could a pitbull be moving to your neighborhood? [Archive]

monsterone

07-20-2005, 06:55 PM

<a href="http://news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&cid=519&e=1&u=/ap/denver_dog_ban" target="_self">way to go fucktards</a>. blame the animals and not the humans.

<center><img border=1 src="http://scripts.cgispy.com/image.cgi?u=monsterone01"> </center>

<center>

violent thoughts & prayers

</center>

FUNKMAN

07-20-2005, 08:04 PM

i feel bad for the good ones although i have to admit that i just can't buy into the 'if they're brought up right' theory... i feel that any dog at any time can turn vicious, some more than others. The only problem is pitbulls have the size, power, and rage that kills people, mainly children. a chihuaha would give you a stingy little bite but a pitbull is a whole different storysorry brother... they scare me moreso not for me but for children...

<img src="http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v91/SatCam/sig_funkmanstill.jpg">

monsterone

07-20-2005, 08:19 PM

agreed funk, my problem is the legislation is directed toward the animal and not the individuals who own them.  the greater majority of dog attacks aren't 1's who snap, but escape from owners who use them nefariously.  lock those sick fuckers up; anyone involved in dog fighting should die slowly.

<center><img border=1 src="http://scripts.cgispy.com/image.cgi?u=monsterone01"> </center>

<center>

violent thoughts & prayers

</center>

FUNKMAN

07-20-2005, 08:26 PM

just looks like a tough situation all around,,,  and you're right about how more responsiblity needs to be placed on the owner. i guess you'd have to prove in a court of law that the owner was neglectful or purposely taught the dog to injure or kill people and that would probably be a tough thing to prove without direct evidence

<img src="http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v91/SatCam/sig_funkmanstill.jpg">

monsterone

07-20-2005, 08:38 PM

owing a pit, it's not to hard.  theses are personal statistics (so go ahead and call me a racist), but these folks are usually from the hood, clip their dogs ears/ tails for fighting purposes, ask you if you want to fight your dog, and are black.

<center><img border=1 src="http://scripts.cgispy.com/image.cgi?u=monsterone01"> </center>

<center>

violent thoughts & prayers

</center>

Bulldogcakes

07-21-2005, 02:41 AM

Pit bull typically describes three kinds of dogs — the American Pit
Bull Terrier, American Staffordshire Terrier and the Staffordshire Bull
Terrier. But Denver's ban applies to any dog that looks like a pit
bull. The animal's actual behavior does not matter.

City Councilman Charlie Brown said that in his judgment, "pit bulls are trained to attack. They're bred to do that."
 This is the problem with living in a Democracy. Sometimes the brain dead win.  

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v303/Kevin2700/cakescopy.jpg

My brand spankin new site Bully Baby (http://bulldogcakes.tripod.com/index.html)

Do Siamese twins have to file seperate tax returns? Or do they file jointly?

Bulldogcakes

07-21-2005, 03:01 AM

quote:i
feel bad for the good ones although i have to admit that i just can't
buy into the 'if they're brought up right' theory... i feel that any
dog at any time can turn vicious, some more than others. The only
problem is pitbulls have the size, power, and rage that kills people,
mainly children. a chihuaha would give you a stingy little bite but a
pitbull is a whole different storysorry brother... they scare me more so not for me but for children...

 People are known to turn on you too, Funk. Guess we should exterminate them. Lets
be clear about this. This is a ban on the entire BREED. With no
consideration to behavior whatsoever. So by that logic, since Blacks
have higher crime rates, we should arrest all of them, and not care
which ones are actually guilty of anything. This is also effectively a
death sentence, because 90% of the dogs in City shelters get killed for
lack of space. This is the most uncivilized, inhumane, neanderthal
legislation I've ever seen. I understand the desire to protect your kids,
which of course everybody supports, but banning an entire breed is nuts. quote:But the researchers also noted that fatal attacks represent a small
proportion of dog-bite injuries and that the number of bites per breed
simply seems to rise with their popularity. Remember
the Disney movie "Lady and a Tramp"? After that movie was released, the
#1 breed associated with dog bites were Cocker Spaniels. Because kids
saw the movie and wanted one. The problem isn't with Pit Bulls, its
with the wannabe gangstas who get them and teach them to be vicious. I
know dozens of people with pit bulls, all of them nice people with nice
dogs. But every so often you see some kid with a dog he treats like a
weapon. But they're the EXCEPTION not the rule.  

<img border="0" src="http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v303/Kevin2700/cakescopy.jpg" />

<a href="http://bulldogcakes.tripod.com/index.html" target="blank">My brand spankin new site Bully Baby</a>

Do Siamese twins have to file seperate tax returns? Or do they file jointly?



This message was edited by Bulldogcakes on 7-21-05 @ 7:04 AM

Doctor Manhattan

07-21-2005, 03:30 AM

I'm sorry Bulldog, but they are animals and people have died. People come first. Even if it's just that one kid who died.I'd like to see a federal ban on all pets, but that's just me.It's not so much the fact that Pitbulls and similar dogs may "go nuts", it is the fact that I don't trust most people to properly take responsibility for anything that could end up being dangerous (Dogs, Guns, Cars, Sporting equipment, Kids)A People are stupid, generally.

