Everybody Pick A Team

[Judge Smails]

The End of Days is nigh, people. What'cha gonna do when they come for you?

Meh, there's been a lot of religion talk on the board lately. Just wondering what our ronfez.net breakdown is, and whether it reflects the nation as a whole.

As for myself, I had a difficult choice: I was raised a strict Catholic but my wife is Episcopalian (Protestant) which, much like vegetarianism, pretty much makes me one too. However, I've personally been leaning towards Agnostic. But if you put a gun to my head and made me choose, I guess I'd say Protestant. I'd hate to think that I'm just throwing away all that money I put in the collection plate on Sundays.

Sorry, if I left anyone out but I'm limitted to 10 choices.

[FUNKMAN]

mines not listed, i'm in the SIB category

Seeing Is Believing

when I see a god then I'll believe in a god. it's not too much to ask. a little meeting, just a few minutes of his/her time. and if there is none and when you're gone you're gone, then I wouldn't know the different

[PapaBear]

I picked "other". It's between me and God. Organized religion sucks.

[sailor]

mines not listed, i'm in the SIB category

Seeing Is Believing

when I see a god then I'll believe in a god. it's not too much to ask. a little meeting, just a few minutes of his/her time. and if there is none and when you're gone you're gone, then I wouldn't know the different

isn't that agnostic, essentially?

[RoseBlood]

Why isn't Latvian Orthodox an option? :wink:

http://i.tbs.com/v5cache/TBS/Images/Dynamic/i23/seinfeld_episode075_337x233_040420061510.jpg

To answer your question: I was raised Catholic, I attend a Catholic school, I believe in God. Sorry if that offends anyone.

[FUNKMAN]

mines not listed, i'm in the SIB category

Seeing Is Believing

when I see a god then I'll believe in a god. it's not too much to ask. a little meeting, just a few minutes of his/her time. and if there is none and when you're gone you're gone, then I wouldn't know the different

isn't that agnostic, essentially?

thanks Sailor! i really never looked into what 'agnostic' means... i thought it meant you believed in Spiro Agnew... my bad

i got nuthin

[JPMNICK]

I was raised Italian Catholic, and since 9th grade I have been nothing. I do not believe in god at all

[BeltOfScotch]

Thanks to wikipedia, I've discovered that I'm an Apatheist

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Apathetic_agnosticism

Apatheism (a portmanteau of atheism and apathy), also known as pragmatic or practical atheism, is a subset of atheism (when atheism is defined as lack of belief in deities, rather than specific disbelief in deities). An apatheist is someone who is not interested in accepting or denying any claims that God, or any other supernatural being, exists or does not exist. In other words, an apatheist is someone who considers the question of the existence of God as neither meaningful nor relevant to human affairs.

[JPMNICK]

isn't that agnostic, essentially?

sailor is a smart man... and Funkman makes good Kielbalsa

[FUNKMAN]

Thanks to wikipedia, I've discovered that I'm an Apatheist

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Apathetic_agnosticism

Apatheism (a portmanteau of atheism and apathy), also known as pragmatic or practical atheism, is a subset of atheism (when atheism is defined as lack of belief in deities, rather than specific disbelief in deities). An apatheist is someone who is not interested in accepting or denying any claims that God, or any other supernatural being, exists or does not exist. In other words, an apatheist is someone who considers the question of the existence of God as neither meaningful nor relevant to human affairs.

i'll take Apetheist for 200 Alex

[Marc with a c]

http://www.solidlightco.com/photos/RTA5312WR-2T.jpg

[Gvac]

RoseBlood wrote:
Why isn't Latvian Orthodox an option?



I've got the Kavorka!

I believe there is a flow of life throughout the universe and it follows it own course. All things (including us) arise from it, but it does not create them. It does not judge or crave worship. It merely is.

No real religion, but spiritual nonetheless.

[sailor]

sailor is a smart man... and Funkman makes good Kielbalsa

aw, shucks. i just had like 16 years of catholic education. also, up until very recently i considered myself agnostic, now i'm moving back towards catholicism. i'm mostly a confused guy.

[RoseBlood]

I've got the Kavorka!

I believe there is a flow of life throughout the universe and it follows it own course. All things (including us) arise from it, but it does not create them. It does not judge or crave worship. It merely is.

No real religion, but spiritual nonetheless.

You are so wise, for real..

I denounce Catholicism! I pray to Gvac Almighty!!!

[Gvac]

You are so wise, for real..

I denounce Catholicism! I pray to Gvac Almighty!!!

HAHA! I'm flattered, but I think that would be what I feel most organized religions have done - concentrated on the finger pointing to the moon rather than the moon itself.


http://i24.photobucket.com/albums/c34/Gvac/FingerPointMoon.jpg

[Fat_Sunny]

F_S Has To Say He's More On The Gvac Wavelength. We All Have That Little "Blue Pearl" Of Conciousness (Or Spirit) That Has To Work It's Way Back To The Big Ocean. It's An Almost-Never-Ending Journey. Fat's Definitely In The "Eastern" Camp, So He'll Claim Hindu For Now!

