HoF or winning a championship?

[furie]

Hypothetical question; if you were a professional athlete and had to choose between winning a championship or going into the hall of fame which would you choose?

[Snoogans]

it depends for me which sport. Also, its really hard cause of the other factors we dont know. Id rather be HOF and have all the money that came with it than be the 12th man on some NBA team that won a championship and i was out of the league 2 years later.

For Football, i would say HOF. The playoffs are one game at a time, and anything can cost you a playoff game. Including refs, etc. Plus, you have the most teammates around you, giving the most potential for you to lose despite actually performing at the highest level yourself. Plus you dont get much time in football, and life is pretty fucked after that, so id like to get all the money i could out of that.
I think baseball id go HOF too. the company you would be in, plus the fact that you could be the best player ever and be on say the Mets, you aint winning shit. Plus if you were a HOF baseball player you made like 300 million dollars in this day. I could live with that.

basketball, there has been so many guys who were HOF and never won anything. No one seems to really care about it, unless its a current guys greatness we are discussing. No one ever questions barkley even though he never got one, he was a beast. and basketball is another game rooted so much in teamwork that often being the best doesnt guarantee you a title, unless you are so much the best that you can scare people into doing everything they needed, like Jordan did.


I guess i have to say ill take the HOF. I dont wanna be remembered for what my teammates did. Id rather be a monster myself and let the chips fall how they may. Im still paid. And fuck, if i need a ring that bad, ill just go buy one on ebay.

Or sign with some team that is loaded when im old and steal a ring that way

[A.J.]

I'd say championship. The knock on guys like Ted Williams, Ernie Banks, Dan Marino, Jim Kelly, Karl Malone and Charles Barkley was always "great players sure, but they never won a championship". I imagine hearing that has to suck no matter how great a player you were.

[ozzie]

Just "a" championship?

Wow. It would have to be one helluva memorable championship, and at the right time in my career.

Winning one my rookie year, and then never again would suck.

Or going almost a full career being labeled as they guy who never won one... and then being on a team to win one on my last year, but not getting much credit for getting them there and winning it. No thanks.

A lot of the starters on the '85 Bears only got the one, but those guys will never have to pay for a drink in that town again, and some major contributors are not in the hall.

Maybe if it were like almost singlehandedly bringing a major city without a title their FIRST and Only one... like QB'ing the Browns or Eagles to a title... maybe something like that would outshine an enshrinement.

Otherwise, gimme the Hall, hands down.

[Jujubees2]

Hockey - championship (get my name on Lord Stanley's Cup!)

All other sports probably HOF

[Snoogans]

I'd say championship. The knock on guys like Ted Williams, Ernie Banks, Dan Marino, Jim Kelly, Karl Malone and Charles Barkley was always "great players sure, but they never won a championship". I imagine hearing that has to suck no matter how great a player you were.

no one kills barkley for that. in fact. anyone who played against jordan in playoffs should get a pass for not winning. except ewing. he was just a fuckin a bum




this question is hard to answer with no other context. a championship, but what kinda career did you have with the title?

[A.J.]

no one kills barkley for that. in fact. anyone who played against jordan in playoffs should get a pass for not winning. except ewing. he was just a fuckin a bum


I know that, it's just that sometimes he's used as an example. Remember Drexler got the same crap until he won one with Houston?

And Ewing should have had one if Reilly had put in Rolando Blackman for Starks in 1994 and if Charles Smith wasn't such a pussy and made a simple layup.

[Snoogans]

I know that, it's just that sometimes he's used as an example. Remember Drexler got the same crap until he won one with Houston?

And Ewing should have had one if Reilly had put in Rolando Blackman for Starks in 1994 and if Charles Smith wasn't such a pussy and made a simple layup.

believe me, ewing did plenty of fuckin up chances himself. starks fucked the dog, no doubt. but ewing did his fuckin part.

ALL OF THEM BUMS

[TripleSkeet]

Im assuming youre a starter nd actual contributor to your team in both, as theres no way youre going to the HOF as a bench player. So in that context, I pick championship. To me thats the ultimate goal.

[mdr55]

I know that, it's just that sometimes he's used as an example. Remember Drexler got the same crap until he won one with Houston?