<a href="http://www.xmradio.com"><img src="http://scripts.cgispy.com/image.cgi?u=skw" border=0></a>

TheMojoPin

07-21-2005, 07:20 AM

If they can ban smoking from places, they can ban dogs.  They're just animals, and people come first.  Now I FINALLY understand where all those jerkstore anti-smoking people are coming from, because I'd love to live in a neighborhood where dogs like these are banned.  Does it say anywhere they're KILLING the dogs?  Aren't they just not allowed in a specific neighborhood?  Sure, people should be able to own the dog...but at the same time, shouldn't their neighbors be able to live without the worry that that dog is going to turn on their kids, or even them?  Let's not pretend this is like someone moving in with a retriever here...And aren't dalmations semi-retarded and especially prone to bite people?  And yet people want them all the time because of the cartoon and the firefighter thing...<img src="http://scripts.cgispy.com/image.cgi?u=TheMojoPin" border="0" /> 1979 << On the streets of your town... >> "You can tell some lies about the good times we've had, but I've kissed your mother twice...and now I'm working on your dad..."

This message was edited by TheMojoPin on 7-21-05 @ 11:26 AM

FUNKMAN

07-21-2005, 07:42 AM

People are known to turn on you too, Funk. Guess we should exterminate them.  Lets be clear about this. This is a ban on the entire BREED. With no consideration to behavior whatsoever. So by that logic, since Blacks have higher crime rates, we should arrest all of them, and not care which ones are actually guilty of anything.Bulldog,These are the two most assinine statements i've probably read since i joined the board. There is nowhere in my statement that i said all the dogs should be exterminated. Secondly you are blinded by your avid love for dogs.  Judging by these statements, it wouldn't be beyond you to actually marry a dog, you seem to compare humans and dogs as equal.I was just stating a few facts and a few opinions about this subject. This article that i just found seems to be in line with what i was trying to get across:<a href="http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?file=/c/a/2005/06/05/MNGQAD3UJ61.DTL" target="_self">Why Did They Attack?</a>

<img src="http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v91/SatCam/sig_funkmanstill.jpg">

TheMojoPin

07-21-2005, 07:49 AM

Lets be clear about this. This is a ban on the entire BREED.And...?What, the usual, "wait until one bites/mauls/kills someone, take it from the owner, destroy it, repeat the process again and again and again and again down the line" is somehow better?This is a pre-emptive measure.  People don't want to live in a neighborhood in fear of these kind of dogs, which have a history of attacking people moreso than most other breeds.I'm sorry, but this is along the lines of someone thinking they can raise a bobcat or a wolf.  Some dogs simply should NOT be pets.  This is one of them.  It has nothing to do with people being "anti-dog"...just "anti-pitbull."  If somebody moved in next door to you with a cheetah or a hyena or a dingo and assured that it was OK, that he had rasied it carefully and lovingly from a kitten or a pup and it NEVER EVER attacked anyone, would you be fine with it?

<img src="http://scripts.cgispy.com/image.cgi?u=TheMojoPin">

1979 << On the streets of your town... >> "You can tell some lies about the good times we've had, but I've kissed your mother twice...and now I'm working on your dad..."

angrymissy

07-21-2005, 08:12 AM

They would be better off making sure everyone gets their dogs spayed or neutered.  Most of these attacks are made by intact dogs.I am terrified of pit bulls (and most dogs) because I was attacked by a dog when I was 2.  Unfortunately, even though these attacks are usually the owners fault for not properly training their dogs, a pitbull can do a lot more damage than most other dogs.

 <img src="http://i9.photobucket.com/albums/a63/angrymissy/newsig.gif">
"To announce that there must be no criticism of the president, or that we are to stand by the president right or wrong, is not only unpatriotic and servile, but is morally treasonable to the American public." [ Theodore Roosevelt ]

Furtherman

07-21-2005, 08:38 AM

My neighbor's dog just sits on top of his doghouse dressed like a WWI fighter pilot and shakes his fist to the sky.  Probably half a retard but the machine gun sounds can get annoying sometimes.

<img src="http://img.photobucket.com/albums/1003/Furtherman/furtherblur.jpg" alt="Image hosted by Photobucket.com">

Death Metal Moe

07-21-2005, 08:44 AM

I tried to enforce a NO POODLES law in my house, but my mother totally ignored me.  You know what a grown man my size looks like taking a poodle out to drop a steaming pile?Gay.  Yes, gay.

