Webcast Royalty Rates = Internet Radio is fucked

[JustJon]

<p><a href="http://www.kurthanson.com/archive/news/030207/index.shtml" target="_blank">Read here</a></p><p>So not only are our webcasting friends like the fine folks at ThereIsNoRadio.com fucked up the ass, but it is retroactive to the beginning of 2006, essentially raping them with a concrete dildo.</p><p>And no one will be able to afford to do music radio online again.</p>

[JPMNICK]

<strong>JustJon</strong> wrote:<br /><p><a href="http://www.kurthanson.com/archive/news/030207/index.shtml" target="_blank">Read here</a></p><p>So not only are our webcasting friends like the fine folks at ThereIsNoRadio.com fucked up the ass, but it is retroactive to the beginning of 2006, essentially raping them with a concrete dildo.</p><p>And no one will be able to afford to do music radio online again.</p><p>that is horseshit that it is retroactive. how do they expect people to pay for this? this is the big companies lobbying to get the rules changed for their best interest. </p>

[Marc with a c]

thoughts and prayers

[AngelAmy]

i guess stugots will have to play bobo and perrynoid songs from now on now

[Don Stugots]

<strong>Marc with a c</strong> wrote:<br />thoughts and prayers<p>&nbsp;you are such a wise ass.&nbsp; thhhaaaaannkkk you. </p>

[Judge Smails]

<p>&nbsp;<img src="http://www.radiobbq.net/images/lenay/lenayflag.jpg" border="0" width="200" height="267" /></p><p>Dis is a outwage!</p>

[J.Clints]

<strong>Don Stugots</strong> wrote:<br /><strong>Marc with a c</strong> wrote:<br />thoughts and prayers <p>&nbsp;you are such a wise ass.&nbsp; thhhaaaaannkkk you. </p><p>So what does this mean for people like you</p>

[JPMNICK]

<strong>Judge Smails</strong> wrote:<br /><p>&nbsp;<img src="http://www.radiobbq.net/images/lenay/lenayflag.jpg" border="0" width="200" height="267" /></p><p>Dis is a outwage!</p><p>holy shit that was hysterical</p>

[Knowledged_one]

i blame george bush and the rest of the ultra conservative right

[Sleeves]

<p>it is 8 cents a performance?&nbsp; what is .0008?</p><p>8 cents a play is death and then 11 cents?&nbsp;&nbsp; or are these fractions of pennies? </p>

[JPMNICK]

<p>.08 is 8 cents</p><p>&nbsp;</p>

[Knowledged_one]

<p>If its fractions of a penny cant Sameer and Micheal Bolton to write a program to chop those fractions of a cent off</p><p>That way Peter can then put it in their system to erase those fractions from existence</p><p>Its kinda like Superman 3</p>

[Dougie Brootal]

<strong>Knowledged_one</strong> wrote:<br /><p>If its fractions of a penny cant Sameer and Micheal Bolton to write a program to chop those fractions of a cent off</p><p>That way Peter can then put it in their system to erase those fractions from existence</p><p>Its kinda like Superman 3</p><p>NICE!!</p><p><img src="http://faculty-staff.ou.edu/B/Tiya.D.Bolding-2/officespace4.jpg" border="0" width="450" height="308" /></p>

[Don Stugots]

<strong>jclintsma</strong> wrote:<br /><strong>Don Stugots</strong> wrote:<br /><strong>Marc with a c</strong> wrote:<br />thoughts and prayers <p> you are such a wise ass. thhhaaaaannkkk you. </p><p>So what does this mean for people like you</p><p>&nbsp;i guess i will have to start doing I57 ignite live reads or play commericals.&nbsp; i have no idea.&nbsp; i will ask BADMONKEY, but i think JON is right.&nbsp; oh well, it will be phun while it lasts. &nbsp; </p>

[badmonkey]

<p>Sorry this is so long, but please read it because this is very important. Without your help, ThereIsNoRadio may very soon be no longer able to provide you with shows like Lenay D's Musical Saturday Mornings, The Don Stugots Experience, The Music that Mikey Likes, DJNewStyle, Suburban Shakedown, Kieska UK's Weekly Showcase, Hear It Loud Radio, RobOnt Radio, Hate the Radio, Fandick, and The Badmonkey Show/The Asylum. In fact, without your help, no other internet radio station will likely be around to provide them either.<br /><br />To be clear from the beginning, I beleive that the artists that we play at ThereIsNoRadio deserve payment for their work. The vast majority of the artists played at TiNR are hand chosen and mixed in with more popular music as an effort to promote them and encourage sales of their music. Many of them are artists that you will not hear on traditional corporate radio and it is stations like ours that get the word out about these artists. The artists in our heaviest rotation fall into this category. <br /><br />The Copyright Royalty Board announced on Friday the increase in royalties for internet radio. The board rejected all arguments made by webcasters and adopted the proposal from SoundExchange (the royalty collection agency created by the RIAA). The rates we have been paying for the last year are the 2005 rates. The new rates for 2006 will be charged to us retroactively and they will increase every year for the foreseeable future. By 2009, we will be paying over twice the royalty cost per listener that we paid in 2005, which is way beyond our means at this point without a serious change in the way we do things. I do not have any desire to fill the station up with constant commercial ads to make up the difference in royalties. We do not have the corporate backing to cover this cost.<br /><br />The new royalty rates will look like this:<br /> 2006 - $.0008 per performance<br /> 2007 - $.0011 per performance<br /> 2008 - $.0014 per performance<br /> 2009 - $.0018 per performance<br /> 2010 - $.0019 per performance <br /><br />1 performance = 1 play of one song multiplied by the number of listeners tuned in for any part of it.<br /> <br /><br />At 100 connections almost constantly tuned in for the year, we will owe about $864 in royalty payments per month or $10,368 for the year. If we get to 1000 listeners for the majority of the day, we will owe around $103,3680 for the year. These numbers are just the 2006 rates at $0.0008 per performance. As you can see, by 2008 at $0.0014 per performance, we will owe about $3,024/month and $36,288 per year with just 100 listeners. We do not know yet what we will owe the RIAA in retroactive charges for 2006. <br /><br />These rates do not include the other royalty payments we make to SESAC and ASCAP. These rates also do not include the cost of bandwidth and server capacity. This may very well destroy not just ThereIsNoRadio, but also all non-corporate backed LEGAL internet radio. This will not affect the hundreds of thousands of internet radio stations operating illegally without paying royalties. <br /><br />Everyone involved in ThereIsNoRadio is here only for their love of radio and none of us make a dime from it. As you can see from the above, we spend money to make these shows possible without any expectation of compensation.<br /><br /><font size="2"><strong>What can you do? <br />Write to, or<br />Call your Representatives: <a href="http://www.house.gov/writerep/" target="_blank">http://www.house.gov/writerep/</a><br />Call your Senators: <a href="http://www.senate.gov/general/contact_information/senators_cfm.cfm" target="_blank">http://www.senate.gov/general/contact_information/senators_cfm.cfm</a><br />Call the Copyright Royalty Board: <a href="http://www.loc.gov/crb/contact/" target="_blank">http://www.loc.gov/crb/contact/</a><br /></strong></font><br />Let them know that if they support this, they are willfully supporting the destruction of free and independent media, the interests of big busi

[lleeder]

<font size="3">Can I borrow a calculator?</font>

[Don Stugots]

lets go people, be dailing

[Tall_James]

<p>I'm already prepared for the future.</p><p><img src="http://webhome.idirect.com/~griffith/hrnov87.jpg" border="0" width="386" height="691" /></p><p>&nbsp;</p><p>Get ready for the &quot;Tall James Happy Happy Fun Show&quot; every Thursday between 11:00 pm - 3:00 am on&nbsp; 495 mhz on your Ham dial.</p><p>Mmmmm.....ham.</p>

[Don Stugots]

Chuck and Hil dont have a stance on it yet.&nbsp; go figure.&nbsp; looks like Mr. STUGOTS might be going to washington.&nbsp;

[bobrobot]

<p>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; <strong><font color="#000080">When will they push thru the fun tax so we can't afford any more of that either??? It's time for a revolution!!!</font></strong></p><p><img src="http://www.recordplanet.nl/img_def/vrijmarkt/maart/gilscott.jpg" border="0" width="200" height="197" /></p>

[JustJon]

<strong>jclintsma</strong> wrote:<br /><strong>Don Stugots</strong> wrote:<br /><strong>Marc with a c</strong> wrote:<br />thoughts and prayers <p>&nbsp;you are such a wise ass.&nbsp; thhhaaaaannkkk you. </p><p>So what does this mean for people like you</p><p>To be honest, I haven't heard Stu's show yet.&nbsp; But from what I've been told by him and others, it is a talk show.&nbsp; His show would be ok if it's mostly talk and some music by unsigned acts, like Sleeves and Perrynoid.&nbsp; </p><p>Alternatively, it would destroy a small show like Lenay's, if she has to pay at $500 a month to do her show (but it's more likely she does it meet the $500 per month based on the mathematics prescribed by the RIAA)</p>

[J.Clints]

I wrote in. this is crap

[Don Stugots]