And Ewing should have had one if Reilly had put in Rolando Blackman for Starks in 1994 and if Charles Smith wasn't such a pussy and made a simple layup.

Charles Smith was freaking fouled. We all know it. Am I one of the only Charles Smith supporters out there? Dude scored like 20+ with the Clippers.

[WRESTLINGFAN]

Ray Bourque won a cup in his final season with the Avalanche.

I know Bruins fans would have wanted him to win one in Boston but I remember them being happy for him that he did win a cup

[newport king]

Id pick HOF for most sports with 2 exceptions, hockey (as someone said above get your name on the cup, itll be in the HOF anyway. And hitting a walkoff hr in game 7 for either the Cubs or Redsox (neither team i like) before they won. Youd be a fuckin rockstar in that town till the day you die

[cougarjake13]

yeh I'd need more info


is it a great hall of fame close career but dont get in and one championship ?

or u can be a role player with a ring or a hall of gamer without ?



if all things being equal I'd rather have the hof career

[WRESTLINGFAN]

I think in a sport like Baseball if someone is a borderline HoF player but probably wont get 75% of the ballot like Cone, Bernie or O'Neill they would rather have the rings.

[sailor]

Hof. Not even a debate to me.

[CountryBob]

Why not both? If you win championships you could also end up in the HOF too...

[cougarjake13]

Why not both? If you win championships you could also end up in the HOF too...


yes that's obviously the best but that's not the question


also just winning doesn't guarantee a hof

is brad Johnson or Trent dilfer goin to the hof without buying a ticket?

[KnoxHarrington]

no one kills barkley for that. in fact. anyone who played against jordan in playoffs should get a pass for not winning. except ewing. he was just a fuckin a bum




this question is hard to answer with no other context. a championship, but what kinda career did you have with the title?

That Malone/Stockton Jazz team would have been a dynasty in any other era. They would have won at least 2 or 3 championships if they hadn't kept bumping into Jordan.

[CountryBob]

Do they get paid any money for HOF?

[NickyL0885]

Hall of Fame, hands down. Anyone can win a championship. But being in the HoF is exclusive.

Speaking of hall of fame, and I don't mean to get off topic, but I love how when an actor or actress gets a star on the walk of fame, they have to pay $10,000 to get the star. It's like "hey, we want to honor your great work. But you have to pay for it".

[Snoogans]

That Malone/Stockton Jazz team would have been a dynasty in any other era. They would have won at least 2 or 3 championships if they hadn't kept bumping into Jordan.

Probably the Payton/kemp sonics too

[TripleSkeet]

Anyone can win a championship.


Tell that to this guy....

http://img843.imageshack.us/img843/3299/marinoonphone.jpg (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/843/marinoonphone.jpg/)

[Kevin]

Tell that to this guy....

http://img843.imageshack.us/img843/3299/marinoonphone.jpg (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/843/marinoonphone.jpg/)


Or any Eagle since 60....

Sorry Skeet, had to do it.

[Snacks]

For the most part I would say HoF except Basketball. Basketball is the one sport where 1 great player can take a team on its back and win a championship. But that is still hard to do as someone mentioned Barkley , Ewing etc.

All other sports there are so many factors like your teammates, current dynasty's, officiating, coaching, style of offense or defense etc. A championships makes some great players look better but there are many all time great in all sports who never won a championship and are still considered better then most who did win.

Also a HoF for the most part is based off of what you did not what your team did. Its your stats, a championship could get a borderline player in but an all time great is an all time great with or without a ring. Not to mention all time greats/hof guys usually made the most money and had the most fame. That is another pretty big reason to pick HoF.

[Kevin]

Which sport has the lowest standard for HOF?

I think right now by far is baseball.

They let questionable players get in because of automatic stats like 500hrs and 3k hits.

I think they have by far the most questionable HOFers.

[Snoogans]

Which sport has the lowest standard for HOF?

I think right now by far is baseball.

They let questionable players get in because of automatic stats like 500hrs and 3k hits.

I think they have by far the most questionable HOFers.

until pete rose is in it, the baseball HOF is and always will be a fuckin sham

[furie]

Just "a" championship?

yes just one. because a dynasty would be the better than HOF hands down.