<img src="http://scripts.cgispy.com/image.cgi?u=njdmmoe">

<A HREF="http://www.unhallowed.com">www.unhallowed.com</A>
<A HREF="http://thebigsexxxy.blogspot.com/">One Big SeXXXy Blog</A>

TooCute

07-21-2005, 11:40 AM

<blockquote style="">quote:<blockquote style="">quote:People are known to turn on you too, Funk. Guess we should exterminate them. ÿLets be clear about this. This is a ban on the entire BREED. With no consideration to behavior whatsoever. So by that logic, since Blacks have higher crime rates, we should arrest all of them, and not care which ones are actually guilty of anything.[/quote]ÿBulldog,These are the two most assinine statements i've probably read since i joined the board. There is nowhere in my statement that i said all the dogs should be exterminated. Secondly you are blinded by your avid love for dogs.ÿ Judging by these statements, it wouldn't be beyond you to actually marry a dog, you seem to compare humans and dogs as equal.I was just stating a few facts and a few opinions about this subject. This article that i just found seems to be in line with what i was trying to get across:<a href="http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?file=/c/a/2005/06/05/MNGQAD3UJ61.DTL" target="_self">Why Did They Attack?</a>

<img src="http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v91/SatCam/sig_funkmanstill.jpg" border="0" />[/quote] This actually IS for all intents and purposes a death sentence for the dogs. The majority of these dogs being impounded (and subsequently killed in a lot of cases as per the article) are family pets, no more likely to attack anyone than any other dog. They get a bad rap because of the few assholes that use them to fight. 99% of "pitbulls" are never going to attack anything. UKC registered "pitbulls" have never been involved in a fatal attack. ANY dog can flip out and attack - my friend just had to put her jack russel terrier to sleep because after 6 years of being the sweetest dog in the world, he suddenly started attacking everyone and putÿ 30 holes in her father's arm (some medical problem which made him crazy, poor guy). Labs, golden retrievers, and other popular breeds are involved in more dog bite incidents (albeit not fatal ones - "pitbulls" are indeed more likely to be in fatal attacks) than "pitbulls" are, but nobody's looking to ban them...because the thugs out there involved in dog fighting aren't using them in their fights. Pitbulls weren't bred to be aggressive towards people or dogs. 99% of the "pitbulls" you meet are likely to better behaved than most other dogs, because the owners are aware of the prejudices other people have against them.*> </div>*>I know it is tough for a non-dog-owner to understand, but these are like peoples' children. They're being taken away because they look* like dogs that a few irresponsible people have done wrong with.ÿ</div>*> </div>*>*look like... which of these dogs is actually a pitbull? <a href="http://www.pitbullsontheweb.com/petbull/findpit.html">Find the pitbull</a></div>

<img src="http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v306/Eilial/rf.jpg">

This message was edited by TooCute on 7-21-05 @ 3:40 PM

Hottub

07-21-2005, 04:20 PM

TooCute, once again you have added some real info to this topic. Thanks again! Now for my opinion;It is not the dog, it is the owner!!! The master will determine what kind of pet you have!!Example 1<img height="324" src="http://silentpix.com/modules/Myalbums/albums/userpics/10014/KC.jpg" width="432" border="0" /> Here is my KC. More than likely a Pit. We don't know for sure since she was rescued by "Friends of Animals" on the day see was sentenced to death! We got her at Petco!Now I prove my point...<img height="270" src="http://silentpix.com/modules/Myalbums/albums/userpics/10014/KC%20sean.jpg" width="360" border="0" /> My first son the VERY DAY he got home from the hospital!!  Not enough??? <img height="324" src="http://silentpix.com/modules/Myalbums/albums/userpics/10014/KCkev.jpg" width="432" border="0" /> My second boy. Same thing!! Once again. Not the dog, the owner!!

<img src=http://silentpix.com/images/mysigs/hottub/rotate.php border=0 align=right>
so does that mean that it was
"THE ORANGE BOWL OF FAILURE?"
Staples
See The Cruising Vessel (http://www.silentpix.com/modules.php?op=modload&name=Myalbums&file=thumbnails&album=41)
Check out silentpix.com

TooCute

07-21-2005, 04:42 PM

<a href="http://www.dog-play.com/pitbull.html">Article about the difficulties with breed sepcific legislation</a>

<img src="http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v306/Eilial/rf.jpg" border="0" />

This message was edited by TooCute on 7-21-05 @ 8:43 PM

Alice S. Fuzzybutt

07-21-2005, 07:41 PM

I have my problems with put bills. Granted I have met some as sweet as butter but I also live in an urban area where there are children and some poeple allow they're dogs to run free. For some reason they don't think the leash law applies to them. I never let my dachsie run free. Unfortunately there are too many people who believe there dogs are more sweet than butter. It doesn't work out that way and there are leash laws in communities.<img src="http://home.comcast.net/~stan_ferguson/alicesig.jpg" border="0" /> "We sound just like Cheap Trick only the guitars are louder," - Kurt Cobain "I prefer to listen to Cheap Trick." -Homer Simpson

This message was edited by Alice S. Fuzzybutt on 7-21-05 @ 11:42 PM

monsterone

07-21-2005, 09:14 PM

alice, blame the fucking pet owner, goddammit!!!!!!!!!!!!!!  kill all these fuckers who fight their animals!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

<center><img border=1 src="http://scripts.cgispy.com/image.cgi?u=monsterone01"> </center>

<center>

violent thoughts & prayers

</center>

A.J.

07-21-2005, 11:45 PM

They would be better off making sure everyone gets their dogs spayed or neutered. If only we could do the same to some humans...

<img src=http://img40.photobucket.com/albums/v124/Canofsoup15/Sigs/AJinDC-Sig.jpg>

A Skidmark/canofsoup15 production.

