My father "went there".

[sr71blackbird]

I don't know if it because he is getting older and losing touch with the social graces, or if he ever really had them to begin with, but my father told my sister at the dinner table that she needs to lose weight!
She's been struggling with weight loss for years and put on some weight since her divorce, but she has been losing recently and she's been redoubling her efforts lately because she met someone online and will meet him after the holidays. So she's been dieting and working out and sensitive about it.
But at dinner she was talking about this dermabrasion thing and my father blurts out all she needs is to lose weight. It was like the needle was scratched and lifted off the record and all conversation ended. She looked crushed and quickly left the table.
Everyone started in on my father about how insensitive he was, but he is pig headed and full of Italian machismo and insisted he was right and getting loud and it was a disaster.
I cannot imagine how he doesn't know that that subject is the most known of the taboo subjects and things you never tell a woman. I did my best to soothe my sisters bruised feelings, but I'd like to somehow demonstrate to my father that he commited a major faux pas.
Is it wring for me to even try or should I mind my business? I was trying to find a video on YouTube that I could email to my father about things not to say to a woman, but I couldn't find an appropriate one, or even know if I should or not.

[boosterp]

He may at this point be a lost cause with herritage, age, and such. Your sister would do well n confronting him, if anything just for face value.

[Marc with a c]

oh no he didn't.

[Ritalin]

Sounds like your sister went there.

There being White Castle.

[OneEyeJack]

I got an idea..How about breaking all the mirrors in the house and go on pretending...

[sailor]

it's his daughter, he can say that.

[A.J.]

You should have told him that the "airing of grievances" takes place during Festivus, not Thanksgiving.

[sailor]

please note the forum this was posted in. thx.

[Marc with a c]

at least he told her in english.

[NateCantDance]

May have been rude, but I wish people would be ruder in general about being overweight. Keeping the topic as taboo hasn't done any favors to us.

[OneEyeJack]

Raking leaves is a Healthy exercise....:smile:

[Death Metal Moe]

May have been rude, but I wish people would be ruder in general about being overweight. Keeping the topic as taboo hasn't done any favors to us.

Yea, because someone saying "You're a fatty" to your face will just break down the whole facade a fat person has built up in their head trying to fool themselves that they're actually a size 2.

Most fat people know their fat and some douche bag yelling it at them wasn't the thing they were waiting for to kick start a diet and exercise regimen.

[sr71blackbird]

Jesus, I thought this forum was for serious replies. I'd like to find a way to get through to my father that he should choose his words more carefully and with tact, but without appearing to lecture my father. He does not take to kind to having his kids tell him what to do, etc.

[Sheila]

you can't really change your father, all you can tell her that you support and are proud of her efforts to get in shape/diet, and love her no matter what weight she is. Dad is always going to be dad, and you can tell him his words/actions affected your sister, and tell him you get that he wants the best for his kids and that approach is no way helping. (my mom can be as blunt too)

but no matter what your sister has to deal with people who criticize, even her flesh and blood, you can just make sure that you are a supportive person who is there for her.

[sr71blackbird]

What also happened was that her 2 kids were at the table as well and as soon as everyone started chastizing my father, they lept to their mothers defense. My father kind of yelled at both of them for it, and we in turn defended the kids. My father was at the point where he was being ganged up on in his own house and he went into full blown Galabrian thick head mode. My sister left in a huff shortly after that and later on I called her at home and offered support and also pride that she had raised her kids good and they defended her. I think that that made her feel a lot better. I am thinking of calling my father, but don't know what to say. I was unsuccessful yesterday in getting him to apoligise to my sister or to go to her while she was out of the room, probably crying.

[Death Metal Moe]

Ya know there's nothing wrong with pointing out your father was wrong and leaving it like that. Just because he's your father doesn't mean you have to put up with his bullshit when he's wrong. I know people who treat their father like some untouchable perfect being and it's complete garbage. It's also kind of unhealthy in my opinion.

You may have to tell him "You were wrong and I'm going to drop it but I think you were wrong and you owe her an apology. Until that happens you may not see her again, if that's OK with you then let it go on."