[Leticia]

I went to catholic school most of my life and was raised catholic.

This all made me hate catholicism but not what it actually stood for.

I'm against organized religion because of the hate it cause people to have towards those who are not of that religion. I have very personal issues that affected me directly.

I'm Agnostic because, although I don't think there's a being up there waiting to judge us, I do believe in the soul and spirituality. I believe that maybe people has misinterpreted god as something that in in all of us.

Not in the way that the church tells us tho. There isn't a part of god in all of us.. we are god. People just don't know how to explain that...

But, of course, this is just another theory that I have thought about in the past. I'm not holding myself to it.


It just feels like there's no possible way of finding out ourselves what the trith is. There's just to many contradictory theories.

Like I said... Agnostic,lol.

[TheMojoPin]

It's "buddHist."

[Judge Smails]

It's "buddHist."

Thank you, Noah Webster.

You'd be hard pressed to find another poster who will edit his posts for the smallest typographical error. I also spelled "limited" incorrectly. However, ronfez.net v.2 won't allow me to go back and change it at this point. That is something that I, and my OCD, will have to live with and suffer through. Thanks again for rubbing it in.

[mikeyboy]

If we're talking end of days, I'm going Jedi. It's not because I'm a Star Wars fan. I just assume whatever God comes out on top will see the the folks who choose that as their religion as harmless idiots and ultimately say "Come on you knuckleheads. You're with us" after smiting the worshippers of other gods.

[scottinnj]

What'cha gonna do when they come for you?



Bad boys bad boys...........Whatcha gonna do?
Policeman don't gimme no break yaya!




Sorry, I couldn't resist.

[TheMojoPin]

Thank you, Noah Webster.

You'd be hard pressed to find another poster who will edit his posts for the smallest typographical error. I also spelled "limited" incorrectly. However, ronfez.net v.2 won't allow me to go back and change it at this point. That is something that I, and my OCD, will have to live with and suffer through. Thanks again for rubbing it in.

Just busting yer chops. It's my pick, so I wanted to clarify for the rest.

[weekapaugjz]

science, save us!

http://images.southparkstudios.com/media/images/1013/1013press_future_cartman.jpg

[Marc with a c]

i pick kathleen from the bronx

[Fat_Sunny]

i pick kathleen from the bronx

Well, Then, F_S Will Pick Ronnie B's Imitation Of Kathleen From The Bronx!!

[mikeyboy]

i pick kathleen from the bronx

Haha. You're going to have to be the one who tells her she's a god.


...wait. That's much better than telling her she's a hayseed.

[Friday]

If you asked me a year ago I would say No Comment. But watching my mom die made me love God more, rather than fear him/her. Go figure, right? That was the LAST thing I thought would happen.
But something about watching a long battle of pain and suffering finally end peacefully... it changes your world.
So I love God, and I have new respect for her/him. Though I still freely question him/her.

If i had to choose an actual religion it would be Unitarian Universalist. A cop out amongst religions, but it encompasses a love for nature and a higher spiritual cause. And it welcomes and embraces alternative lifestyles... which is important to me.

[prothunderball]

If i had to choose an actual religion it would be Unitarian Universalist. A cop out amongst religions, but it encompasses a love for nature and a higher spiritual cause. And it welcomes and embraces alternative lifestyles... which is important to me.

I was raised a unitarian. and I agree it is kind of a cop out, when compared to other organized religions. But I'm glad that i was raised with it, it lets you figure out things for yourself while still instilling a sense of spirituality. Once you get past the hippiness of the whole thing I think it's the best way to go.

[Gvac]

Not to derail this thread, but I think there are more lapsed Catholics than any other religion. Maybe it's because it's force fed to us from such a young age, but I'm not sure. I was raised Catholic and attended Catholic schools and I don't practice or believe anymore.

I guess I was 15 or 16 and attending a mass in school when it hit me that I really didn't accept or believe anything about the religion. Even though I'd attended hundreds of masses, for some reason on this particular day it struck me as lunacy that a man in a black robe was on an altar performing a "sacrifice" and spoke of eating flesh and drinking blood. I thought to myself "and we laugh at voodoo?" It was an epiphany.

When I got home and informed my mother that I was no longer a believer and wouldn't be attending church on Sunday anymore she was horrified and was literally afraid the lightning bolts were coming. She couldn't believe her Catholic educated son had become so sacrilegious as to compare the church to voodoo.

Aside from weddings, funerals, and baptisms, I haven't gone to church ever since that moment.

I don't belittle anyone who does believe, this was just my personal experience.

[JPMNICK]

I was raised a unitarian. and I agree it is kind of a cop out, when compared to other organized religions. But I'm glad that i was raised with it, it lets you figure out things for yourself while still instilling a sense of spirituality. Once you get past the hippiness of the whole thing I think it's the best way to go.