<strong>bobogolem</strong> wrote:<br /><p> <strong><font color="#000080">When will they push thru the fun tax so we can't afford any more of that either??? It's time for a revolution!!!</font></strong></p><p><img src="http://www.recordplanet.nl/img_def/vrijmarkt/maart/gilscott.jpg" border="0" width="200" height="197" /></p><p>&nbsp;we are way passed time for a revolution.</p><p>&nbsp;</p>

[burrben]

<strong>bobogolem</strong> wrote:<br /><p>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; <strong><font color="#000080">When will they push thru the fun tax so we can't afford any more of that either??? It's time for a revolution!!!</font></strong></p><p><img src="http://www.recordplanet.nl/img_def/vrijmarkt/maart/gilscott.jpg" border="0" width="200" height="197" /></p><p>that's weird because that was almost my guess for the open of the show today.</p><p>&nbsp;</p><p>but seriously, the RIAA are fucking pricks. this is twice in two weeks that they've gotten in my way. fuck the fucking cunts</p>

[Don Stugots]

<strong>JustJon</strong> wrote:<br /><strong>jclintsma</strong> wrote:<br /><strong>Don Stugots</strong> wrote:<br /><strong>Marc with a c</strong> wrote:<br />thoughts and prayers <p> you are such a wise ass. thhhaaaaannkkk you. </p><p>So what does this mean for people like you</p><p>To be honest, I haven't heard Stu's show yet. But from what I've been told by him and others, it is a talk show.&nbsp;&nbsp; </p><p>&nbsp;you haven't hear it yet?&nbsp; JUSTJON, fuck-o list.</p><p>As for the music that i play, i play it really to take a leak and a small break.&nbsp; now, i will start to play indie music, just to be safe.&nbsp; thanks jon.&nbsp;</p>

[bobrobot]

<strong>Don Stugots</strong> wrote:<br /><strong>JustJon</strong> wrote:<br /><strong>jclintsma</strong> wrote:<br /><strong>Don Stugots</strong> wrote:<br /><strong>Marc with a c</strong> wrote:<br />thoughts and prayers <p>you are such a wise ass. thhhaaaaannkkk you. </p><p>So what does this mean for people like you</p><p>To be honest, I haven't heard Stu's show yet. But from what I've been told by him and others, it is a talk show.&nbsp;&nbsp; </p><p>&nbsp;you haven't hear it yet?&nbsp; JUSTJON, fuck-o list.</p><p>As for the music that i play, i play it really to take a leak and a small break.&nbsp; now, i will start to play indie music, just to be safe.&nbsp; thanks jon.&nbsp;</p><p><strong><font color="#000080">You've got a court minstrel, what else do ya need???</font></strong></p><p>&nbsp;</p>

[badmonkey]

<p>Actually, the RIAA doesn't differentiate between talk and music.&nbsp; We pay slightly lower royalties for talk shows than we do for music.&nbsp; It doesn't matter if it's independent artists either.&nbsp; We have to be able to prove that we have royalty free permission for every track we play in order to not have to pay royalties.&nbsp; There's no way around this but to pay or go silent.&nbsp; Royalties are based more on listeners per hour than anything.&nbsp; They assume that if you're an internet radio station, that you are playing music all the time. </p><p>&nbsp;</p><p>Badmonkey&nbsp;</p>

[bobrobot]

<strong>badmonkey</strong> wrote:<br /><p>Actually, the RIAA doesn't differentiate between talk and music.&nbsp; We pay slightly lower royalties for talk shows than we do for music.&nbsp; It doesn't matter if it's independent artists either.&nbsp; We have to be able to prove that we have royalty free permission for every track we play in order to not have to pay royalties.&nbsp; There's no way around this but to pay or go silent.&nbsp; Royalties are based more on listeners per hour than anything.&nbsp; They assume that if you're an internet radio station, that you are playing music all the time. </p><p>&nbsp;</p><p>Badmonkey&nbsp;</p><p><strong><font color="#000080">That is the most phucked up thing I've ever heard in my life!!! Who&nbsp;cut this deal, the Mafia??? Isn't a recording of a show that doesn't play any copyrighted music adequate proof that you don't owe anyone any publishing or performance rights???</font></strong></p><p>&nbsp;</p>

[oh_kee_pa]

this is really aweful... while i dont patronize internet radio stations i still don't feel its correct for someone to take 100% + of the moneys generated.... they really need to take this on a station by station basis, i.e. incom tax.... if you make 30,000 dollars you pay 33%... if you make 250,000 you pay 47%... ect ect....ÿ

[J.Clints]

<strong>badmonkey</strong> wrote:<br /><p>Actually, the RIAA doesn't differentiate between talk and music.&nbsp; We pay slightly lower royalties for talk shows than we do for music.&nbsp; It doesn't matter if it's independent artists either.&nbsp; We have to be able to prove that we have royalty free permission for every track we play in order to not have to pay royalties.&nbsp; There's no way around this but to pay or go silent.&nbsp; Royalties are based more on listeners per hour than anything.&nbsp; They assume that if you're an internet radio station, that you are playing music all the time. </p><p>&nbsp;</p><p>Badmonkey&nbsp;</p><p>With out a dout this is bull shit</p>

[Wallower]

<p>What about offshore hosting? I don't think united states of advertising can touch that.&nbsp;</p>

[Hottub]

<strong>Wallower</strong> wrote:<br /><p>What about offshore hosting? I don't think united states of advertising can touch that.&nbsp;</p><p>It really should not have to come to that. Anybody I know who has a show is doing it for fun and a love for radio. Ask anyone on this board who has a show how much money they are making. If anything, they are all losing money paying for expenses out of pocket. This bit of legislation is really going to stomp it into the ground for most folks.</p><p>&nbsp;</p><p>PS Jon. You had better start listening while you can.</p>

<span class=post_edited>This message was edited by Hottub on 3-5-07 @ 5:45 PM</span>

[foodcourtdruide]

<p>This is a prime example of big business&nbsp;using the law to maintain their profitabality. Technology has clearly surpassed copyright laws. In a justified world laws will be altered to accomodate this technology and ensure that the free-flow of information is not interrupted. Unfortunately, in our neo-conservative/capitalistic society laws are altered to ensure that the wealthy stay wealthy. </p><p>It always makes me laugh when the news media and individuals use the term capitalism and democracy like they are synonomous with one another, nothing could be further from the truth. </p>

[Don Stugots]

<strong>Hottub</strong> wrote:<br /><strong>Wallower</strong> wrote:<br /><p>What about offshore hosting? I don't think united states of advertising can touch that. </p><p>It really should not have to come to that. Anybody I know who has a show is doing it for fun and a love for radio. Ask anyone on this board who has a show how much money they are making. If anything, they are all losing money paying for expenses out of pocket. This bit of legislation is really going to stomp it into the ground for most folks.</p><p>&nbsp;</p><p>PS Jon. You had better start listening while you can.</p> <span class="post_edited">This message was edited by Hottub on 3-5-07 @ 5:45 PM</span><p>&nbsp;well put TUB.&nbsp; i guess once this happens my show will no longer be live and will just be another podcast on intunes.&nbsp; </p><p>I got in touch with Chuck and Hil's offices and neither one has issued a statement or a stance.&nbsp; Hil's office did say that they will send me a package to look over for her up coming presidntial bid.&nbsp; nice.&nbsp; Chuck's office will be getting a call tomorrow, it may get recorded.&nbsp; BADMONKEY: get me some questions that i could ask. &nbsp;&nbsp;</p>

[reillyluck]

<p align="center">This is complete horseshit.&nbsp; i cant believe jon hasnt listened to the show.&nbsp; boooooo!</p><p align="center">&nbsp;</p><p align="center">seriously,&nbsp; this is rediculous.&nbsp; well all i can say is write in and try to make a difference.&nbsp; until then.....</p><p>http://i61.photobucket.com/albums/h69/reillyluck/l_307dce1f6e80a3c14d47bb3931da9857.jpg</p><p>&nbsp;</p>

[Don Stugots]

<p>reilly, you just made my day. &nbsp; thanks.&nbsp; JUSTJON, still, fuck-o list. </p>

[KnoxHarrington]

The RIAA is not only greedy, they're one of the stupidest, most short-sighted trade organizations in existence. They're so hell-bent on protecting the dying format of CD that they're stifling anything else that could preserve their future.

[PapaBear]

What the fuck is the Copyright Royalty Board? Are they the ones that put people on double secret probation? This is bullshit!

