Headscarf ban causes arrests

[WRESTLINGFAN]

More of a local story but still can be discussed in a political forum. I break away from many on the right when it comes to things like this. If people want to wear Hijabs or Burquas it's their choice. I know Playland was looking at this from a safety matter to prevent lawsuits but if Muslim women want to wear hijabs or burquas they are free to do so. What playland should have done is make people sign waivers so that in case there was injury/death Playland would not be held liable

http://www.lohud.com/article/20110831/NEWS02/108310335/15-arrested-Playland-melee-over-head-scarves

[A.J.]

Religious freedom + Darwinism = Win.

[Judge Smails]

First of all, have you ever been to a busy amusement park and seen the lines? Now we're going to get Playland to have extra employees on hand responsible for getting signatures and verifying them. I was at the Meadowlands Fair recently and had to sign a waiver because they were filming a t.v. show and I had to give my consent for them to use my likeness. I signed it: Heywood Jablowme. Good luck getting that to stand up in court (because my name isn't really Heywood Jablowme).

Also, everyone knows that in the event of an injury, those waivers mean next to nothing. Just like those statements when you park your car in a garage that say they're not responsible for any damage to your car.

[CountryBob]

Follow the fucking rules - if it is against your religion dont fucking ride the damn rides!
Saftey trumps all -

I am so fucking tired of everything these days. The language in this country is English - if you are a permanent resident here then fucking speak it. If there are rules in place due to safety then obey them. if you dont like it fucking stay at home.

:furious:

[WRESTLINGFAN]

In a case like this it was for Muslims only so the park wouldnt be busier than a regular day with General admission.

How about just putting signs on the rides like they do with height restrictions etc. Why wouldnt that stand up in court?

[Misteriosa]

More of a local story but still can be discussed in a political forum. I break away from many on the right when it comes to things like this. If people want to wear Hijabs or Burquas it's their choice. I know Playland was looking at this from a safety matter to prevent lawsuits but if Muslim women want to wear hijabs or burquas they are free to do so. What playland should have done is make people sign waivers so that in case there was injury/death Playland would not be held liable

http://www.lohud.com/article/20110831/NEWS02/108310335/15-arrested-Playland-melee-over-head-scarves

yep. make them sign a waiver. the same way you cant force others from another religion to remove their headdresses, you cant force it here.

[CountryBob]

Why cant safety trump everything?

Drives me crazy how we have to be so sensitive to everyone's situation now.


What happens if a waiver is signed and then a headscarf causes an accident that kills your family member? Would you be happy - no, you would be angry that the park allowed that shit to be worn on the ride.

I'm just venting but I dont think that religion, fashion or someone's want should ever trump the safety rules of anything...

[Chigworthy]

yep. make them sign a waiver. the same way you cant force others from another religion to remove their headdresses, you cant force it here.

It wouldn't be forcing someone to remove it if they aren't being forced to get on the ride. If it's a safety issue where someone could possibly die, which could also put other people at risk, they're not just going to let people ride if they sign a waiver or see a sign. It's a recreational ride, not live-giving sustenance. And it's not a "head scarf ban", it's a ban on headgear. After three fatalities in 2004-2007, you can't blame the park for trying to limit the horrifying deaths that occur there. I'm pretty sure that if there were deities, they wouldn't give a holy fuck if their followers were allowed on a roller coaster or not.

[WRESTLINGFAN]

yep. make them sign a waiver. the same way you cant force others from another religion to remove their headdresses, you cant force it here.

They are voluntarily entering an establishment. No one is banning the headscarf. I put forth another option like warning signs where the rides are.

Wanna wear your traditional clothing thats your right, however don't sue if you get injured

[Misteriosa]

They are voluntarily entering an establishment. No one is banning the headscarf. I put forth another option like warning signs where the rides are.

Wanna wear your traditional clothing thats your right, however don't sue if you get injured

umm.. im not arguing against you.

[Judge Smails]

They are voluntarily entering an establishment. No one is banning the headscarf. I put forth another option like warning signs where the rides are.

Wanna wear your traditional clothing thats your right, however don't sue if you get injured

Warning signs are useless and would never protect Playland from liability. Even assuming they were a "get out of jail free card" (which it isn't) for Playland that would still not stop an injured party from suing them and Playland would have to go through the expense of getting it thrown out of court. The only way for Playland to protect itself is to avoid any injuries.

If that was the case every store, restaurant or other business would simply put a sign up on their front door that said "You might be injured in here - But we're not responsible".