I have never even heard of it before. sounds interesting though. I love to learn about religion, which is kind of odd that i do not believe in anything. i guess for me it is more of a study of the pasts and reasons why things came out, and how it shaped society

[prothunderball]

I have never even heard of it before. sounds interesting though. I love to learn about religion, which is kind of odd that i do not believe in anything. i guess for me it is more of a study of the pasts and reasons why things came out, and how it shaped society

I honestly haven't been to unitarian service in years and years, so I'm don't want to be the one to try and explain it. I think it is technically considered a branch of Christianity, but it really doesn't have all that much to do with Christ.

It's funny now that I've thought about after reading this thread I think I might start going to a unitarian church again, if nothing else I think it might just be nice to belong to a positive community.

[weekapaugjz]

I have never even heard of it before. sounds interesting though. I love to learn about religion, which is kind of odd that i do not believe in anything. i guess for me it is more of a study of the pasts and reasons why things came out, and how it shaped society

i feel the exact same way. i love learning about the history of religion and how it has guided humans into the actions they have done, but i really do not believe in any type of religion. i guess i would fall under atheist but i feel there is "something" that has created the universe as it is, which would fall under agnostic.

[SatCam]

i believe in whichever one has the hottest chicks

[JPMNICK]

i believe in whichever one has the hottest chicks

muslim, just look at lily...

[RoseBlood]

Not to derail this thread, but I think there are more lapsed Catholics than any other religion. Maybe it's because it's force fed to us from such a young age, but I'm not sure. I was raised Catholic and attended Catholic schools and I don't practice or believe anymore.

I guess I was 15 or 16 and attending a mass in school when it hit me that I really didn't accept or believe anything about the religion. Even though I'd attended hundreds of masses, for some reason on this particular day it struck me as lunacy that a man in a black robe was on an altar performing a "sacrifice" and spoke of eating flesh and drinking blood. I thought to myself "and we laugh at voodoo?" It was an epiphany.

When I got home and informed my mother that I was no longer a believer and wouldn't be attending church on Sunday anymore she was horrified and was literally afraid the lightning bolts were coming. She couldn't believe her Catholic educated son had become so sacrilegious as to compare the church to voodoo.

Aside from weddings, funerals, and baptisms, I haven't gone to church ever since that moment.

I don't belittle anyone who does believe, this was just my personal experience.
Gvac, I have often found myself thinking similar thoughts, questioning Catholicism as I think it's only natural. In fact, I'm still sorting out where I stand exactly on the religious spectrum. Although my mother doesn't agree with everything the Church has done she still has faith in it. My father couldn't disagree with her more..haha. He absolutely despises the Catholic church and thinks all organized religion is a sham and a crime and he makes no apologizes, nor should he. I find myself somewhere in the middle in my views.

I've had similiar discussions with my mother. She was raised in a fairly strict Catholic household, went to Catholic school etc. She still considers herself a Catholic today as she attends church as regularly as her modern life will allow. She has never forced or guilted my father into attending church with her.

For a religious woman my mothers very very open-minded and liberal.. so much so that after we received our first Communion she let my brother and I choose whether or not we wanted to continue our religious education. Personally I'm not so sure that's a decision you can leave up to an eight year old.. lol. But I digress, my mother taught me that being a 'good Catholic' is not measured by how many times I attend church. Call us fair-weathered Catholics because neither of us subscribe to everything the church has taught us to believe. There is a difference between blindly following religion and using religion as a foundation. I don't know if I'm making any sense, it's 4:15 am, and I'm still hopped up on my evening coffee (big mistake!!!).

[Reephdweller]

I've got the Kavorka!

I believe there is a flow of life throughout the universe and it follows it own course. All things (including us) arise from it, but it does not create them. It does not judge or crave worship. It merely is.

No real religion, but spiritual nonetheless.

Well said. I am a loyal member of the "other" party.
I was raised catholic, but I'm somewhere between no religion and a desire to want to believe there is a god or at least a reason for it all. So i won't go full tilt agnostic just yet.

[booster11373]

The thing I dont get about those who believe in the rapture is, people who believe in it are just going to lie down and do nothing while everyone esle and everything we have built as a society is destroyed and only the worthy are taken chosen whatever.....

Just because whatever is doing the destroying is called "god"

What if they are wrong and its aliens or maybe even those damn Japanese robots that me and Mr B have been warning you about!


I'm an Atheist and believe the whole thing is funny in a tragic way

[A.J.]

I'm A Recovering Catholic. I have since embraced Athieism.

[cupcakelove]

I grew up without any kind of religious education. My Mom was raised in a strict Catholic family, and really hated it, so she spent a lot of my childhood looking around for a church she could fit in with. She went to Unitarian services for a while, and I can't remember what she goes to know, but its one of the Protestant denominations. Now that I'm all grown up and on my own, I've been trying to figure out exactly what my spirituality is, especially since I've been dating a Jewish person, and getting exposed to a lot of things I never have before. I've done a little bit of reading, and do like the Buddhist way of looking at things. I'm really not into the organized religion thing at all. I guess I could be considered Agnostic, but I voted for Buddhist anyways just to be cool.