[Snacks]

<p>Im so confused by all of this. When I managed nightclubs we used to get a letter in the mail once a year to pay royalties for DJ's&nbsp;playing music. We would throw it away and were never sued. I do remember it being a licensong fee for a few thousand dollars a year. Why would they charge a radio station based on listeners per hour/per song? Why not just a flat fee based on the show? I could even understadnd if they said &quot;you have 5000 listners then you pay .0008 cents per listner per year&quot; Not .0008 per listner per song, that crazy. Its like your being punished for having lisnters.</p><p>I wonder when they are going to start sending letters out to everyone telling us if we have a party and we play a music at the parties then we have to pay royalties!</p><p>If you buy a cd or a song you own it, you should have the right to do whatever you want with it, the fact that you bought it should cover royalities. </p><p>Its funny they even charge a radio station fees for playing music. B/C without these radio station playing these idiots music, no one would know who they are or would want to buy their cd. A radio station cant be paid for playing an unknown artist, but they must pay that unknow artist by helping them sell their music??? No right</p>

<span class=post_edited>This message was edited by Snacks on 3-5-07 @ 6:57 PM</span>

[badmonkey]

<p>Links for more information/action:<br /><br /><a href="http://savenetradio.org" target="_blank">SaveNetRadio.org</a><br /><br /><a href="http://www.thepetitionsite.com/takeaction/647826498" target="_blank">thepetitionsite.com</a></p><p>&nbsp;</p><p>&nbsp;</p>

<span class=post_edited>This message was edited by badmonkey on 3-5-07 @ 8:02 PM</span>

[Don Stugots]

signed it.&nbsp; i hope other people too.&nbsp;

[Dan 'Hampton]

During the XM/SIRIUS merger meeting last week it was brought up that Internet radio, sat radio and basically all other forms of audio entertainment EXCEPT for Terrestrial Radio have to pay this performance fee.&nbsp; When the douche bag<img src="http://tbn0.google.com/images?q=tbn:_40VeJJD9B2PqM:http://images.radcity.net/5988/1189651.jpg" border="0" width="100" height="95" />, David Rehr (President and CEO of <font size="-1">National Association of Broadcasters</font>, who looks alot like the donkey boy from Pinnochio, claimed this was fair because of the long standing relationship between artists and radio stations.&nbsp; Basically that radio stations promote artists so they shouldn't have to pay for the right to play their songs.

[JerseyRich]

<p>I would like to offer my band's music to anyone who wants to use it, royalty free.</p><p>&nbsp;</p><p>Just PM me for MP3's.</p><p>It's a professionally produced and released album.</p><p>&nbsp;</p><p><a href="http://www.glennwoodmusic.com" target="_blank">glennwoodmusic.com&nbsp;</a></p>

[Don Stugots]

<strong>JerseyRich</strong> wrote:<br /><p>I would like to offer my band's music to anyone who wants to use it, royalty free.</p><p>&nbsp;</p><p>Just PM me for MP3's.</p><p>It's a professionally produced and released album.</p><p>&nbsp;</p><p><a href="http://www.glennwoodmusic.com" target="_blank">glennwoodmusic.com&nbsp;</a></p><p>send me some.&nbsp; after the upcoming show, i am thinking of getting rid of all commerical music.&nbsp; if you have any songs by crankcase, i will take them too.&nbsp; </p>

[badmonkey]

<p><a href="http://energycommerce.house.gov/Subcommittees/telint.shtml" target="_blank">http://energycommerce.house.gov/Subcommittees/telint.shtml</a></p><p>&nbsp;</p> <p align="center"><strong>SUBCOMMITTEE ON<br /> TELECOMMUNICATIONS AND THE INTERNET<br /> (Ratio: 18-15)<br /> Edward J. Markey (MA), <em>Chairman</em></strong><br /><br />Mike Doyle, PA , Vice Chair<br /><br />&nbsp;&nbsp; Fred Upton, MI, Ranking Member<br /><br />Jane Harman, CA&nbsp;&nbsp; </p><p align="center">J. Dennis Hastert, IL<br /><br />Charles A. Gonzalez, TX&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; </p><p align="center">Cliff Stearns, FL<br /><br />Jay Inslee, WA<br />&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; <br />Nathan Deal, GA<br /><br />Baron P. Hill, IN<br />&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; <br />Barbara Cubin, Wy<br /><br />Rick Boucher, VA<br />&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; <br />John Shimkus, IL<br /><br />Edolphus Towns, NY&nbsp;&nbsp; </p><p align="center">Heather Wilson, NM<br /><br />Frank Pallone, Jr., NJ<br />&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; <br />Charles W. &quot;Chip&quot; Pickering, MS<br /><br />Bart Gordon, TN<br />&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; <br />Vito Fossella, NY<br /><br />Bobby L. Rush, IL<br /> </p><p align="center">George Radanovich, CA<br /><br />Anna Eshoo, CA&nbsp;&nbsp; </p><p align="center">Mary Bono, CA<br /><br />Bart Stupak, MI<br />&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; <br />Greg Walden, OR<br /><br />Eliot L. Engel, NY<br /> </p><p align="center">Lee Terry, NE<br /><br />Gene Green, TX&nbsp; <br /><br />Mike Ferguson, NJ<br /><br />Lois Capps, CA&nbsp; <br /><br />Joe Barton, TX (Ex Officio)<br /><br />Hilda L. Solis, CA&nbsp;<br /><br />John D. Dingell, MI (Ex Officio)<br />&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; <br />&nbsp;</p> <p>This is the list of people you need to write to immediately. They will be meeting tomorrow on this.</p><p>&nbsp;</p><p>Badmonkey </p>

<span class=post_edited>This message was edited by badmonkey on 3-6-07 @ 4:20 PM</span>

[Don Stugots]

<p>called Fossella, the Rep for NY, he is a brooklyn guy.&nbsp; No one in these peoples offices know what the stances of their bosses are.&nbsp; why is that?&nbsp; </p><p>&nbsp;</p><p>i really think i am going to Washington. &nbsp;&nbsp;</p>

[badmonkey]

<p>Friday is the earliest I can go to any offices, but hopefully my suit fits and they'll see me when I get there.&nbsp;&nbsp; Will they pay attention when Badmonkey and Stugots go to Washington?</p><p>&nbsp;</p><p>&nbsp;</p><p>&nbsp;</p>

[Don Stugots]

<strong>badmonkey</strong> wrote:<br /><p>Links for more information/action:<br /><br /><a href="http://savenetradio.org" target="_blank">SaveNetRadio.org</a><br /><br /><a href="http://www.thepetitionsite.com/takeaction/647826498" target="_blank">thepetitionsite.com</a></p><p>&nbsp;</p><p>&nbsp;</p> <span class="post_edited">This message was edited by badmonkey on 3-5-07 @ 8:02 PM</span><p>&nbsp;BUMP!</p><p>people sign the petition.&nbsp; this is an important issue. &nbsp;&nbsp;</p>

[Don Stugots]

<strong>badmonkey</strong> wrote:<br /><p>Friday is the earliest I can go to any offices, but hopefully my suit fits and they'll see me when I get there. Will they pay attention when Badmonkey and Stugots go to Washington?</p><p>&nbsp;</p><p>&nbsp;</p><p>&nbsp;</p><p>&nbsp;my suit fits, but i will be here in NYC working.&nbsp; shit. &nbsp; </p>

[angelinad128]

Since my first reading of this I can just say It's Bullshit and just Fucked Up!

[Don Stugots]

hey, badmonkey.&nbsp; syndication underground?&nbsp; just in case?

[badmonkey]

<p>Other ways to support the station after you've called/mailed your govt reps.</p><p>Go visit http://www.garageband.com/</p><p>Search for your favorite bands and you will get a list of bands that sound like them.</p><p>Email the artist and song info to tinradio (at) gmail (dot) com and I will go grab them and add them to the station.&nbsp; There is a slim possibility that this will help us get out from under the RIAA's foot.&nbsp; Garageband has an agreement with partner stations (like ours) that lets us play their music <a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Copyright_Arbitration_Royalty_Panel" target="_blank">CARP</a> free. </p><p><a href="http://faq.garageband.com/index.php?action=artikel&amp;cat=17&amp;id=270&amp;artlang=en" target="_blank">http://faq.garageband.com/index.php?action=artikel&amp;cat=17&amp;id=270&amp;artlang=en</a></p><p>Even if this doesn't end up helping the station, at least it will get you into some new musicand increase the independent acts we promote til the station goes dark. </p><p>&nbsp;</p><p>Thanks,</p><p>&nbsp;</p><p>Badmonkey&nbsp;</p>

[NortonRules]

<strong>Snacks</strong> wrote:<br /><p>Im so confused by all of this. When I managed nightclubs we used to get a letter in the mail once a year to pay royalties for DJ's&nbsp;playing music. We would throw it away and were never sued. I do remember it being a licensong fee for a few thousand dollars a year. Why would they charge a radio station based on listeners per hour/per song? Why not just a flat fee based on the show? I could even understadnd if they said &quot;you have 5000 listners then you pay .0008 cents per listner per year&quot; Not .0008 per listner per song, that crazy. Its like your being punished for having lisnters.</p><p>I wonder when they are going to start sending letters out to everyone telling us if we have a party and we play a music at the parties then we have to pay royalties!</p><p>If you buy a cd or a song you own it, you should have the right to do whatever you want with it, the fact that you bought it should cover royalities. </p><p>Its funny they even charge a radio station fees for playing music. B/C without these radio station playing these idiots music, no one would know who they are or would want to buy their cd. A radio station cant be paid for playing an unknown artist, but they must pay that unknow artist by helping them sell their music??? No right</p><span class="post_edited">This message was edited by Snacks on 3-5-07 @ 6:57 PM</span> <p>You say radio stations shouldn't be charged to play music because the artist needs the radio.&nbsp; The radio needs the music more.&nbsp; Most real artists get no airplay.&nbsp; Ever.&nbsp; Radio has dumped them in favor of making as much money as possible (for the most part).&nbsp; If the typical awful radio station can't play music, they have no listeners, thus no advertisers, thus no income.&nbsp; They aren't victims.&nbsp; They're playing the most popular garbage (usually the same ten shitty songs over and over again) so they can make money off of it.&nbsp; Radio stations aren't helpless victims.&nbsp; </p><p>I'm no expert on internet radio.&nbsp; I've never listened to internet radio, so I can't really comment on that.&nbsp; I'm having a hard time figuring exactly what this new charge is for, especially if ASCAP and SESAC are already being paid.&nbsp; Does this affect ASCAP or SESAC?&nbsp; Who does this new money go to?&nbsp; </p>