[A.J.]

until pete rose is in it, the baseball HOF is and always will be a fuckin sham

And Shoeless Joe Jackson.

[cougarjake13]

Which sport has the lowest standard for HOF?

I think right now by far is baseball.

They let questionable players get in because of automatic stats like 500hrs and 3k hits.

I think they have by far the most questionable HOFers.



well the nfl is kinda fucked up in that they have to have at least 4 but no more then 7 every year so some years u culd have some questionable picks

[TripleSkeet]

until pete rose is in it, the baseball HOF is and always will be a fuckin sham

This.

But I also do think that 500 Home Runs or 3000 hits should be n automatic HOF pass as well. Those arent numbers you can get being a flash in the pan.

[Kevin]

This.

But I also do think that 500 Home Runs or 3000 hits should be n automatic HOF pass as well. Those arent numbers you can get being a flash in the pan.

I just have a problem with someone playing 20-25yrs getting them and getting in when they clearly are not HOF guys.

[cougarjake13]

I just have a problem with someone playing 20-25yrs getting them and getting in when they clearly are not HOF guys.



of the 500 plus homer guys already in who do you think is a compiler and not really worthy of getting in ?


I agree on 3000 hits you could never be great but consistently get 175-200 hits a year and get to 3000 and I don't think that means ur a hall of famer

[Kevin]

of the 500 plus homer guys already in who do you think is a compiler and not really worthy of getting in ?


I agree on 3000 hits you could never be great but consistently get 175-200 hits a year and get to 3000 and I don't think that means ur a hall of famer

I mean lets look at Fred Magriff.

He has like 496 hrs i think.

If he got 500 he would be automatic.

But he has 496 or whatever and he is being debated on if he or is he not a HOF.

My thinking is if you have ANY doubt on your mind than he is not a HOF.

Myself In my opinion think he is one, he was very underrated. But I just think its stupid to have a set # that if he has this or that, he is auto in.

[Snacks]

I mean lets look at Fred Magriff.

He has like 496 hrs i think.

If he got 500 he would be automatic.

But he has 496 or whatever and he is being debated on if he or is he not a HOF.

My thinking is if you have ANY doubt on your mind than he is not a HOF.

Myself In my opinion think he is one, he was very underrated. But I just think its stupid to have a set # that if he has this or that, he is auto in.

But he also played 19 years and you just said you dont like when a guy plays too many years and gets certain stats and then gets in. Well he played a lot of years and still didnt reach that bench mark that is measured as automatic.

[TripleSkeet]

That is a milestone number. Think of all the people that have played the sports of baseball in the past 125 years. Out of all those guys only 25 have ever accomplished that feat. I dont care if the guy played 20 years, if he was good enough to hang around the league that long and get that number, then hes a HOF'er in my book. Its not like teams are signing guys just to give them a job when they are in their 40s, theyve got to be able to play too. Look at Julio Franco, even at the end he was still a big contributor to his team.

Crimedog was a good player, and Im not saying hes not a Hall of Famer, but the bottom line is hes not automatic because he didnt hit that milestone. 496 isnt 500, its that simple.

[Snoogans]

But he also played 19 years and you just said you dont like when a guy plays too many years and gets certain stats and then gets in. Well he played a lot of years and still didnt reach that bench mark that is measured as automatic.

yea but you gotta look at the way things went. McGriff is the only guy in major league history to hit 20 Hrs a year for 15 years and i think the only one to hit 30 every year for 10 years in a row up until the time he was playin. something like that.

His last couple years he was compiling a bit, but the first 16 or so years he was a beast. he should be in on account that he was a top tier player in MLB for a solid 15 straight years. again, if pucket is in, alot of guys should be.


Also, and this will be weird comin from a sox fan. I think Mattingly should be in there. I know the injuries robbed alot but there was a good 5-7 years stretch where mattingly was the most feared player in baseball. I dont hold it against guys that they got hurt. He was a HOF caliber player.

[NickyL0885]

yea but you gotta look at the way things went. McGriff is the only guy in major league history to hit 20 Hrs a year for 15 years and i think the only one to hit 30 every year for 10 years in a row up until the time he was playin. something like that.

His last couple years he was compiling a bit, but the first 16 or so years he was a beast. he should be in on account that he was a top tier player in MLB for a solid 15 straight years. again, if pucket is in, alot of guys should be.