[Freakshow]

http://www.nyu.edu/classes/siva/archives/fsm_1.jpg

[Midkiff]

My shit's all fucked up. I was raised a bible-thumping protestant. I married a Catholic. I myself, after tons of research and reading, have come to waver between agnostic and atheist. What's even crazier, is that I send my son to Catholic school - not because it's Catholic, but because it's the best private school in town (academically, I mean).

[grlNIN]

I was raised Roman Catholic and am currently residing with a couple of Agnostics and a few born again Lutherans.

I don't consider myself anything more than highly superstitious.

The writing's on the wall.

[FUNKMAN]

i was a half-irish protestant and a half-italian protestant and went to 13 years of catholic school... as a kid i was told god was in front of me and the devil was behind me so for a while i would try to hit the devil by throwing elbows and punches behind me. i would even get afraid he would retaliate. this was mostly as i was walking down the street.

[Flops]

spiritual but religious.

[Wallower]

Cynicism is right for me.

[Furtherman]

"Nothing exists without my consent."

[Gvac]

I'm somewhere between no religion and a desire to want to believe there is a god or at least a reason for it all.

Reefy, I think the source of a lot of anxiety in people is looking for a "reason" for it all, just as people wonder why bad things happen to good people and vice versa.

Does it rain only on "evil" people? Does the sun shine on only "good" people?

Is there air to breathe only for the "saints" and none for the "sinners"?

Because most of us are raised with the belief in a God who actually looks down on us, watches over us, and judges us constantly people have a hard time letting that belief go.

In my eyes, to assume that man is the supreme ultimate power in the universe in folly; to spend the rest of your life in fear of a greater power is equally foolish.

[sailor]

My shit's all fucked up. I was raised a bible-thumping protestant. I married a Catholic. I myself, after tons of research and reading, have come to waver between agnostic and atheist. What's even crazier, is that I send my son to Catholic school - not because it's Catholic, but because it's the best private school in town (academically, I mean).

catholic schools have a decent percentage of non-catholics. they are good schools in general.

[Crispy123]

I believe that religion is coded into our DNA as humans, the belief that there is something to life and that life is worth living. This is why I do not buy into Atheism. If people truly believed that there was nothing, then there would be no point to living. The whole point of living is to do something with your life. A true Atheist would commit suicide when they were "enlightened".

It can be said that religion has been used to control humanity and people become disaffected for this reason. Just because you do not conform to any of the "recognized" religions wouldn't classify someone as an Atheist, IMHO. In fact that is one of the definitions of Atheism but I don't buy it. Buddhism is technically considered Atheism, which is the choice closest to what I believe out of what you have given. People believe in something on some level, even if it is money, power, fame etc.. otherwise you just have nothingness and death.

I like aspects of many of the religions and see some copy and pasting going on in several of them; from the Ancient Greeks to Islam to Satanism. Wisdom and knowledge are the keys and enlightenment is the goal. There is more that we don't know than we do, no one person on this earth has the answers we seek, but there are clues in everything around us.

[sailor]

I do not buy into Atheism. If people truly believed that there was nothing, then there would be no point to living. The whole point of living is to do something with your life. A true Atheist would commit suicide when they were "enlightened"

crazy talk. even if you don't believe there's something after, why would you not enjoy the present?

like super hot girl wants you for one night only, then she's off to djibouti for the rest of her life. you'd turn her down just because you'll never get to enjoy the experience again??

[Crispy123]

crazy talk. even if you don't believe there's something after, why would you not enjoy the present?

like super hot girl wants you for one night only, then she's off to djibouti for the rest of her life. you'd turn her down just because you'll never get to enjoy the experience again??

If you truly believed in nothing.....yes.

But if you believe in love, or even lust, physical enjoyment etc.. then you believe in something and you would jump in there and pin her legs to her ears for a couple of hours.

[ralphbxny]

crazy talk. even if you don't believe there's something after, why would you not enjoy the present?

like super hot girl wants you for one night only, then she's off to djibouti for the rest of her life. you'd turn her down just because you'll never get to enjoy the experience again??

Exactly....I think...I vote for what ever religion has super hot girls going to Djibouti and want to have sex with random men....if not I am a Catholic who doesnt believe in organized religion. I dont know where that puts me.

[underdog]

If you truly believed in nothing.....yes.

But Atheism is not believing in God. You can still believe in love or sex or whatever else.

I'm not an atheist, but I still think there's absolutely no point to life. I don't kill myself because I like having nothing to do. I have no point, no real direction. I love it.

[BeltOfScotch]

If you truly believed in nothing.....yes.

But if you believe in love, or even lust, physical enjoyment etc.. then you believe in something and you would jump in there and pin her legs to her ears for a couple of hours.

It sounds like you're talking more about nihilism. Atheism isn't believing in nothing, it's believing that there is no God. To some people, the presence of God in their lives is so strong, not having that is akin to not having anything. By that I mean, if there's no God, what's the point of anything.

But, an atheist doesn't necessarily think the way someone with faith thinks they believe. Physical enjoyment isn't something you believe in. It's something that just is. Even something abstract like morals don't have to exist because of a belief in something. If I think killing people is wrong, it's not because the third Commandment says so (is it the third?), it's because societal norms and my own internal beliefs lead me to that conclusion. It doesn't necessarily have to be because of a belief in some higher power.