[badmonkey]

<strong>Don Stugots</strong> wrote:<br />hey, badmonkey. syndication underground? just in case?<p>I cannot officially condone a group of people getting together and siphoning off our feed and rebroadcasting it to others using their own resources like a p2p network or individual shoutcasts servers lowering both our bandwidth and royalty costs by risking their own necks legally.&nbsp; I also can't control it. </p><p>&nbsp;</p>

[badmonkey]

<strong>NortonRules</strong> wrote:<br /><p>You say radio stations shouldn't be charged to play music because the artist needs the radio. The radio needs the music more. Most real artists get no airplay. Ever. Radio has dumped them in favor of making as much money as possible (for the most part). If the typical awful radio station can't play music, they have no listeners, thus no advertisers, thus no income. They aren't victims. They're playing the most popular garbage (usually the same ten shitty songs over and over again) so they can make money off of it. Radio stations aren't helpless victims. </p><p>I'm no expert on internet radio. I've never listened to internet radio, so I can't really comment on that. I'm having a hard time figuring exactly what this new charge is for, especially if ASCAP and SESAC are already being paid. Does this affect ASCAP or SESAC? Who does this new money go to? </p><p>&nbsp;</p><p>Nobody says we shouldn't pay royalties.&nbsp; We just want royalty rates to be reasonable and not force us off the air.&nbsp; We aren't doing this for a profit.&nbsp; We do this because it's fun and we love doing it. Otherwise I wouldn't be shelling out all the money for the streaming, the royalties, the computers, software, mixing boards, microphones, etc.&nbsp; If the RIAA and SoundExchange are not willing to offer their product at an affordable rate to their customers, the we will simply be forced to search for alternate vendors to obtain similar products. </p><p>It does not affect ASCAP or SESAC, which we also pay. It's an increase in the SoundExchange royalty rates that we are already paying.&nbsp; </p><p>Hope that answers your questions.</p><p>&nbsp;</p><p>Badmonkey&nbsp;</p>

<span class=post_edited>This message was edited by badmonkey on 3-6-07 @ 6:39 PM</span>

[NortonRules]

<strong>badmonkey</strong> wrote:<br /><strong>NortonRules</strong> wrote:<br /><p>You say radio stations shouldn't be charged to play music because the artist needs the radio. The radio needs the music more. Most real artists get no airplay. Ever. Radio has dumped them in favor of making as much money as possible (for the most part). If the typical awful radio station can't play music, they have no listeners, thus no advertisers, thus no income. They aren't victims. They're playing the most popular garbage (usually the same ten shitty songs over and over again) so they can make money off of it. Radio stations aren't helpless victims. </p><p>I'm no expert on internet radio. I've never listened to internet radio, so I can't really comment on that. I'm having a hard time figuring exactly what this new charge is for, especially if ASCAP and SESAC are already being paid. Does this affect ASCAP or SESAC? Who does this new money go to? </p><p>&nbsp;</p><p>Nobody says we shouldn't pay royalties.&nbsp; We just want royalty rates to be reasonable and not force us off the air.&nbsp; We aren't doing this for a profit.&nbsp; We do this because it's fun and we love doing it. Otherwise I wouldn't be shelling out all the money for the streaming, the royalties, the computers, software, mixing boards, microphones, etc.&nbsp; If the RIAA and SoundExchange are not willing to offer their product at an affordable rate to their customers, the we will simply be forced to search for alternate vendors to obtain similar products. </p><p>It does not affect ASCAP or SESAC, which we also pay. It's an increase in the SoundExchange royalty rates that we are already paying.&nbsp; </p><p>Hope that answers your questions.</p><p>&nbsp;</p><p>Badmonkey&nbsp;</p><span class="post_edited">This message was edited by badmonkey on 3-6-07 @ 6:39 PM</span> <p>I never said that you said you didn't want to pay royalties.&nbsp; Someone referred to helpless radio.&nbsp; Radio in the traditional sense is not helpless- they are parasites.&nbsp; Internet radio is different in my opinion, and I stated that I don't know anything about it and couldn't form a real opinion.&nbsp; I'm sure you're doing it for the love.&nbsp; I believe you.&nbsp; </p><p>I'm still not clear on who this extra money ultimately goes to.&nbsp; I don't understand all of the industry jargon (that's my own fault).&nbsp; Sound Exchange royalty rates are separate from ASCAP/SESAC, I take it?&nbsp; Solely the SoundExchange royalty rates will be increased, but not the ASCAP/SESAC rates?&nbsp; Who or what does the money from Sound Exchange go to in the end?&nbsp; The artist, a corporation&nbsp;or the government or all of the above?&nbsp; I'm just trying to understand this.</p>

[badmonkey]

<strong>NortonRules</strong> wrote:<p>I never said that you said you didn't want to pay royalties. Someone referred to helpless radio. Radio in the traditional sense is not helpless- they are parasites. Internet radio is different in my opinion, and I stated that I don't know anything about it and couldn't form a real opinion. I'm sure you're doing it for the love. I believe you. </p><p>I'm still not clear on who this extra money ultimately goes to. I don't understand all of the industry jargon (that's my own fault). Sound Exchange royalty rates are separate from ASCAP/SESAC, I take it? Solely the SoundExchange royalty rates will be increased, but not the ASCAP/SESAC rates? Who or what does the money from Sound Exchange go to in the end? The artist, a corporation or the government or all of the above? I'm just trying to understand this.</p><p>Sorry... I might have misread some of what you typed.&nbsp; I didn't mean to imply that you thought we were parasites.&nbsp; Just trying to answer your questions quickly and probably added stuff that didn't necessarily respond to you.&nbsp; I got a lot on my mind with all of this so my posts may ramble a bit.&nbsp; It's hard to ask for people to help you when you come off sounding like an asshole so again I apologize if that's how it came off. </p><p>The soundexchange royalties are the actual sound recording performance royalties and go to the artists and/or copyright holders.&nbsp; They are separate from the ASCAP and SESAC royalty rates.</p><p>&nbsp;</p><p>Badmonkey&nbsp;</p>

[badmonkey]

<p><a href="http://www.petitiononline.com/SIR2007r/petition.html" target="_blank">http://www.petitiononline.com/SIR2007r/petition.html</a></p><p>&nbsp;</p><p>This is the real petition.&nbsp; Apparently the other one is old.</p><p>&nbsp;</p><p>Badmonkey&nbsp;</p>

[ralphbxny]

I signed it...I got my buddays back!

[Don Stugots]

yeah, i signed it twice.&nbsp; thanks Badmonkey.

[Don Stugots]

the part of this that really burns me is that we all work hard on this to make it work, fun and maybe lead to something bigger and those dreams will get pissed on by the government.&nbsp; if you people think i am pissed off now watch happens when my show is taken away from me and the station that i enjoy is run out of town on a rail.&nbsp;

[Don Stugots]

little update.&nbsp; i spoke with Jon Taets from Fossella's office.&nbsp; I sent him all of the info that Badmonkey had posted.&nbsp; He is looking into it and he will let me know today what and the stance of Fossella's office is and why.&nbsp; He was very nice and seemed concerned.&nbsp; what bothered me is that he didnt know that Fossella was even on this commitee or that there was something to issue an officale statement on.&nbsp;

[Don Stugots]

p.s. this afternoon, Hillary and Chuck will be getting calls again, that i will be recording to use for the show.&nbsp; basically, i will be asking, what their stance are and why.&nbsp;

[ralphbxny]

<strong>Don Stugots</strong> wrote:<br />p.s. this afternoon, Hillary and Chuck will be getting calls again, that i will be recording to use for the show.&nbsp; basically, i will be asking, what their stance are and why.&nbsp; <p>Nice!!</p>

[Marc with a c]

<strong>Don Stugots</strong> wrote:<br />p.s. this afternoon, Hillary and Chuck will be getting calls again, that i will be recording to use for the show.&nbsp; basically, i will be asking, what their stance are and why.&nbsp; <p>call as danza</p>

[Don Stugots]

<strong>Marc with a c</strong> wrote:<br /><strong>Don Stugots</strong> wrote:<br />p.s. this afternoon, Hillary and Chuck will be getting calls again, that i will be recording to use for the show. basically, i will be asking, what their stance are and why. <p>call as danza</p><p>&nbsp;it crossed my mind.&nbsp; regina broke out laughing when i called Hil's office yesterday and gave my address and before i hung up i said &quot;take luck.&quot; </p>

[TerrancePryor]

I work for a college radio station that's basically a webcast.The thing that we do is play inide and unsigned artists.They're not looking for any royalties or anything,just exposure.If they want the CD or songs to be played in a certain time period they'll send that with the waiver form.It's funny because we still have Kanye West in our database when the label told us to take it off over a year ago so it depends on how sneaky you can be.

