whacked. First, when Phil came to his mother's house, second, when Silvio met him in that parking lot and third, when Tony came to his motel room and was looking at the dumbells on the floor.

The funniest line (about A.J.): "He's been asking about event planning."

"Isn't that gay?"

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[Recyclerz]

While Tony was having his ursine jog through the snow, did anybody else have the thought "Hey, I wonder what did happen to that Russian?"

Christopher may have whined one of the best "break-up" lines ever uttered


She was willing to rat me out because she couldn't do five years? I thought she loved me.


I intend to use that line (or a variation of it) every chance I get.



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[keithy_19]

When I read these posts, I like to read them in an Italian accent.

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[TheKnicks23]

When I read your posts I hit myself over the head with a brick and talk like a retard.

<center><img src="http://theknicks23.8k.com/images/papermariosig2.jpg"></center>

[keithy_19]

Awww come on now. You don't need to hit yourself with a brick to talk like a retard. Just be yourself.

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[Noellevious]

The funniest line (about A.J.): "He's been asking about event planning."


His turn as a "bouncer" was about as convincing as Ben Affleck as a hit man in Gigli.

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This message was edited by Noellevious on 6-7-04 @ 11:14 PM

[TheMojoPin]

I'm unsure of the origin but I'm positive the phrase "opening up the books" describes when a guy gets made. Also, if the family is not excepting any new members they say "The books are closed".

Traditionally in the mafia doesn't each Capo have a crew of guys? Thats why I'd assume that Paulie would have his own crew of guys like Tony did when he was one of the 5 capos.

You're incorrect when you say they didn't get rank bumps. When it was officially Tony's "crew" in Season 1 and 2 Paulie was just made, not a Capo and Chris wasn't made at all. Down the line Paulie got bumped up to Capo and Chris got made. Now EVERYBODY is Tony's guys since they all report back to him, though the show is shot in a way that the same guys that were with Tony when he was just a capo are still with him.

So its untraditional for guys so high up in a family to all stay in 1 group, right?


<center><img src="http://theknicks23.8k.com/images/papermariosig2.jpg"></center>

Is it? I'm just saying we never saw anything that indicated that being made capo in the Soprano "gang" meant you automatically had lieutenants under you. All things have indicated you just get a bunch of younger guys working for you..."go-fer work," making collections, adding muscle, that kinda stuff...it seemed the biggest leap was that these guys just get more money and added protection since they're so close to T.

Don't get me wrong, I totally understand what you're saying...I'M just saying that how that haw the crews are formatted is how they've been presented ON THE SHOW since day 1. What you're talking about was never presented as how things were run. It seemed more about who was making how much, as opposed to who ran who.

<img src="http://scripts.cgispy.com/image.cgi?u=TheMojoPin">
1979 << December boys got it BAD >> "You can tell some lies about the good times we've had, but I've kissed your mother twice...and now I'm working on your dad..."

[TheMojoPin]

I'm unsure of the origin but I'm positive the phrase "opening up the books" describes when a guy gets made. Also, if the family is not excepting any new members they say "The books are closed".

Traditionally in the mafia doesn't each Capo have a crew of guys? Thats why I'd assume that Paulie would have his own crew of guys like Tony did when he was one of the 5 capos.

You're incorrect when you say they didn't get rank bumps. When it was officially Tony's "crew" in Season 1 and 2 Paulie was just made, not a Capo and Chris wasn't made at all. Down the line Paulie got bumped up to Capo and Chris got made. Now EVERYBODY is Tony's guys since they all report back to him, though the show is shot in a way that the same guys that were with Tony when he was just a capo are still with him.

So its untraditional for guys so high up in a family to all stay in 1 group, right?


<center><img src="http://theknicks23.8k.com/images/papermariosig2.jpg"></center>

Is it? I'm just saying we never saw anything that indicated that being made capo in the Soprano "gang" meant you automatically had lieutenants under you. All things have indicated you just get a bunch of younger guys working for you..."go-fer work," making collections, adding muscle, that kinda stuff...it seemed the biggest leap was that these guys just get more money and added protection since they're so close to T.

Don't get me wrong, I totally understand what you're saying...I'M just saying that how that haw the crews are formatted is how they've been presented ON THE SHOW since day 1. What you're talking about was never presented as how things were run. It seemed more about who was making how much, as opposed to who ran who.

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1979 << December boys got it BAD >> "You can tell some lies about the good times we've had, but I've kissed your mother twice...and now I'm working on your dad..."

[Reephdweller]

Having finally watched the season finale of The Sopranos I have to say I loved it. I stayed away from this thread and avoided all conversations at work about this episode so I can see it on my own.

My guess is that Carmine's son will take over, or Tony will try to branch out his terrority some more.

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