[Furtherman]

Who'd a thunk particles and gravity would one day give out to carnies and rubes.

Oh yea, nobody.

[Chigworthy]

I'll go Pagan when the End of Days goes down. I'll head for the hills and worship deer antlers and subside off of miner's lettuce and grubs. No more pesky hygiene.

[riverofpiss]

Where are all the Rastafarians? I figured there would be at least one. And what about all the Satanists? Where have we all gone?

[ppanda]

I am a recovering catholic

[burrben]

catholic all the goddamn way

[Don Stugots]

if the end of days in coming, i would sit down with a leather bound edition of the Ron's Line of the Day thread from Wackbag and begin reading it out loud for all enjoy and laugh as they die a slow, painful death.

[cougarjake13]

mines not listed, i'm in the SIB category

Seeing Is Believing

when I see a god then I'll believe in a god. it's not too much to ask. a little meeting, just a few minutes of his/her time. and if there is none and when you're gone you're gone, then I wouldn't know the different

exactly

if you've read the bible that motherfucker was showing up all the time, to various different people,

now we never see anything, no burning bushes, no floods, no nothing

so other than faith what have i got to believe ???



i mean if a religion , if you can call it that , like scientology can be invented and believed then how can we seriously believe that there's an old man in the sky

[sailor]

if the end of days in coming, i would sit down with a leather bound edition of the Ron's Line of the Day thread from Wackbag and begin reading it out loud for all enjoy and laugh as they die a slow, painful death.

et tu, amphibian?

[Don Stugots]

et tu, amphibian?

i dont post there but i read the thread. i post on the "under the radar" board when i am not here.

[sailor]

i dont post there but i read the thread. i post on the "under the radar" board when i am not here.

get to the cut-and-paste, my friend.

[A.J.]

I believe that religion is coded into our DNA as humans, the belief that there is something to life and that life is worth living. This is why I do not buy into Atheism. If people truly believed that there was nothing, then there would be no point to living. The whole point of living is to do something with your life. A true Atheist would commit suicide when they were "enlightened".

I don't believe that there is "nothing". I just don't believe there is a God and I don't obsess over "why am I here" or "what is the meaning of life".

I just hope to live a good, meaningful life and try not to be an asshole. If only others in this world tried as hard....

[Yerdaddy]

I don't like the concept of faith; I think it's one of the best ways to be wrong about shit. I'm very comfortable being an atheist.

[cupcakelove]

I don't like the concept of faith; I think it's one of the best ways to be wrong about shit. I'm very comfortable being an atheist.

But isn't atheism a form of faith itself?

[Yerdaddy]

But isn't atheism a form of faith itself?

Not for me. I feel the evidence - and lack of evidence - supports it. I won't say I'm 100% sure there is no god because I'm not perfect. But I came to that conclusion by weighing the evidnece, which is not a perfect way of making decisions but it's always better than consciously relying on faith in my opinion.

Don't get me wrong. I don't begrudge people relying on faith for their personal choices. I think it's intrinsically human to do so. I just try and avoid it because it has never proved to be a useful methodology in my life.

[Crispy123]

But Atheism is not believing in God. You can still believe in love or sex or whatever else.

I'm not an atheist, but I still think there's absolutely no point to life. I don't kill myself because I like having nothing to do. I have no point, no real direction. I love it.

Yes I agree in principle Atheism is belief in no God. The argument is this, if you live your life, you live it for a reason or purpose whether it be money, power, sex, etc... and that is your God. To truly have no God is, yes, Nihilistic and there is no point of going on, so if you truly had this epiphany then you would turn out the lights, IMO. The Greeks went so overboard they had a God or minor deity for every human emotion out there.

[Yerdaddy]

Yes I agree in principle Atheism is belief in no God. The argument is this, if you live your life, you live it for a reason or purpose whether it be money, power, sex, etc... and that is your God. To truly have no God is, yes, Nihilistic and there is no point of going on, so if you truly had this epiphany then you would turn out the lights, IMO. The Greeks went so overboard they had a God or minor deity for every human emotion out there.

Tell me why it is impossible to not believe in God or have a purpose in life and still be able to resist the uncontrolable urge to kill yourself? I mean I don't believe in God, I don't have or want a purpose in my life, and yet I'm not about to go off and... AAARg

[SatCam]

Yes I agree in principle Atheism is belief in no God. The argument is this, if you live your life, you live it for a reason or purpose whether it be money, power, sex, etc... and that is your God. To truly have no God is, yes, Nihilistic and there is no point of going on, so if you truly had this epiphany then you would turn out the lights, IMO. The Greeks went so overboard they had a God or minor deity for every human emotion out there.

give it up already. you are almost as bad as an athiest

[Crispy123]

Tell me why it is impossible to not believe in God or have a purpose in life and still be able to resist the uncontrolable urge to kill yourself? I mean I don't believe in God, I don't have or want a purpose in my life, and yet I'm not about to go off and... AAARg

Oh no!