[badmonkey]

<p>If you'd like to listen to the hearing on this in the house today, the audio/video are available here: </p><p><a href="http://energycommerce.house.gov/" target="_blank">http://energycommerce.house.gov/</a> </p><p>&nbsp;</p><p>&nbsp;</p><p>Direct link to the stream: (winmedia) <a href="http://boss.streamos.com/wmedia-live/energycommerce/11991/100_energycommerce-2322_060901.asx" target="_blank">http://boss.streamos.com/wmedia-live/energycommerce/11991/100_energycommerce-2322_060901.asx</a> </p><p>Meeting is currently in progress!&nbsp;</p><p>&nbsp;</p><p>Badmonkey </p> <span class="post_edited"></span>

<span class=post_edited>This message was edited by badmonkey on 3-7-07 @ 3:55 PM</span>

[Don Stugots]

i clicked the links.&nbsp; it says it is not available at this time.

[Don Stugots]

nevermind i got it

[badmonkey]

<p>Try this one:</p><p><a href="http://energycommerce.house.gov/cmte_mtgs/110-ti_hrg.030707.future_radio.shtml">http://energycommerce.house.gov/cmte_mtgs/110-ti_hrg.030707.future_radio.shtml</a></p><p>May be a shitload of people watching and they're out of slots.&nbsp;</p><p>Badmonkey&nbsp;</p>

[Don Stugots]

<p>they are talking about XM and sirius.&nbsp; big mel is taking questions.&nbsp;&nbsp; </p>

[Don Stugots]

was CBS news this worried about CNN?&nbsp; i dont remember.

[badmonkey]

<p>Yeah, when Mel came in he shifted it over.&nbsp; I missed the first 90 mins of the hearing so I don't know how much they have focused on internet radio.&nbsp; They're about to take a short break and who knows wtf is gonna happen after that.</p><p>So far CNN, Fox News, Washington Post, and Drudge have all passed on this and ignored my emails.&nbsp; This should be front page everywhere, but they all seem to be more interested in the outcome of the Libby trial and the 2 inches of snow we got in DC. </p><p>Badmonkey&nbsp;</p>

[Don Stugots]

Mr. Doyle is on our side.&nbsp;

[Don Stugots]

it sounded like they will be talking about this when they come back.&nbsp; i heard someone say that they may be there past dinner time.&nbsp; i had no idea that these things went out for hours and hours like that.&nbsp; i thought at 5.00 or so, they would shut down for the night.&nbsp;

[Dirtybird12]

<p>Was internet radio really ever alive?</p><p>It died a long time ago.</p><p>now everyone has a show. everyone thinks they have something to say. Worse, everyone thinks people want to hear what they have to say. </p><p>too many talentless shows and they all sound the same. </p><p>royalties havent killed internet radio.&nbsp;bad shows have. bad producers / hosts. </p><p>&nbsp;ive created a montster. </p><p>&nbsp;its time to step down and retire from the cosmic circus fake radio show. </p><p>&nbsp;</p><p>&nbsp;</p><p>but fuck royalties. internet radio was ruined long before this. </p><p>&nbsp;</p><p>&nbsp;</p><p>&nbsp;</p><p>&nbsp;</p><p>&nbsp;</p><p>&nbsp;</p><p>&nbsp;</p>

[Dan 'Hampton]

I've been listeing to alot of XM online lately. Does that count?&nbsp; I signed the petition for ya buddays.

[badmonkey]

<p>Absolutely it counts.&nbsp; All internet streaming is subject to these new rates.&nbsp; Unfortunately, only the major corporations can afford to pay.</p><p>&nbsp;</p><p>Badmonkey&nbsp;</p>

[Don Stugots]

<p>thanks DS.</p><p>&nbsp;</p><p>perry, sorry you feel that way.&nbsp; regardless if i had something to lose in this or not, i would feel the same way.&nbsp; i am all for anything that makes the establishment nervous.&nbsp;</p>

[Dan 'Hampton]

<strong>Don Stugots</strong> wrote:<br /><p>thanks DS.</p><p>&nbsp;</p><p>perry, sorry you feel that way. regardless if i had something to lose in this or not, i would feel the same way. i am all for anything that makes the establishment nervous. </p><p>&nbsp;Hey how'd you figure my initials from my cleverly anonymous name. </p>

[Don Stugots]

<p>haha.</p><p>&nbsp;</p><p>the guy from commerical radio in boston wouldnt even say Stern's name.&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;</p>

[Dirtybird12]

<p>not you Don. </p><p>&nbsp;</p><p>The OTHER 60 billion shows. </p><p>&nbsp;</p><p>I like what you do buddy. Im just fried and burnt on the whole thing. Thats why I say for me, internet radio was dead long ago - </p><p>&nbsp;</p><p>&nbsp;</p>

[Don Stugots]

<p>thanks perry.&nbsp; i didnt think you meant me.&nbsp; i do see your point and i agree with it to a certain extent.&nbsp; if it wasnt for THEREISNORADIO.com my show would be just another podcast on itunes.&nbsp; the fact that i can go live makes it different.&nbsp; same for any of the shows on the site.&nbsp; they all have a few things in common, we all do it for fun and maybe it will take us somewhere and we are live and can interact with the people listening in ways that other podcasts can not. </p><p>&nbsp;</p>

[TerrancePryor]

<strong>badmonkey</strong> wrote:<br /><p>Absolutely it counts.&nbsp; All internet streaming is subject to these new rates.&nbsp; Unfortunately, only the major corporations can afford to pay.</p><p>&nbsp;</p><p>Badmonkey&nbsp;</p><p>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; I believe the only ones who are actually safe are college radio stations who use internet streaming.I don't know about what any of you guys do but we have a staff and are in contact with record labels meaning that they gave us permission to play/use their material on the radio.</p>

[Don Stugots]

Mel just asked them why were they all here and not at the global warming hearings.

[Don Stugots]

Fossella isnt even there.&nbsp;&nbsp; maybe he didnt even know he was on the commitee.

[NortonRules]

<strong>CircusFreak</strong> wrote:<br /><p>Was internet radio really ever alive?</p><p>It died a long time ago.</p><p>now everyone has a show. everyone thinks they have something to say. Worse, everyone thinks people want to hear what they have to say. </p><p>too many talentless shows and they all sound the same. </p><p>royalties havent killed internet radio.&nbsp;bad shows have. bad producers / hosts. </p><p>&nbsp;ive created a montster. </p><p>&nbsp;its time to step down and retire from the cosmic circus fake radio show. </p><p>&nbsp;</p><p>&nbsp;</p><p>but fuck royalties. internet radio was ruined long before this. </p><p>&nbsp;</p><p>&nbsp;</p><p>&nbsp;</p><p>&nbsp;</p><p>&nbsp;</p><p>&nbsp;</p><p>&nbsp;</p><p>The same thing has happened with music.&nbsp; Because of the technology that is now available, it's so easy to make a CD.&nbsp;&nbsp;You don't have to work hard or even sing or even play an instrument.&nbsp; It's too easy to&nbsp;put something out these days...in my opinion.&nbsp; The world is now saturated with crap.&nbsp; Of course there will be exceptions and people who manage to create great art using this&nbsp;technology, but not enough.&nbsp; &nbsp;</p>

[PapaBear]

<strong>CircusFreak</strong> wrote:<br /><p>not you Don. </p><p>&nbsp;</p><p>The OTHER 60 billion shows. </p><p>&nbsp;</p><p>I like what you do buddy. Im just fried and burnt on the whole thing. Thats why I say for me, internet radio was dead long ago - </p><p>&nbsp;</p><p>&nbsp;</p><p>I'm still not taking the sticker off my car.</p>

[Don Stugots]

Mel is not telling the whole story with cell phone access to internet radio.&nbsp; if you can get to an internet feed on your phone than you can get to XM, Sirius or Free Radio feeds too.&nbsp; He also shouldnt be upset that the new AUX jacks in cars for Ipods, hurts all radio (Sat. and Terr.) my XM works perfect for that too.&nbsp;

[PapaBear]

<strong>Don Stugots</strong> wrote:<br />Mel is not telling the whole story with cell phone access to internet radio.&nbsp; if you can get to an internet feed on your phone than you can get to XM, Sirius or Free Radio feeds too.&nbsp; He also shouldnt be upset that the new AUX jacks in cars for Ipods, hurts all radio (Sat. and Terr.) my XM works perfect for that too.&nbsp; <p>I bought a radio with an aux jack SPECIFICALLY for my XM radio. He'd have to be an idiot to think they hurt radio.</p>

[badmonkey]

<strong>PapaBear</strong> wrote:<br /><strong>Don Stugots</strong> wrote:<br />Mel is not telling the whole story with cell phone access to internet radio. if you can get to an internet feed on your phone than you can get to XM, Sirius or Free Radio feeds too. He also shouldnt be upset that the new AUX jacks in cars for Ipods, hurts all radio (Sat. and Terr.) my XM works perfect for that too. <p>I bought a radio with an aux jack SPECIFICALLY for my XM radio. He'd have to be an idiot to think they hurt radio.</p><p>Me too... if I hadn't I'd be stuck with using one of those FM transmitter things.&nbsp; Although, I have nearly deafened myself several times switching back to cd or am/fm after having the XM up to about 50 so I can fucking hear it.</p><p>&nbsp;</p><p>&nbsp;</p><p>&nbsp;</p><p>&nbsp;</p>

[Reephdweller]

<p>Signed that bitch.</p><p>&nbsp;</p><p>SAVE INTERNET RADIO</p><p>&nbsp;</p><p>SAVE DON STUGOTS!!&nbsp;</p>