[sailor]

Also, even if you remove any liability, the bad press from someone dying won't help them (granted I never knew of these three deaths, so it wouldn hurt much - and this is bad PR today anyway).

That said, I agree with the one muslim spokesman; I can see both sides and both sides over-reacted and helped it escalate.

[furie]

umm.. im not arguing against you.

he just likes to argue

[StanUpshaw]

More important question: Why the fuck is an amusement park owned by the government?

[Misteriosa]

More important question: Why the fuck is an amusement park owned by the government?

i think its something having to do with the park's landmark status.

eta: here is the wiki

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Playland_(New_York)

[StanUpshaw]

The wiki says the government built it and 60 years later it was declared a landmark.

[StanUpshaw]

I'm searching the tragically crippled, anemic, gutshot Google News Archives...

And I'm reading the history of this bullshit park. It is a schadenfreudic delight to any libertarian. Running million dollar deficits since its inception, waste, fraud, cronyism, abuse. What a glorious microcosm.

[furie]

More important question: Why the fuck is an amusement park owned by the government?

That's a Westchester thing. Westchester County also owns the airport up there, HPN. There are a number of enterprises that are county owned in Westchester.

[WRESTLINGFAN]

I hope this doesnt spread around the Muslim world. Dont want some nutjob in Pakistan issuing a fatwa on the Dragon coaster

[Judge Smails]

I hope this doesnt spread around the Muslim world. Dont want some nutjob in Pakistan issuing a fatwa on the Dragon coaster

Or, even worse, use their Satanic Muslim juju and turn us all into a nation of Boy-Men.

http://thephoenixofhotelfreds.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/07/zoltar.jpg








See what I did there? I tied in the turban wearing Zoltar machine from "Big" with the fact that it was at Playland in the movie and I threw in a little xenophobic slur for good measure.

http://28.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_lef0vyQE5K1qzpwi0o1_500.jpg

[Marc with a c]

dragon coaster. FTW!

[CountryBob]

Or, even worse, use their Satanic Muslim juju and turn us all into a nation of Boy-Men.

http://thephoenixofhotelfreds.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/07/zoltar.jpg








See what I did there? I tied in the turban wearing Zoltar machine from "Big" with the fact that it was at Playland in the movie and I threw in a little xenophobic slur for good measure.

http://28.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_lef0vyQE5K1qzpwi0o1_500.jpg

Well, that was clever

[Dude!]

when it has to be explained,
not so clever

[Judge Smails]

when it has to be explained,
not so clever

Did you know the machine from the movie was in Playland? I'd venture to guess 99% of the people outside the NY area didn't.

[TripleSkeet]

Also, everyone knows that in the event of an injury, those waivers mean next to nothing.

Can someone that studies law explain to me why exactly this is? I never understood why if someone is willing to sign something giving up their right to sue, it wouldnt hold up in court.

[Chigworthy]

So some idiot with a picnic blanket on their head signs a waiver and gets on the ride, the blanket gets caught on the thingamajig and pulls blanket head's lifeless body into the rows behind it, injuring them and covering the kids with blood and brainguts. Good plan. How about just make it so if you want to ride the damn thing, you can't wear the thing that may cause problems.

[sailor]

They did.

[Chigworthy]

They did.

I'm signing a waiver against you.

[WRESTLINGFAN]

Would have to cover all religions. Sister Mary Grace wearing a full habit would also be a safety concern

[Judge Smails]

Can someone that studies law explain to me why exactly this is? I never understood why if someone is willing to sign something giving up their right to sue, it wouldnt hold up in court.

Courts will often find any kind of loophole to let an injured party sue. Insurance companies will often look to settle out of court rather than taking a chance with a trial or jury.

Having schoolage kids I can't tell you how many waivers I've signed. Everything they do seems to require a waiver from sports to cheerleading to Boy Scout camping to paintball to riding an elephant at the county fair etc. etc. If I didn't sign these waivers these kids couldn't do anything. I have no bargaining power to negotiate the terms of these waivers. It's take it or leave it. Everytime we get one my wife freaks out and thinks she has to read it all. I know better and just sign it and hope nothing happens but know that I will be protected (at least until "tort reform" sweeps in).

It's like I said before - you park your car in a garage and the ticket says they are not responsible for damage or theft. You've got no choice in the matter. If someone drove off with your car, or even keyed it up real good, while you were at dinner or something would you say "Oh well, the ticket says its not their fault. I won't even bother them with this and just go through my insurance." Probably not, and you'd probably win too.

