2009 NFL Draft thread

[hammersavage]

Matt Cassel never started a college game at QB, never had a good season, fuck he never even threw a TD pass.

College career(link) (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Matt_Cassel#College_career)

Cassel spent his entire Trojan career as a backup behind Heisman Trophy winners Carson Palmer [9] and Matt Leinart. Cassel was the backup for Palmer during his Heisman-winning 2002 season. In the fall, Cassel lost the battle for the starting position to the previous third-string quarterback in Leinart. As a result of Leinart's success, Cassel spent time at tight end and wide receiver in 2001, and some special teams that year. He started at half-back against California once as well,even making his lone collegiate start at that position. During his four seasons there, Cassel completed 19 of 33 passes for 192 yards, with no touchdowns and one interception.[10]

Cassel, a communication major at USC, was also roommates with current Pittsburgh Steelers safety Troy Polamalu[11] and Carson Palmer.[12]

Cassel played one season of baseball for USC in 2004, he had an 0-1 record with 10 strikeouts and 4 walks, he played in 8 games and started 1. Cassel struck out in his only at bat in college. He also had 2 saves with a 9.35 ERA, and was selected by the Oakland Athletics in the 36th round of the 2004 MLB Draft.[13]

And here (http://www.pro-football-reference.com/players/C/CassMa00.htm)at the bottom of the reference for football is his whole college career, less than 200 yards total passing for his entire career.

USC is not a qb factory, one year does not a franchise qb make and carson palmer has turned to shit once teams figured out his tendencies, hes serviceable as a qb but to say hes a franchise qb? Thats just fucking crazy, even after his few years in the league hes not worth what stafford got this year or even what ryan got last year.

To even think that cassel didnt walk into a great fucking scenario last year is just insane, he had a team that was one win away from being undefeated, even brady cant say that. If he can even come close to what joe montana did in KC then he may be worthy to be mentioned as a franchise qb but rest assured his being designated as a franchise qb had nothing to do with him being the franchise as much as it had to do with NE not wanting to lose him and get nothing in return.

Did you really just link the fact that Cassell didn't start in college? Any other breaking news you want to fill me in on. I was just correcting your mistake when you said he only played in 15 games, not start. You were wrong.

I think the fact that he can't play in the NFL because he didn't start in college is a dead argument. He was behind 2 Heisman trophy winners. He came in last year, great situation or not, and flourished. You may be the last person who thinks that's a fair argument. They would have pulled him after a couple games last season. You can think he won't be great in KC but clearly he's an NFL quarterback.

And to call Palmer 'not a franchise QB' shows your absolute lack of knowledge on the sport. He got his knee blown out in a playoff game or he would have gone to the AFC championship game. Last year he hurt his elbow. He's still and elite quarterback if he comes back healthy. Injuries are the only thing that may keep him from being an annual pro bowler.

[HBox]

I like it too. But do you think that Maclin is a perfect fit with Jackson already there? Wouldn't have a different receiver been a better fit with what they have? Eagles fan would know better than me on this.

Considering the fact that Andy Reid, at this point, will continue doing what he is doing this is as good as it gets. He's never been a fan of the huge WRs.

But considering how Reid runs the offense, with Jackson, Maclin and Curtis running around as WRs, Westbrook and McCoy being able to both run the ball and catch short passes and Celek and potentially Ingram as TEs Reid and Mornhinweg will be reeking havoc between the 20s. They'll be able to take the ball for a TD from almost anywhere on the field. But I suspect they'll have the same redzone issues they've had for years unless Celek and Ingram can work the endzone. Celek shows promise, Ingram I don't know.

[hammersavage]

Considering the fact that Andy Reid, at this point, will continue doing what he is doing this is as good as it gets. He's never been a fan of the huge WRs.

But considering how Reid runs the offense, with Jackson, Maclin and Curtis running around as WRs, Westbrook and McCoy being able to both run the ball and catch short passes and Celek and potentially Ingram as TEs Reid and Mornhinweg will be reeking havoc between the 20s. They'll be able to take the ball for a TD from almost anywhere on the field. But I suspect they'll have the same redzone issues they've had for years unless Celek and Ingram can work the endzone. Celek shows promise, Ingram I don't know.

Fair enough.


I said it for months that I was a fan of Hakeem Nicks. And especially when the Boldin rumors started, he made more sense. You are getting the exact physical player that Boldin is, they're the same exact size and both bring the same things to the offense. The Giants wisely got a similar player (totally unproven but with similar drawbacks to Boldin) without giving up picks. Free up Hixon to go downfield with a big, physical receiver underneath for Eli was the best thing they could do for him. I think it'll work.

[Tenbatsuzen]

BTW, why are people calling Leinart a bust? He's basically been given less than 2 seasons worth of games to play, on a Cardinals team that was pretty bad.

[hammersavage]

Will Beatty is a damn solid pickup for the Giants.

One of the magazines, can't remember which one, ripped him worse than any played they talked about. Said he doesn't care about football and called him, and I quote "a wine drinking, cake eater."

I don't know this kid and I don't even know what that means, but I'll forever refer to him as the wine drinking cake eater.

[K.C.]

I like it too. But do you think that Maclin is a perfect fit with Jackson already there? Wouldn't have a different receiver been a better fit with what they have? Eagles fan would know better than me on this.

I really think they see Jason Avant as a viable possession receiver based off last season.

I'm never going to complain about more speed. Maclin should be a nice addition.

[razorboy]

BTW, why are people calling Leinart a bust? He's basically been given less than 2 seasons worth of games to play, on a Cardinals team that was pretty bad.

A high first round draft pick was handed the starting job four games into his career and sucked. Since that point he hasn't been able to take the starting job from Warner and has become more well known for his partying and whining. Might as well add two more years to his time of inactivity at this point. I'm going to go ahead and say if the #10 overall pick can't win the starting job on a heretofore shitty team, it's fair to classify him as a bust.

[razorboy]

One of the magazines, can't remember which one, ripped him worse than any played they talked about. Said he doesn't care about football and called him, and I quote "a wine drinking, cake eater."

I don't know this kid and I don't even know what that means, but I'll forever refer to him as the wine drinking cake eater.

Never heard a bad word a bout the kid and was always impressed by his play. I Always heard he was one of the hardest workers for UCONN. You might be able to say that he is bit of a finesse player, but that's about the worst thing I've ever heard about him.

[Tenbatsuzen]

A high first round draft pick was handed the starting job four games into his career and sucked. Since that point he hasn't been able to take the starting job from Warner and has become more well known for his partying and whining. Might as well add two more years to his time of inactivity at this point. I'm going to go ahead and say if the #10 overall pick can't win the starting job on a heretofore shitty team, it's fair to classify him as a bust.

