ron and fez get worked

[morecowbell11]

first let me say that im big ass card number 2032. ron and fez invited joe wersiki(or however you spell it) to their show in hope of making him look like an idiot because hes trying to keep moore's movie out of the theatres. throughout the interview both ron and fez tried to trip this guy up and both failed miserably. they seemed to think that anyone who would want to boycott a movie would be a an illiterate redneck opposed to free speech but this guy consistently got the better of the two of them. my personak opinion is moore is a ridiculous liar, just check out mooreexposed.com. anyway, i know most of you will be mad at me for saying this but ive been a r&f fan since they were "Radio All-Stars" in the post, but in this case they were most definetly worked

[FUNKMAN]

happens to the best and it may have just did ...

but So What! life goes on and the show goes on...

<img src="http://thereisnogod.faithweb.com/images/funkman.gif">

[HBox]

I'm glad there are people like you to defend people like Wersiki who want to keep people like me from deciding whether I can handle Fahrenheit 9/11 because God knows people like me need guidance from people like Wersiki because people like me have brains like people from Poland unlike people like Wersiki who have brains like people not from Poland.

http://www.myimgs.com/random/hbox/sig

[monsterone]

i did not here the interview yet, but i am reading the interview in playboy, and bush bashing aside, he is kind of right on. believe me, i feel moore is propelled by his own agenda and white guilt. (even google for images of white guilt and guess what you'll see as #1)

and this opinion is second sourced. the libs in my office are up in arms about the fact that moore tried to scoop the media with the prison abuse allegations. it's supposedly in his movie and waited to reveal that there.

lastly, the blocking of the movie, i believe, was a promotion stunt by moore, just to increase tthe hype.

<center><img border=1 src="http://scripts.cgispy.com/image.cgi?u=monsterone01"><br></center>

<center>

<font color="blue" size="1"> Now even though I went to college and dropped out of school quick
I always had a Ph.D.: a Pretty Huge Dick </font>


<font color="white">moe & horde king, come back soon</font>


</center>
[color=White]

[monsterone]

hey hbox, go piss in the corner of this circular room.

<center><img border=1 src="http://scripts.cgispy.com/image.cgi?u=monsterone01"><br></center>

<center>

<font color="blue" size="1"> Now even though I went to college and dropped out of school quick
I always had a Ph.D.: a Pretty Huge Dick </font>


<font color="white">moe & horde king, come back soon</font>


</center>
[color=White]

[FMJeff]

lets keep it civil ok boys

<center><img src="http://thereisnogod.faithweb.com/images/fmjeff.gif">
<br>
It made my heart sing.

[monsterone]

forgot my sarcasm quotes, but i agree with hbox completely. this is the first mm movie i want to see since <i>roger & me</i>.

<center><img border=1 src="http://scripts.cgispy.com/image.cgi?u=monsterone01"><br></center>

<center>

<font color="blue" size="1"> Now even though I went to college and dropped out of school quick
I always had a Ph.D.: a Pretty Huge Dick </font>


<font color="white">moe & horde king, come back soon</font>


</center>
[color=White]

[The Blowhard]

http://www.imho.blogger.com.br/bush_horses_ass.jpg

[Mike Teacher]

1. The man has not seen the movie that he speaks of; this is not the best position when deciding whether or not others should see it.

2. Over and over the man kept saying that 'people should have the right to choose not to see this movie'. This is in direct contradiction to what he says is his aim. He wants to decide what people get to decide, taking personal responsibility out of the equation, this would make it seem that:

3. The man is opposed to free speech.

4. The man who wishes to control what others hear and see, could not control himself during a radio interview and said 'Bullshit' or something to that effect, that needed to be dumped. The discomfort you hear from Ron is clearly, and he said this on-air, is that he would like to have a conversation with this man without him jeopardizing their show. The discomfort is realizing the man on the other line may well have no clue whatsoever as to how to conduct a professional-level radio interview. This discomfort was probably due to the fact that the man could not, in fact, do that.

To him, we shouldnt be allowed to see a movie he hasn't yet seen, because he says so, and uttering obscenities on-air is of no consequence to him.

Yeah, I can see where he just Killed Ron and Fez.


