Newsweek's blunder [Archive] - RonFez.net Messageboard

King Imp

05-17-2005, 10:14 AM

I don't know how many people have been following this story that Newsweek has basically caused a riot resulting in numerous deaths over false statements, but I just had one thing I'd like to say on the matter. If this story were true, and in all honesty it still could be, I wouldn't defend what we did. Because of the retraction though, I really get annoyed at shit like this. Look at this picture. <img src="http://i.a.cnn.net/cnn/2005/WORLD/asiapcf/05/17/newsweek.quran/story.india.jpg" border="0" />  The guy on the left holding the Newsweek sign makes perfect sense, but the one on the right with the Bush sign is a moron. I'm not saying Bush is infallible. He certainly is not, but the fact that it has come out that this was Newsweek's blunder and totally their fault says that we had nothing to do with this. Yet, the blind still insist on blaming Bush and the U.S. for everything. Pull your heads out of your fucking asses and place the blame where it's truly deserved! 

This message was edited by King Imp on 5-17-05 @ 2:22 PM

TheMojoPin

05-17-2005, 12:37 PM

The whole thing really smacks of them being forced to retract their initial story.Why couldn't it be true?If it is, what was even the point?People are just WAY too uptight.Though, granted, if someone flushed my comics down the toilet, I'd probably do some murdering, too.

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1979 << On the streets of your town... >> "You can tell some lies about the good times we've had, but I've kissed your mother twice...and now I'm working on your dad..."

HBox

05-17-2005, 12:56 PM

This whole
thing is fucking
insanity. I don't see why Newsweek should be totally at fault. Their source
backed off afterwards. And that the White House has the balls to blame
this recent surge in anti-americanism completely on Newsweek is either
them trying to evade responsibiliy AGAIN or shows how completely out of
touch they are with the Arab world. And since when has the White House
accepted any excuse for these breakouts of insanity? Then there's to
mention this gem of a quote
Larry DiRita, who works at the Pentagon and apparently has a short
memory. quote:Told of what the NEWSWEEK source said, DiRita exploded, "People are
dead because of what this son of a bitch said. How could he be credible
now?" <a href="http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/7857407/site/newsweek/page/2/" target="_blank">Drowning in irony.</a> 

<img border="0" src="http://img255.echo.cx/img255/5972/mariosig8fk.jpg" />





This message was edited by HBox on 5-17-05 @ 4:58 PM

torker

05-17-2005, 01:08 PM

I rolled a doobie with a page from Gideon's Bible.<img height="83" src="http://photos.photosig.com/photos/71/68/1306871-thumb.jpg" width="125" border="0" />For this I apologize.

[center]<IMG SRC=http://home.comcast.net/~rmfallon/RFnettorker1313.jpg>[center]
[center]Enemy to those who make him an enemy.
Friend to those who have no friend.
[center]

King Imp

05-17-2005, 01:10 PM

Since you appear to be defending Newsweek on this deal, I present to you a quote from them. "Well, you know, theres a lot of anti-US sentiment in those areas anyway, so those riots would have happened regardless." Heaven forbid they take some responsibility for their actions.

torker

05-17-2005, 01:19 PM

Though, granted, if someone flushed my comics down the toilet, I'd probably do some murdering, too.<img height="204" src="http://www.downtownexpress.com/de_67/ed.jpg" width="150" border="0" />GET OFF MY PHONE!Straight ahead, ladies and gentlemen....Straight ahead

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[center]Enemy to those who make him an enemy.
Friend to those who have no friend.
[center]

FUNKMAN

05-17-2005, 01:23 PM

everybody needs to chill, have a cream soda, eat a sandwich or do some fucking thingeveryone has some fault in this situation...  over-reactions all around

<img src="http://groups.msn.com/_Secure/0TwAdA7AVvz2ldnjw80kRVwsu1c7UdrOs1GKJquk79iea0IKr4 RwxKGkJq4aNu7X76!GDtJL9!ZyRCMozmii00zoSpuchIJSY5R8 A1slffKxYEslSCzLIEA/FUNK2.JPG?dc=4675521715404891557">