...he lost the job to a former MVP who had a career revitalization and lead the team to a superbowl after they restocked the team and got a new coach. It's not like he lost the job to Tavaris Jackson.

[HBox]

...he lost the job to a former MVP who had a career revitalization and lead the team to a superbowl after they restocked the team and got a new coach. It's not like he lost the job to Tavaris Jackson.

He had Anquan Boldin, Larry Fitzgerald and Steve Breaston to throw to and still sucked. I'm not saying he's can't still be a good QB but he's been inexcusably lousy thus far.

[hammersavage]

The Mr. Irrelevant thing has gone to new levels of stupidity.


Hoyer goes undrafted and I'd say he has the best opportunity to be Tony Romo of the group. Also surprised Gano didn't get drafted. He's a pretty good kicker.

[Tenbatsuzen]

The Mr. Irrelevant thing has gone to new levels of stupidity.


Hoyer goes undrafted and I'd say he has the best opportunity to be Tony Romo of the group. Also surprised Gano didn't get drafted. He's a pretty good kicker.

I'm fucking shocked that Pat McAfee got drafted, but he did get taken by a team who plays primarily in a dome.

[Snoogans]

Seattle got a steal. I knew he was too talented to not get drafted. Get that Seahawk Teel jersey ordered Snoogans.

I wouldnt call Mike Teel a steal. Unless you are tryin to lose games

[Snoogans]

By the way, I hate to say this. But the Jets got a fuckin great pick in Shonn Greene. If he can stay out of trouble, he will be very good

[Tenbatsuzen]

I've chosen my new nickname for Sanchez.

From here on out, he will be known as...

Machete.

[Snoogans]

I've chosen my new nickname for Sanchez.

From here on out, he will be known as...

Machete.

Nice. Is that cause of how bad he is gonna slice the Jets future by being shitty?

[razorboy]

I've chosen my new nickname for Sanchez.

From here on out, he will be known as...

Mediocre.

Agreed.

[Tenbatsuzen]

Nice. Is that cause of how bad he is gonna slice the Jets future by being shitty?

You're fucking with the wrong Mexican.

[Tenbatsuzen]

Agreed.

after Favre last year, and the choice of Clemens, I'll take mediocre.

[Snoogans]

You're fucking with the wrong Mexican.

When it comes to knives, is there ever a right mexican to fuck with?


Sanchez is a fag anyway. Even if he becomes the best QB in NFL history, he will still be a bitch

[hammersavage]

I will call him Dirty.

[Snoogans]

you know what really kicks ass


Carson Palmer was pretty good. And then Leinart sucked balls. Then Matt Cassel was pretty good. Now that means Sanchez is gonna lick balls.


And if that isnt enough, he also will be playing for the Jets. Tough mountain to climb, there

[Tenbatsuzen]

Sanchez's agent:

http://www.nlm.nih.gov/medlineplus/images/donfrancisco1.jpg

[Snoogans]

Sanchez talent:
http://www.cbc.ca/gfx/topstory/johnson_rob.jpg

another USC elite, btw

[hammersavage]

I think the Jets did great. Only 3 picks but Sanchez should be good and I'm on record as loving Shonn Green.

They still need a wide receiver, maybe off the scrap heap, for Sanchez to throw to. But they can go after that next offseason. They can't expect too much from his as a rookie anyhow.

[hammersavage]

Bears got Cutler a target in Iglesias. He and Hester should open up the field for the rocket that Cutler has.


Also can't wait to see Crabtree step into the Rice legacy in San Fran. I think Nate Davis will eventually get a shot out there too.

[Snoogans]

being completely honest, I cant argue. Its probably the best draft the Jets have had that I remember, at least at this time. I do hope Sanchez blows, but I dont think they made any wrong moves

[Snoogans]

Bears got Cutler a target in Iglesias. He and Hester should open up the field for the rocket that Cutler has.


Also can't wait to see Crabtree step into the Rice legacy in San Fran. I think Nate Davis will eventually get a shot out there too.

I didnt like what I saw from Davis in college in terms of being a good NFL QB. He seemed too fast to break off and try to run in college, which doesnt bode well for the NFL usually.

[hammersavage]

I didnt like what I saw from Davis in college in terms of being a good NFL QB. He seemed too fast to break off and try to run in college, which doesnt bode well for the NFL usually.

You're right. I mean the guy was drafted in the 5th I believe. But something about him intrigued me, could be dead wrong.


Of the QB's, I liked Sanchez, Davis, Bomar, Hoyer and Teel. Just either something I saw or where they went.

That's the way I follow the draft and the NFL for that matter. I try to see talent in certain players and follow them since I don't have a real favorite team. Doesn't fuck with my fantasy teams or gambling addiction.

[Snoogans]

You're right. I mean the guy was drafted in the 5th I believe. But something about him intrigued me, could be dead wrong.


Of the QB's, I liked Sanchez, Davis, Bomar, Hoyer and Teel. Just either something I saw or where they went.

That's the way I follow the draft and the NFL for that matter. I try to see talent in certain players and follow them since I don't have a real favorite team. Doesn't fuck with my fantasy teams or gambling addiction.

You should really get more into College Football

[hammersavage]

You should really get more into College Football

I am pretty into it. I'm a Notre Dame fan so that kinda has waned some of my interest in recent years. Almost like the Rangers in hockey, when my favorite team is good, I care about that sport way more. It's not even a fairweather thing cuz even when they're bad I watch more than most people I know.

But I loathe the bowl system. I don't care about any bowl except 1 or 2, they just seem so pointless. I cherry pick and watch for players

[Snoogans]

I am pretty into it. I'm a Notre Dame fan so that kinda has waned some of my interest in recent years. Almost like the Rangers in hockey, when my favorite team is good, I care about that sport way more. It's not even a fairweather thing cuz even when they're bad I watch more than most people I know.

But I loathe the bowl system. I don't care about any bowl except 1 or 2, they just seem so pointless. I cherry pick and watch for players

I dont care about the bowl system. Ill take the good things out of it. Im one of the few that doesnt care if they have a playoffs.

But in general, ive gotten to the point with NFL I just follow guys I liked watching in college. I watch Giants games cause they are my team, but more so I care about players.

And if it wasnt for the bowl system, the week 2 or 3 atmosphere's would not be that nuts

[SP1!]

Did you really just link the fact that Cassell didn't start in college? Any other breaking news you want to fill me in on. I was just correcting your mistake when you said he only played in 15 games, not start. You were wrong.

