What Makes a Civilization Advanced?

[CofyCrakCocaine]

I noticed some guy bashing the board historian in the Anthony Cumia thread for disliking Dr.Cumia's equating gun-having with being culturally advanced. He said "gee, I read a best-selling book called Guns Germs and Steel", but in one of those snide ways.

But hey, maybe guns are what makes us civilized. I don't think so, but prove me wrong people. Or don't. I likely won't be on this board for quite some time and I did post this in the fairly worthless politics thread at the equally unpopular hour of 1 in the hay - em.

But maybe I'll check up on this in a few days. See if anything neat was written.

p.s. I'm Rich.

p.p.s. Is the MojoPin still with us?

[PapaBear]

Guns don't make civilizations advanced. They are just another form of weapon, and weapons have always been around. Philosophy, education, and communication make civilizations advanced. Guns are just a necessary tool used by civilizations for many reasons.

[keithy_19]

Guns don't make civilizations advanced. They are just another form of weapon, and weapons have always been around. Philosophy, education, and communication make civilizations advanced. Guns are just a necessary tool used by civilizations for many reasons.

Like keeping people like CCC in line.

[Snoogans]

I noticed some guy bashing the board historian in the Anthony Cumia thread for disliking Dr.Cumia's equating gun-having with being culturally advanced. He said "gee, I read a best-selling book called Guns Germs and Steel", but in one of those snide ways.

But hey, maybe guns are what makes us civilized. I don't think so, but prove me wrong people. Or don't. I likely won't be on this board for quite some time and I did post this in the fairly worthless politics thread at the equally unpopular hour of 1 in the hay - em.

But maybe I'll check up on this in a few days. See if anything neat was written.

p.s. I'm Rich.

p.p.s. Is the MojoPin still with us?

if i point a gun in your face and tell you im civilized are you gonna disagree?

ps who cares

pps i believe he is

[keithy_19]

pps i believe he is

Theologians and philosophers have often asked: if Mojo dies would anyone know?

[ChrisBrown]

I feel like I am talking to my grandpa when I hear the world 'civilized'. He traveled to India in the 1950's and told us stories when we were kids about how 'uncivilized' the place was. It was such an ignorant thing to say. What he meant is that India didn't have modern technology like the West does but to him it indicated the people were savages.

A discussion about which society is more 'advanced' is a more interesting conversation. Even then, you need to throw in another word for it to make sense. For example, you can have a debate about which society is 'technologically advanced'. It's easy to back up your argument that Japan is more technologically advanced than New Guinea. But how about 'culturally advanced', 'spiritually advanced', 'morally advanced'? I'd saw Bhutan is a more moral, enlightened society than the US.

[A.J.]

Legalized prostitution.

[ChrisBrown]

It's funny that Anthony is so caught up on what's civilized when the rest of the industrial world considers the US 'uncivilized' for having capital punishment, lack of universal health care, low literacy rates, high infant deaths, third world health stats, ridiculous number of gun deaths, poverty while we spend billions on foreign wars to 'spread democracy', etc. If you equate 'civilized' with 'technologically advanced', the US can compete with Japan and Europe but if you broaden the definition to mean a healthy society, we are far from 'civilized'

[CountryBob]

I love guns

[El Mudo]

Paraphrasing what I wrote about it on the other thread:




Anthony's point (as I recall it) was basically that technology is what determines an "advanced" culture, which is what I disagree with. How do you define "advanced"? It's too broad of a definition. How do you define "superior" technology? He kept harping on the fact that "the Africans didn't have guns" while completely ignoring their suffering from various western diseases they had never been exposed to.

Ever read anything about Zulu battle tactics? They weren't an "advanced" society in your definition, but their military tactics were ingenious. Which again, when you're analyzing complex human societies, it's just too fucking simple to say "oh this one's advanced and this one's not because they have 'superior' technology" because the world, and societies, aren't that fucking simple.

[sailor]

I love guns


Guns are cool.

[A.J.]

Guns are cool.

But happiness is a warm gun.

[Willmore]

If there is a Starbucks within 10 mile of you, you are in civilized country. Now, the advantage of this, is that it doesn't generalize countries as one blob of civilization or barbarism. So, we can automatically cut off all the hicks out of our nice civilization, and invite the good Brits (London), some really smart Indians (Mumbai, Delhi, Hyderabad), so super-rich Russians (Moscow, Saint Petersburg) etc. etc.

At the same time, we don't have any Africans, almost no middle-easterners (we still get the Jews and the rich Saudis), so it's a pretty effective rule of thumb.

[A.J.]

If there is a Starbucks within 10 mile of you, you are in civilized country. Now, the advantage of this, is that it doesn't generalize countries as one blob of civilization or barbarism. So, we can automatically cut off all the hicks out of our nice civilization, and invite the good Brits (London), some really smart Indians (Mumbai, Delhi, Hyderabad), so super-rich Russians (Moscow, Saint Petersburg) etc. etc.

At the same time, we don't have any Africans, almost no middle-easterners (we still get the Jews and the rich Saudis), so it's a pretty effective rule of thumb.

There are Starbucks and other chain coffee places all over the Middle East.

[Willmore]

There are Starbucks and other chain coffee places all over the Middle East.

Yeah, UAE, Kuwait, Qatar, Bahrain, etc. ... you know, the rich ones. Try to find one in Iraq, Iran, Palestine or Yemen.

[Chigworthy]

I'd saw Bhutan is a more moral, enlightened society than the US.

If you equate 'civilized' with 'technologically advanced', the US can compete with Japan and Europe but if you broaden the definition to mean a healthy society, we are far from 'civilized'

It must suck living in such an awful place.

[badmonkey]

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[torker]

It is so stupid of modern civilisation
to have given up believing in the devil
when he is the only explanation of it.

[ChrisBrown]

It must suck living in such an awful place.

The US is a perfectly fine country. It's got strengths and weaknesses. I never said it was awful.

[Syd]

If you equate 'civilized' with 'technologically advanced', the US can compete with Japan and Europe but if you broaden the definition to mean a healthy society, we are far from 'civilized'

It is difficult to say we're more technologically advanced when fusion reactors aren't even built here nor are new particle accelerators. All the science is overseas now. We may have more guns, but they're going to have the ability to make much better guns one day.

[ChrisBrown]

It is difficult to say we're more technologically advanced when fusion reactors aren't even built here nor are new particle accelerators. All the science is overseas now. We may have more guns, but they're going to have the ability to make much better guns one day.


Good point.

[CountryBob]

Didnt you watch Southpark? Everyone having access to the internet makes us civilized! Internet Porn is the dividing line/

[Dudeman]

good book

http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/I/516H1W1ASTL.jpg

[brettmojo]

Reversed engineered alien technology.

[TripleSkeet]

The question isnt what makes a person civilized, its what makes a civilization advanced. ChrisBrown hit it on the head. Technology. Using education to invent things from the wheel on up is whats help make and determine which civilization is most advanced.

In a way, yes guns are an example of the technology that makes a civilization advanced. Just like the bow and arrow was before that.

[Suspect Chin]

It is difficult to say we're more technologically advanced when fusion reactors aren't even built here nor are new particle accelerators. All the science is overseas now. We may have more guns, but they're going to have the ability to make much better guns one day.

But we did invent the iPhone. I would guess 90% of the engineers/scientists currently working abroad were educated at an American university.

[hanso]

Legalized prostitution.

I went with free porn. But I like this too.