Happy 40th Birthday Amtrak

[WRESTLINGFAN]

Only a GSE could celebrate an event like this by offering free rides which will lose even more money.


http://travel.usatoday.com/destinations/dispatches/post/2011/05/amtrak-40th-anniversary-national-train-day/168294/1

[A.J.]

The last time I rode Amtrak was in college: DC to New Haven. The trip was bad enough but Thanksgivings were the worst. People had to sit in the aisle all the way up to NYC.

[WRESTLINGFAN]

Amtrak Joe's comments about this...


http://farm5.static.flickr.com/4053/4461892134_a3a12279c2_z.jpg

[brettmojo]

Me and my wife took Amtrak to NYC and back last year for vacation. Other than the three or more hour delay the train had arriving to pick us up on the way down I though it was fantastic. It was cheaper to buy round trip tickets than it was to valet my car for the week.

[Furtherman]

Before I discovered the uber-cheap Bolt Bus, I use to take Amrtak all the time between NYC and Philly. Never had a bad ride. It's quick, a little expensive, but you can find good deals online at off hours. If I had money to burn, I'd take it all the time.

[Judge Smails]

Happy Birthday!

http://i16.photobucket.com/albums/b47/alden97/HappyBirthdayBlackKid.gif?t=1304964672

[Dudeman]

Took Amtrak twice from NYC to Boston (to do some work at mit and to interview at harvard.)
Both round-trip rides were good- quiet, on time, and much easier than flying or bus.
2 thumbs up for my experiences.
:thumbup:

[jonyrotn]

http://i178.photobucket.com/albums/w272/adammehers/Ricoh%20R7%20Pics/RIMG0112_cropped.jpg
Live it up birthday boy, she's yours all night..

[WRESTLINGFAN]

http://i178.photobucket.com/albums/w272/adammehers/Ricoh%20R7%20Pics/RIMG0112_cropped.jpg
Live it up birthday boy, she's yours all night..

The only ones getting fucked are the taxpayers :furious:

[furie]

Gse?

[underdog]

Love Amtrak. Boston-NYC is awesome on it. Drops you off in the middle of the city, and is a comfortable ride. Wi-Fi, outlets in every seat. It's awesome.

[WRESTLINGFAN]

Gse?



Govt sponsored enterprise. they also call Fannie and Freddie that

[NewYorkDragons80]

The only ones getting fucked are the taxpayers :furious:

Stop... just stop. How much do the taxpayers pay for roads? Airports? Rare indeed is the "libertarian" who has a true plan for ending subsidies to the aforementioned drains on the taxpayer.

The evidence is clear that the Acela route is effective, popular, and practical. Is there something in the water between Boston and DC? Are northeasterners a sub-species of Homo Sapiens? *OR* is Amtrak a viable service nationwide *if* it isn't forced to share routes with freight trains? Considering how much taxpayers subsidize GE, Grumman, Lockheed, and the like, it's beyond trivial to single out Amtrak as somehow bilking the taxpayers when there's a measurable positive impact on our transportation infrastructure.

Furthermore, to say the taxpayers are "getting fucked" is an unintentionally accurate way of putting it. We're decades behind the big players in Asia and Europe and as long as the obstructionists continue doing what they do best, we'll continue to fall behind.

[StanUpshaw]

Stop... just stop. How much do the taxpayers pay for roads? Airports?

According to libertarians: (http://www.cato.org/pubs/bp/bp107.pdf)
The net subsidy to highways was about half a penny per passenger mile.

Subsidies to air travel were about 0.1 cent per passenger mile.

Subsidies to Amtrak about 22 cents per passenger mile.


According to the federal govenment: (http://www.bts.gov/publications/federal_subsidies_to_passenger_transportation/pdf/entire.pdf)
http://i.imgur.com/EJLri.jpg


Continue WF...just continue!



...
I hope you don't threaten me for proving you wrong. :glurps::glurps:

[WRESTLINGFAN]

Stop... just stop. How much do the taxpayers pay for roads? Airports? Rare indeed is the "libertarian" who has a true plan for ending subsidies to the aforementioned drains on the taxpayer.

The evidence is clear that the Acela route is effective, popular, and practical. Is there something in the water between Boston and DC? Are northeasterners a sub-species of Homo Sapiens? *OR* is Amtrak a viable service nationwide *if* it isn't forced to share routes with freight trains? Considering how much taxpayers subsidize GE, Grumman, Lockheed, and the like, it's beyond trivial to single out Amtrak as somehow bilking the taxpayers when there's a measurable positive impact on our transportation infrastructure.