What I am saying is, especially if you are a Capitalist American, you get up every day go to work and spend your money living your life. To do this you put your belief in a system that trades labor for printed paper that you then give to someone else for goods to make your life better, survive, get loving etc. This belief is in my eyes, for all intensive purposes a God. It is how you govern your life and the principles you live by.

[Yerdaddy]

Oh no!

What I am saying is, especially if you are a Capitalist American, you get up every day go to work and spend your money living your life. To do this you put your belief in a system that trades labor for printed paper that you then give to someone else for goods to make your life better, survive, get loving etc. This belief is in my eyes, for all intensive purposes a God. It is how you govern your life and the principles you live by.

By the same token, when I go into the bathroom, drop my skivvies, sit down, and drop a deuce I have faith that there's toilet paper there and that faith is, for all intensive purposes a god? No. It's an expectation (too often defied) based on observation of data from past experiences. Like playing a first-person video game like Tomb Raider: You jump Lara Croft around the CGI sets, shooting Italians and giant spiders, jumping cravaces and climbing ropes (pausing to get good angle close-ups of her CGI tits and ass), and when you're killed you remember what killed you and you start back where the game was saved and you do the whole thing over the same way but try not to get killed by the same greezy Ital. That's just a model of the life you're describing - going through daily routines, trusting your knowledge of how things work around you so you can get what you want out of it. What does that have to do with an all-seeing all-knowing being that created the universe and us and sees all and knows all and all that other bullshit ascribed to Him? Why so I shoot whenever I see an Italian come around the corner instead of jumping? And why do I have Lara Croft do the same when I'm playing the video game? Is it faith in God or faith in my understanding of video game programming gleaned from playing video games 23 hours a day?

Forget everything I just wrote; I was just dragging out that metaphor in order to keep thinking about a video game character's ass.

Some of us (you) do that shit for the same reason mice learn the path through a maze to get to the cheese: because they like cheese. And they evolved a certain American Idol Contestant-sized brain to help them better learn how to find cheese to stay alive. Some of you feel like they follow a higher purpose in their daily lives. Fair enough. But those of us who don't - don't. And we're not unconcioulsy believers because we trust that someone will give us cheese (or a lap dance) if we give them certain green pieces of paper. We just like lap dances and we work at jobs to fullfil no higher purpose than to have a cranked out chick's fake tits rubbed in our faces.

And if we don't do any of those things you describe we don't feel compelled to kill ourselves. (I was just acting before. I didn't really kill myself.) I get up in the afternoon, drink coffee and smoke cigarettes, play on the internet and wander around Third World tourist traps trying to bang German chicks, and that's about the extent of my life. Sometimes I try to bang Polish chicks. I have no purpose, no meaning in my life, no goals, and ultimately I give two shits about what happens to me or anyone or anything. And yet I'm still here. The only time I ponder suicide is when I stare at my shitty Phnom Penh hotel room's cieling fan too long, or when the girl I just bought a blowjob from asks for one in return.

I think you're just projecting beliefs on us non-believers becuase you want to believe we're more like you than we really are for the sake of validating your own belief. But trust me, I'm betting my eternal soul that I have no eternal soul. How much more confident in my own atheism can I be?

[ToddEVF]

I traded my pick for a religion to be named later.

[A.J.]

The only time I ponder suicide is when I stare at my shitty Phnom Penh hotel room's cieling fan too long, or when the girl I just bought a blowjob from asks for one in return.?

Shit, that might very well be proof of a vengeful, merciless God.

[Crispy123]

By the same token, when I go into the bathroom, drop my skivvies, sit down, and drop a deuce I have faith that there's toilet paper there and that faith is, for all intensive purposes a god?

No, Shitting is a fundamental life process. It requires no faith or belief, you merely have to be alive. To live and survive in modern day America or any industrialized society. You have to have faith, in people, in the rule of law, in government. These would replace your faith in a Christian, Muslim, Jewish, etc. idea of "God".

I revise my earlier statement to include an alternative to suicide. If you were truly an Atheist, you would be an outlaw living outside of society. You certainly would not be going to work, school, or visiting internet chat rooms.

[BeltOfScotch]

No, Shitting is a fundamental life process. It requires no faith or belief, you merely have to be alive. To live and survive in modern day America or any industrialized society. You have to have faith, in people, in the rule of law, in government. These would replace your faith in a Christian, Muslim, Jewish, etc. idea of "God".

I revise my earlier statement to include an alternative to suicide. If you were truly an Atheist, you would be an outlaw living outside of society. You certainly would not be going to work, school, or visiting internet chat rooms.

It's an interesting way to think about the concept of God, but it doesn't really have much to do with Atheism. Atheism is a general response to the Judeo-Christian-most other religions idea that there was a supreme being that created the Universe and made human beings in the image of that creator. Atheists simply don't believe that is true. The Universe was created via the Big Bang and we evolved as a species into human beings.