Red Sox Nation

Doctor Manhattan

07-22-2005, 03:41 AM

Now for my opinion; It is not the dog, it is the owner!!! The master will determine what kind of pet you have!!That's the problem. Most People are dumbasses. You could raise a Lion not to hurt people, but are you going to trust most people with one?

<a href="http://www.xmradio.com"><img src="http://scripts.cgispy.com/image.cgi?u=skw" border=0></a>

angrymissy

07-22-2005, 05:16 AM

Now I prove my point...<img height="270" src="http://silentpix.com/modules/Myalbums/albums/userpics/10014/KC%20sean.jpg" width="360" border="0" /> My first son the VERY DAY he got home from the hospital!!My Grandparents have similar pictures of me as an infant with the evil dog Dutchess.  Dutchess and I got along just peachy until I sat on the floor in front of him when I was 2 and he snapped and tore half my face off.  He was a large dog and did a lot of damage (over 250 stitches).  Unfortunately, a dog like a pitbull or German Shepard (evil Dutchess) can do a LOT of damage.

 <img src="http://i9.photobucket.com/albums/a63/angrymissy/newsig.gif">
"To announce that there must be no criticism of the president, or that we are to stand by the president right or wrong, is not only unpatriotic and servile, but is morally treasonable to the American public." [ Theodore Roosevelt ]

angrymissy

07-22-2005, 05:58 AM

But let me also say, I think its horrible that they are actually taking peoples pets away from them.  They need to do something like have all current owners register their dogs after they are spayed or neutered, and not allow any new pitbulls in the town if thats what they are going for.  I cannot imagine how horrible it would be to have someone take my pets away from me.

 <img src="http://i9.photobucket.com/albums/a63/angrymissy/newsig.gif">
"To announce that there must be no criticism of the president, or that we are to stand by the president right or wrong, is not only unpatriotic and servile, but is morally treasonable to the American public." [ Theodore Roosevelt ]

Bob Impact

07-22-2005, 06:09 AM

quote: This is a pre-emptive measure.  People don't want to live in a neighborhood in fear of these kind of dogs, which have a history of attacking people moreso than most other breeds.  <a href="http://www.atts.org/" target="_self">Are you sure about that?</a>Pitbulls are statistcally less likely to bite than MANY other types of dogs.  I personally have rehabilitated several dozen pits in my time with animal shelters in and around CT.  I have dealt with some that have been too deeply abused for rehab, some that came around and quite a few that were the sweetest dogs I have ever seen.  Tell me about your one or two stories of a bad pitbull, because i have 50 stories of great dogs.  Tell me about the one who attacked you and I will tell you about the horrors that dog has most likely seen.  To write off an entire species you would need to get rid of every breed that is more likely to bite than a pit is, well maybe not, there's over 70 of them including golden retrievers, beagles, labradors, cocker spaniels, most hounds and dalmatians.  But those dogs aren't natural born killers, right?Secondly, people have mentioned here that pitbulls have "locking" jaws.  This is complete, absolute bullshit, a myth, and one that an unfortunate amount of people believe (including some vets).  The pits jaw is built just like any other terrier dog's (Boston Terrier, Yorkshire, Jack Russell, Airdale, etc.)  There is NOTHING in the jaw that causes it to lock.  Nothing.  It's not physically possible.The pitbull (Mostly Stafordshire's but later it's cousin the American Bull) was bred originally as a caretaker for small children(This is why a pit was the chosen breed for the dog in the Little Rascals, because of the ease of working with it on set, as well as the reality of the situation).  They have been and continue to be one of the most loyal breeds of dog.  It is this loyalty that causes a lot of the abuse they have undergone, as most pits will do ANYTHING for their masters.  Go watch the video at <a href="http://www.pitbullproblem.tk/">www.pitbullproblem.tk</a> and tell me that they ANY living creature deserves this treatment.  Before you judge these animals, KNOW THE FACTS.  A councilman claiming that a breed is naturally vicious is so disgusting to me I can't put it into words.  We condemn an entire breed, yet the punishment for animal creulty (including fighting them) is very often a small fine.  There is almost NEVER any type of jail time.  Put the monsters who fight pits in jail, and close down shelters that knowingly give these people animals and the "problem" will be solved in 20 years, erase the pitbull breed, and you'll have to do it all over again with dobermans, then rotweillers, or whatever the new "in" breed becomes.There are people out there (<a href="http://www.pitbullrescuecentral.com/" target="_self">PBRC</a> and <a href="http://www.badrap.org/" target="_self">Bad Rap</a>) that can give you a LOT of information about why this is such a misunderstood breed statistically, but I can only speak from my experience.Sorry if I came off as confrontational to anyone here, but this is a subject near and dear to my heart.  I challenge any person here to see the negative things I've seen (dogs coming in emaciated, ripped to shreds, or afraid of anything that moves) and the beautiful dogs that these messes become and then tell me that the pitbull is naturally vicious.