HBox

05-17-2005, 02:51 PM

Heaven forbid they take some responsibility for their actions.I don't see why Newsweek should be totally at fault.And,
has anyone at the White House or Pentagon even denied that this
happened? This is another attempt to silence the press. What the White
House has been saying is making me puke.The White House said Tuesday that the U.S. image abroad had suffered
irreparable damage from a now-retracted Newsweek article alleging that
American interrogators at Guantanamo Bay desecrated the Quran, the
Muslim holy book.<a href="http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/7864705/" target="_blank">link here.</a> [size=2]WTF?
They did nothing but try and minimize the Abu Ghraib scandal, but now
one report of a flushed Quran with a shoddy source that still might be
true, and NOW our reputation is down the toilet. This administration
has consitently done whatever it can to dodge its own responsibility.
This administration has put in place policies that make this story
believable in the first place. It definiely resulted in Abu Ghraib and
Guantanamo and the abuses that happened there. But no, this
administration would like us to believe that them shipping prisoners to
countries that allow torture, and them finding any excuse to "legally"
get away with what is essentially torture has little effect, but one
lousy story has completely ruined our previously sterling
reputation? 


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FUNKMAN

05-17-2005, 03:06 PM

tomorrow it will be yesterdays news but today it is tomorrows news

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DarkHippie

05-17-2005, 03:08 PM

This isn't the first accusation of desecrating the Koran.  Released prisoners have been saying this for months.And fuck you to Newsweek for backing down from their story.

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King Imp

05-17-2005, 04:08 PM

To those of you who automatically assume Bush had something to do with this, do me a favor. If you ever commit a crime and go to trial, make sure to let me know. I'd like to be one of the jurors so I can automatically consider you guilty without hearing the evidence. 

This message was edited by King Imp on 5-17-05 @ 8:08 PM

HBox

05-17-2005, 04:13 PM

To those of you who
automatically assume Bush had something to do with this, do me a favor.
If you ever commit a crime and go to trial, make sure to let me know.
I'd like to be one of the jurors so I can automatically consider you
guilty without hearing the evidence.I'm not even sure what you're talking about.[/font] 


http://img255.echo.cx/img255/5972/mariosig8fk.jpg

King Imp

05-17-2005, 04:22 PM

quote:  quote: To those of you who automatically assume Bush had something to do with this, do me a favor. If you ever commit a crime and go to trial, make sure to let me know. I'd like to be one of the jurors so I can automatically consider you guilty without hearing the evidence.  I'm not even sure what you're talking about.   Meaning, some of you are so quick to automatically blame our current government because you don't believe in their politics that you overlook the true villain in this whole thing an that's Newsweek and/or their source. This is just like when Dan Rather decided to talk out of his ass for the sole sake of bashing Bush. Look where his error got him. I am so glad I don't consider myself Democrat or Republican because I can clearly see both sides of an issue without blindly attacking based on my parties beliefs. 

This message was edited by King Imp on 5-17-05 @ 8:22 PM

HBox

05-17-2005, 04:45 PM

Meaning,
some of you are so quick to automatically blame our current government
because you don't believe in their politics that you overlook the true
villain in this whole thing an that's Newsweek and/or their source.
This is just like when Dan Rather decided to talk out of his ass for
the sole sake of bashing Bush. Look where his error got him. I
am so glad I don't consider myself Democrat or Republican because I can
clearly see both sides of an issue without blindly attacking based on
my parties beliefs.You
do realize that the only thing Newsweek retracted was that these
accusations that the Quran was trashed would be published in an
upcoming report. They are not backing down from saying that the Quran
shit did happen.  And you do realize that these allegations have
been printed before, right? Don't take my word for it, here they
are:<a href="http://www.philly.com/mld/inquirer/news/nation/10685611.htm" target="_blank">Here. (username-marketing@philly.com password-1dumbploy)</a>Some detainees complained of religious
humiliation, saying guards had defaced their copies of the Koran and,
in one case, had thrown it in a toilet, said Kristine Huskey, who
interviewed clients late last month.<a href="http://66.102.7.104/search?q=cache:cBAdCUQ2aOsJ:www.ccr-ny.org/v2/reports/docs/Gitmo-compositestatementFINAL23july04.pdf+attorneys+Guan tanamo+Koran+pages+ripped&hl=en&client=safari" target="_blank">Here.</a><a href="http://66.102.7.104/search?q=cache:cBAdCUQ2aOsJ:www.ccr-ny.org/v2/reports/docs/Gitmo-compositestatementFINAL23july04.pdf+attorneys+Guan tanamo+Koran+pages+ripped&hl=en&client=safari" target="_blank"></a> 72. They were never given prayer mats and initially they didn’t get a Koran. When the Korans were provided, they were kicked and thrown about by the guards and on occasion thrown in the buckets used for the toilets. This kept happening. When ithappened it was always said to be an accident but it was a recurrent theme.[quote]74. Asif says that ‘it was impossible to pray because initially we did not know the direction to pray, but also given that we couldn’t move and the harassment from the guards, it was simply not feasible. The behaviour of the guards towards our religious practices as well as the Koran was also, in my view, designed to cause us as much distress as possible. They would kick the Koran, throw it into the toilet and generally disrespect it. It is clear to me that the condi