<IMG SRC="http://members.aol.com/miketeachr/sigsig">

This message was edited by Mike Teacher on 6-21-04 @ 12:41 AM

[mikeyboy]

I did hear the interview, and I disagree with your characterization. Ron & Fez did not go into this expecting the guy to be an idiot. They're much smarter than that. They did pick at the flaws in his argument though:

1) That despite the fact that Wersiki is within his rights to do what he is doing, there is something very anti-free speech in attempting to supress the speech of another.

2) Mr. Wersiki's actions in attempting to supress the film were taken without having seen the film. He claimed to have seen some footage (that appeared to have been limited to the trailer) and some transcripts.

I have problems with Moore as well, but I feel that people should be able to see this movie and access the counter opinions and make a decision for themselves. What Mr. Wersiki wants to happen is directly counter to that. I think Ron & Fez pointed this out, and did just fine.

<img src="http://scripts.cgispy.com/image.cgi?u=mikeyboy">
Ron & Fez Show Log (http://www.osirusonline.com/ronfez.htm)

[morecowbell11]

mike, with all due respect, your argument is ridiculous. i would expect more from a person who educates children. Firstly, you argue the man is against freedom of speech by voicing his opinion. a little ironic dont you think. if you listened to the interview you would LEARN that hes not trying to suppress michael moore's ideas he's trying to establish the voice of people who believe michael moore credibility is severely flawed.
Secondly, he did use the word bullshit on the air, but hes not a radio professionl such as yourself. hes probably not had the iullustrious career such as yourself where hes been able to do voice over work.
Finally you keep bringing up the fact that he ONCED used the word bullshit and thats why ron couldnt have a further conversation with him because he could jeopardize the show. you cant be serious with this one. he said it once in the beggining of the interview and had a long lucid conversation afterwards so your argument is nonsence.
im not trying to disrespect you here mike, but your arguments are insane, its sounds as if you didnt listen to the interview and if you did i suggest you listen again, my best wishes to anyone that is stuck in your classroom

[mikeyboy]

morecowbell11, you are welcome to debate the issue that you have laid on the table, but if you continue to resort to personal attacks, you will no longer be welcome.

<img src="http://scripts.cgispy.com/image.cgi?u=mikeyboy">
Ron & Fez Show Log (http://www.osirusonline.com/ronfez.htm)

[HBox]

And what people don't understand is that this will be by far Moore's biggest film, seen by his biggest audience yet. if he pulls the same crap like he did in Bowling for Columbine, his career is over and he'll probably do damage to his cause. So if I were conservative and I believe that Moore is a lying scumbag, I'd want the film to be released.

Also, what a lot of people don't understand is that a documentary is NEVER objective. You can only show 2 hours of literally 100s of hours filmed. Interviews will always be edited down, often with a slant. This is the case with every documentary ever. If he makes someone look stupid, that's alright. If he makes someone look like he said something that he clearly didn't, that's wrong.

http://www.myimgs.com/random/hbox/sig

[morecowbell11]

mikeyboy...i do apologize if i offended anyone. Sorry, but i am passionate about this issue. i am a bush hater but i cant stand when the left cries about the rights lies and do the same thing themselves. i would love to hear frankens opinion on michael moore when hes an obvious publicity hound and LIAR. i read frankens book but i must have missed the chapter on moore

This message was edited by morecowbell11 on 6-21-04 @ 1:13 AM

[Mike Teacher]

I have problems with Moore as well


Moore is great at making these films. Roger and Me? Wonderful.

But he just blows it, again and again when he opens his mouth.

Case in Point: How Moore Blew it at the Oscars.

I'm trying to paraphrase, from memory, a village voice article by Nat Hentoff. Nat Hentoff is perhaps The leading First Amendment propenent, protector, whatever it is I use the wrong words.

Anyway Nat said this: Moore could have made a wonderful statement against Guns, The NRA, Bush's Policies, the events in Iraq, and he began to, but when he brought up 'fictitious' election of Bush in 2000, Hentoff says, and I agree, he completely blew it.

Why? Because he neglects to differentiate those who might well have Voted for Bush, and thought the election legit. And in this huge set of Bush Voters, there will be, and are increasing numbers of people who are against:

NRA/How the War in Iraq is Going/Pick your issue here...

[can we ignore whether the election was legit, for the sake of my shitty thread? thanx]

So you have an increasing subset of people who might be on the fence, these are people who voted for Bush, might like or have liked him, but are becoming sick and tired of some of, or a lot of, what he is doing. And when Moore Lumps the 'Fictitious Election' in there, he blows those fence sitters, Exactly the people who could actually be swayed by a movie like this [the hard liners on both sides wont be budged by a mere movie], back off the fence; and some react by lashing out at Moore, or dismissing what he has to say, because he's lumping every bit, evey subset of the political Venn Diagram, into the same lump.