Here's some good info I found that lists a lot of waiver exceptions found by courts that explains it much better than I could.

http://sportslaw.uslegal.com/tort-law/waivers-and-releases/

[Judge Smails]

Just to clarify lest anyone think I'm sue happy and don't believe in taking any personal responsibilty.

My son loves playing football. I signed many waivers for him to play and am very aware of the inherent dangers of the sport. He has had MANY minor injuries over the years. Many X-Rays and doctor's visits which I handled through my insurance with the associated deductibles. Other kids have had broken arms and legs and as far as I know no one has sued the Pop Warner league or the school district now that my son is in Junior High.

So, the other day my son comes home from practice and says his neck hurts. He says one of the new kids who never played football before grabbed my son's head with both hands and twisted his head. Apparently the coaches never taught this kid proper tackling technique. Now, God forbid my son was paralyzed and needed lifetime care - don't you think I/he should be able to sue the school district for the coach's failure to do his job or should I be precluded because I signed a waiver.

[CountryBob]

Did you know the machine from the movie was in Playland? I'd venture to guess 99% of the people outside the NY area didn't.

Bingo

[Recyclerz]

Did you know the machine from the movie was in Playland? I'd venture to guess 99% of the people outside the NY area didn't.

If the hurricane coverage taught us anything it is that 99% of the people outside the NY area don't matter.



:innocent:

[Chigworthy]

Would have to cover all religions. Sister Mary Grace wearing a full habit would also be a safety concern

In the article (you know, the one you linked), it says headgear is prohibited. It has nothing to do with religion.

[cougarjake13]

shits getting ridiculous now

[StanUpshaw]

ri-god damn-diculous?

[Chigworthy]

Everyone else just admit they're wrong and we can move on from this.

[TripleSkeet]

Just to clarify lest anyone think I'm sue happy and don't believe in taking any personal responsibilty.

My son loves playing football. I signed many waivers for him to play and am very aware of the inherent dangers of the sport. He has had MANY minor injuries over the years. Many X-Rays and doctor's visits which I handled through my insurance with the associated deductibles. Other kids have had broken arms and legs and as far as I know no one has sued the Pop Warner league or the school district now that my son is in Junior High.

So, the other day my son comes home from practice and says his neck hurts. He says one of the new kids who never played football before grabbed my son's head with both hands and twisted his head. Apparently the coaches never taught this kid proper tackling technique. Now, God forbid my son was paralyzed and needed lifetime care - don't you think I/he should be able to sue the school district for the coach's failure to do his job or should I be precluded because I signed a waiver.

Honestly? I think you should be precluded. Simply because practice is where you go to learn. If the kid fucks up a tackle because he doesnt know, hes practicing to learn. Just like if the same thing happened in a game, should you be able to sue the other team because the coach didnt teach well enough? If thats OK then you would pretty much say goodbye to all volunteer coaches in this country.

Im not sue happy, but I definitely think people shouldnt be afraid to sue either. The problem is when people start winning cases like that, activities start to dissapear. Football is a violent sport that can end in paralysis, the minute you sign that waiver you shouldnt be allowed to sue for anything that happens on the field (Just my opinion).

The whole reason I ask is this, in Philly every May at the Italian Market they have an Italian Festival. Its awesome. All kinds of food, drinks, desserts, music, trinkets, its all for sale for about 8-10 blocks. They have all kinds of stuff there. For about 80 years they had something called the Greased Pole. It was a 25 foot high steel pole, covered in lard. At the top was a ring with meats, cheeses and envelopes of money hanging from it. All the neighborhood guys would pitch in and try for hours to get to the top, forming pyramids, wiping the grease off as they went. You would have guys ages 6-50 working together on this thing. Once one would get to the top hed throw the meats and cheese to the crowd, and take the money and buy beer for all the participants. It was a highlight of the festival every year. It was something my grandfather did, my dad, me, my brothers and cousins. In all the years we did it we never remembered anyone getting seriously injured.

About 6 years ago someone that didnt grow up there decided to try, and sprained his ankle. He tried suing the cheese place that donated the food and money on the top of the pole. They took it down and its never gone up again. The way society is today Im surprised it took so long, but what bothered me is the people running the festival wanted to get insurance and have all competitors sign wavers, and the insurance company still refused. So an 80 year tradition dissapears. My son and nephews will never get to experience that fun and unique family tradition. All because lawyers get involved and loopholes are used to win court cases instead of common sense. I know it sounds like something dumb to be pissed over but it was a tradition I grew up with and now its gone.

[Snacks]

buy a pole grease the fucker up and put it in your backyard have a bbq and continue the tradition.