Furthermore, to say the taxpayers are "getting fucked" is an unintentionally accurate way of putting it. We're decades behind the big players in Asia and Europe and as long as the obstructionists continue doing what they do best, we'll continue to fall behind.

The NE Corridor makes a profit due to the major business areas like DC Phila NY and Bos but theres more to the country than jst the NE. As a whole Amtrak is a loser. The ACELA trains can have WI=Fi, Flat panel TVs and free blowjobs but if the entire company has never made a profit wheres the benefit.

Funny thing you bring up high speed rail. Its all risk and no benefit. This is just for NC. Imagine this on a larger scale? Maybe it would work for the NE but as an entire country not even close.

http://lincolntribune.com/?p=10338


And what if there is a train bombing on the Acela out of Penn station, Think air travel is bad? Wait till big brother and the TSA infests the rail system

[WRESTLINGFAN]

Subsidies for Amtrak. Shocking, They underestimated


http://www.usatoday.com/travel/news/2009-10-27-amtrak-passenger-subsidies_N.htm

[Dudeman]

The only ones getting fucked are the taxpayers :furious:

I can definitely agree on one thing- you are sitting in front of your computer like this ":furious::furious:" over how the government has ruined your life.

[underdog]

According to libertarians: (http://www.cato.org/pubs/bp/bp107.pdf)
The net subsidy to highways was about half a penny per passenger mile.

Subsidies to air travel were about 0.1 cent per passenger mile.

Subsidies to Amtrak about 22 cents per passenger mile.


According to the federal govenment: (http://www.bts.gov/publications/federal_subsidies_to_passenger_transportation/pdf/entire.pdf)
http://i.imgur.com/EJLri.jpg


Continue WF...just continue!



...
I hope you don't threaten me for proving you wrong. :glurps::glurps:

I'd be curious to see how many people travel on train v. road/air. I think that's a reason this administration has pushed rail travel, to push down the overall per passenger cost.

[underdog]

The NE Corridor makes a profit due to the major business areas like DC Phila NY and Bos but theres more to the country than jst the NE. As a whole Amtrak is a loser. The ACELA trains can have WI=Fi, Flat panel TVs and free blowjobs but if the entire company has never made a profit wheres the benefit.

I've never taken acela. Regular amtrak have wi-fi.

And there is nothing in this country outside the northeast.

And what if there is a train bombing on the Acela out of Penn station, Think air travel is bad? Wait till big brother and the TSA infests the rail system

What if? What if? What if?

the best thing about rail travel is the lack of security theater. Although, schumer wants to change that.

[WRESTLINGFAN]

I'd be curious to see how many people travel on train v. road/air. I think that's a reason this administration has pushed rail travel, to push down the overall per passenger cost.

Sorry to be nitpicky but would that include Commuter rail like for example in suburban NYC and CT THere is Metro North, thats a better way to go to work than driving. As much as a pain in the ass that air travel is, Id rather hop on a bird than take a train for long trips

[WRESTLINGFAN]

I've never taken acela. Regular amtrak have wi-fi.

And there is nothing in this country outside the northeast.



What if? What if? What if?

the best thing about rail travel is the lack of security theater. Although, schumer wants to change that.

Are you saying a Madrid 3/11 isn't possible? I did hear Schumer wants to have a no ride list for Amtrak. Just when you thought gov't cant get any more bloated

[WRESTLINGFAN]

I've never taken acela. Regular amtrak have wi-fi.

And there is nothing in this country outside the northeast.



What if? What if? What if?

the best thing about rail travel is the lack of security theater. Although, schumer wants to change that.

The subsidies would skyrocket if there is a terrorist attack because more security would be needed, more TSA more screening etc etc

[NewYorkDragons80]

According to libertarians: (http://www.cato.org/pubs/bp/bp107.pdf)
The net subsidy to highways was about half a penny per passenger mile.

Subsidies to air travel were about 0.1 cent per passenger mile.

Subsidies to Amtrak about 22 cents per passenger mile.


According to the federal govenment: (http://www.bts.gov/publications/federal_subsidies_to_passenger_transportation/pdf/entire.pdf)
http://i.imgur.com/EJLri.jpg

So according to that data, transit is at roughly the same level. Should the taxpayers be "furious" about the New York Subway system? Should they demand divestment/privatization? Again, it provides a measurable public service that is both necessary and *far* cleaner than auto or air travel.


I hope you don't threaten me for proving you wrong. :glurps::glurps:

What's this now?