WOW Thats a confusing, meandering post, and I havent even glaned up yet! Not going to! Here goes!

[click]

<IMG SRC="http://members.aol.com/miketeachr/sigsig">

[HBox]

Firstly, you argue the man is against freedom of speech by voicing his opinion.

He is against free speech. Just because he uses free speech doesn't mean he supports it. There have been plenty of people who use free speech to try and destroy it. Nobody here is saying he can't do what he's doing. We're just saying he's wrong.

he's trying to establish the voice of people who believe michael moore credibility is severely flawed.

He's organizing people to stop theaters from carrying this movie, which would suppress his speech and deny me from seeing his film and deciding on my own. I don't how more clear cut I can make this.

http://www.myimgs.com/random/hbox/sig

[morecowbell11]

how is that different to any other boycott. thats what this countries civil rights struggles were based on. if people dont believe in the issue than they wont contribute to that particular fight

[Mike Teacher]

mike, with all due respect, your argument is ridiculous. i would expect more from a person who educates children.


Get past Ad Hominem. It works for some, but with my Ego as dead as it is, it doesnt really work. Either way, as a debate tactic, it's just not good.

As to my career, its not illustrious. But the guy dropping 'bullshit'? you dont need an FCC license to know thats just asinine.



im not trying to disrespect you here mike, but your arguments are insane, its sounds as if you didnt listen to the interview and if you did i suggest you listen again, my best wishes to anyone that is stuck in your classroom


Dude, the first part of the sentence and the last part? Whoa! No need for me to comment on that! Nice try! :)

<IMG SRC="http://members.aol.com/miketeachr/sigsig">

[Mike Teacher]

And you Disable Private Messaging ?!?!?!

ROFL!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

This is AWESOME ! ! !

Welcome BACK ! !

<IMG SRC="http://members.aol.com/miketeachr/sigsig">

[HBox]

how is that different to any other boycott.

Because their goal is to stop me and a large audience from seeing what we want to see. These people aren't going to see this movie, taht is clear. So why shouldn't I? Tell me that, and we can go further.

http://www.myimgs.com/random/hbox/sig

[morecowbell11]

mike, stop your posturing and address the issues i brought up. if you would like to personally speak to me i would be delighted, my aol name is morecowbell12

[TheMojoPin]

how is that different to any other boycott.

A boycott is declaring, "I refuse to support this movie by paying to see it." This guy is trying to prevent people from having that choice. He's tring to stop theaters from carrying the film.

That's not free speech.

That's not a choice.

That's not a boycott.

That's censorship.

mooreexposed.com

You know you've got a really bold "investigative" site when the first things you see and read are not shots at Moore's films or books...but his weight.

And I'm well aware of the "flaws" in Moore's work in recent years. I point people to plug his name into SpinSanity.com (http://www.spinsanity.com) all the time (I suggest you do the same, and dump that "mooreexposed.com" site). But trying to "silence" him by blocking the release of his work is censorship, plain and simple, no way around it.

<img src="http://scripts.cgispy.com/image.cgi?u=TheMojoPin">
1979 << December boys got it BAD >> "You can tell some lies about the good times we've had, but I've kissed your mother twice...and now I'm working on your dad..."

[morecowbell11]

hbox, you make an excellent point. my argument to that would be that if you dont agree with the boycott than you dont have to contribute. there are always multiple sides to any issue, and lets get serious, this boycott is not going to stop a thing, but i think this guy has a right to do what hes doing

[TheMojoPin]

Dude, you gotta come with us on this...this is NOT a boycott.

Main Entry: boyúcott
Pronunciation: 'boi-"k„t
Function: transitive verb
Etymology: Charles C. Boycott died 1897 English land agent in Ireland who was ostracized for refusing to reduce rents
: to engage in a concerted refusal to have dealings with (as a person, store, or organization) usually to express disapproval or to force acceptance of certain conditions

A boycott would entail refusing to see the film once it was released, and encouraging others to do the same. The guy who was on the R&F show WANTED TO STOP THE FILM FROM BEING RELEASED IN THE FIRST PLACE.