[Judge Smails]

buy a pole grease the fucker up and put it in your backyard have a bbq and continue the tradition.

Make sure you have your friends sign a waiver though.

[StanUpshaw]

Hell, skip the pole and just have a pile of greasy Italian men. I know what this is really all about.

[CountryBob]

If the hurricane coverage taught us anything it is that 99% of the people outside the NY area don't matter.



:innocent:

You New Yorker's think your so special :huh:
I think the Big Apple must have a rotten worm in it or sumphin... - tss tsss

[WRESTLINGFAN]

Article from the girl who started everything

http://www.lohud.com/article/20110901/NEWS02/109010375/Teen-talks-role-Playland-melee-over-head-scarves?odyssey=mod|breaking|text|Frontpage

"They did everything so brutally," she said.



Brutally? Maybe she should visit Muslim countries where adulterers get stoned to death. Now thats brutal

[foodcourtdruide]

Honestly? I think you should be precluded. Simply because practice is where you go to learn. If the kid fucks up a tackle because he doesnt know, hes practicing to learn. Just like if the same thing happened in a game, should you be able to sue the other team because the coach didnt teach well enough? If thats OK then you would pretty much say goodbye to all volunteer coaches in this country.

Im not sue happy, but I definitely think people shouldnt be afraid to sue either. The problem is when people start winning cases like that, activities start to dissapear. Football is a violent sport that can end in paralysis, the minute you sign that waiver you shouldnt be allowed to sue for anything that happens on the field (Just my opinion).

The whole reason I ask is this, in Philly every May at the Italian Market they have an Italian Festival. Its awesome. All kinds of food, drinks, desserts, music, trinkets, its all for sale for about 8-10 blocks. They have all kinds of stuff there. For about 80 years they had something called the Greased Pole. It was a 25 foot high steel pole, covered in lard. At the top was a ring with meats, cheeses and envelopes of money hanging from it. All the neighborhood guys would pitch in and try for hours to get to the top, forming pyramids, wiping the grease off as they went. You would have guys ages 6-50 working together on this thing. Once one would get to the top hed throw the meats and cheese to the crowd, and take the money and buy beer for all the participants. It was a highlight of the festival every year. It was something my grandfather did, my dad, me, my brothers and cousins. In all the years we did it we never remembered anyone getting seriously injured.

About 6 years ago someone that didnt grow up there decided to try, and sprained his ankle. He tried suing the cheese place that donated the food and money on the top of the pole. They took it down and its never gone up again. The way society is today Im surprised it took so long, but what bothered me is the people running the festival wanted to get insurance and have all competitors sign wavers, and the insurance company still refused. So an 80 year tradition dissapears. My son and nephews will never get to experience that fun and unique family tradition. All because lawyers get involved and loopholes are used to win court cases instead of common sense. I know it sounds like something dumb to be pissed over but it was a tradition I grew up with and now its gone.

Thanks for making me angry, TS.

I think this story can be used as anecdotal evidence for 80% of what's wrong with this country. But that's mostly just because Philadelphia is involved... jk.

[Judge Smails]

"Muslims wouldn't allow it to get caught," Salem said Wednesday. "It's worn low and tight."


Family sees mother strangled by hijab in freak go-karting accident
(http://www.smh.com.au/nsw/family-sees-mother-strangled-by-hijab-in-freak-gokarting-accident-20100408-rvci.html)

[foodcourtdruide]

Article from the girl who started everything

http://www.lohud.com/article/20110901/NEWS02/109010375/Teen-talks-role-Playland-melee-over-head-scarves?odyssey=mod|breaking|text|Frontpage

"They did everything so brutally," she said.



Brutally? Maybe she should visit Muslim countries where adulterers get stoned to death. Now thats brutal

I'd feel pretty stupid if I was arguing with a 17 year old.

[A.J.]

Family sees mother strangled by hijab in freak go-karting accident
(http://www.smh.com.au/nsw/family-sees-mother-strangled-by-hijab-in-freak-gokarting-accident-20100408-rvci.html)

The Saudis were right -- women shouldn't drive.

[sailor]

Reminds me of how the one twin on big love died after her ponytail got caught in her car door.

[WRESTLINGFAN]

I'd feel pretty stupid if I was arguing with a 17 year old.

In some countries a 17 year old is already married and has multiple children

[Chigworthy]

Reminds me of how the one twin on big love died after her ponytail got caught in her car door.

I saw that, but I think she had signed a waiver with Roman.

[sailor]

I saw that, but I think she had signed a waiver with Roman.


he forged it!