[sr71blackbird]

Thanks, that's all very reasonable advise folks. I think there is a precentage of the population that has no understanding how a persons weight issue can be an extremely sensitive and personal failure issue that shatters a persons self esteem. I get it that "we should all be tough as shoe leather" but this subject, especially to a woman (or to me apparently) is tenuous at best.

[Death Metal Moe]

Ya know what it is? It's the fact that she knows she's overweight, and then one of the very people she thought she could count on NOT to make fun of her suddenly turns on her. That's fucked up. There's so many tactful ways for people to talk to her about her weight if concerned, but the way he did it and then going on full defense mode was just douchey at best.

I mean it's Thanksgiving for Christ's sake. She just wanted to enjoy some time with her family, eat a meal and relax for a day. Then dear ol' Dad has to shit on it.

[Furtherman]

Jesus, I thought this forum was for serious replies. I'd like to find a way to get through to my father that he should choose his words more carefully and with tact, but without appearing to lecture my father. He does not take to kind to having his kids tell him what to do, etc.

Ya know there's nothing wrong with pointing out your father was wrong and leaving it like that. Just because he's your father doesn't mean you have to put up with his bullshit when he's wrong. I know people who treat their father like some untouchable perfect being and it's complete garbage. It's also kind of unhealthy in my opinion.

Moe is right. You don't have to "lecture" your father, just ask him to hear you out. Or don't ask, just let him know. He may not like it, he may fight back, but at least he will hear the words and maybe they'll sink in after he comes to his senses.

Then do something fun with your sister.

[TjM]

Moe is a wise man.

[Death Metal Moe]

Then do something fun with your sister.

......naaaa. I'm gonna leave that one alone. :devil2:

[Death Metal Moe]

Moe is a wise man.

TY sir. I just hate when families do that. They act like an elder is God. I see it a lot.

You respect your parents more than most but they're not perfect. A lot of people forget that or don't develop that kind of relationship with their parents. Your parents are wrong, a lot. They were wrong sometimes when you were a kid but you had no choice but to do as you were told because they were clothing and feeding you. Now that you're an adult, you can talk to them like adults.

Sometimes they are wrong. I'd really hate to hear about another family broken up by stupid bullshit though, express that to your father. Does he really want to not see your sister for years on end because of this? Because that shit happens. A lot. I can think of 5 people off the top of my head who don't see close members of their family anymore and it's rough.

If your father starts to get pig headed and stubborn again you need to tell him that kinda shit because it's a possibility. And I'd like to not hear it became a reality.

[sailor]

if everyone called him on it at dinner, why the need for a follow-up?

[Death Metal Moe]

if everyone called him on it at dinner, why the need for a follow-up?

Because nothing came of it and if it sits like this he might not see his daughter until he's on his death bed. It needs to be addressed and somehow settled.

[sailor]

Because nothing came of it and if it sits like this he might not see his daughter until he's on his death bed. It needs to be addressed and somehow settled.

eh, there's nothing new to say to him. if he didn't listen before i doubt he'd listen now.

[Death Metal Moe]

eh, there's nothing new to say to him. if he didn't listen before i doubt he'd listen now.

Outside of that heated argument at the table, away from all the yelling, hopefully he can more reasonably talk to now that he may not feel ganged up on.

[NateCantDance]

Yea, because someone saying "You're a fatty" to your face will just break down the whole facade a fat person has built up in their head trying to fool themselves that they're actually a size 2.

Most fat people know their fat and some douche bag yelling it at them wasn't the thing they were waiting for to kick start a diet and exercise regimen.

You're putting words into my mouth. But yes. In general, people in our country that smoke cigarettes are looked at more negatively by society than people who eat Big Macs. And fewer people smoke now. If obesity was more actively shamed rather than just reluctantly and silently accepted, perhaps things would be different.