I think the fact that he can't play in the NFL because he didn't start in college is a dead argument. He was behind 2 Heisman trophy winners. He came in last year, great situation or not, and flourished. You may be the last person who thinks that's a fair argument. They would have pulled him after a couple games last season. You can think he won't be great in KC but clearly he's an NFL quarterback.

And to call Palmer 'not a franchise QB' shows your absolute lack of knowledge on the sport. He got his knee blown out in a playoff game or he would have gone to the AFC championship game. Last year he hurt his elbow. He's still and elite quarterback if he comes back healthy. Injuries are the only thing that may keep him from being an annual pro bowler.
The fact that he didnt start at USC was what the fuck we had argued for like 2 pages the shit had less that 200 yards his entire college career and he never started a single game. Whats worse is that he just wasnt that good to take starts away from an established guy or win a job over a 3rd stringer his final few years. He got lucky and brady got hurt, personally I wouldnt have traded him from NE simply because he was comfortable but now the guppy has been thrown into the sea so lets see if he can swim, Im not sold on him being a franchise QB though.

Palmer had an ideal situation with a couple of great receivers without being head cases when he first started, now they have ego and a me first attitude going for them, lets see if he can reign them in, out of all the USC qbs he was the one that I thought had the most promise as far as talent. Now lets see if he has the leadership to back it up, hes already shown hes fragile so the franchise tag is done with him since no one will pony up big bucks to have a chandelier as their starting QB. 4-5 years from now palmer will probably be in a booth somewhere instead of on a sideline.

Franchise is not what you think it means, most of the time teams just use it so they get something in return for a player not that they are building a team around him because there are very few USC qbs that anyone would build a team around and I even mean recently.

BTW, why are people calling Leinart a bust? He's basically been given less than 2 seasons worth of games to play, on a Cardinals team that was pretty bad.

He had Anquan Boldin, Larry Fitzgerald and Steve Breaston to throw to and still sucked. I'm not saying he's can't still be a good QB but he's been inexcusably lousy thus far.
Yeah leinart is a big bust if he doesnt step up and take that job away from kurt, fuck how do you let a man that is almost 40 take your job? Thats fucking weak, leinart should have busted his ass to get that job back but he appears content to hold a clipboard for years since he cant make the throws or take the hits needed to win.

You should really get more into College Football
College football is the shit, pro is ok but to see real talent college is the place to be.

I also recommend justin.tv for everyone in the fall, if you like football you can watch it from friday night to late saturday/early sunday and see who will be playing in the future NFL.

Still Im shocked so many north carolina receivers got picked in the draft.

[hammersavage]

Palmer had an ideal situation with a couple of great receivers without being head cases when he first started, now they have ego and a me first attitude going for them, lets see if he can reign them in, out of all the USC qbs he was the one that I thought had the most promise as far as talent. Now lets see if he has the leadership to back it up, hes already shown hes fragile so the franchise tag is done with him since no one will pony up big bucks to have a chandelier as their starting QB. 4-5 years from now palmer will probably be in a booth somewhere instead of on a sideline.

This is why I can't have sports discussions with anonymous posters on a message board. It's just such a dumb thing to say. He got his big bucks and years already, there's no question about if it will happen. He signed a six year extension to a deal that still had three to go to make $118.75 million in salary and bonuses until 2014.

You also said Cassell didn't start in 15 games. C'mon man, google at least.

[Knowledged_one]

This is why I can't have sports discussions with anonymous posters on a message board. It's just such a dumb thing to say. He got his big bucks and years already, there's no question about if it will happen. He signed a six year extension to a deal that still had three to go to make $118.75 million in salary and bonuses until 2014.

You also said Cassell didn't start in 15 games. C'mon man, google at least.

my favorite that people do is the switch of subjects on a point not being discussed and i was wrong about pat white

[SP1!]

This is why I can't have sports discussions with anonymous posters on a message board. It's just such a dumb thing to say. He got his big bucks and years already, there's no question about if it will happen. He signed a six year extension to a deal that still had three to go to make $118.75 million in salary and bonuses until 2014.

You also said Cassell didn't start in 15 games. C'mon man, google at least.

SO fucking what? There are plenty of players getting paid by the NFL that arent or will not play a fucking down this season, it doesnt make them a franchise fucking player, besides what the hell else is cincy going to do they locked him up before he was injured now hes in the same boat that pennington was in, ligament injuries and recovery. We were arguing that cassel cant be considered a product of the USC system since he never started a game for them in college, you should really look into a reading comprehension program.

You are arguing for the point that your NFL team drafted a school known as a QB factory, I simply pointed out the fact that wasnt true, dont get upset that sanchez will end up being a bust and no where near the savior that jets fans think he will become. He had one average season in a bad pac 10 year and up until these last few weeks the scouts thought he had an average arm and little up side, after a few workouts he was a man child ready to take the NFL to new levels. There was another guy who had these lofty standards but tony mandarich never lived up to his standards either but Im suuuuuuuure that sanchez will be the second coming of joe willie and get you that win over the colts.......

[hammersavage]

Nope, a franchise quarterback gets a 9 year extension and 120 million. Big Ben, Manning, Brady. Look this stuff up, its online.


And fuck the Jets, I don't care if their plane crashes. Just get me new goons I can wager on.

[SP1!]

my favorite that people do is the switch of subjects on a point not being discussed and i was wrong about pat white

I wasnt arguing about pat white, I think the guy is a tremendous talent but I do think he is crazy for not at least agreeing to think about switching positions once hes drafted.

I never fucking said he should be listed as a receiver on the draft board, just that he should be open to all positions since teams have issues with him as a passer. Even if he was listed as a receiver or ATH(like they list them in college or HS) he is a unique talent and would be too great to be past upon, I actually think he dropped a few spots in the draft by saying he wouldnt consider a switch and that teams higher would have taken him as a RB or a slot receiver just to use him and his abilities.

Great talent, he just doesnt seem to be a fit for the pro qb position.

[Knowledged_one]

Did casell go to usc?
did he get the same coaching the other qbs did? Yes well then he is a product of the usc system

[Knowledged_one]

I wasnt arguing about pat white, I think the guy is a tremendous talent but I do think he is crazy for not at least agreeing to think about switching positions once hes drafted.

I never fucking said he should be listed as a receiver on the draft board, just that he should be open to all positions since teams have issues with him as a passer. Even if he was listed as a receiver or ATH(like they list them in college or HS) he is a unique talent and would be too great to be past upon, I actually think he dropped a few spots in the draft by saying he wouldnt consider a switch and that teams higher would have taken him as a RB or a slot receiver just to use him and his abilities.