This message was edited by Bob Impact on 7-22-05 @ 10:16 AM

Doctor Manhattan

07-22-2005, 06:27 AM

Hey, didn't a little boy die from a Pit Bull attack? Case closed.quote: I cannot imagine how horrible it would be to have someone take my pets away from me.  I can't imagine how horrible it would be to have some idiot's dog KILL my son.<a href="http://www.xmradio.com/"><img src="http://scripts.cgispy.com/image.cgi?u=skw" border="0" /></a>

This message was edited by SKW on 7-22-05 @ 10:31 AM

angrymissy

07-22-2005, 06:46 AM

I can't imagine how horrible it would be to have some idiot's dog KILL my son.I understand that.  I got attacked by a dog when I was younger and still have scars on my face from it.  I'm terrified of most dogs.  I just am not a big fan of them passing a law and then removing someone's pet.  Sure, they should not allow pits in the future, but these people already have pets.  They need to make a grandfather clause with restrictions for the current owners.  Register w/ the town, spay/neuter the dogs, and if the dogs are outside, require them to be muzzled.  One violation and the dog is taken away.

 <img src="http://i9.photobucket.com/albums/a63/angrymissy/newsig.gif">
"To announce that there must be no criticism of the president, or that we are to stand by the president right or wrong, is not only unpatriotic and servile, but is morally treasonable to the American public." [ Theodore Roosevelt ]

TooCute

07-22-2005, 06:48 AM

<blockquote style="">quote:Hey, didn't a little boy die from a Pit Bull attack? Case closed.<blockquote style="">quote: I cannot imagine how horrible it would be to have someone take my pets away from me. [/quote] I can't imagine how horrible it would be to have some idiot's dog KILL my son.[/quote]<div> </div>People have died from Golden Retriever attacks. People have died from GSD attacks. People have died from attacks by many breeds. <a href="http://www.understand-a-bull.com/BSL/OtherBreedBites/AllDogsBite.htm">Here are some examples of maulings by other breeds.</a> <div>Yes, some IDIOT's dog - that is the point after all - the idiot, not the dog. It just stinks for pit bulls that they are popular among idiots, and they have the bad rap that is so evident even on this messageboard.</div><div> </div><div>Besides, it's not as if these breed specific bans are going to do /anything/ - the assholes who are raising "pit bulls" to be vicious fighting dogs are not likely to follow these laws anyway. It's all the responsible owners with dogs just as sweet as any other that are getting the shaft. Their family pets are being taken away and killed because of the hideous prejudice the actions of a few assholes have created in the community.</div><div> </div><div> </div><div> </div><div> </div>

<img src="http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v306/Eilial/rf.jpg">

Doctor Manhattan

07-22-2005, 06:55 AM

Sure, they should not allow pits in the future, but these people already have pets.  They need to make a grandfather clause with restrictions for the current owners.  Register w/ the town, spay/neuter the dogs, and if the dogs are outside, require them to be muzzled.  One violation and the dog is taken away.That's a good idea. May cost a lot to pull off, but it would be better for those pet owners who actually take care of the pets. I know what I'm saying sucks to those who take responsibility for thier dogs. But I have always put Kids before animals. I love kids. so I'm a bit biased. I just don't want any kids to die because of lazy/irresponsible pet owners.

<a href="http://www.xmradio.com"><img src="http://scripts.cgispy.com/image.cgi?u=skw" border=0></a>

TooCute

07-22-2005, 07:01 AM

<blockquote style="">quote: I know what I'm saying sucks to those who take responsibility for thier dogs. But I have always put Kids before animals. I love kids. so I'm a bit biased. I just don't want any kids to die because of lazy/irresponsible pet owners.[/quote] <div> </div><div>And a breed specific ban (keeping in mind that "pit bull" is not a breed, so how the hell do you enforce it, anyway?) is protecting children from lazy and irresponsible owners, how? How pointless is your comment, anyhow - "I love kids, so I'm a bit biased" - do you think there is anyone reading this that actually feels that it is ok if kids (and adults, and other peoples' dogs, and anything else) are getting mauled by "pitbulls" ?</div>

<img src="http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v306/Eilial/rf.jpg">

Bob Impact

07-22-2005, 07:14 AM

I know what I'm saying sucks to those who take responsibility for thier dogs. But I have always put Kids before animals. I love kids. so I'm a bit biased. I just don't want any kids to die because of lazy/irresponsible pet owners.It's the oldest trick in the book to attack based upon emotion, but NOBODY likes children dying.  If this is actually true you should be fighting to stiffen penalties on those who abuse animals.  End of story.