[Don Stugots]

<strong>Reephdweller</strong> wrote:<br /><p>Signed that bitch.</p><p>&nbsp;</p><p>SAVE INTERNET RADIO</p><p>&nbsp;</p><p>SAVE DON STUGOTS!! </p><p>&nbsp;thanks reeph.</p>

[badmonkey]

<p>&nbsp;</p><p><font size="2"><strong>New Net radio rules draw fire on Capitol Hill</strong></font><br />&quot;WASHINGTON--A key Democrat in the U.S. House of Representatives on Wednesday slammed new federal rules that would require many Internet radio services to pay higher fees to record companies.&quot; </p><p>&quot;This represents a body blow to many nascent Internet radio broadcasters and further exacerbates the marketplace imbalance between what different industries pay,&quot; Markey said at <a href="http://dw.com.com/redir?destUrl=http%3A%2F%2Fenergycommerce.house.go v%2Fcmte_mtgs%2F110-ti_hrg.030707.future_radio.shtml&amp;siteId=22&amp;oId=210 0-9588-6165336&amp;ontId=9588&amp;lop=nl.ex" target="_blank">a hearing here titled &quot;The Future of Radio&quot;</a>. The hearing was convened by the House panel on telecommunications and the Internet, of which Markey is chairman. &quot;It makes little sense to me for the smallest players to pay proportionately the largest royalty fee.&quot; </p><p><a href="http://news.zdnet.com/2100-9588_22-6165336.html" target="_blank">http://news.zdnet.com/2100-9588_22-6165336.html</a></p><p>&nbsp;</p><p>We're still bent over with our pants around our ankles, but we may at least be getting some lubricant.&nbsp; We might even get to pull our pants up.</p><p>&nbsp;</p><p>Badmonkey&nbsp;</p>

[Don Stugots]

a few of them had positive things to say.&nbsp;

[BrownTown]

<strong>CircusFreak</strong> wrote:<br /><p>not you Don. </p><p>The OTHER 60 billion shows.&nbsp;</p><p>I understand that this is somewhat off-topic, but that comment peaked my curiosity. I'd love to hear what shows you specifically think suck vs. which ones you think are O.K., Perry. I'm not sure why this intrigues me so much, but it does. </p>

[Dirtybird12]

<p>yeah i can name a few that suck. </p><p>&nbsp;</p><p>everything except for the cosmic circus sucks. </p><p>&nbsp;</p><p>&nbsp;</p><p>im the best and everyone else stinks. </p><p>&nbsp;</p><p>&nbsp;</p>

[badmonkey]

<strong>CircusFreak</strong> wrote:<br /><p>yeah i can name a few that suck. </p><p>&nbsp;</p><p>everything except for the cosmic circus sucks. </p><p>&nbsp;</p><p>&nbsp;</p><p>im the best and everyone else stinks. </p><p>&nbsp;</p><p>&nbsp;</p><p>But we are constantly trying different soaps, deoderants, and colognes/perfumes until we get the mix just right.</p><p>Smell is somewhat subjective tho as we all know, everybody loves the smell of their own farts but can rarely stand the farts of others.</p><p>&nbsp;</p><p><img src="http://www.ronfez.net/messageboard/tiny_mce/plugins/emotions/images/thumbup.gif" border="0" /></p><p>&nbsp;</p><p>Badmonkey&nbsp;</p>

[BrownTown]

<strong>CircusFreak</strong> wrote:<br /><p>yeah i can name a few that suck. </p><p>everything except for the cosmic circus sucks. </p><p>im the best and everyone else stinks. </p><p>I set myself up for that one.&nbsp;I don't know why I expected anything else.&nbsp;Your almost endorsement of The Don Stugots Experience had me believing&nbsp;you'd be more forthcoming. Oh well.&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;</p>

[Dirtybird12]

<p>thereisnoradio - is one of the exceptions to internet radio. </p><p>&nbsp;they have some really talented folks on there. <br />Good stuff. </p><p>&nbsp;</p><p>Best in Show is a great listen.&nbsp; Its been a while. But from what Ive heard, it's a good show. </p><p>&nbsp;</p><p>For the most part - Thereisnoradio has been really good about NOT putting out a crappy product. </p><p>&nbsp;</p><p>&nbsp;</p>

[Don Stugots]

<strong>BrownTown</strong> wrote:<br /><strong>CircusFreak</strong> wrote:<br /><p>yeah i can name a few that suck. </p><p>everything except for the cosmic circus sucks. </p><p>im the best and everyone else stinks. </p><p>I set myself up for that one. I don't know why I expected anything else. Your almost endorsement of The Don Stugots Experience had me believing you'd be more forthcoming. Oh well. </p><p>&nbsp;it wasnt an almost endorsement.&nbsp; He told me to my face that he liked what i was doing and told me good luck with it.&nbsp; i dont need much else.&nbsp; thanks perry.&nbsp; </p>

[BrownTown]

<p><strong>Don Stugots</strong> wrote:</p><p>&nbsp;it wasnt an almost endorsement.&nbsp; He told me to my face that he liked what i was doing and told me good luck with it.&nbsp; i dont need much else.&nbsp; thanks perry.&nbsp; </p>Forgive me, Don.&nbsp;It was indeed a full-on&nbsp;endorsemnet. It was&nbsp;the follow-up&nbsp;of &quot;everything except for the cosmic circus sucks&quot; that made me add in the&nbsp;almost.&nbsp;I agree&nbsp;that internet radio shows don't need much more than getting the blessing of&nbsp;the innovator of fake radio. Hell, I may go so far as to throw his &quot;almost-endorsement&quot; of Best In Show on our website. Thanks, Perry.

[Don Stugots]

<strong>BrownTown</strong> wrote:<br /><p><strong>Don Stugots</strong> wrote:</p><p> it wasnt an almost endorsement. He told me to my face that he liked what i was doing and told me good luck with it. i dont need much else. thanks perry. </p>Forgive me, Don. It was indeed a full-on endorsemnet. It was the follow-up of &quot;everything except for the cosmic circus sucks&quot; that made me add in the almost. I agree that internet radio shows don't need much more than getting the blessing of the innovator of fake radio. Hell, I may go so far as to throw his &quot;almost-endorsement&quot; of Best In Show on our website. Thanks, Perry.<p>&nbsp;BT, no need to ask for forgivness.&nbsp; i didnt tell anyone about, how would you know?&nbsp; you know? &nbsp;</p><p>&quot;everything excpet the cosmic circus suck&quot; threw me a for a loop too but its cool. &nbsp;</p><p>&nbsp;</p><p>Best in Show is good stuff.&nbsp; i enjoyed what i heard of it.&nbsp; I also enjoy DJNEWSTYLE and CT &amp; Jivin. &nbsp;&nbsp;</p>

[BrownTown]

<strong>Don Stugots</strong> wrote:<br /><p>Best in Show is good stuff. </p><p> Sweet! The positive reviews are pouring in.</p><p>I'd love to reciprocate, but sadly, I've yet to hear TDSE. I plan to tune in this Sunday. You need to get some downloads available for the constantly working set like me (or maybe they're already available, and I'm just stupid). &nbsp;</p>

<span class=post_edited>This message was edited by BrownTown on 3-8-07 @ 10:22 PM</span>

[JustJon]

So the broadcasters have gone before Congress now.&nbsp; Any updates?

[badmonkey]

<p>Appeals have been filed and there is apparently going to be a 60 day review period.&nbsp; We have achieved some media attention and some senators/congressmen are unhappy with the decision of the CRB.&nbsp; Hopefully they can force the extension of the Small Webcaster Act of 2002&nbsp;</p><p>We are moving to independent artists as fast as we can find them, but it will not necessarily lower our rates or allow us to continue to broadcast.&nbsp; Things are just starting to get a lot more complicated because we will have to negotiate royalty cost or waivers with each individual artist. &nbsp;</p><font size="3"></font>From the FAQ at <a href="http://www.savethestreams.org/serendipity/pages/faq.html" target="_blank">savethestreams.org</a>:<br /><br /><strong>5. Well... independent music is cool. Why not just play independent music?</strong><br />This is very important to understand, as lots of people see this as a solution. The statutory webcast license covers ANY copyright music, <strong>from the biggest labels, down to the smallest, and even independently-released music. Again, the license covers ANY copyright music. The copyright owner need NOT be part of SoundExchange or the RIAA.</strong> The ONLY exceptions to this are (A) direct deals with each and every sound recording copyright owner, (B) copyright owners that are willing to make a blanket &quot;waive&quot; of fees, or (C) non-copyright, public domain music. <p>&nbsp;Some terrestrial radio stations have spoken up and taken some action too. </p><font size="3"></font><span class="postbody"><span style="font-weight: bold">From FMQB: Chicago's 9 FM Bans CD Giveaways</span> <br /> <br /> <span style="font-style: italic">March 20, 2007</span> <br /> <br /> Newsweb Radio Company's 9 FM, which trimulcasts on WDEK, WKIE and WRZA in Chicago, has decided to ban CD prize giveaways as an act of protest against the recent royalty rate hike for online music streaming. <br /> <br />&quot;When I read that the RIAA and SoundExchange needed money so badly that they were going to price gouge independent Web streamers and radio stations who stream online, I knew we had to do our part,&quot; said Matt DuBiel, Director of Programming for 9 FM. &quot;In the face of the RIAA's struggles, it just doesn't seem fair for us to be giving away CDs (for free) to music fans fully capable of paying for the music themselves. We're inviting everyone who has won a CD from 9 FM or any other radio station in Chicago this year, to return it to us and we'll exchange it for a 9 FM t-shirt and give the CDs back to the RIAA. Radio stations need to be able to stream online affordably.&quot; <br /> <br />9 FM also has been airing public service-style announcements encouraging listeners to voice their concerns over the Copyright Royalty Board's rate hike ruling by signing a petition posted on 9 FM's Web site: <a href="http://www.weplayanything.com/" target="_blank">http://www.WePlayAnything.com</a> <br /> <br /> The Story can be found here: <br /> <a href="http://www.fmqb.com/Article.asp?id=373556" target="_blank">http://www.fmqb.com/Article.asp?id=373556</a>&nbsp; </span> <p>&nbsp;</p><p>We're still at the beginning of the fight, but no real updates yet.&nbsp; </p><p>&nbsp;</p><p>Badmonkey&nbsp;</p><p><span class="postbody"><span style="font-weight: bold"></span></span></p>