Great talent, he just doesnt seem to be a fit for the pro qb position.

easy breezy that comment wasnt directed at you

[TheMojoPin]

Bears got Cutler a target in Iglesias. He and Hester should open up the field for the rocket that Cutler has.

Knox might be a decent pick along those lines, too. He'll need some work, but he's incredibly fast. If he can even just be serviceable that'll give Cutler 3 deep targets to pick from with Olsen and Forte to mix things up.

I was not expecting the 3rd pick of Gilbert at all but I REALLY like it for the Bears the more I look into this guy. I think he has a real shot at being a serious sleeper pick. As much issues as I have with Angelos as a GM, his 3rd round and later picks have usually been pretty solid or better.

[SP1!]

Nope, a franchise quarterback gets a 9 year extension and 120 million. Big Ben, Manning, Brady. Look this stuff up, its online.


And fuck the Jets, I don't care if their plane crashes. Just get me new goons I can wager on.

Yeah you are arguing with the wrong person on the contract issue, the falcons signed vick to the largest extension before his troubles and I thought it was the dumbest move ever.

Just because large money is thrown at QBs its not so much the player as it is the state of the position, fuck kyle boller was starting and kyle orton were seen as decent qbs. Now if you want to argue that palmer is above those guys, then yeah I will agree but if I want a qb to build a franchise around then palmer is not the one I am putting at the reins.

You have to remember Cincinnati is a stupid organization and doomed to failure, that deal was thought to be outrageous at the time and if he doesnt come back from his tendinitis or ends up needing the surgery then that franchise is in deep shit for a decade.

[hammersavage]

Wrong. Vick was a franchise quarterback and got thrown in jail. He would still be their QB if he wasn't. Keep going though, I like your effort. Still haven't made a valid point yet but I applaud you.

[SP1!]

Did casell go to usc?
did he get the same coaching the other qbs did? Yes well then he is a product of the usc system
Well he wasnt good enough in their system to break into the starting line up, ever. If you arent the starter you are only getting half the tutelage, its just the way it goes until you are needed.

easy breezy that comment wasnt directed at you
Sorry, someone else called me on white shit earlier and even though I like him, his insistence to play QB may have cost him a few million.

[razorboy]

Wrong. Vick was a franchise quarterback and got thrown in jail. He would still be their QB if he wasn't. Keep going though, I like your effort. Still haven't made a valid point yet but I applaud you.

Here is where we part ways. Being paid like a franchise QB and being a franchise QB are two different things entirely. Vick was a craptastic QB with a shiteload of hype and fan support. His NFL career was shite, and if you look at his college statistics, they were shite as well.

[hammersavage]

Here is where we part ways. Being paid like a franchise QB and being a franchise QB are two different things entirely. Vick was a craptastic QB with a shiteload of hype and fan support. His NFL career was shite, and if you look at his college statistics, they were shite as well.

I'm not debating you, you may have valid points.

[MattCassel]

just to settle this, I suck

[Snoogans]

Here is where we part ways. Being paid like a franchise QB and being a franchise QB are two different things entirely. Vick was a craptastic QB with a shiteload of hype and fan support. His NFL career was shite, and if you look at his college statistics, they were shite as well.

I'm not debating you, you may have valid points.

no, he doesnt.

1, Michael Vick led the NCAA in pass efficiency rating as a sophmore

2. He was a great passing QB. But you are INSANE if you say his time was shit. He won alot of games for them with his legs, and despite his short comings, they werent nearly as good when he wasnt there. That playoff win in Lambeau was a big fuckin deal. He led the team. He wasnt a good passer, but he got that team to play the best they could

[hammersavage]

no, he doesnt.

1, Michael Vick led the NCAA in pass efficiency rating as a sophmore

2. He was a great passing QB. But you are INSANE if you say his time was shit. He won alot of games for them with his legs, and despite his short comings, they werent nearly as good when he wasnt there. That playoff win in Lambeau was a big fuckin deal. He led the team. He wasnt a good passer, but he got that team to play the best they could

Huge deal. No one had done that at the time, Favre was still Favre. And I said maybe.

[Snoogans]

sorry he didnt lead the NCAA in efficiency. he set the record for efficiency as a freshman and then was pretty high as a soph. But he wasnt bad and his stats werent bad.

[hammersavage]

See, facts are out there. Just google.

[Snoogans]

In NCAA Football Bowl Subdivision (formerly division I-A), the career record for passing efficiency is held by Ryan Dinwiddie of Boise State, who had a career mark of 168.9 between 2000 and 2003. The single-season record belongs to Colt Brennan of Hawaii, who amassed a passer rating of 186.0 over the 2006 season, while the freshman record belongs to Michael Vick of Virginia Tech, whose rating during the 1999 season was 180.4. Current NCAA Football Bowl Subdivision passing efficiency ratings can be found here.

best ever is 186. Vick had 180.4 as a freshman. Man did he fuckin blow

[Knowledged_one]

In NCAA Football Bowl Subdivision (formerly division I-A), the career record for passing efficiency is held by Ryan Dinwiddie of Boise State, who had a career mark of 168.9 between 2000 and 2003. The single-season record belongs to Colt Brennan of Hawaii, who amassed a passer rating of 186.0 over the 2006 season, while the freshman record belongs to Michael Vick of Virginia Tech, whose rating during the 1999 season was 180.4. Current NCAA Football Bowl Subdivision passing efficiency ratings can be found here.

best ever is 186. Vick had 180.4 as a freshman. Man did he fuckin blow

he did at picking dog fight winners

[SP1!]

Wrong. Vick was a franchise quarterback and got thrown in jail. He would still be their QB if he wasn't. Keep going though, I like your effort. Still haven't made a valid point yet but I applaud you.

Vick was not a franchise qb, ever.

He was a great talent but any one, ANYONE who saw him play with the falcons realized that he was never going to get them to a super bowl let alone win one at QB.

Down here they called it racism but if you watched him play you could see that he couldnt read defenses and he couldnt check off to his receivers or dump off to RBs in the flat. He was horrible but only those that watched him week after week could see that.

[hammersavage]

he did at picking dog fight winners

He had nothing on Cheese.

Vick was not a franchise qb, ever.

He was a great talent but any one, ANYONE who saw him play with the falcons realized that he was never going to get them to a super bowl let alone win one at QB.

Down here they called it racism but if you watched him play you could see that he couldnt read defenses and he couldnt check off to his receivers or dump off to RBs in the flat. He was horrible but only those that watched him week after week could see that.

And there it is.

[Knowledged_one]

He had nothing on Cheese.