[sr71blackbird]

Well since I myself struggle with weight loss and my father and my whole family have never been skinny, I can personally emphesise with anyone who felt that knife go in your heart by cold people who openly mention peoples weight. We certainly do not need open season on comments on obese people, because no one mentions when someone has a lazy eye or a deformity. There's a guy where I work who is like a 60 yr old athlete and he is always at the gym and riding bikes and playing basketball etc and he's thin as a rail and has no problem voicing how you should do this it do that, not eat bad stuff, or he will walk by and see me eating a bagel and say "do you really need that??" it's very annoying and hurts.

[SatCam]

What I would do is let this one go. He said what he said and he knows how you guys feel about it. What's important is if he says something like that again that you guys speak up again and let him know he shouldnt be saying that to her. At this point last night's dinner is a dead horse. Just stand your ground every time he talks down and eventually he will shut up and get the idea.

[NateCantDance]

Well since I myself struggle with weight loss and my father and my whole family have never been skinny, I can personally emphesise with anyone who felt that knife go in your heart by cold people who openly mention peoples weight.

And? My whole family is the same way. We eat too much. We eat too often. We eat the wrong things. And we also enable each other like crazy. We need a cultural change, not to grow fatter and more miserable together. That sound familiar?

We certainly do not need open season on comments on obese people, because no one mentions when someone has a lazy eye or a deformity.

I completely disagree. If I showed up to Thanksgiving with a rash on my face or a growth on my arm, my family would be like "WTF, dude go get that checked out!", but if I showed up 20+ pounds heavier than the last time they saw me they'd absolutely notice but not say a word.

There's a guy where I work who is like a 60 yr old athlete and he is always at the gym and riding bikes and playing basketball etc and he's thin as a rail and has no problem voicing how you should do this it do that, not eat bad stuff, or he will walk by and see me eating a bagel and say "do you really need that??" it's very annoying and hurts.

It hurts and is annoying because you know the answer is "no, I don't need it." You'd just rather not be confronted with that. Sure, it's none of this guy's business what you put into your mouth, but my point is that if you were confronted with it more often, you might make better choices.

If every day you experienced peer pressure to eat well and exercise, you'd probably eat well and exercise. Instead, we pressure each other to drink beer, eat pizza and be lazy asses.

[sr71blackbird]

I understand your point Nate, but simply because it is not healthy to be overweight should not necessarily legitimize the free expression of what someone else feels without consideration and consequence. I know I am fat, and I know its not good and I am unhappy with my inability to control my own self and this failure on my own part is painful enough, so that when another person points out that failure, it drives me deeper within my own agony. I gain nothing but pain by a reminder of it. It will and must be my own charge to change myself, assuming I or anyone else has that ability. Your suggestion is not really helpful, unless the intent is to seek to hurt someone's self esteem. I am not suggesting that no one should be able to say what they want, but I am suggesting that certain things are best left unsaid, wether it be someone's weight, age, height, race, sexual preference or anything that we as a society have determined though social intercourse to be considered inappropriate.

[Suspect Chin]

My opinion is that your sister and the rest of your family are over reacting. Who cares? It's your dad and I'm sure he thought he was being helpful. It doesn't mean he hates her now, he probably just wants the best for her and took the wrong approach. If your family can't criticize you, who can?

[Dude!]

your dad should adopt me
i am skinny and
would make him proud

[underdog]

My opinion is that your sister and the rest of your family are over reacting. Who cares? It's your dad and I'm sure he thought he was being helpful. It doesn't mean he hates her now, he probably just wants the best for her and took the wrong approach. If your family can't criticize you, who can?

I was thinking the exact same thing.

Family says dumb things all the time, but they're allowed to. The only thing you have control over is how you react.

[Marc with a c]

your dad should adopt me
i am skinny and
would make him proud

I'd love to adopt you.

[Dude!]

I'd love to adopt you.

i would love that

[TheMojoPin]

We certainly do not need open season on comments on obese people, because no one mentions when someone has a lazy eye or a deformity.

Now this attitude is a total cop out towards being heavy or obese. Yes, SOME people do truly have a genetic or whatever problem that makes keeping the weight off truly a struggle, but the majority of overweight people are that way due to lifestyle choices. Someone with a lazy eye or deformity is born that way and can't do anything about it short of surgery (if even that). Most fat people could ultimately be less fat or not fat at all if they chose to eat less, eat better and exercise more and stuck to it. It's typically not a deformity.