[underdog]

Sorry to be nitpicky but would that include Commuter rail like for example in suburban NYC and CT THere is Metro North, thats a better way to go to work than driving. As much as a pain in the ass that air travel is, Id rather hop on a bird than take a train for long trips

I'd much rather take a train for decent trips. You have so much more freedom. Anything over a couple hours, though, I'd probably hop on a plane. Took a train from Toronto to Montreal, and will take it most time from Bos-NYC.

Are you saying a Madrid 3/11 isn't possible? I did hear Schumer wants to have a no ride list for Amtrak. Just when you thought gov't cant get any more bloated

Oh, it's definitely possible. But there's a possible negative to everything. Schumer wanting a no-ride list is retarded. They don't card you after you buy your tickets on trains, if they actually card you at all. And you can usually get on a train without showing a ticket, so, even if they did start checking IDs when buying a ticket, you could still get on the train with whatever you want and blow that shit up when the ticket puncher comes along.

Fuck, you wouldn't even need to buy a ticket.

The subsidies would skyrocket if there is a terrorist attack because more security would be needed, more TSA more screening etc etc

With more security, I think rail travel (outside of commuter traffic) would disappear more than it already is.

[Dude!]

did i just read there are free
blowjobs on amtrak?

[StanUpshaw]

So according to that data, transit is at roughly the same level. Should the taxpayers be "furious" about the New York Subway system? Should they demand divestment/privatization? Again, it provides a measurable public service that is both necessary and *far* cleaner than auto or air travel.
Transit is a big category. People probably should get furious about stupid shit like trolley and cable car projects. Busses, not so much.

There's also a big difference in subsidizing transport for a schlub to get to work at the laundromat, and subsidizing suits to zip back and forth to DC.

What's this now?

Nnn...nothing. Forget I said it.

[StanUpshaw]

The subsidies would skyrocket if there is a terrorist attack because more security would be needed, more TSA more screening etc etc

I'm pretty sure TSA funding doesn't count as an airline "subsidy".

Apples to apples and all.

[WRESTLINGFAN]

Theres no doubt America needs an efficient light rail system for certain areas specifically the NE.


However, Amtraks route system is aged and when 40 out of about 50 lines lose money, thats no way to operate a business.

[WRESTLINGFAN]

I'm pretty sure TSA funding doesn't count as an airline "subsidy".

Apples to apples and all.

Youre right, but there is an inconvenience factor that will happen if theres an attack on the tracks. People will have to arrive at Penn Station at a specific time before their train leaves for Boston or DC.

[Dudeman]

Are you saying a Madrid 3/11 isn't possible? I did hear Schumer wants to have a no ride list for Amtrak. Just when you thought gov't cant get any more bloated

I don't understand (other than you are :furious: about government and democrats).

Are you saying that if the free market ran the train system, the terrorists wouldn't want to attack it?
Or are you saying that private companies be soley responsible for preventing terrorism?
Or are you saying, who cares about trying to stop terrorism- we can't baby everyone; in which case what do you think will happen to the private industry if any terrorism is attempted?


(It seems like you made a point about bloated government and Schumer being bad because your cookie-cutter ideology tells you to think those things, but I don't see how those things deal with Madrid 3/11.)

[WRESTLINGFAN]

If the free market ran the train system, the terrorists wouldn't want to attack it? Or would the private companies be soley responsible for preventing terrorism?

I dont think terrorists are thinking who runs a train system when they have C4 strapped to them

They are going to do as much damage as they can, they will even go for freight trains too.

A terrorist doesnt care if he kills 100 people or the engineer of a CSX train, their goal is to inflict terror and adjust the way people live

[NewYorkDragons80]

The NE Corridor makes a profit due to the major business areas like DC Phila NY and Bos but theres more to the country than jst the NE. As a whole Amtrak is a loser. The ACELA trains can have WI=Fi, Flat panel TVs and free blowjobs but if the entire company has never made a profit wheres the benefit.

[QUOTE=NewYorkDragons80;2850949]The evidence is clear that the Acela route is effective, popular, and practical. Is there something in the water between Boston and DC? Are northeasterners a sub-species of Homo Sapiens? *OR* is Amtrak a viable service nationwide *if* it isn't forced to share routes with freight trains?

[Now in bold so that you'll read it]

It would take one 24 hours to get from El Paso to Austin on Amtrak, compared to 10 hours driving and 5 hours flying (including a layover in DFW). Why? Because the trains in the Southwest are outdated and are forced to yield to freight trains as I mentioned earlier.