[Cleophus James]

Lets say you have a song on your myspace, does this bill cover that also?<br />

[Don Stugots]

<strong>ESDsucks@life</strong> wrote:<br />Lets say you have a song on your myspace, does this bill cover that also?<br /> <p>&nbsp;that is a good point but i think it would be considered self promotion.&nbsp; that is just what i think.&nbsp; </p>

[Dirtybird12]

<strong>badmonkey</strong> wrote:<br /><p><strong>5. Well... independent music is cool. Why not just play independent music?</strong><br />This is very important to understand, as lots of people see this as a solution. The statutory webcast license covers ANY copyright music, <strong>from the biggest labels, down to the smallest, and even independently-released music.</strong> </p><p><span class="postbody"><span style="font-weight: bold"></span></span></p><p>all songs copyright &copy; 2006-2007 Perrynoid Music Inc.</p><p>(scratches head) </p><p>&nbsp;</p><p>&nbsp;</p><p>&nbsp;</p>

[badmonkey]

<p>Today I sent this to every member of the House committee involved, the Copyright Royalty Board, the President, the Vice President, the op/ed and letters to the editor sections of about 50 newspapers, and other related agencies and committees.</p><p>&nbsp;</p><hr width="75" /><p>&nbsp;</p><p>I received an email from iTunes today that would have had me dancing around the room six months ago, but today gives me a very different reaction.&nbsp; Today I was notified that my internet radio station, ThereIsNoRadio.com, has been added to the iTunes radio station directory and my reaction is a lot more fear than joy.&nbsp; This will increase listenership to the station dramatically over the coming weeks.&nbsp; What's wrong with people listening to the station you ask? Isn't that the goal of a radio station?&nbsp; Well, yes it is, but with the new royalty rates looming over the heads of mine and all other internet radio stations; new listeners, at the rate they will come through iTunes, could very well mean the death of the station.<br /><br />With only 100 streams filled 24 hours per day and 7 days per week and averaging about 16 songs per hour, we are looking at paying royalty rates of $42 per day, $295 per week, $1,182 per month and $15,375 per year. We have well over 100 streams to fill so our royalty costs could easily more than double.&nbsp; We have never attempted to make money with the station. One of our goals has been to make enough money to continue to break even as we gain listeners and add slots. Currently I spend out of pocket about $250 per month between costs to stream, website hosting, and royalty payments.&nbsp; We make about $20 per month for ads and have never come close to breaking even.&nbsp; My day job currently funds almost all of the station expenses.<br /><br />Our station is different from lots of internet stations in that our primary objective is talk radio.&nbsp; Our talk shows run in the evenings and the guys running these shows do it for a love of radio.&nbsp; They do not get paid for their efforts, but they are the reason most people tune into the station. We do play music throughout the day and late nights to fill time between talk shows. Because we don't run commercials, the talk show hosts run music when they take breaks to rest their voices.<br /><br />The cost of playing RIAA bands has now gone out of the range of what we can afford and we will be concentrating our future efforts on independent bands. It is interesting that the laws of the United States seem only to be obeyed when it benefits the record companies. The record companies who have been illegally paying FM radio stations to play their music for the promotional value of radio are now requiring internet radio to pay them for the same promotional value.<br /><br />We could switch formats to 100% talk radio with no music, but for some reason, we would still have to pay music royalties because we are an internet radio station.&nbsp; The real talents aired on the station, the talk show hosts, will continue to go unpaid.<br /><br />Make no mistake, we are not asking for a free ride.&nbsp; We understand and accept that royalties are part of the cost of doing business.&nbsp; Artists should be paid for their work at a fair market price.&nbsp; The current market price is out of our range, so ThereIsNoRadio and many other internet radio stations will soon be going to another vendor (the independent artists ) for a similar product at a better price.<br /><br />The addition of our station to the iTunes directory has been a goal of ours for awhile and I am both happy and proud that we have achieved it.&nbsp; It is unfortunate that to keep our station on the air, we may now have to have that listing removed to keep both our listenership and costs down. <br /><br />Thank you for your time,</p><p>&nbsp;</p><p>&nbsp;</p><hr width="75" /><br />Hopefully it falls on supportive ears.<p>&nbsp;</p><p>&nbsp;</p><p>Badmonkey&nbsp;</p>

[badmonkey]

<p>I do have a new update:</p><p><a href="http://www.ronfez.net/messageboard/replytotopic.cfm/Forum/89/Topic/57556/currentpage/Copyright%20board%20to%20reconsider%20higher%20roy alties%20for%20Net%20music" target="_blank">Copyright board to reconsider higher royalties for Net music.</a></p><p class="byline"><span>By Bloomberg News &nbsp;|&nbsp;</span> <span class="date">March 21, 2007</span></p><p>LOA ANGELES -- The Library of Congress Copyright Royalty Board agreed to reconsider a decision to increase royalties for music played on the Internet after radio broadcasters complained the new prices were too high.</p>The judges agreed to listen to arguments submitted by National Public Radio, commercial radio broadcasters, and college stations, the board said yesterday. NPR spokeswoman Andi Sporkin provided a copy of the board's order. <p>The higher Internet royalties would force NPR stations to cease offering Web simulcasts, Sporkin said. SomaFM, owner of 11 Web music channels, said its 2006 fees would multiply 27 times under the new rates to more than $600,000. Next year's would exceed $1 million, the company said.</p><p>Record companies &quot;don't want competition from independent webcasters&quot; because it threatens the labels' business models, SomaFM said.</p><p>A call to a Recording Industry Association of America spokesman wasn't immediately returned.</p><p>The royalty board on March 2 decided Internet radio outlets must pay a fee for each song they play, a change from a previous formula which called for payment based on a percentage of revenue.</p><p>It does look like we are making progress here.&nbsp; More calls and letters to the CRB, your reps and senators would still probably be helpful.&nbsp; I really do appreciate all the support you guys have shown the station and internet radio in general since this all started.&nbsp; Thanks again.</p><p>Badmonkey</p><span class="post_edited"></span>

<span class=post_edited>This message was edited by badmonkey on 3-21-07 @ 9:15 PM</span>

[Don Stugots]

i have called so many pols. offices that i expect the CIA is going to come to my apartment.

[JustJon]

<strong>CircusFreak</strong> wrote:<br /><strong>badmonkey</strong> wrote:<br /><p><strong>5. Well... independent music is cool. Why not just play independent music?</strong><br />This is very important to understand, as lots of people see this as a solution. The statutory webcast license covers ANY copyright music, <strong>from the biggest labels, down to the smallest, and even independently-released music.</strong> </p><p><span class="postbody"><span style="font-weight: bold"></span></span></p><p>all songs copyright &copy; 2006-2007 Perrynoid Music Inc.</p><p>(scratches head) </p><p>&nbsp;</p><p>&nbsp;</p><p>&nbsp;</p><p>&nbsp;Silly question, but isn't any music created to be implied copyright by the author, even if thy don't formally copyright them?<br /> </p>

[Thebazile78]

<strong>JustJon</strong> wrote:<br /><strong>CircusFreak</strong> wrote:<br /><strong>badmonkey</strong> wrote:<br /><p><strong>5. Well... independent music is cool. Why not just play independent music?</strong><br />This is very important to understand, as lots of people see this as a solution. The statutory webcast license covers ANY copyright music, <strong>from the biggest labels, down to the smallest, and even independently-released music.</strong> </p><p><span class="postbody"><span style="font-weight: bold"></span></span></p><p>all songs copyright &copy; 2006-2007 Perrynoid Music Inc.</p><p>(scratches head) </p><p>&nbsp;</p><p>&nbsp;</p><p>&nbsp;</p><p> Silly question, but isn't any music created to be implied copyright by the author, even if thy don't formally copyright them?<br /> </p><p>It's not a silly question, actually.</p><p>&nbsp;</p><p>Technically, one's work is copyrighted if one says it is. You can register it officially with the Copyright office in DC, but you don't technically need to. If you don't sell your copyright or have it taken from you through a contract, you still own it so you are protected in a small way under copyright and IP laws.</p><p>Publishing your work may give you additional protections, depending on the medium and the terms of your contract. </p><p>&nbsp;</p>