[OneEyeJack]

No Pain, No Gain....or should it be loss.

[TripleSkeet]

Sounds to me like your whole family is just oversensitive. You shouldnt have to tiptoe about certain issues to your own family, especially not in your own house.

I stand by your old man. Besides, its not like he said "Another serving of turkey, fatso??" He just said she could stand to lose some weight.

Thats not an insult. Its a family member possibly concerned for his kid. Your family really needs to lighten up.

[TripleSkeet]

I understand your point Nate, but simply because it is not healthy to be overweight should not necessarily legitimize the free expression of what someone else feels without consideration and consequence.

Actually when that person is your parent, thats EXACTLY what it does.

[cougarjake13]

i know what forum this is and all but when i clicked over the thread and got only half the title i thought it was gonna say

my father went walkabout




sorry about your dad though

[sr71blackbird]

I was thinking about it today after I posted what I did in my last post, and the parallel is if you have a child that is not doing well in school, and you call him a dummy, or an idiot or stupid. It is the same thing, it does not help the situation and only isolates the kid further and makes them feel like a failure and once "branded", they tend to stick with the problematic behavior. In this way it is the same scenario with labeling.

[TheMojoPin]

But your dad didn't go out of his way to insult anyone. It would one thing if he called her "fatso" or mocked her for her weight as in the scenario with the kid not doing well in school, but he didn't. He flat out said "you could stand to lose some weight." That would be like saying to the kid "you could be doing better in school." It's not branding someone with insults as you're suggesting.

[biggirl]

it doesn't sound like your dad is going to change his mind and realize he did anything wrong. The rest of your family should just stick by your sister and continue to encourage her weight loss.

It doesn't bother me when people bring up my weight. It just reminds me that I should be doing something about it. At least I know they care. Your dad probably said it out loud to let her know that he cares about her. He just isn't tactful. You'll never change that quality about him.

[RhinoinMN]

I have gained 30 pounds since the last time I was in NYC. That was in April. Now I will be going out there again to the christmas party. I fully expect everyone I saw there in April to call me a fat, fat fatty fuck because it is my own damn fault. They can say that cuz I am comfortable with myself in any shape or form. Hell, it may spur me to do something about it.

Katja pointed out my little double chin that I have developed that wasn't there in April. I gave her shit about being insensitive, but it was pure joking. The truth is she was right and I didn't not get worked up about it. Katja is a Nazi. If I got upset it would mean that the Nazis win and that would be bad.

[underdog]

I have gained 30 pounds since the last time I was in NYC.

Well, now that you've brought it up...

[sailor]

I have gained 30 pounds since the last time I was in NYC. That was in April. Now I will be going out there again to the christmas party. I fully expect everyone I saw there in April to call me a fat, fat fatty fuck because it is my own damn fault. They can say that cuz I am comfortable with myself in any shape or form. Hell, it may spur me to do something about it.

Katja pointed out my little double chin that I have developed that wasn't there in April. I gave her shit about being insensitive, but it was pure joking. The truth is she was right and I didn't not get worked up about it. Katja is a Nazi. If I got upset it would mean that the Nazis win and that would be bad.

if we didn't see you in april do the same rules apply?

[RhinoinMN]

if we didn't see you in april do the same rules apply?
Do you mean "Can we judge you without ever seeing you?"

If so, why not?

[Marc with a c]

"we judge you without ever seeing you"

that should be ronfez.nets slogan.

[sailor]

Do you mean "Can we judge you without ever seeing you?"

If so, why not?

sweet! you won't be as fat as marc in any event.

[NateCantDance]

SR71, you and I seem to be talking past each other. What I'm suggesting is a world where people as a whole are more health conscious, and maintaining a decent body weight is as culturally expected as brushing your teeth on a regular basis. What you seem to be envisioning is everyone pelting you with dodge balls and pulling your underwear over your head on some imaginary playground.

A little bit extreme, don't you think?

[Willmore]

Ah, family.

You're not allowed to kill them, so you might as well accept them.