Funny thing you bring up high speed rail. Its all risk and no benefit. This is just for NC. Imagine this on a larger scale? Maybe it would work for the NE but as an entire country not even close.

Roads, bridges, and airports don't fall from the sky. They all require enormous government-borne risks with the only benefit being a new transportation option. I'm curious to learn your definition of "benefit".

And what if there is a train bombing on the Acela out of Penn station, Think air travel is bad? Wait till big brother and the TSA infests the rail system

I don't think it's appropriate to blame a method of transportation for the possible security measures the federal government would take following a hypothetical attack.

[NewYorkDragons80]

Nnn...nothing. Forget I said it.

???

In that case, please stop raping children.

[Dudeman]

I dont think terrorists are thinking who runs a train system when they have C4 strapped to them

They are going to do as much damage as they can, they will even go for freight trains too.

A terrorist doesnt care if he kills 100 people or the engineer of a CSX train, their goal is to inflict terror and adjust the way people live

Agreed.

So what does your negative comment about Schumer and bloated government have to do with Madrid 3/11???

(It seems like you made a point about bloated government and Schumer being bad because your cookie-cutter ideology tells you to think those things, but I don't see how those things deal with Madrid 3/11.)

[NewYorkDragons80]

Transit is a big category. People probably should get furious about stupid shit like trolley and cable car projects. Busses, not so much.

Intra-city rail transit draws more passengers irrespective of social/economic class. Buses are proven to draw almost solely from the lowest rung of the social ladder. Additionally, light rail spurns development around its stations, while bus routes can easily be changed and bring little to no benefit to the surrounding area. Expensive? In the beginning, but the permanence of a light rail system brings with it a sustained and stable stream of investment.

[Dudeman]

What is the logical connection between these two posts? How do your points about terroism support your anti-Schumer and anti-bloated government comment? I'm trying to see the connection between, on one hand, believing a Madrid style attack can occur and, on the other hand, mocking a politician and government trying to prevent that from occurring??

Are you saying a Madrid 3/11 isn't possible? I did hear Schumer wants to have a no ride list for Amtrak. Just when you thought gov't cant get any more bloated

I dont think terrorists are thinking who runs a train system when they have C4 strapped to them

They are going to do as much damage as they can, they will even go for freight trains too.

A terrorist doesnt care if he kills 100 people or the engineer of a CSX train, their goal is to inflict terror and adjust the way people live

[WRESTLINGFAN]

[QUOTE=WRESTLINGFAN;2850959]The NE Corridor makes a profit due to the major business areas like DC Phila NY and Bos but theres more to the country than jst the NE. As a whole Amtrak is a loser. The ACELA trains can have WI=Fi, Flat panel TVs and free blowjobs but if the entire company has never made a profit wheres the benefit.



[Now in bold so that you'll read it]

It would take one 24 hours to get from El Paso to Austin on Amtrak, compared to 10 hours driving and 5 hours flying (including a layover in DFW). Why? Because the trains in the Southwest are outdated and are forced to yield to freight trains as I mentioned earlier.

Each geographical part of the country is different so why would Amtrak be needed if there are freight trains in the SW? Why even bother operating a commuter rail line
Roads, bridges, and airports don't fall from the sky. They all require enormous government-borne risks with the only benefit being a new transportation option. I'm curious to learn your definition of "benefit".

Roads and bridges are maintained by local and state gasoline taxes. In the NE there is a demand for a light rail so people can conduct business. I dont think a rancher in Montana needs Amtrak to make a deal to purchase beef cattle.
Like I said its viable for some areas of the country but as a whole its a losing venture


I don't think it's appropriate to blame a method of transportation for the possible security measures the federal government would take following a hypothetical attack.


Im saying is that its naive to think train travel wont be inconvenienced if theres an attack

[WRESTLINGFAN]

What is the logical connection between these two posts? How do your points about terroism support your anti-Schumer and anti-bloated government comment? I'm trying to see the connection between, on one hand, believing a Madrid style attack can occur and, on the other hand, mocking a politician and government trying to prevent that from occurring??

1. Since when do you have to give your name to get a train ticket?

2. If I was a terrorist wanting to wreak havoc from inside a train, I wouldn't care if I was on an Amtrak do-not-ride list; I'd get on a commuter train and blow that up, like they did in Madrid & London; more casualties than Amtrak. Could do it in Park Ave. tunnel for maximum effect.