And there it is.

now that was funny

[SP1!]

no, he doesnt.

1, Michael Vick led the NCAA in pass efficiency rating as a sophmore

2. He was a great passing QB. But you are INSANE if you say his time was shit. He won alot of games for them with his legs, and despite his short comings, they werent nearly as good when he wasnt there. That playoff win in Lambeau was a big fuckin deal. He led the team. He wasnt a good passer, but he got that team to play the best they could

NCAA is not nearly the same as the pros, once tampa bay exposed him and showed how to contain him, he was done.

Most of you saw it once a year or his best runs on the highlights, atlanta fans saw it every week and just wondered when he was going to fuck up and lose the game.

Everything is a highlight from the outside, from the inside it was a fucking nightmare. Sorry the dogs got hurt but Im fucking glad vick is gone, hopefully he can come back as a receiver or back but thank god it wont be with atlanta.

[Snoogans]

Vick was not a franchise qb, ever.

He was a great talent but any one, ANYONE who saw him play with the falcons realized that he was never going to get them to a super bowl let alone win one at QB.

.

i disagree. Vick was the only reason those teams ever got near the playoffs. If they had had ANY WRs who could actually catch in those couple years, they woulda been fine. He wasnt great, but he probably had more of his passes dropped than other QBs too. And the team wasnt smart enough (or in hindsight, way smart) to build the system 100% around him. They kinda only half committed.

[SP1!]

i disagree. Vick was the only reason those teams ever got near the playoffs. If they had had ANY WRs who could actually catch in those couple years, they woulda been fine. He wasnt great, but he probably had more of his passes dropped than other QBs too. And the team wasnt smart enough (or in hindsight, way smart) to build the system 100% around him. They kinda only half committed.

Funny we went to the SB a couple years before vick ever got here.

He was horrible to watch try and pass, he could never check off and if his primary receiver wasnt open he would take off running, when TB put a LB on him to stuff him he was shut down.

[Snoogans]

NCAA is not nearly the same as the pros, once tampa bay exposed him and showed how to contain him, he was done.

Most of you saw it once a year or his best runs on the highlights, atlanta fans saw it every week and just wondered when he was going to fuck up and lose the game.

Everything is a highlight from the outside, from the inside it was a fucking nightmare. Sorry the dogs got hurt but Im fucking glad vick is gone, hopefully he can come back as a receiver or back but thank god it wont be with atlanta.

i didnt say it was. Razor made the comment vick was shit in college and his numbers were shit. Which is completely not true.

If you bothered to fuckin read, you might be able to follow what we are doin here

[Snoogans]

Funny we went to the SB a couple years before vick ever got here.

He was horrible to watch try and pass, he could never check off and if his primary receiver wasnt open he would take off running, when TB put a LB on him to stuff him he was shut down.

completely different team. Thats my point. They never built the team for vick. And the receivers were ass. Of course he wont succeed when everyone knows every pass has to go to Crumpler cause no one else will catch it. Ok warrick dunn too but


and TB was probably the only team at that time with a LB fast enough to stop him that way. Dont think other teams didnt try the same thing, they just couldnt do it

[razorboy]

sorry he didnt lead the NCAA in efficiency. he set the record for efficiency as a freshman and then was pretty high as a soph. But he wasnt bad and his stats werent bad.

Cmp-Att Yds. TD Int Rushing:No. Yds. Avg. TD LG
202-360 3,504 22 12 262 1,318 5.0 18 82

Very impressive career stats for a six foot QB with the hands of a six year old girl.

[hammersavage]

I like it better when Snoogans is behind me on a point.




And yes, I know how open the beginning of that sentence is to a mod quote.

[Snoogans]

Cmp-Att Yds. TD Int Rushing:No. Yds. Avg. TD LG
202-360 3,504 22 12 262 1,318 5.0 18 82

Very impressive career stats for a six foot QB with the hands of a six year old girl.

if you think those are bad stats you dont watch football. You just laid them out and they are very very solid

seriously, 180.6 rating. You cant argue with that. Thats fuckin incredible

[SP1!]

And there it is.
Yes I dont like the black QB I must be racist, fuck I yelled cause I thought matt ryan shouldnt be drafted as well, does that even it out? Fuck you people are predictable.

I loved vick his first year, then his second when he got us to the playoffs, after that he was toast. Tampa shut him down, then all the other teams followed that blueprint and he was all of a sudden an ordinary QB, his qb rating never got back above 80 again.

Great athlete but once it came down to making reads he just froze and decided to run, that worked well the first year but after that he was done.

[Snoogans]

Yes I dont like the black QB I must be racist, fuck I yelled cause I thought matt ryan shouldnt be drafted as well, does that even it out? Fuck you people are predictable.

I loved vick his first year, then his second when he got us to the playoffs, after that he was toast. Tampa shut him down, then all the other teams followed that blueprint and he was all of a sudden an ordinary QB, his qb rating never got back above 80 again.

Great athlete but once it came down to making reads he just froze and decided to run, that worked well the first year but after that he was done.

i think it was the broken leg that did that. He had the big comeback but I think that hurt him alot in the long run

[SP1!]

completely different team. Thats my point. They never built the team for vick. And the receivers were ass. Of course he wont succeed when everyone knows every pass has to go to Crumpler cause no one else will catch it. Ok warrick dunn too but


and TB was probably the only team at that time with a LB fast enough to stop him that way. Dont think other teams didnt try the same thing, they just couldnt do it
They paid a high price to bring in receiver for him, he just couldnt get them the ball.

if you think those are bad stats you dont watch football. You just laid them out and they are very very solid

seriously, 180.6 rating. You cant argue with that. Thats fuckin incredible
So you argue so much about his college QB rating, now defend his 75.7 pro QB rating.

They guy had skills but he was shit as a qb in the pros

[hammersavage]

You people?


And there it is.

[razorboy]

if you think those are bad stats you dont watch football. You just laid them out and they are very very solid

seriously, 180.6 rating. You cant argue with that. Thats fuckin incredible

I do watch college football, and for a Big East QB with two years of starting to amass 3,500 yards and 22 passing TDs is more than a little disappointing.

[SP1!]

i think it was the broken leg that did that. He had the big comeback but I think that hurt him alot in the long run

He was fine after it healed, he had his best rushing seasons after it healed, his problem was in the fact he couldnt relax and check off to the open receiver, we watched it every fucking week it was infuriating that he couldnt look across the field to see a guy wide open.