King Imp

05-17-2005, 05:27 PM

That's funny, because in every report (no, not a pro-Republican report) I've read Newsweek is basically saying they screwed up and didn't have the correct information. Nothing about they are only retracting it from an upcoming report. Look, don't get me wrong, I don't put it past our military after what went down at Abu Gharib. Plus I don't deny the accusations of what was said in the past. That's why I said in my original post, if you bothered to read it, that in all honesty it could be a real story. I don't know for a fact if it is or not and neither should anyone else.Like I said, I'm neither pro-conservative nor pro-liberal. I call it like I see it. Bush has made plenty of mistakes in the past, I do not deny that in the least, but when you have the source of this latest outburst retracting their own statement and saying they were wrong it is ludicrous for people to automatically jump on the Bush administration over this. Last I checked, in this country you are innocent until proven guilty, but I guess those rules don't apply for liberals living under a Bush administration. Oh, and in case you are thinking this sounds like a typical Republican, think again. I would feel the same exact way if the conservatives were attacking a Democrat president over this without having the full story.

Recyclerz

05-17-2005, 05:45 PM

Oh, and in case you are thinking this sounds like a typical Republican, think again. I would feel the same exact way if the conservatives were attacking a Democrat president over this without having the full story. That's good but also pretty ironic because the reporter at the center of this shitfest is Michael Isikoff, the same one who leaked information (fed to him by Republican partisans) about Clinton getting BJs in the Oval Office, which turned the faltering Whitewater witchhunt into Monicagate.

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Bulldogcakes

05-17-2005, 06:12 PM

quote: I don't see why Newsweek should be totally at fault. Good journalism usually requires more than one source, preferrably three. Or else you shouldn't print it. You can refer to allegations in a related piece, but not do a whole story on one guy's word. Bad journalistic practices. This is why Drudge has a 60% accuracy rate. A reputable news source is supposed to do alot better. But I never considered Newsweek to be a news magazine. Way too slanted. Its an editorial from front to back. Opinion masquerading as news. [/quote]

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HBox

05-17-2005, 06:18 PM

That's funny, because in
every report (no, not a pro-Republican report) I've read Newsweek
is basically saying they screwed up and didn't have the correct
information. Nothing about they are only retracting it from an upcoming
report.<a href="http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/7857154/site/newsweek/" target="_blank">Then you can click here and read the actual retraction, and not the hideous, half-assed reporting about it.</a>Editor's Note:  On Monday afternoon, May 16, Whitaker issued the
following statement: Based on what we know now, we are retracting our
original story that an internal military investigation had uncovered
Qur'an abuse at Guantanamo Bay.Here's
why I am pissed at the Bush administration: At it's core, we have a
story about Quran abuse in Guantanamo Bay. Whether it's true, I don't
know, but I do know that Newsweek hasn't backed down from that, the
accusations have been reported elsewhere, and the White House isn't
even denying it. And maybe it had something to do with those riots.
General Richard Myers said that probably didn't have much to do with
it. So what Newsweek did wrong is that they said that this abuse would
be in an internal Pentagon report.Does that sound worthy of all
this outrage? It doesn't to me. IMO, its the White House making an
attempt to tame the press and distract people from the reports of
abuses and torture in Guantanamo and Iraq. It's not the first time its
happened and I doubt it will be the last time. And I find it ironic
that they are trying to blame the riots on Newsweek. When the U.S.
government does something that causes riots and Arab outrage, we are
completely justified in our actions and completely blameless. When
Newsweek does it, it's Newsweek's fault. Those people rioting and
killing people burning the flag could help themselves under the massive
influence of evil Newsweek.[/font][/color][/size] 
<a href="http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/7857154/site/newsweek/" target="_blank"></a>

http://img255.echo.cx/img255/5972/mariosig8fk.jpg

HBox

05-17-2005, 06:24 PM

Good
journalism usually requires more than one source, preferrably three. Or
else you shouldn't print it. You can refer to allegations in a related
piece, but not do a whole story on one guy's word. Bad journalistic
practices.I
obviously don't know anything about the source, but if he has been 100%
right in the past I could see using it. But they did say in their
retraction they did contact two other government officials. One did not
comment, the other did not dispute the Quran portion. 


http://img255.echo.cx/img255/5972/mariosig8fk.jpg

A.J.