Main Entry: censor
Function: transitive verb
Inflected Form(s): cenúsored; cenúsorúing /'sen(t)-s&-ri[ng], 'sen(t)s-ri[ng]/
: to examine in order to suppress or delete anything considered objectionable

<img src="http://scripts.cgispy.com/image.cgi?u=TheMojoPin">
1979 << December boys got it BAD >> "You can tell some lies about the good times we've had, but I've kissed your mother twice...and now I'm working on your dad..."

[HBox]

Well, no one here is saying this guy can't do what he's doing. We are just saying that he is against free speech. And he is, in this case. The usual response to something you disagree with is to refute it, or argue against it, not try to hide it from everybody. This guy comes off as scared of Moore and his movie, and all he is doing is drawing more attention to it. So he's standing against Freedom of Speech, failing at that, and at the same time helping the film. He's a stupid failure if you ask me.

http://www.myimgs.com/random/hbox/sig

[TheMojoPin]

And here, try these Moore-related articles on for size. They're MUCH more well-researched and presented than the "mooreexposed" site.

In "Bowling for Columbine," Michael Moore once again puts distortions and contradictions before the truth. (http://www.spinsanity.org/columns/20021119.html)

With his factually challenged bestseller, Michael Moore becomes an unfortunate poster boy for dissent. (http://www.spinsanity.org/columns/20020403.html)

Moore's myriad mistakes. (http://www.spinsanity.org/columns/20031016b.html)

Dude, Where's My Intellectual Honesty? (http://www.spinsanity.org/columns/20031016.html)

<img src="http://scripts.cgispy.com/image.cgi?u=TheMojoPin">
1979 << December boys got it BAD >> "You can tell some lies about the good times we've had, but I've kissed your mother twice...and now I'm working on your dad..."

[morecowbell11]

mojopin...your just flat out wrong. hes not trying to stop the release hes trying to stop the mass distribution. there is a difference, if only a slight one. i cant argue that this guys plight isnt flawed, but in his actions hes brining attention to the fact that michael moore is an instrument of the left and his message is a politically charged one...its not a "Fair and Balanced One". so to speak

[TheMojoPin]

Whoever said Moore had to be fair and balanced? He never claimed he was, nor is he obligated to be so. And of course his message is "politically charged." He's making political documentaries. That was a pretty redundant "revelation."

Documentaries ALWAYS reflect the personal feelings, opinions and agendas of the filmmaker. The key is whether or not the information that is presented is essentially correct. With Moore, it isn't always. But that still doesn't mean his films shouldn't be released, or widely distributed. Again, it should be up to people to choose whether or not they want to see the film, and whether or not they agree with what Moore is trying to say. This guy is trying to make that choice for people. If his goal was to just challenge Moore's opinions and work, he could easily do that without attempting to deny other people the chance to see the film in the first place. It's still censorship.

michael moore is an instrument of the left

Alright, I'm calling this out. Tell me exactly who "the left" is and how exactly they're controlling Michael Moore. That's a strawman accusation that has no basis in reality whatsoever.

<img src="http://scripts.cgispy.com/image.cgi?u=TheMojoPin">
1979 << December boys got it BAD >> "You can tell some lies about the good times we've had, but I've kissed your mother twice...and now I'm working on your dad..."

[morecowbell11]

mojopin you ignorant slut...just joking... by definition you are incorrect...Inflected forms: pl. docúuúmenútaúries
A work, such as a film or television program, presenting political, social, or historical subject matter in a factual and informative manner and often consisting of actual news films or interviews accompanied by narration......according to the english languiage documentaries are defined as being FACTUAL...just because you dont like this guys objectives doesnt mean hes trying to Censor you...thats ridiculous, he's just trying to make it known that moore is biased.....trust me..you will be able to see this movie

[monsterone]

i am more than willing to see this film but fear the propogating he did with <i>bfc</i>.

<center><img border=1 src="http://scripts.cgispy.com/image.cgi?u=monsterone01"><br></center>

<center>

<font color="blue" size="1"> Now even though I went to college and dropped out of school quick
I always had a Ph.D.: a Pretty Huge Dick </font>


<font color="white">moe & horde king, come back soon</font>


</center>
[color=White]

[Def Dave in SC]

he blows those fence sitters


Wow, I wanna get a seat on that fence.


Here it is, as I see it:

Michael Moore must be commended for voicing an unpopular opinion, or that of those who are rarely heard. There is no dount that he says things that need to be said.