Also, and this will be weird comin from a sox fan. I think Mattingly should be in there. I know the injuries robbed alot but there was a good 5-7 years stretch where mattingly was the most feared player in baseball. I dont hold it against guys that they got hurt. He was a HOF caliber player.

If you put Mattingly in, Keith Hernandez needs to be in too. Best defensive first baseman in history, 2 WS titles, 1 MVP, multiple all-stars. Without him, the Mets never win in the 80's.

[A.J.]

Also, and this will be weird comin from a sox fan. I think Mattingly should be in there. I know the injuries robbed alot but there was a good 5-7 years stretch where mattingly was the most feared player in baseball. I dont hold it against guys that they got hurt. He was a HOF caliber player.

I always liked Donnie Baseball. One of the best hitters of his era.

[Snacks]

yea but you gotta look at the way things went. McGriff is the only guy in major league history to hit 20 Hrs a year for 15 years and i think the only one to hit 30 every year for 10 years in a row up until the time he was playin. something like that.

His last couple years he was compiling a bit, but the first 16 or so years he was a beast. he should be in on account that he was a top tier player in MLB for a solid 15 straight years. again, if pucket is in, alot of guys should be.


Also, and this will be weird comin from a sox fan. I think Mattingly should be in there. I know the injuries robbed alot but there was a good 5-7 years stretch where mattingly was the most feared player in baseball. I dont hold it against guys that they got hurt. He was a HOF caliber player.

I didn't say McGriff shouldn't be in, he should. I was just pointing out that he contradicted himself saying what he said about playing a lot of years to get certain numbers when McGriff did play a lot of years and still didn't get the so called numbers needed for an automatic vote in.

I agree with you on Kirby and would add Rizzuto who might be the worse HoF inductee. But I disagree with Mattingly. He was the best player on a shit team for years. His defense is HoF worthy but his overall career offensives numbers are not. He is one of those guys we talked about that if he had a ring or 2 MIGHT get him in but based on what he did he isn't a HoF in my opinion.

He still has a shot at the HoF, maybe in 20 years he gets in as a manager?!

[Kevin]

I didn't say McGriff shouldn't be in, he should. I was just pointing out that he contradicted himself saying what he said about playing a lot of years to get certain numbers when McGriff did play a lot of years and still didn't get the so called numbers needed for an automatic vote in.

I agree with you on Kirby and would add Rizzuto who might be the worse HoF inductee. But I disagree with Mattingly. He was the best player on a shit team for years. His defense is HoF worthy but his overall career offensives numbers are not. He is one of those guys we talked about that if he had a ring or 2 MIGHT get him in but based on what he did he isn't a HoF in my opinion.

He still has a shot at the HoF, maybe in 20 years he gets in as a manager?!

It depends on what level you were in your say 15-20+ years. If you are hitting like 220 and keep jacking up bombs and stuff then no.

But if you are still at a respectable level when you are playing in years 15 to 20 then yea you should be in.

Like Say Damon hangs all these next few years and gets 3k hits yet he is hitting like 230, then no he should not be in the HOF even though he got 3000.

[cougarjake13]

to me you should have dominated during your playin time or been at least top five in the major categories to even be considered

under that provision mcgriff would easily qualify

[Snoogans]

I didn't say McGriff shouldn't be in, he should. I was just pointing out that he contradicted himself saying what he said about playing a lot of years to get certain numbers when McGriff did play a lot of years and still didn't get the so called numbers needed for an automatic vote in.

I agree with you on Kirby and would add Rizzuto who might be the worse HoF inductee. But I disagree with Mattingly. He was the best player on a shit team for years. His defense is HoF worthy but his overall career offensives numbers are not. He is one of those guys we talked about that if he had a ring or 2 MIGHT get him in but based on what he did he isn't a HoF in my opinion.

He still has a shot at the HoF, maybe in 20 years he gets in as a manager?!

his numbers werent there cause injuries. thats what i was sayin before. Im one of the people who dont knock a guy for time missed on injuries. the time he was playin healthy, he most certainly was putting up HOF numbers. thats why he is in for me.

I understand alot of people say you need the longevity and cant have been hurt alot. I just dont think that way.