Doctor Manhattan

07-22-2005, 08:04 AM

quote: It's the oldest trick in the book to attack based upon emotion, but NOBODY likes children dying.  If this is actually true you should be fighting to stiffen penalties on those who abuse animals.  End of story. There is no trick. I'm not fighting against Dog owners. I am just sitting at my computer agreeing with the ban in Denver. It would be better if they could regulate the people who own the dogs. And I don't think I said anything to indicate I would not want very stiff penalties for those who abuse any animals. Saying I'd like to protect Kids is not mutually exclusive of being in favor of going after Animal abusers. Showing pictures of Dogs with Kids is using that same "trick." Once that boy died in Denver that was the end of the story for me. Most People just can't be trusted with these dogs. I know there are other breeds (If Pitt Bulls aren't a breed, what is a "Pitt Bull" then? What breed would include them?) That can be dangerous; I would be in favor of expanding the ban on those breeds as well. I'm not anti-dog; I'm anti-idiot who happen to have dogs. It's just way harder to regulate idiots. And No, I don't think anyone would think it's "okay" for Kids to get hurt or killed by Dogs, I just feel there are a number of people who put Pets and Kids on the same level (Not that they think Kids are animals, but they put Pets on par with other family members, which is fine, but I don't agree with) If someone is going to get the short end of the stick because of an unfair law, I'd rather it be people who benefit from it, not animals.  And on top of that I'd much rather prefer a fair law that doesn't hurt innocent dog owners. I do think it sucks for someone's dog to be taken away because of the actions of someone else. It's not fair. I recognize that. I also recognize that there are people who shouldn't have kids, I know that's another story, but I also think there should be stiffer laws and penalties of idiots who raise kids who become dangerous. I would like a totally fair law to be put into place to protect Kids and Animals; I just don't think it's going to happen. My spelling sucks, I'll try to fix it...  <a href="http://www.xmradio.com/"><img src="http://scripts.cgispy.com/image.cgi?u=skw" border="0" /></a>

This message was edited by SKW on 7-22-05 @ 12:09 PM

Doctor Manhattan

07-22-2005, 08:28 AM

I do have one question, and this isn't a joke at all. You you guys who are opposed to this law still be opposed if instead of Pit Bulls it was Lions that were banned in Denver? If people kept Lions as pets and a couple of them hurt people but others did not since they took care of their Lions but had to give them up because of the ban, would you still be on the side of the animals?Now, I am not trying to say Pitt Bulls are the same as Lions. I'm just taking the Dog thing out of the equation.

<a href="http://www.xmradio.com"><img src="http://scripts.cgispy.com/image.cgi?u=skw" border=0></a>

Bob Impact

07-22-2005, 08:29 AM

Showing pictures of Dogs with Kids is using that same "trick." Once that boy died in Denver, that was the end of the story for me. Most People just can't be trusted with these dogs.  I agree there is a plea to emotion in showing pits with children, but it's more a demonstration of the exasperation most pit owners feel about people saying their dogs are "dangerous"  You say on one hand that you're not in favor of people owning so called dangerous dogs, but if there was a way to get rid of the problem without sacraficing the dogs you would be in favor of that instead.  I'm saying that by increasing penalties for abuse (which is not simply beating or starving the dog, it involves neglectful treatment as well) would help tremendously.   quote: I know there are other breeds (If Pitt Bulls aren't a breed, what is a "Pitt Bull" then? What breed would include them?) that can be dangerous, I would be in favor of explanding the ban on those breeds as well.  As I've said, if you go based upon actual stats, you would need to ban 70 other breeds.  There are two breeds people look at and say pit bull: Staffordshire Terriers<img height="295" src="http://www.wolgast.de/Rathaus/Ortsrecht_der_Stadt_Wolgast/Rasenmaherlarmverordnung/Hundehalterverordnung/american_staffordshire_terrier.gif" width="439" border="0" />and American Bull Terriers (American Pit Bull Terrier)<img height="350" src="http://www.dogbreedinfo.com/images11/AmericanPitMountbrierfarmsleon_4h3.jpg" width="254" border="0" />Some people throw Boxers and Miniature Bull Terriers into the breed as well, but this is not what people think of when they think "Pit Bull"  I've worked with both and in my experience there is no real change in temperment, Staffordshires are usually the weaker of the two breeds, and can be somewhat easier to train, American Bulls are more likely to be playful and develop seperation anxiety with their owners.

This message was edited by Bob Impact on 7-22-05 @ 12:34 PM

Bob Impact

07-22-2005, 08:33 AM

quote: I do have one question, and this isn't a joke at all. You you guys who are opposed to this law still be opposed if instead of Pit Bulls it was Lions that were banned in Denver? If people kept Lions as pets and a couple of them hurt people but others did not since they took care of their Lions but had to give them up because of the ban, would you still be on the side of the animals? Now, I am not trying to say Pitt Bulls are the same as Lions. I'm just taking the Dog thing out of the equation.  Left to it's own devices, (IE Not caged) a Lion will eat whatever it contacts, it's natural role is that of a predator.  A pitbull is a domesticated animal (and has been for several centuries) it's role is to be a pet.  There is no point answering this question, you could substitute any dog breed, or sheeps and horses for pitbulls in this question, or tigers and bear for the lion and it would still ask the same thing. Wild animals and domestic animals are two different things.  You wouldn't bring a wolf into your house, but it's in the same genus as a domestic dog.

This message was edited by Bob Impact on 7-22-05 @ 12:36 PM

TheMojoPin

07-22-2005, 08:42 AM

Goddamn, those dogs are scary.I'm sure the numbers somehow prove me wrong, but I remember growing up, it seemed like whenever you'd see a dog being walked or behind a fence that would just go seriously APESHIT when someone went by almost always looked like one of THOSE dogs.  And not the usual, "bark-bark, go away!"  This was clearly, "you're lucky there's something keeping me from you, because otherwise I'd eat your face."  And usually I knew the families that owned them.  They weren't assholes...they treated the dogs just fine.  These things just usually did not like or trust anyone not part of their "family."  Always seemed like a recipe for disaster.And yeah, I know they can be trained.  I just don't trust animals, and espcially not THOSE animals.  Domesticate them all you want...you can't take the wild out of an animal.  And hey, I stick by that.  I've never had a pet, and never will.  I think animals and people should be seperate as much as possible...we do too much damage to each other (mostly us to them, but still).