[Bulldogcakes]

<p><img src="http://entimg.msn.com/i/150/Movies/Actors2/Danza_JM91E42171_150x200.jpg" border="0" width="150" height="200" />&nbsp;</p><p>&quot;Hey. . . eeehhh. . .Stu . . . . .eeehh. . I want my fuckin 8 cents!&quot;&nbsp;</p>

[patsopinion]

<p>yea i dont know how i missed this thread for that long but that is soooooooooo fucked</p><p>um if anyone has some recorded materials id start editing that shit..... and maybe taking it down until its edited.</p><p>or try to get the right to play the stuff</p><p>but if u did that it would put you on the radar and that may be a mistake</p>

[Don Stugots]

<strong>Bulldogcakes</strong> wrote:<br /><p><img src="http://entimg.msn.com/i/150/Movies/Actors2/Danza_JM91E42171_150x200.jpg" border="0" width="150" height="200" /> </p><p>&quot;Hey. . . eeehhh. . .Stu . . . . .eeehh. . I want my fuckin 8 cents!&quot; </p><p>&nbsp;screw you Danza, you get nothing and like it.</p>

[badmonkey]

Thought some of you might be interested that a letter I printed on the station site and sent out last week to various congressmen, legislative commities, and news outlets about the our addition to the iTunes radio list has been published in an article on SaveOurInternetRadio.com (http://www.saveourinternetradio.com/) today. They contacted me last night for permission to use it. This might actually help us get a story or interview with some real news outlets.

We're currently on their front page, but here's the "permanent link (http://www.saveourinternetradio.com/2007/03/29/internet-radio-too-popular-for-its-own-good/)".

Feel free to "digg (http://digg.com/submit?phase=2&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.saveourinternetradio.com%2F20 07%2F03%2F29%2Finternet-radio-too-popular-for-its-own-good%2F)" it if you like.



Badmonkey

[Don Stugots]

wow. nicely put.

[JustJon]

And congrats on making it onto iTunes

[badmonkey]

And congrats on making it onto iTunes

Thanks. Today iTunes, tomorrow the world!

Badmonkey

[empulse]

This showed up in my email today. There are several good links in here.

http://www.freepress.net/action/

I can't for the life of me understand how in the fuck Internet Radio stations are supposed to pay royalties for playing music. I worked in a radio station in upstate NY for years (program director), and it was like xmas every day in there. I loved to go and get the mail, because it was a crate. A GIANT CRATE. full of music. promos, full albums, items that weren't going to be released in stores, and all the schwag you could handle. Whenever I think "I wish i had a job that i liked" i remember "damn. i did have a job i liked. radio" altho the pay stunk. i still loved it.

The RIAA in this country is the new Gestapo. Internet radio should pay no fees. none. it is FREE PROMOTION for what is the most part (not knocking anyone here..) shit. 90% of what comes out from most labels is garbage. This is the RIAA's last gasp. CD's and Full Albums altogether are dinosaurs. They will disappear soon, just like 8-tracks. And they can't find a revenue model that is going to feed the beast so they are suing, and trying to influence (or just flat out write) legislation to steal everything they can get there hands on.

Don't let yourself take the stance that "oh, the artist deserves something from me.." well in this model that they want for royalties, how much will the artist get? .0002%? No. they will get 0%. You shoot yourself in the foot when you try to be understanding in this argument. It also stems from the artists not having a full brain cell in their head. they sell their souls to the recording industry. There are bands out there that actually let you download their music from their sites, and have a paypal button that says "if you feel like we are worth it, please contribute". I have even seen some that say "so you really like our music? But you have downloaded it illegally, please feel free to donate." I feel WAAAAAy better about that then the RIAA saying they are defending the artists right to make money.

This has bad JuJu written all over it. Our senators and congressmen are are to f'ing dumb to know what it even matters in most cases regaurding the DMCA, RIAA, MPAA and Net neutrality. They DO NOT UNDERSTAND TECHNOLOGY. If these are things you understand, and realize all of them are only designed to stick it in your arse... then fight. write letters, tell your friends, and explain what it means, give them a simple example of how its gonna affect them. $. This is the same wart riddled schlong they have been trying to pound satellite radio with, and they are only able to create laws that are this moronic because people don't know any better.

Or incorporate in Morocco and get your server hosting done in a country that doesn't give a rats ass about US law, and use a proxy connection to broadcast. hi-tech pirate radio.

FreePress also has resources for people who want to have a real radio station, licensing is coming up soon for Non-profits and LP-FM commercial stations, so if you are interested (I am, want to buy a station in the midwest within 2 years, full power FM), then read, read some more, and have your papers and cash ready.

I never really knew how bad they were trying to stick it to internet radio till the last couple of days, this would be hard as hell to enforce, but being that you are in the US, and ITunes is now waving a banner with your name on it..damn.

[badmonkey]

The Copyright Royalty Board has rejected the appeal. (http://www.usatoday.com/tech/news/techpolicy/2007-04-16-internet-radio-ruling_N.htm)

It looks like our next step is to attempt to get Congress to rewrite DMCA, extend the Small Webcasters Act of 2002, or write new legislation to protect us from this extortion by the record labels.

Regardless of whether you have already gone to www.savenetradio.org, please go again today. The site has changed dramatically and we now have legal representation and lobbyists. They have provided a place that you can send a message to your representatives that can be delivered by email, fax, or paper mail.

Please join their mailing list and send these messages to your reps once per day.

The support you guys have given our station and internet radio has been amazing and I appreciate it more than you could ever know.

Thanks,

Badmonkey

[Don Stugots]

*bump*

come on people, we need your help to keep the shows you enjoy on the air.

[J.Clints]

*bump*

come on people, we need your help to keep the shows you enjoy on the air.

http://spreadtheiris.com/images/smilies/bump2.gif

[Don Stugots]

*bump*

if we lose internet radio than the terrorists win.

[PhishHead]

if we lose internet radio...Phishy's Musical Tour will never be off the ground.

[Don Stugots]

call Chuck's office and speak with Lauren
at Wiener's office speak with Tina
Hillary's office said they will look into yet would not give there name

Contact Jon Taets in Fosella's office in Washington.

if we all annoy the same people maybe something can get done.



Phishy's musical tour? love it and will tune it everyweek. i am sure it will be golden.

[J.Clints]

BUMP



Needs to be kept on top.......

[Don Stugots]

BUMP



Needs to be kept on top.......

have you made any phone calls to people?

[J.Clints]

have you made any phone calls to people?

Yea to my Locals here. Want the names and numbers?

Shoul I call someone else.

[Don Stugots]

Yea to my Locals here. Want the names and numbers?

Shoul I call someone else.

i called the people that i know supported us in this. other than that, i dont know what else to do.

[J.Clints]

i called the people that i know supported us in this. other than that, i dont know what else to do.

I am going to call back to see what else I can do.

[RoseBlood]

if we lose internet radio...Phishy's Musical Tour will never be off the ground.

Ideas for your show banner:
http://i.walmart.com/i/p/00/01/47/08/50/0001470850192_215X215.jpg
http://www.argos.co.uk/wcsstore/argos/images/3480555A63UC153106M.jpg

Your target audience?
http://z.about.com/d/couponing/1/0/-/6/352718.jpg
http://www.web-strategist.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2006/11/fisherprice_2%5B1%5D.jpg

[PhishHead]

Ideas for your show banner:
http://i.walmart.com/i/p/00/01/47/08/50/0001470850192_215X215.jpg
http://www.argos.co.uk/wcsstore/argos/images/3480555A63UC153106M.jpg

Your target audience?
http://z.about.com/d/couponing/1/0/-/6/352718.jpg
http://www.web-strategist.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2006/11/fisherprice_2%5B1%5D.jpg

wow you were just on a roll last night huh?

Love making fun of me i see. :glurps:

[Don Stugots]

picture of Biz Markie saying OH SNAP!

[KnoxHarrington]

Another little tip: members of Congress tend to take letters sent by the US Mail more seriously than e-mails, so you might want to go that route.

[badmonkey]

SaveNetRadio (http://www.savenetradio.org) has redone their site and you can now submit your letters to congress by email, fax, or snail mail.

Also, they are organizing a "Hill Walk" for May 1st. If any of you are in or nearby the DC area and can make it, please do. The information should be up at www.savenetradio.org in the next few days. The only thing I know about it currently is the date it will happen.

I don't know for sure if you can get them before May 1st or not, but if you want a ThereIsNoRadio T-shirt to wear to this event, you can order them at http://www.cafepress.com/thereisnoradio (the white ones seem to print/ship faster)
I just marked everything in the TINR Gear (http://www.cafepress.com/thereisnoradio/1417433) section down to cost so it's available to you guys at the lowest price cafe press will let me sell it.

If you want to meet up with me for the event and can't get your shirts in time, I can bring a few of my station shirts with me. I only have a few that I can loan out. None are new. All have been worn multiple times. They are all XXL. Yes I was fat.


Badmonkey

[Gvac]

US Representatives Don Manzullo (Rep - IL) and Jay Inslee (Dem - WA) introduced bipartisan legislation to protect internet music webcasters from unfair government regulations. (http://manzullo.house.gov/News/DocumentSingle.aspx?DocumentID=63775)

Here's how you can contact your Representatives - Click Here (http://www.house.gov/writerep/)