[Snoogans]

I do watch college football, and for a Big East QB with two years of starting to amass 3,500 yards and 22 passing TDs is more than a little disappointing.

he ran for almost 1500 yards too. And look at the numbers, they just didnt throw alot. They ran that offense different. That has to be accounted for. But you cant say he is bad, look at his efficiency alone. Completion % is solid, and he ran a ton like I said

[hammersavage]

I do watch college football, and for a Big East QB with two years of starting to amass 3,500 yards and 22 passing TDs is more than a little disappointing.

40 total TD's

[SP1!]

You people?


And there it is.

I set you up and you slam dunked it, congrats.

He couldnt read a defense for shit, its like he was fez having an on air panic attack if his primary receiver wasnt open.

[razorboy]

40 total TD's

Fine. Enough reason that he should have never been the no. 1 overall pick.

[hammersavage]

As someone who knows someone who owns a black man, I'm offended.

[Snoogans]

I set you up and you slam dunked it, congrats.

He couldnt read a defense for shit, its like he was fez having an on air panic attack if his primary receiver wasnt open.

or maybe he just didnt wanna throw it cause he new Price would drop it again.

Im not sayin Michael Vick was a great passer. I didnt even want to discuss him. But Razor claimed his college and nfl career were total shit, and he is so way off its not even funny

[SP1!]

I do watch college football, and for a Big East QB with two years of starting to amass 3,500 yards and 22 passing TDs is more than a little disappointing.

I will argue all day about vicks pro stats but his college stats were phenomenal, he was like a god among men playing on saturdays, fuck I had barely heard of VT before he came along and put that team on the national map.

College game doesnt always translate to the pros though.

[hammersavage]

He shoulda went to USC. They are a breeding ground for NFL starters.

[Snoogans]

Fine. Enough reason that he should have never been the no. 1 overall pick.

You could say that about 900 QBs. Vick was the right pick. It just didnt work out.

[Snoogans]

He shoulda went to USC. They are a breeding ground for NFL starters.

he was an NFL starter and still would be, asshat

[hammersavage]

he was an NFL starter and still would be, asshat

They woulda cleared up his character issues. They don't do dogfighting on the beach.

[Snoogans]

They woulda cleared up his character issues. They don't do dogfighting on the beach.

Yea cause USC is known for character guys.....and all the money they gave Bush and OJ Mayo. All class baby

[razorboy]

he was an NFL starter and still would be, asshat

He would've been a fantastic KR.

[hammersavage]

Yea cause USC is known for character guys.....and all the money they gave Bush and OJ Mayo. All class baby

Reggie Bush fucks Kim Kardashian. End of story.

[SP1!]

He would've been a fantastic KR.

Thats where he may end up if they ever lift his suspension.

[SP1!]

Reggie Bush fucks Kim Kardashian. End of story.

I would have more respect for him if he went OJ and killed the bitch, what a waste of space kim is and you can always find a dumb hot bitch to fuck athletes.

[razorboy]

Reggie Bush fucks Kim Kardashian. End of story.

She fucked Brandy's brother too. She knows how to pick winners.

[Snoogans]

I would have more respect for him if he went OJ and killed the bitch, what a waste of space kim is and you can always find a dumb hot bitch to fuck athletes.

are you gay? Im not making a joke, im legitimately asking

[SP1!]

are you gay? Im not making a joke, im legitimately asking

I have no room for vapid whores like kim or paris, besides kims younger sister is hotter, not the sasquatch bitch the little one.

[Snoogans]

I have no room for vapid whores like kim or paris, besides kims younger sister is hotter, not the sasquatch bitch the little one.

did you just seriously compare Kim to Paris? Are you gay and blind?

[hammersavage]

I have no room for vapid whores like kim or paris, besides kims younger sister is hotter, not the sasquatch bitch the little one.

Which one?

http://evilbeetgossip.film.com/wp-content/uploads/2007/10/kendall_kylie1.jpg


Perv

[Snoogans]

HA

[razorboy]

Which one?

You're a horrible, horrible person.

[hammersavage]

For making him have to choose?

[Snoogans]

ha

[SP1!]

Hot

[razorboy]

For making him have to choose?

Apparently you made his day.

[Snoogans]

From sporting news run downs:
Hakeem Nicks
Bottom line: Nicks made the right decision to declare early for the draft. He had a breakout junior season and is entering when his stock is the highest. He has everything it takes to make big plays, and he is a rare receiving prospect who should be drafted late in the first round or early in the second.


Kenny Britt
Bottom line: Britt is a big competitor who can change the game in an instant with the ball in his hands. He is productive, has outstanding strength and accelerates to top speed quickly, making him a deep threat. Britt, not Michael Crabtree, may be the best receiver in the draft. There are some minor character concerns regarding Britt, but nothing that will keep him from being taken on Day 1.

[Snoogans]

Kenny Britt

Overall grade: 8.4
Position rank: 2
Blocking: 12
Hands: 20
Patterns: 13
Release: 2
Run after catch: 4
NFL comparison:
Larry Fitzgerald, Cardinals


FUCK YOU JERRY REESE. NEW VIDEO COMING AS SOON AS I GET MY VOICE BACK

[SP1!]

I still have no clue what oakland was thinking taking bey at 7.

There is no way he turns out to be a better player than crabtree unless he gets hurt. Its just insane how stupid they are.

[JimBeam]

I still have no clue what oakland was thinking taking bey at 7.

There is no way he turns out to be a better player than crabtree unless he gets hurt. Its just insane how stupid they are.

We have no idea who will be there better pro.

You'd have said the same thing 20+ years ago if somebody had drafted a Jerry Rice over the flavor of the year at that time.

How many times has the WR that everybody was in love w/ failed to meet expectations ?

Ask Detroit about that.

[epo]

We have no idea who will be there better pro.

You'd have said the same thing 20+ years ago if somebody had drafted a Jerry Rice over the flavor of the year at that time.

How many times has the WR that everybody was in love w/ failed to meet expectations ?

Ask Detroit about that.

Players fail all the time. Drafting a projected late first-rounder at #7 overall is just stupid.

In the second round they took a guy who was a projected 7th rounder and in the third round they took a projected 5th rounder who was actually sleeping when the Raiders called him.

This is a microcosm as to why Al Davis and his Raiders are a damned punchline.

[SP1!]

We have no idea who will be there better pro.

You'd have said the same thing 20+ years ago if somebody had drafted a Jerry Rice over the flavor of the year at that time.

How many times has the WR that everybody was in love w/ failed to meet expectations ?