<img src="http://scripts.cgispy.com/image.cgi?u=TheMojoPin">

1979 << On the streets of your town... >> "You can tell some lies about the good times we've had, but I've kissed your mother twice...and now I'm working on your dad..."

angrymissy

07-22-2005, 09:40 AM

you can't take the wild out of an animalmy kitties still have wild lion in them:<img src="http://www.foundrymusic.com/common_images/member_galleries/155921_IM000535.JPG" border="1" /> <img src="http://i9.photobucket.com/albums/a63/angrymissy/newsig.gif" border="0" /> "To announce that there must be no criticism of the president, or that we are to stand by the president right or wrong, is not only unpatriotic and servile, but is morally treasonable to the American public." [ Theodore Roosevelt ]

This message was edited by angrymissy on 7-22-05 @ 1:50 PM

Doctor Manhattan

07-22-2005, 09:44 AM

<img height="498" src="http://s1.imagesubmit.com/2005327201524_pittbull.jpg" width="560" border="0" />Found this one a Google Image Search for "pittbull"<a href="http://www.xmradio.com/"><img src="http://scripts.cgispy.com/image.cgi?u=skw" border="0" /></a>

This message was edited by SKW on 7-22-05 @ 1:45 PM

Bulldogcakes

07-23-2005, 06:15 AM

quote:Bulldog,These
are the two most assinine statements i've probably read since i joined
the board.Asinine You
might want to learn how to SPELL a word before you go around trying to
insult people with it. You know, so you dont make an ass out of
yourself. 
 There is nowhere in my statement that i said all the dogs
should be exterminated. Secondly you are blinded by your avid love for
dogs. Judging by these statements, it wouldn't be beyond you to
actually marry a dog, you seem to compare humans and dogs as equal.I
was just stating a few facts and a few opinions about this subject. I
know you dont make the connection, but if you educate yourself on this
subject you would know that is the EFFECT of this law. The ban is on
the ENTIRE breed, and there's no space for them at the shelters. What
do you think happens to dogs when there's no space for them? They get
killed, and you're  supporting a law that makes it happen. So
please defend this law with the understading that most of these dogs
are killed. 
 My comparisons to people was to try to get those of you that
dont own pets to empathize and to examine the logic behind these laws,
which I think is faulty. Are pets equal to humans? Of couse not. Are
they members of the family? You bet. BTW Here's some of my Honeymoon pix<img width="236" height="235" border="0" src="http://crackednews.com/dogmarriage.jpg" />  


http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v303/Kevin2700/cakescopy.jpg

My brand spankin new site Bully Baby (http://bulldogcakes.tripod.com/index.html)

Do Siamese twins have to file seperate tax returns? Or do they file jointly?

FUNKMAN

07-23-2005, 06:43 AM

My comparisons to people was to try to get those of you that dont own pets to empathize and to examine the logic behind these laws, which I think is faulty. Are pets equal to humans? Of couse not.i believe you are 'backtracking' a little here but it really doesn't matter...  i have been a pet owner for 19 years and cried each time i had to bury one of our cats in the backyard, and i also have children...I also love dogs. When i visit a friends house who owns a dog they could jump on me all they want and i'll scratch their backs all night longi'll just stand by what i stated in my first reply(below). it seems alot of people have stated that there are 'other dogs that BITE more than pitbulls' which may be the case but i haven't heard of any other dogs that kill more than pit bulls. And i believe we have been excluding the killing of other dogs and cats.  i feel that any dog at any time can turn vicious, some more than others. The only problem is pitbulls have the size, power, and rage that kills people, mainly children. a chihuaha would give you a stingy little bite but a pitbull is a whole different storyas far as spelling assinine...to be honest i wasn't sure how to spell it so i went to dictionary.com before i posted it... i felt my spelling to be more appropriate at the time. for me it just shows you're argument has some weaknesses  to have to point out a misspellPeace

<img src="http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v91/SatCam/sig_funkmanstill.jpg">

Bulldogcakes

07-23-2005, 06:55 AM

Fine. I thought you were like Mojo and just didn't like animals in
general. But folks should be aware of what these laws really mean in
practice. Might sound like a good idea, but sometimes the reality is
different. 
Pit Bulls have really got a bad rap, and again I have alot of
friends who are nice people with nice pit bulls. And you read a story
like this and see them targeted this way, regardless of behavior, its
just wrong. If a dog is vicious, it has to dealt with. To protect
society. But this net was cast way too wide, and is sweeping up the
good with the bad. Here's a
link (http://www.dogbitelaw.com/PAGES/statistics.html#homicide)
with all the stats on dog bites, homocides etc.  
"Breed" shouldn't play any role in this. If a dog is vicious, deal with that individual dog and the owner. 