If you want to say that Atheists aren't truly God-less because everyone has some force that drives/guides them in life, that's one thing. But that's not really the issue here at all. I'm not an Atheist, but I think their focus on the problem with religion is the existence of the Creator figure not the idea that people have something in their lives that influences their decisions and guides their actions.

[Crispy123]

It's an interesting way to think about the concept of God, but it doesn't really have much to do with Atheism. Atheism is a general response to the Judeo-Christian-most other religions idea that there was a supreme being that created the Universe and made human beings in the image of that creator.

Well, the definitive answer. Is your last name Webster?

For the rest of us non-reference types, the definition of terms like faith, God, Atheism are a little harder to pin down.

You might consider going to Israel or Palestine and explain things to those guys.

:laugh:

[BeltOfScotch]

Well, the definitive answer. Is your last name Webster?

For the rest of us non-reference types, the definition of terms like faith, God, Atheism are a little harder to pin down.

You might consider going to Israel or Palestine and explain things to those guys.

:laugh:

Or you could have tried to actually respond to my point.

[Crispy123]

Or you could have tried to actually respond to my point.

Your premise that the belief there is no God, based on the response of someone declaring that there is a God, is an argument I get from my three year old.

"It's sunny out."

"No it isn't."

It's like, what came first the chicken or the egg? No one can prove they are an Atheist. We can't even agree what the definition of an Atheist is.

I know how someone could prove they are an Atheist to me. Blow your brains out or become Jesse James.

[Gvac]

I know how someone could prove they are an Atheist to me. Blow your brains out or become Jesse James.

I'd like to know why you think that a fear of God is the only thing that prevents people from becoming criminals or depressed creatures bent on self destruction.

It's a completely illogical argument, and far more in tune with your 3 year old's thinking than any of your other examples.

[Crispy123]

I'd like to know why you think that a fear of God is the only thing that prevents people from becoming criminals or depressed creatures bent on self destruction.


I didn't say fear of "God". The point I am making is that it is belief, faith or whatever you want to call it in something bigger than yourself. I can't define God for you. I have my definition and Im not really trying to make any converts.

To truly have no God then you are the center of your universe and accountable to no one but yourself. Some people would say that is the definition of a Psychopath. That is coming from Scholars that have been studying the subject far longer than my little one was even a gleam in my eye.

[CofyCrakCocaine]

I'm agnostic. Here's another thing I consider psychopathic: the arrogance of thinking you understand an infinite being beyond all comprehension better than anyone else, and therefore being better than everyone else based upon this faith. You hardly need a "god" to keep you centered and self-less.

"Fear of God" could be the exact same thing as "Fear of Stalin" or "Fear of Dad's Swift Wrath". You don't need a "God" to keep you pure and lawful and obeying all the rules or surviving and not being miserable. "Fear of Law" is why most people obey the speed limits (to a degree). Most religion exists solely to make people accept their own mortality anyway, whether it be through the promise of rebirth and an awesome afterlife as the Egyptians saw it, or through the dismal man-eating river into the land of no light as the Sumerians saw it, or yet again into the den of heaven or hell for the good and bad in Zoroastrianism.

And you don't need faith in some mystical being or mystical force to center your heart and keep you from 'blowing your brains out or being Jesse James'. While I think you are well-argued to some extent CPW, you undermine your own credibility by giving into the principle reason why I have zero faith in all the Man-Made faiths out there: arrogance and a smug sense of superiority over others simply because they think not like yourself and you disapprove of their way of thinking. But other than that, you are well spoken.

[Yerdaddy]

No, Shitting is a fundamental life process. It requires no faith or belief, you merely have to be alive. To live and survive in modern day America or any industrialized society. You have to have faith, in people, in the rule of law, in government. These would replace your faith in a Christian, Muslim, Jewish, etc. idea of "God".

I revise my earlier statement to include an alternative to suicide. If you were truly an Atheist, you would be an outlaw living outside of society. You certainly would not be going to work, school, or visiting internet chat rooms.

If it makes you feel better about your own faith to believe you know me better than I know myself then knock yourself out.

[Crispy123]

You hardly need a "god" to keep you centered and self-less.

This is one of the major arguments of Atheism, which I disagree as I have previously explained.

"Fear of God" could be the exact same thing as "Fear of Stalin" or "Fear of Dad's Swift Wrath". You don't need a "God" to keep you pure and lawful and obeying all the rules or surviving and not being miserable. "Fear of Law" is why most people obey the speed limits (to a degree).

This has been my argument all along. Fear of something greater than yourself. I never said God. I said these things that are bigger than ourselves have been historically given deity status. From dictators having divine rule to Gods of love, lust, order, war, etc to one true ruler of the universe, you either believe their is more than just your own ego or you don't.

While I think you are well-argued to some extent CPW, you undermine your own credibility by giving into the principle reason why I have zero faith in all the Man-Made faiths out there: arrogance and a smug sense of superiority over others simply because they think not like yourself and you disapprove of their way of thinking. But other than that, you are well spoken.

If you or anyone think Im being arrogant or condescending then you have serious self respect issues. This thread asks what side are you on, its a little complicated and Ive expressed my views.