Ask Detroit about that.
Detroits problem was their organization not just who they drafted, they didnt develop them right and set them up for failure, they have gotten rid of almost all their dead weight and can finally start moving in the right direction. It just took them years to finally fire millen which is crazy since he was the worst GM of all time, and 20 years ago there wasnt the saturation of scouting that they have today. Hell most decent players come out of mid to large schools, the last player I can think of that came out of a small school is farve and his school isnt that small anymore.

Players fail all the time. Drafting a projected late first-rounder at #7 overall is just stupid.

In the second round they took a guy who was a projected 7th rounder and in the third round they took a projected 5th rounder who was actually sleeping when the Raiders called him.

This is a microcosm as to why Al Davis and his Raiders are a damned punchline.

That is the point, bey is a late first round at best, nobody was going to take him before then so why waste this high pick and pay him that money when you could have gotten either more picks or saved a shitload of money?

That being said, crabtree looks like he can play right now while bey just does not have the physical size to dominate.


Oh god, I just heard dave agreeing with me on USC qbs being over rated, that means I am 100% wrong, dave is never right

[JimBeam]

I'm not saying that overall they didn't make dumb moves and that even the " experts " questioned them but none of us, not even the supposed experts, can tell us how good or bad this kid will be.

Everybody, I mean everybody, was in love w/ Russell when they picked him so how'd that worked out for them ?

I'm no Raiders fan, I'm a Saints fan, so I'm not defending them blindly on this pick, I just want us to see what this kid can do before we write him off so soon.

[JimBeam]

That being said, crabtree looks like he can play right now while bey just does not have the physical size to dominate.

Then why did he fall all the way to #10 ?

You can't use the experts projections of a guy being a late 1st rounder to make one point and then not also validate how another guy that you think can play right now " fell " to #10.

Actually there were quite a few people questioning whether Crabtree's playing in a pass happy offense against sub-par defenses makes him the star his stats say.

How is Crabtree in your eyes a better player ? Because he was talked about more ?

The synopsis on Bey was that he has size and speed so how would he not be suited for the NFL ?

The knock on him was the same as on Crabtree and that was that they had inconssitent hands.

So w/ all things like that equal why not take the bigger and faster guy ?

Maybe Bey never turns into anything but I can see the same thing happening w/ Crabtree especially w/o a decent choice @ QB in San Fran.

[SP1!]

Then why did he fall all the way to #10 ?

You can't use the experts projections of a guy being a late 1st rounder to make one point and then not also validate how another guy that you think can play right now " fell " to #10.

Actually there were quite a few people questioning whether Crabtree's playing in a pass happy offense against sub-par defenses makes him the star his stats say.

How is Crabtree in your eyes a better player ? Because he was talked about more ?

The synopsis on Bey was that he has size and speed so how would he not be suited for the NFL ?

The knock on him was the same as on Crabtree and that was that they had inconssitent hands.

So w/ all things like that equal why not take the bigger and faster guy ?

Maybe Bey never turns into anything but I can see the same thing happening w/ Crabtree especially w/o a decent choice @ QB in San Fran.
Crabtree is better because I watched him play a shitload of games on justin.tv, bey was shown locally and he would just disappear some games. Do you really believe the ACC plays tougher defense than the big 12? The acc is a quite a bit weaker lately and give up a ton of points outside of conference play so that is just stupid to say bey was in a stronger defense conference. Also, bey is shorter by at least 3 inches, hes been listed as just over 6' while crabtree is 6'3" and has been listed a little taller in other guides.

The only reason people could have apprehension about crabtree would be because of his leg injury but he still came back to play in a game where they said he should have sat out. They guy is a freak and reminds me alot of moss, while bey was never anything special and could be shut down with one average DB, to take him above crabtree is crazy, nobody wanted bey so they trade down to get him a lot cheaper than what they are going to end up over paying at number 7. Its another fucking idiotic move by the raiders, now even the lions can point and laugh.

[Snoogans]

Spoon made a good point. At least when the Lions were taking WR every year in the first round, they took the best one available

[JimBeam]

Spoon made a good point. At least when the Lions were taking WR every year in the first round, they took the best one available

Or they were taking the one that was supposed to be the best.

Don't tell me that Charles Rodgers and Mike Williams both sucked because of Millen.

Do you really believe the ACC plays tougher defense than the big 12? The acc is a quite a bit weaker lately and give up a ton of points outside of conference play so that is just stupid to say bey was in a stronger defense conference.

I'm not gonna go back and readdress things we all discussed in the college football thread but the ACC did have the best non-conference record and did send the most teams to bowl games while the Big 12 again lost a title game and Crabtree's team lost to less than the best team from another conference.

I can't defend Bey statistically, w/o looking them up, because I really didn't and don't know much about him other than what I heard this weekend.

Most " experts " are knocking the Bey choice because they though he could've been picked lower and not because they think he'll be a bad player.

It was Crabtree's stock that took more of a hit before the draft and not just because of the foot injury.

[hammersavage]

Most " experts " are knocking the Bey choice because they though he could've been picked lower and not because they think he'll be a bad player

That's the only reason it was a dumb pick for me. Trade down to the mid-teens and get another pick late. Still get the same player. Same for the bum they took in the 2nd round.

The pick usually doesn't come down to best talent, it comes down to value and need.


Hoyer signs with the Patriots. Chase Daniel with Redskins.

[JimBeam]

I dislike Mike Leach more and more every time he opes his fat mouth.

http://sports.espn.go.com/ncf/news/story?id=4105406

[Al Davis]

So when does this draft bullshit get started? I accidentally took a couple extra of my "happy" pills and I just woke the fuck up.

It's done? Well, I guess someone made our picks for us. Who'd we take?

Really?

Holy fuck.

[HBox]

So when does this draft bullshit get started? I accidentally took a couple extra of my "happy" pills and I just woke the fuck up.

It's done? Well, I guess someone made our picks for us. Who'd we take?

Really?

Holy fuck.

4.3 40. 4.3 40.

[SP1!]

did you just seriously compare Kim to Paris? Are you gay and blind?
I dont think I could stand either one for the 5 minutes it would take to talk them into bed, they are both rich bitch wastes of space and other than cumming on their faces then posting it on the web there is not much use for them. But if I had to choose looks then kim is usually the kind of girl I like, dark and sultry just like my GF.

Spoon made a good point. At least when the Lions were taking WR every year in the first round, they took the best one available
Yep

Or they were taking the one that was supposed to be the best.

Don't tell me that Charles Rodgers and Mike Williams both sucked because of Millen.
Yes, it was millens fault, he drafted a receiver but gave them nothing else to work with. Shitty QBs, unfocused linemen, no running game once barry left, he was scattershot in his management style and detroit should have burned down the stadium to get his sorry ass out of there.