3. More state control over our lives. Papers please!






4. And where does it end? How about a do not ride list for Greyhounds.

[NewYorkDragons80]

2. If I was a terrorist wanting to wreak havoc from inside a train, I wouldn't care if I was on an Amtrak do-not-ride list; I'd get on a commuter train and blow that up, like they did in Madrid & London; more casualties than Amtrak. Could do it in Park Ave. tunnel for maximum effect.

<iframe width="425" height="349" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/DDQNpr2RnFI" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

Watch for WF's concerns aired @ 3:00

[StanUpshaw]

Intra-city rail transit draws more passengers irrespective of social/economic class. Buses are proven to draw almost solely from the lowest rung of the social ladder. Additionally, light rail spurns development around its stations, while bus routes can easily be changed and bring little to no benefit to the surrounding area. Expensive? In the beginning, but the permanence of a light rail system brings with it a sustained and stable stream of investment.

Where have I heard that before?

http://i.imgur.com/vr6lH.jpg



(Also, I'm pretty sure you didn't mean "spurn")

[Dudeman]

1. Since when do you have to give your name to get a train ticket?

2. If I was a terrorist wanting to wreak havoc from inside a train, I wouldn't care if I was on an Amtrak do-not-ride list; I'd get on a commuter train and blow that up, like they did in Madrid & London; more casualties than Amtrak. Could do it in Park Ave. tunnel for maximum effect.


3. More state control over our lives. Papers please!






4. And where does it end? How about a do not ride list for Greyhounds.


I'm afraid I'm not too knowledgeable about the Ron/Rand approach to terrorism.

Is this the way to try to prevent it?

http://adamarmour.files.wordpress.com/2010/04/fingers-crossed.jpg


And this the reaction to when it is done?

http://www.istockphoto.com/file_thumbview_approve/1239117/2/istockphoto_1239117-scientist-shrug-on-gray-gradient.jpg

I'm certainly not saying you can stop everything and anything is appropriate in attempt to stop it. Remember your party was for going through people's library records, while Schumer and Obama were against it. Over the last 10 years, your Republican party has been a much stronger advocate for intrusive actions. That's not to say the Dem administration hasn't continued some of those policies (TSA for example.) But as the library record example demonstrates, your republican party was much more aggressive, while the Boxer's and Kucinich's and Moore's were vocal against those policies. (are you in the wrong party?)

Any reasonable person knows there is a difficult balance between minimizing the possibility of terrorism vs. defending individual rights. It is a very difficult happy medium that needs to be found. But your rigid, ideology driven, one size fits all approach to everything won't ever find that delicate balance.

[Dude!]

Took Amtrak twice from NYC to Boston (to do some work at mit and to interview at harvard.)
:thumbup:

the only way that sentence is believable
is if you were interviewing
for a janitor position at Harvard

[Dudeman]

the only way that sentence is believable
is if you were interviewing
for a janitor position at Harvard

.

[Dude!]

You're right. You caught me- it is only partially true. I forgot that I also took Amtrak from nyc to phily to interview at Penn.

yeah, the cleaning jobs
are competitive these days
and you have to apply
at like 100 places

[Dudeman]

yeah, the cleaning jobs
are competitive these days
and you have to apply
at like 100 places

you'd know

[Fallon]

Love Amtrak. Boston-NYC is awesome on it. Drops you off in the middle of the city, and is a comfortable ride. Wi-Fi, outlets in every seat. It's awesome.

What he said.

I've only had one problem when the engine died coming back to Boston, was stuck on the tracks for about three hours until a new engine was hooked up. I just slept, no biggie.

The Acela isn't really that big of a difference, just newer trains that have less stops. Maybe you get to NYC a half hour quicker.

[WRESTLINGFAN]

I'm afraid I'm not too knowledgeable about the Ron/Rand approach to terrorism.

Is this the way to try to prevent it?

http://adamarmour.files.wordpress.com/2010/04/fingers-crossed.jpg


And this the reaction to when it is done?

http://www.istockphoto.com/file_thumbview_approve/1239117/2/istockphoto_1239117-scientist-shrug-on-gray-gradient.jpg

I'm certainly not saying you can stop everything and anything is appropriate in attempt to stop it. Remember your party was for going through people's library records, while Schumer and Obama were against it. Over the last 10 years, your Republican party has been a much stronger advocate for intrusive actions. That's not to say the Dem administration hasn't continued some of those policies (TSA for example.) But as the library record example demonstrates, your republican party was much more aggressive, while the Boxer's and Kucinich's and Moore's were vocal against those policies. (are you in the wrong party?)