I'm not denying that there are Atheists. I think that true Atheists are murderers, kid toucher's, junkies, etc. People who are so self centered that nothing else matters.

Just because someone tells me they are a Christian minister does not mean for one second that I think they believe in God. On the flip side I don't exactly agree that the majority of people that would come to a website like this in their spare time and post in this forum are truly Atheists. Its possible, but I doubt it.

[Yerdaddy]

If you or anyone think Im being arrogant or condescending then you have serious self respect issues.

I think that true Atheists are murderers, kid toucher's, junkies, etc. People who are so self centered that nothing else matters.

As a person who declared myself an athiest in this thread, fuck you you self-richeous prick. If I had said that about "true" Christians in this thread you'd have been offended. What you're saying now is a disgrace to the rest of the Christians here.

And i say this in the spirit of "love the sinner hate the sin". I have nothing against you personally. BUt what you've been saying in this thread, (while it has been civil), has gone from extremely arrogant and presumputous to patently insulting to a whole category of people. And now I'm just really curious to know if you're capable of seeing that. Take a look and let's find out.

[Crispy123]

As a person who declared myself an athiest in this thread, fuck you you self-richeous prick. If I had said that about "true" Christians in this thread you'd have been offended. What you're saying now is a disgrace to the rest of the Christians here.

And i say this in the spirit of "love the sinner hate the sin". I have nothing against you personally. BUt what you've been saying in this thread, (while it has been civil), has gone from extremely arrogant and presumputous to patently insulting to a whole category of people. And now I'm just really curious to know if you're capable of seeing that. Take a look and let's find out.

You misread,

I insulted Christians and Athiests. And if you presume you know what offends me then go fuck your mother.

[Yerdaddy]

That's what I expected. You're so insecure about your own Christian beliefs that you're an intolerant ass who considers people who don't share your faith to be beneath contempt. You think we're so far beneath you that we're not capable of knowing ourselves and we're impossible to insult. That kind of intolerant faith has more in common with the Taliban than it does Jesus Christ. I hope you outgrow it some day.

[Crispy123]

That's what I expected. You're so insecure about your own Christian beliefs that you're an intolerant ass who considers people who don't share your faith to be beneath contempt. You think we're so far beneath you that we're not capable of knowing ourselves and we're impossible to insult. That kind of intolerant faith has more in common with the Taliban than it does Jesus Christ. I hope you outgrow it some day.

I thought you were just fucking with me but you're truly that ignorant.

[Furtherman]

I think that true Atheists are murderers, kid toucher's, junkies, etc. People who are so self centered that nothing else matters.

I thought you were just fucking with me but you're truly that ignorant.

I'm sorry, but who is the ignorant one?

I'm an atheist. A true atheist. And I'm not a murderer, a kid toucher, or a junkie.

[Crispy123]

I'm sorry, but who is the ignorant one?

I'm an atheist. A true atheist. And I'm not a murderer, a kid toucher, or a junkie.

The Ignorant one is the person who read my posts and thinks Im a Christian.

You say your an Atheist, great. What does that mean to you? The definition is not written in stone like some people in this thread are claiming. I claimed Buddhist on this little poll. Some people would say that makes me an Atheist. I say BS as I have explained at length in my posts.

If you believe in something, what someone else says isn't going to matter about your belief unless its not very strong.

And if your gonna cry that Im being arrogant or insulting, you can save it cause Ive already heard it.

[Furtherman]

I claimed Buddhist on this little poll. Some people would say that makes me an Atheist. I say BS as I have explained at length in my posts.

If you believe in something, what someone else says isn't going to matter about your belief unless its not very strong.

And if your gonna cry that Im being arrogant or insulting, you can save it cause Ive already heard it.

Oh don't worry, I won't be crying about anything. But your anger betrays you.

You claimed Buddist on this poll?

And yet you still said:

I think that true Atheists are murderers, kid toucher's, junkies, etc. People who are so self centered that nothing else matters.

That's not very Buddist of you. It seems you still have some figuring out to do.

[Crispy123]

That's not very Buddist of you. It seems you still have some figuring out to do.

If you read my original post you would see that is the closest to what I believe. (reading comprehension 101)

Buddhism is technically considered Atheism, which is the choice closest to what I believe out of what you have given.

You have found my secret. I believe in suffering, reincarnation, and the quest for enlightenment. However, I believe that violence and death are natural parts of life and must be done as with every other aspect of our lives, with the purpose of enlightenment.

[Chigworthy]

I'm a law-abiding atheist. In my world there is no higher power that is sentient, there is only higher powers that simply are. My lack of belief in a sentient higher power does not cause me to feel like the center of the universe, nor am I unaccountable to anyone but myself. That is just silly. I hold doors open for people, I use my turn signal, I tip big, I even admire people with religious conviction that use it to better the world. Some of you may remember that I recently helped that old cripple broad get some milk out of the cold case at Safeway. Why? Because we are all in this together, and regardless of our unprovable beliefs, getting along with each other makes our brief stay here a lot better for everyone.