My only problem is similar to that brought up by Mike. Moore falls into the trp of so many extremists--and yes Moore is an extremist, not an extreme extremist, but he's out there. What Moore has a tendancy to do is to present opinion as fact. That is wrong no matter how you try to justify it.

But, like I said, Moore is doing a good thing by voicing these facts and opinions. The audience just has to take his films with a grain of salt.

Also, when one party tries to stop another party from being heard, that is censorship. Plain and simle. This guy wants to make sure that Moore's film is never seen, heard, or talked about. He is not trying to stop people from going to see the film, he is trying to prevent them from seeing it. Textbook censorship.

<img src="http://scripts.cgispy.com/image.cgi?u=DefDave"><br>

Much Love to my Homies dcpete, Todd EVF, Pantera, Tall_James, Saddlelight Kam (sp?) and everyone else who made me a sig


UCF:AYBABTU

[FMJeff]

Morecowbell, passionate or not, "ignorant slut" is not appropriate, whether you follow it with a "just joking" or not. If you want people to respect your opinion, you should be respectful as well.

That being said, have some faith in people to research the facts to germane issues before they formulate thier opinions. The American people, at least those concerned with affairs of a political nature, are not as easily sold on the opinions of a documentary filmmaker as you might believe. For every Michael Moore there is a Michael Wilson and dozens of websites disputing the information he puts forth in his films. That being said, Moore has every right to say what he believes, and if he violates documentary ethics to make his point that is his right as an artist and a filmmaker. Of course his material is inflammatory. We live in inflammatory times, and any documentary attempting to make sense of it all will be slanted by personal bias. The factual evidence of his bias is available on at least twenty different websites. Some people will agree with Moore blindly, others will pick and choose elements of his arguement that work for them. Many will dismiss it entirely. It is not for anyone but the audience to decide what is right and wrong.

All this guy is doing is making people want to see it more...if not in the theatres than on DVD or the Internet. He's accomplishing exactely the opposite by campaigning against him.





<center><img src="http://thereisnogod.faithweb.com/images/fmjeff.gif">
<br>
It made my heart sing.

[ADF]

The "ignorant slut" remark is from an old SNL bit. An outdated joke that doesn't really fit in this context, but not entirely inappropriate.

Wersiki's main goal is to prevent people, i.e. stupid Americans, from seeing this film and being swayed to not vote for Bush. Durh... me am so stupid. Cannot make up own mind... durh.

Censorship.

<center><a href="http://somesuch.org" target="_blank"><img src="http://somesuch.org/sigpics/topato.jpg"></a><i><br><br><b>blablam!</i></b></center>

[Billy Staples]

From an old law and criminal justice major...a lot of talk about free speech and such, but do we really know how it is defined by the supreme court in recent times.

A lot of us have heard the speech equation of you can't yell fire in a theater unless there is really one, that is not covered free speech (paraphrased from memory)

but check this out, sums this up in a ruling regarding this subjuct

"Thus, according to Justice Douglas, "freedom of speech, though not absolute, is protected against censorship or punishment unless shown likely to produce a clear and present danger of serious substantive evil that rises far above public inconvenience, annoyance or unrest."

for more info this page explains it better than I can, actually this is a well thought out argument on both sides, reminds me of Will Ferrel taking on James Carville in "Old School


http://www.crf-usa.org/terror/clear_present.htm

Oh yeah speaing of freedom of speech. dont forget to vote for the video Talk Shows on Mute on MTV2.com....freedom of speech=plug whore

Staples

[TheMojoPin]

mojopin you ignorant slut...just joking...

Hey, *I* got it...and I don't think I was even born when that skit aired.

Anyway, on to other things...

forms: pl. docúuúmenútaúries
A work, such as a film or television program, presenting political, social, or historical subject matter in a factual and informative manner and often consisting of actual news films or interviews accompanied by narration

I never said that a documentary isn't SUPPOSED to be that. What I DID actually say was the following...

Documentaries ALWAYS reflect the personal feelings, opinions and agendas of the filmmaker. The key is whether or not the information that is presented is essentially correct. With Moore, it isn't always. But that still doesn't mean his films shouldn't be released, or widely distributed.