Any reasonable person knows there is a difficult balance between minimizing the possibility of terrorism vs. defending individual rights. It is a very difficult happy medium that needs to be found. But your rigid, ideology driven, one size fits all approach to everything won't ever find that delicate balance.

My party? Why do you paint some broad brush that people opposed to your views are big gov't neo cons Im against the patriot act. Something that This administration is still continuing. Im not going to speculate of you belong to that party, but now that Obama is in office theres nothing to see. I will assume that youre against the patriot act but why arent more people speaking out now that Obama is in charge?


In regards to preventing terrorism, lets just pour more money down a schumer sewer, like we dont spend enough money already.


http://www.economist.com/blogs/gulliver/2011/04/deterring_terrorism

[Dudeman]

In regards to preventing terrorism, lets just pour more money down a schumer sewer, like we dont spend enough money already.


http://www.economist.com/blogs/gulliver/2011/04/deterring_terrorism

Ok, so then what is the right amount? None?

[Dudeman]

My party? Why do you paint some broad brush that people opposed to your views are big gov't neo cons Im against the patriot act. Something that This administration is still continuing. Im not going to speculate of you belong to that party, but now that Obama is in office theres nothing to see. I will assume that youre against the patriot act but why arent more people speaking out now that Obama is in charge?


I was being sarcastic. You, of all people, should understand the idea of painting someone with a broad brush. On one hand, you take several data points and make Kucinich, Moore, Boxer, Obama, some random blogger on some random website, and Bush the same. One the other hand, you narrowly define your own positions- even when you have the exact same position as the Cato Institute, for example, or even cite their study to support point, you deny having the same position as a right-wing, Koch Brother financed think tank.

[StanUpshaw]

WF is clearly in lock-step with Cato.

http://i.imgur.com/1fcNr.png
http://www.cato.org/pub_display.php?pub_id=13089

[WRESTLINGFAN]

WF is clearly in lock-step with Cato.

http://i.imgur.com/1fcNr.png
http://www.cato.org/pub_display.php?pub_id=13089

Libertarians are in favor of open immigration both legal and illegal, however where they break away from progressives is that they are opposed to a massive welfare state. Their opinion is that come in, the water's fine but dont expect anyone to rescue you when youre drowning. In a nutshell you are free to come in but you must survive on your own.


I have a different view on immigration than what Cato thinks.

I'll post this again

http://www.lewrockwell.com/kinsella/kinsella18.html

Consider this case. I live in a small independent city, which has about 10,000 residents. It is very small and dense, and smack-dab in the middle of Houston, which has 4 million people. Our City has a public pool a few blocks from my house. As a resident of the City (and hence a taxpayer) I am entitled to use the pool for a very small fee — say, $2 per visit. Nonresidents — outsiders — may use the pool too, but they pay three times as much: $6 per visit.

"Now let's say that as a libertarian I would rather the pool be privatized, or sold and the proceeds returned to those who have been victimized to found or maintain it — the taxpayers, or residents, of this City. This would be a type of restitution for the crime committed against them. Alternatively, if the land for the pool had been expropriated, the owner ought to be paid restitution. Etc. The point is that given a government theft, taking, or trespass, it is better, other things being equal, for the victims to receive restitution; and more restitution is better than a smaller, insufficient amount.

But restitution need not be made only in dollars. It can be made by providing other value or benefits to the victims. One such benefit to me is the ability to use a nice, uncrowded, local pool for a cheap price. It is arguably better, even more libertarian, for the City to discriminate against outsiders. If it did not, the pool would be overrun by outsiders seeking cheap swimming. It would be virtually worthless to me and most of my fellow residents of the City if there were no rules on entry, or no discrimination against outsiders. The rule set on the usage of this property by its caretaker-owner, the City, is a reasonable one — one that the owner of a private pool might adopt, and also one that generates more restitution for the victims of the City's aggression, than a less discriminatory rule would."

[underdog]

What he said.

I've only had one problem when the engine died coming back to Boston, was stuck on the tracks for about three hours until a new engine was hooked up. I just slept, no biggie.

The Acela isn't really that big of a difference, just newer trains that have less stops. Maybe you get to NYC a half hour quicker.

Acela is just a waste of money in non-peak times from Bos-NYC.

[Drew85]

And If I remember right the reason why it cannot get to certain speeds is because of the age of the tracks or why we cannot get faster trains. and plus some high populated areas. but the tracks should really be replaced. and other parts have to be changed on how it's angled. and I took a train up to boston once, it was comfortable and relaxing.