I'm not gonna go back and readdress things we all discussed in the college football thread but the ACC did have the best non-conference record and did send the most teams to bowl games while the Big 12 again lost a title game and Crabtree's team lost to less than the best team from another conference.

I can't defend Bey statistically, w/o looking them up, because I really didn't and don't know much about him other than what I heard this weekend.

Most " experts " are knocking the Bey choice because they though he could've been picked lower and not because they think he'll be a bad player.

It was Crabtree's stock that took more of a hit before the draft and not just because of the foot injury.I can agree the ACC has better defenses but to think crabtree wouldnt have had a field day just as much is crazy. I really suggest you look into http://www.justin.tv/ this fall, you can find every single game under their sports tab on there during the year and from the games I watched crabtree in it was just freaky. He was like randy moss without all the drug charges, if he would have went to an SEC school or USC there would have been no doubt he would have been the first player taken in the draft. I just hope alex smith screws on his balls and gets him some decent passes this year, with singletary and a decent receiving threat this year, the 49ers may end up in the playoffs.

4.3 40. 4.3 40.

Most scouts put very little meaning on 40 speeds, especially that close. Crabtree runs sharper routes than bey and could get separation more easily than bey, with more upper body strength.

I just hope bey gets guaranteed money because with oakland's team he is going to get creamed.

[razorboy]

Don't tell me that Charles Rodgers and Mike Williams both sucked because of Millen.

Charles Rogers din't suck because of Millen, but they took him ahead of Andre Johnson which I thought was an enormous mistake even at that time.

[epo]

The NFL is thinking about going to a 3-day draft (http://www.jsonline.com/blogs/sports/43874097.html):

Brian McCarthy, the National Football League's vice president of corporate communications, said today via Twitter that the league is contemplating taking the draft to prime-time over three days.

The first round would be on Thursday night, rounds two and three would be on Friday night, and Saturday night would host rounds four through seven.


The NFL is teetering on the edge of losing me.

[foodcourtdruide]

The NFL is thinking about going to a 3-day draft (http://www.jsonline.com/blogs/sports/43874097.html):




The NFL is teetering on the edge of losing me.

I think they should have each first round pick on a different day.

[hammersavage]

The NFL is thinking about going to a 3-day draft (http://www.jsonline.com/blogs/sports/43874097.html):




The NFL is teetering on the edge of losing me.

My buddy who had the draft party described how the draft used to be. They used to have it on a Monday and a Tuesday. He would wait on line that morning and was one of about 500 people. No one gave a shit.

Now its another event in a sport that is becoming all about the event and less about the sport and it really turns me off.

[SP1!]

The only reason why I watched so much is football withdrawel, I think I may be the one person who watched all the world games when they were on. And I miss canadian games that espn used to play.

[hammersavage]

The Sanchize

[KnoxHarrington]

Good article in USA Today about how fucked up rookie contracts are now:

http://www.usatoday.com/sports/football/nfl/2009-04-28-salary-issue_N.htm

Matthew Stafford, who might utterly and completely suck (Akili Smith, anyone?) will earn more next season than 3 time Super Bowl champ Tom Brady.

What the fuck?

[hammersavage]

Good article in USA Today about how fucked up rookie contracts are now:

http://www.usatoday.com/sports/football/nfl/2009-04-28-salary-issue_N.htm

Matthew Stafford, who might utterly and completely suck (Akili Smith, anyone?) will earn more next season than 3 time Super Bowl champ Tom Brady.

What the fuck?

It's retarded. Owners fault. And veterans should have used it as a negotiating ploy better. But something needs to be done.

[JimBeam]

It is kinda crazy but it's not like it's unheard of in other industries.

Tom Cruise and Jim Carrey make more per film than a lot of Oscar winners.

Every pitcher in major league baseball today is making more than guys like Cy Young and Bob Gibson.

It's all about when you get in.

[Snoogans]

The NFL is thinking about going to a 3-day draft (http://www.jsonline.com/blogs/sports/43874097.html):




The NFL is teetering on the edge of losing me.

come to the full on college fan side. So much better atmosphere, so much more fun game. And way less butting into shit and tweaking everything EVERY FUCKIN YEAR. No one cares about when or how long the fuckin draft is. People follow to find out who their teams picked. Just leave it alone

[Snoogans]

It is kinda crazy but it's not like it's unheard of in other industries.

Tom Cruise and Jim Carrey make more per film than a lot of Oscar winners.

Every pitcher in major league baseball today is making more than guys like Cy Young and Bob Gibson.

It's all about when you get in.

because tom cruise and jim carey proved they will put out movies that earn a ton, even if they dont win awards. Stafford hasnt proven a single thing. THATS why its insane.

And you cant compare how much money is in sports now to what was there when FUCKIN CY YOUNG PITCHED. Are you serious? Thats a pretty assanine comment.

And baseball is the last sport you can attack for rookie pay. You are changing the issue entirely. Baseball MAKES the young guys earn those deals. Hollywood makes a guy earn big before he gets paid big. NFL does none of it

[hammersavage]

I make more than Cy Young and I'm unemployed

[JimBeam]

because tom cruise and jim carey proved they will put out movies that earn a ton, even if they dont win awards. Stafford hasnt proven a single thing. THATS why its insane.

And you cant compare how much money is in sports now to what was there when FUCKIN CY YOUNG PITCHED. Are you serious? Thats a pretty assanine comment.

And baseball is the last sport you can attack for rookie pay. You are changing the issue entirely. Baseball MAKES the young guys earn those deals. Hollywood makes a guy earn big before he gets paid big. NFL does none of it

OK so I guess a better point would be that a guy like Peyton Manning probably made more when he signed than Joe Montana, Steve Young and Troy Aikman.

Again I don't disagree that it's stupid to pay unproven players more than veterans but it's what's been done and those same veterans probably took advantage of it when they got drafted.

[cougarjake13]

OK so I guess a better point would be that a guy like Peyton Manning probably made more when he signed than Joe Montana, Steve Young and Troy Aikman.

Again I don't disagree that it's stupid to pay unproven players more than veterans but it's what's been done and those same veterans probably took advantage of it when they got drafted.



again like snoogans said you cant compare the different eras


thats like saying some shit movie made more money than star wars
star wars did 350 mil at like 3 bucks a movie and less theaters than some shit movie at 10 bucks and more theaters



anyway goddell is trying to fix it

[razorboy]

I predict Sammie Stroughter will make the Bucs roster and go down as an absolute steal in the seventh.

[cougarjake13]

I predict Sammie Stroughter will make the Bucs roster and go down as an absolute steal in the seventh.

wow