...so basically, documentaries are ALWAYS personal reflections of the filmmakers opinions and intentions. 100% of the time. As an amateur filmmaker myself who has helped edit several documentaries, I can testify this fact to every single one I worked on. Even the process of editing which 2-3 hours of the (usually) hundreds or thousands of hours of footage shot automatically makes the film biased, because the filmmaker is choosing what THEY want to present to us. So yes, documentaries are technically defined as you presented. But I'm telling you that that's now how they actually are. There's no "law" dictating documentaries must be 100% unbiased or even completely factual...and as a result, most pretty much are not. I even copped to the fact Moore ISN'T always factual. But that STILL does not mean someone should PREVENT OTHER PEOPLE FROM SEEING/READING HIS WORK. They can argue against it; they can try and CONVINCE people not to see it; they can present opposing views and information...but trying to actual PREVENT PEOPLE FROM SEEING THE FILM is censorship.

according to the english languiage documentaries are defined as being FACTUAL

But that doesn't mean they have to be. Who is going to enforce that? Like I said, pretty much all documentaries are dictated by personal "bias" and/or opinions. A work that personal almost HAS to be.

just because you dont like this guys objectives doesnt mean hes trying to Censor you...

I disagree with his objective because his goal IS to censor the film! You've said it yourself. He is trying to prevent wide distribution of the film...which is preventing people from seeing the film. It IS censorship. I don't know how to make it any more simple.

thats ridiculous, he's just trying to make it known that moore is biased.....

No, he's not! If he was "just" doing that, he wouldn't be trying to prevent people from seeing the film! If he was "just" trying to show Moore is biased (And by the way, things can easily be politically/socially biased and still be technically factual. You're arguing two different points. Nowhere in your definition does it say documentaries aren't biased. So are you arguing he's lying OR biased? Or both? Because one does not necessarily fit with or "prove" the other), he would create a website like the ones you and I talked about. THAT'S "just" trying to show Moore for what he is. The guest on the show is trying to PREVENT PEOPLE FROM SEEING THE FILM. You canNOT get around that...period. Whether he's actually successful or not isn't the point...it's still what he's presenting as his goal!

<img src="http://scripts.cgispy.com/image.cgi?u=TheMojoPin">
1979 << December boys got it BAD >> "You can tell some lies about the good times we've had, but I've kissed your mother twice...and now I'm working on your dad..."

This message was edited by TheMojoPin on 6-21-04 @ 9:26 AM

[bobrobot]

Ron & Fez handled the Fascist quite well in my opinion.
(Fascist: a tendency toward or actual exercise of strong autocratic or dictatorial control)
It's awkward to have a discussion with a caller who is swimming in a sea of notes and cues to promote his fascist agenda. He was rude, and unfair as he motor-mouthed his way through his scheme to censor a movie he hasn't even seen! Arguing the propriety, decency, or even the rationale of a personal opinion seems pointless when the possessor of this opinion has no reasonable experience with, or working knowledge of the SUBJECT of his opinion! That is propaganda, far more than Moore's film. At least Moore has examined his subject matter and has a working knowledge of it. Moore isn't perfect, I regard him as a kind of "holy fool," and a self appointed "underdog," but he's taking advantage of the cornerstone of this democracy, the expression of "free speech."
Being Jewish (and ¬ Rom), and coming from a family that was 90% destroyed between 1900-1945, I am wary of people who seek to "protect" and inform others by depriving them of information and decrying our rights as people, free to experience that which we desire to experience. First movies, books, and then religions are bad, they express ideas, which are dangerous or evil and must be eliminated. Eventually, as history has shown again and again, the people who possess these ideas, or sympathize with them become that which must be removed!
I believe the Fascist means well, but the road to hell is paved with good intentions.


"Those who can't dance, often blame the band"

[okterrificsk]

""""they seemed to think that anyone who would want to boycott a movie would be a an illiterate redneck opposed to free speech """"

in my opininon anyone who want a movie/book/tv show/radio show banned is a complete idiot. its really that simple.

i would hear this all the time when OnA were still on, people who never even heard the OnA show b4 trying their hardest to get rid of the boys. i know this might be too simple but if you dont like something dont watch/listen to it . so simple.

boycotts of entertainment = always stupid.
censorship= always stupid

next time something gets boycotted look around at who these people are, always crazy stupid white trash. who are 100% more depraved then anything their bitching about.

and on moores movie if its like the right wingers are saying and its all lies, well then that shouldnt be too hard to prove, so why are they worrying so much. either moores movie is facts or lies, by the way all the loud right wingers are acting im guessing facts.

[JZAL8]

Matt Lauer is a tool...is he not?

Joanie loves Chachi!