05-18-2005, 02:04 AM

As a sign of reconciliation, I'm willing to publically desecrate the Bible, Torah, Book of Mormon and any other religious text.  Oh, and I'll throw in copies of Greek and Roman mythology for good measure.

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PapaBear

05-18-2005, 02:20 AM

<img height="310" src="http://cache.corbis.com/education/images/marketing/contact/pic_1.jpg" width="310" border="0" />Whatever... <div>Talk, it’s only talk Arguments, agreements, advice Answers, articulate announcements It’s only talk Talk, it’s only talk Babble, burble, banter Bicker bicker bicker Brouhaha, balderdash, ballyhoo It’s only talk Backtalk Talk, talk, talk, it’s only talk Comments, clich’s, commentary Chatter, chit chat Conversation, contradiction, criticism It’s only talk Cheap talk Talk, it’s only talk Debates, discussions These are words with a d this time Dialogue, duologue, diatribe Dissension, declamation Double talk, double talk Talk, talk, it’s all talk Too much talk, small talk Talk that trash Expressions, editorials, explanations Exclamations, exaggerations It’s all talk Elephant talk, elephant talk, elephant talk!</div>As someone who really gives a damn... it's getting very difficult to give a damn.

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HelghastElite

05-18-2005, 02:18 PM

Even if the allegations were 100% true (not saying they are - quite frankly, don't really give a shit; garbage like this makes me want to start using Korans for toilet paper on a regular basis) it would be criminally irresponsible at the very least for any American to publish it.  Freedom of the press should stop a goddamn good way before the line where deliberately furthering the enemy's aims in wartime begins. I love how Newsweek is asking itself, "How did Newsweek get its facts wrong? And how did the story feed into serious international unrest?"I'll respond to the questions Newsweek's delusional schizophrenics are asking themselves. 1. You didn't care about the facts. 2. Direct causality. Sticking with #1 for a sec - I don't care about the facts either. Because even if every word of the story was true, as loyal Americans, it was your duty to suppress it. If you think you have a "higher duty" to your profession than you do to your country, I cordially invite you to make that case to the American people. Then we can decide if we want to keep buying your shitty magazine. On to #2. You're lying, simpering, solipsistic MURDERING bastards with the moral sense of a Palestinian or a Frenchman. Fuck you. 15 people dead and all you can do is wonder querulously about the merits of your fucking story. FUCK YOU. Jesus God, I wish we really did live in the Nazi-fascist-hegemonic-oil-fuelled-dictatorship you fucking dipshits bitch about all the fucking time. I would LOVE to see each and every one of you motherfuckers hang by the neck until you're fucking dead, dead, dead. Every fucking journalist on the face of the earth ought to be begging forgiveness from every decent human being he sees today. Because you assholes are fucking filth. 

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TheMojoPin

05-18-2005, 02:36 PM

Now THAT was a great bit!

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1979 << On the streets of your town... >> "You can tell some lies about the good times we've had, but I've kissed your mother twice...and now I'm working on your dad..."

Shaka

05-18-2005, 02:55 PM

Why do so many of you sympathize with the Islamic thugs? I'm sure most of you whitebread crackers live in ivory towers. Join the military and see what the world is really like, you pussies! You can't even admit that Newsweek is wrong. Shame on you.

HBox

05-18-2005, 03:39 PM

I love the logic. Action A
everyone knows and agrees is a horrible thing that shouldn't happen and
will help our enemies cause. Group 1, with knowledge of this, does
Action A. Group 2 tells everyone. So, obviously, Group 2 is at fault.Way to apply 2nd grade anti-tattle tail logic!EDIT: Hey mods, Helghast's sig is too big. Look at me being a tattle tail. EDIT2: I'm laughing my balls off thinking of you angrily flipping through the thesaurus for that one. quote:You're lying, simpering, solipsistic MURDERING bastards with the moral sense of a Palestinian or a Frenchman 
 

<img border="0" src="http://img255.echo.cx/img255/5972/mariosig8fk.jpg" />





This message was edited by HBox on 5-18-05 @ 7:45 PM

TheMojoPin

05-18-2005, 03:44 PM

Oh, hey, it is.I blame the vast left-wing conspiracy.He better fix it before I rub some of my fag onto him.