<img border="0" src="http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v303/Kevin2700/cakescopy.jpg" />

<a target="blank" href="http://bulldogcakes.tripod.com/index.html">My brand spankin new site Bully Baby</a>

Do Siamese twins have to file seperate tax returns? Or do they file jointly?

This message was edited by Bulldogcakes on 7-23-05 @ 11:28 AM

Bob Impact

07-23-2005, 06:11 PM

I'm sure the numbers somehow prove me wrong, but I remember growing up, it seemed like whenever you'd see a dog being walked or behind a fence that would just go seriously APESHIT when someone went by almost always looked like one of THOSE dogs.  And not the usual, "bark-bark, go away!"  This was clearly, "you're lucky there's something keeping me from you, because otherwise I'd eat your face."  And usually I knew the families that owned them.  They weren't assholes...they treated the dogs just fine.  These things just usually did not like or trust anyone not part of their "family."  Always seemed like a recipe for disaster.Pits (especially American Bull Terriers) have a tendency to look vicious when they bark, regardless of whats got their attention, its because they usually bare their teeth first.  I've seen several who looked like this when following a "speak" command.

angrymissy

07-23-2005, 08:23 PM

Here's a <a href="http://www.dogbitelaw.com/PAGES/statistics.html#homicide" target="blank">link</a> with all the stats on dog bites, homocides etc.  Not to play devil's advocate, but the pdf file from the CDC in that link shows that pit bulls are the #1 breed involved in dogbite fatalities from 1979-1996 (60 deaths), followed by Rottweilers (29 deaths) and German Shepards (19 deaths).

 <img src="http://i9.photobucket.com/albums/a63/angrymissy/newsig.gif">
"To announce that there must be no criticism of the president, or that we are to stand by the president right or wrong, is not only unpatriotic and servile, but is morally treasonable to the American public." [ Theodore Roosevelt ]

Tenbatsuzen

07-23-2005, 09:09 PM

Well...<a href="http://www.boston.com/news/local/rhode_island/articles/2005/07/15/babys_death_by_dog_bite_a_horrible_tragedy/" target="_self">Siberian Husky mauls six-day old infant to death.</a>I partially blame the parents for this one though, there is absolutely no reason they should have waited to get the kid checked out before the situation got worse.

<center><img src="http://img227.echo.cx/img227/2240/ollie11po.jpg"></center>

Bulldogcakes

07-24-2005, 04:34 AM

quote: quote:Here's a <a href="http://www.dogbitelaw.com/PAGES/statistics.html#homicide" target="blank">link</a> with all the stats on dog bites, homocides etc. Not
to play devil's advocate, but the pdf file from the CDC in that link
shows that pit bulls are the #1 breed involved in dogbite fatalities
from 1979-1996 (60 deaths), followed by Rottweilers (29 deaths) and
German Shepards (19 deaths).

 I know. It has alot
of data that can be argued for either side. Notice that all 3 breeds
you mentioned are dogs which are used by people for "protection", and
therefore trained to be agressive. And nobody seems to be looking to
ban Rottweilers and German Shepards. Plus, for all 3 breeds (w/breed
populations of tens of thousands each) were talking about 1-3 deaths per year.
More people die getting struck by lightning. So the size of the
response compared to the size of the problem is very distorted. But
this is all more about people's fears than any actual problem. 
 
To cut through all the bullshit here, the problem is for young gangsta
punks from the inner cities, usually Black or Latino, these are the
dogs of choice. When these shitheads hold up a liquor store, we blame
them, when they train an attack dog, we blame the dog. If another breed
became popular with these punks tomorrow, this would all go away. And
WHATEVER breed they chose would be the new "problem". Then the Pit Bull
would be just like any another dog breed, and you'd see the bite #s go
down. 


<img border="0" src="http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v303/Kevin2700/cakescopy.jpg" />

<a target="blank" href="http://bulldogcakes.tripod.com/index.html">My brand spankin new site Bully Baby</a>

Do Siamese twins have to file seperate tax returns? Or do they file jointly?

This message was edited by Bulldogcakes on 7-24-05 @ 9:03 AM

Bob Impact

07-25-2005, 06:03 AM

To cut through all the
bullshit here, the problem is for young gangsta punks from the inner
cities, usually Black or Latino, these are the dogs of choice. When
these shitheads hold up a liquor store, we blame them, when they train
an attack dog, we blame the dog. If another breed became popular with
these punks tomorrow, this would all go away. And WHATEVER breed they
chose would be the new "problem". Then the Pit Bull would be just like
any another dog breed, and you'd see the bite #s go down.  Amen!

Bulldogcakes

07-25-2005, 04:50 PM

<img width="250" height="244" border="0" src="http://www.petpics.net/dp/files/1-58.jpg" />Maybe I change my mind. He looks pretty tough, and he's named "Tony Soprano"  


<img border="0" src="http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v303/Kevin2700/cakescopy.jpg" />

<a target="blank" href="http://bulldogcakes.tripod.com/index.html">My brand spankin new site Bully Baby</a>

Do Siamese twins have to file seperate tax returns? Or do they file jointly?

This message was edited by Bulldogcakes on 7-25-05 @ 8:51 PM