[The Blowhard]

How does one stop the mass distribution of a film?
This doesn't sound like a boycott, a la Rosa Parks. It just sounds like ignorance.
Now let me watch "Alexander Nevsky" and "Battleship Potemkin" in peace, okay?

[Doctor Manhattan]

morecowbell11, back to your original post. Should R&F yelled at the guy and cut him off like Bill O'Reilly does? Did they get worked by allowing the guy to speak?

Remember when they were discussing the Bin Laden Family being put onto planes while most other planes were grounded, Joe tried to tell them that there was violence against Muslims. Ron told him and stuck to his point that he lived in NY in an area with lots of Muslims and didn't see it. Joe told him to google it and read about it, but Ron held to the fact that he was there in NY and didn't need to goodle it because he WAS THERE. Joe kinda gave up his point, that's not working Ron.

One should see the movie before putting any label on it (He called it propaganda) The more people protest and complain about the movie, the more people will go check it out to see why they are complaining (sometimes they'll see the movie before the people complaining)

I think the fact that Moore's getting people to talk about this is a good thing. If Joe's worried that stupid people will vote for Kerry based on this without thinking about the issues he shouldn't worry too much. Stupid people go see movies like "Dodgeball" and "Garfield". This Friday they'll be lining up for "White Chicks"
<img src="http://a1608.g.akamai.net/7/1608/1174/200461613306/www.movietickets.com/images/photos/04182202.jpg">

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This message was edited by SKW on 6-22-04 @ 8:18 AM

[Doctor Manhattan]

Here's that link mentioned on the show about the light of the Saudis on 9/13 which White House, aviation and law enforcement officials have insisted the flight never took place:

http://www.sptimes.com/2004/06/09/Tampabay/TIA_now_verifies_flig.shtml

Joe told R&F that is was Dick Clarke not W Bush who authorized it, I say who cares? Someone in the government did and we didn't hear much about it. Good for Micheal Moore to get the word out. I wish he didn't use editing tricks to make the story more sensational but at least he's getting people to talk about it.

Am I too late for this discussion?

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[Jack_Doff]

Isn't the best way to stop Michael Moore is actually let people watch his work and see how biased it is? I mean, it's his right to do it, but isn't everyone kinda onto him at this point?

[Furtherman]

I just heard the interview and I have no idea what you are talking about morecowbell11.... I don't think you heard the same one. Ron & Fez did not try to "trip this guy up" at all. It was a simple interview. I actually found it a little boring. Mostly because that guy was just an annoying conservative.

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...with thanks to JustJon

[bobrobot]

A bunch of my friends and I are each buying tickets for the full opening days worth of showings of Farenheit 911, using the same trick the fundamentalists used to puff up that jesus movie. George Bush doesn't require too much assistance making an ass of himself, but I'm willing to help any way I can.

"Get yer cut throat offa my knife"

[Tall_James]

A bunch of my friends and I are each buying tickets for the full opening days worth of showings of Farenheit 911

If you really want to make a difference - you should've donated the $ you spent to make a point to a soup kitchen or a battered woman's shelter.


<img src=http://home.comcast.net/~jamesgpatton/patton.jpg>
Avoiding household responsibilites...one post at a time
[center]The Best Blog You're Not Reading (http://cheeseeatingbird.blogspot.com)

[Doctor Manhattan]

A bunch of my friends and I are each buying tickets for the full opening days worth of showings of Farenheit 911


You mean a ticket for each showtime?

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[Legolas]

If you really want to make a difference - you should've donated the $ you spent to make a point to a soup kitchen or a battered woman's shelter.


You could say the same thing to anyone who wants to make a diference but then spends money for something else. Do you really have to spend every single dime to your cause and not spend a penny of it on something else or some form of entertainment? The money you are spending fo the internet could be sent to africa to help aids victims.

This isn't just for you, TJ; I say this to all people who figure just because you want to help or have a cause, you can't take time out to do something else.

Ron: Are they lifeguards or lifepussies?!?!

This message was edited by Legolas on 6-23-04 @ 9:11 PM

[Shecky]

I'm reading that people are going to protest this film because it's full of lies.

Could it be possible people wanna protest this movie because it may expose the truth?

I've learned from reality based TV shows that you can edit a persons reactions, but to edit what one says?

No matter how he makes the president look, the president does a better job of making himself look like a fool than anyone could.