<img src="http://scripts.cgispy.com/image.cgi?u=TheMojoPin">

1979 << On the streets of your town... >> "You can tell some lies about the good times we've had, but I've kissed your mother twice...and now I'm working on your dad..."

monsterone

05-18-2005, 03:51 PM

quote: He better fix it before I rub some of my fag onto him.<img src="http://scripts.cgispy.com/image.cgi?u=TheMojoPin" border="0" /> 1979 << On the streets of your town... >> "You can tell some lies about the good times we've had, but I've kissed your mother twice...and now I'm working on your dad..."  you know you're late to the party when that's the first post you read.  carry on. 

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high fly

05-25-2005, 04:20 PM

That's Mojo.Always gotsta play the fag card.... 

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DarkHippie

05-25-2005, 04:45 PM

That's Mojo.Always gotsta play the fag card....He's the Maverick of fagdom

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Death Metal Moe

05-25-2005, 04:48 PM

Mojo is the Magyver of Homosexuality.He can take a pen knife, a straw and some twine and turn it into butt sex.

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DarkHippie

05-26-2005, 01:19 PM

<a href="http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&cid=1802&e=1&u=/washpost/20050526/ts_washpost/inmates_alleged_koran_abuse">http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&cid=1802&e=1&u=/washpost/20050526/ts_washpost/inmates_alleged_koran_abuse</a>Looks like the washington post hates freedom too

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A.J.

05-26-2005, 11:10 PM

The disclosures came on the same day that Amnesty International released a report calling Guantanamo Bay "the gulag of our time" Right -- because all these detainees at GITMO were scholars, politicians and artists like the ones in Stalin's gulags.

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Shaka

05-27-2005, 12:29 PM

Newsweak has always been a rag.

high fly

05-29-2005, 09:30 PM

It's turning out they had the gist of the story correct, but were sloppy in how they reported it.Thing is, no one speaking up for the humiliation or other mistreatment of prisoners is giving any concrete evidence for it helping us in the GWOT.  "Treat the captured soldiers well in order to nurture them [for our own use]. This is referred to as 'conquering the enemy and growing stronger'"---------Sun Tzu"Provide for the captured soldiers and treat them well. This is called increasing our own strength in the process of defeating the army."         (another translation) "In New York, Washington had wept while watching through a spyglass as the British massacred Americans who had surrendered. But Washington, Fisher writes, "often reminded his men that they were an army of liberty and freedom, and that the rights of humanity for which they were fighting should extend even to their enemies." To the American officer in charge of 221 prisoners taken at Princeton, Washington said, "Treat them with humanity, and let them have no reason to complain of our copying the brutal example of the British army in their treatment of our unfortunate brethren.""---"Our Greatest Christmas," by George F. Will, Washington Post, Dec. 25, 2004 Small wars against an insurgency, for example, should be conducted "with a minimum loss of life and property and by methods that leave no aftermath of bitterness or render the return to peace unnecessarily difficult.""In regular warfare, the responsible officers simply strive to attain a method of producing the maximum physical effect with the force at their disposal. In small wars, the goal is to gain decisive results with the least application of force and the consequent minimum loss of life. The end aim is the social, economic, and political developement of the people subsequent to the military defeat of the enemy insurgent forces. In small wars, tolerance, sympathy, and kindness should be the keynote of our relationship with the mass of the population."-----United States Marine Corps Small Wars Manual   

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A.J.

05-29-2005, 11:38 PM

Small wars against an insurgency, for example, should be conducted "with a minimum loss of life and property and by methods that leave no aftermath of bitterness or render the return to peace unnecessarily difficult." "In regular warfare, the responsible officers simply strive to attain a method of producing the maximum physical effect with the force at their disposal. In small wars, the goal is to gain decisive results with the least application of force and the consequent minimum loss of life. The end aim is the social, economic, and political developement of the people subsequent to the military defeat of the enemy insurgent forces. In small wars, tolerance, sympathy, and kindness should be the keynote of our relationship with the mass of the population."-----United States Marine Corps Small Wars Manual Our military isn't who is bombing mosques and marketplaces and causing the collateral damage.

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high fly

05-30-2005, 02:05 AM

That is true, AJ, but the Marine Corps Small Wars Manual was put together by men who had fought and won against insurgencies like we face in Iraq and it contains tactics that were successful then, and I argue, are our best chance of success now. Is there any specific staement in the quotes you'd care to address?    

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A.J.

05-31-2005, 01:39 AM

No.I just read that quote and it made me sort of angry because our military is trying to go "by the book" so to speak and yet these scumbag insurgents still target the innocent. 

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