[The Nature Boy]

A bunch of my friends and I are each buying tickets for the full opening days worth of showings of Farenheit 911, using the same trick the fundamentalists used to puff up that jesus movie. George Bush doesn't require too much assistance making an ass of himself, but I'm willing to help any way I can.

"Get yer cut throat offa my knife"

You're full of shit and you know it you fucking liar. You're doing no such thing, only a fucking a crosseyed mongoloid would do something so stupid.

Bon Jovi Fan Since Day ONE!

[Se7en]

i feel moore is propelled by his own agenda and white guilt. (even google for images of white guilt and guess what you'll see as #1)

Holy shit, I thought you were just joking. But I tried it out and indeed it worked!

Also, what a lot of people don't understand is that a documentary is NEVER objective. You can only show 2 hours of literally 100s of hours filmed. Interviews will always be edited down, often with a slant. This is the case with every documentary ever. If he makes someone look stupid, that's alright. If he makes someone look like he said something that he clearly didn't, that's wrong.

Hbox, I've seen this argument used to sort of excuse Moore, and while technically you're right - all documentaries ultimately wind up portraying the message that the director intends them to - you can't tell me that after watching a movie like BfC, and then studying the number of facts he either distorted, misrepresented, or flat out lied about, that it can easily be dismissed as just 'slanted.'

I didn't hear this guy on the show, but really, I don't know what the fuss is about. What is he really afraid of? The people who hate Bush / conservatives will love this movie, but ultimately this film will have little to NO effect in influencing others to vote for Kerry over Bush unless they were already so inclined to begin with. Add to that the fact that Moore will, inevitably, open his mouth and proceed to doom his cause yet again with his comments, and conservatives really shouldn't have much to fear.

Although now that I have a moment to reflect, it is kind of amusing that the most beloved Democrat icon of the last 20 years, Bill Clinton, has written a book which, by all accounts, is rather mild in its criticism of Bush, and Moore is left to be the big liberal attack dog.

Edited cause I want to clarify this so Mojo doesn't yell at me: I'm not insinuating that the "left" controls Moore - but he IS the most vocal liberal out there criticizing Bush, and it's not as if any Democrat is eager to refute him as maybe a bit too over the top.

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<br>
<br>
Don't blame me....I voted for Kodos.
I look forward to an orderly election that will eliminate the need for a violent bloodbath. </center>

This message was edited by Se7en on 6-23-04 @ 10:04 PM

[mikeyboy]

Nature Boy -

Cut the personal attacks or you'll find yourself put on a vacation.


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Ron & Fez Show Log (http://www.osirusonline.com/ronfez.htm)

[TheMojoPin]

Edited cause I want to clarify this so Mojo doesn't yell at me: I'm not insinuating that the "left" controls Moore - but he IS the most vocal liberal out there criticizing Bush, and it's not as if any Democrat is eager to refute him as maybe a bit too over the top

I'm jumping in anyways.

Why should any liberal or Democrat have to go out of their way to support or tear down Moore? I don't expect conservatives to "explain away" idiots like Coutler or Hannity. I readily recognize those people for the shrill talking heads they are, and that they're spouting their own diatribes and opinions, as opposed to actually representing any type of group or political party. Nobody on "the left" is obligated to do ANYTHING in regards to Moore. It's not our problem how people perceive him. Take Moore's word for what it is...Moore's word.

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1979 << December boys got it BAD >> "You can tell some lies about the good times we've had, but I've kissed your mother twice...and now I'm working on your dad..."

[HBox]

Hbox, I've seen this argument used to sort of excuse Moore,

I'm not trying to excuse Moore. I'm never trusting him again. It'll be a while before I can judge Fahrenheit. But I took a whole course on documentaries in college. One of the films my professor showed was Roger & Me, and its amazing what he got away with in that, and that was one of his good ones!

http://www.myimgs.com/random/hbox/sig

[TheMojoPin]

Flint's a dumpy town, but he made it look like Hell on earth.

How creative.

<img src="http://scripts.cgispy.com/image.cgi?u=TheMojoPin">
1979 << December boys got it BAD >> "You can tell some lies about the good times we've had, but I've kissed your mother twice...and now I'm working on your dad..."

[bobrobot]

Oddly enough, I volunteer at a soup kitchen every Thanksgiving and X-Mas.
Art is a hammer, but someone's got to buy the hammer.
Now I know how detrimental Bon Jovi is to basic human intelligence!

"Get yer cut throat offa my knife"