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Old 04-05-2012, 11:32 AM   #51
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The DLC is free. But all it does is clarify the pile of dog shit that they call an ending
Yes, like I said, fucked either way. What people want is to download a ball licking apology, have $60 mailed back to them, and then see Bioware jump em masse into a volcano on Waponi Woo. And that's so they can then say "See, I told you so, I could run one of these companies so much better."
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Old 04-05-2012, 12:28 PM   #52
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I think people are pissed off and rightly so because EA has been on the forefront of the whole DLC and nickle and diming people who buy there product.

The Javin thing for instance is really ballsy in that from what I have read the content is on the disk when bought, you are paying to just unlock it

DLC should expand and enhance what I worry about is companies making a game then removing aspects and charging for the so called extra content later it just seems wrong

And Bioware doesnt need to clarify the ME 3 ending they need to change it entirely
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Old 04-05-2012, 12:33 PM   #53
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Did anyone maintain a romance with Liara through the 3 games? from what I read and talked about with others she was the uncommon choice with people mostly choosing Ash or Tali

I dont see how you would choose anyone but Liara but still just asking
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Old 04-05-2012, 12:44 PM   #54
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I think people are pissed off and rightly so because EA has been on the forefront of the whole DLC and nickle and diming people who buy there product.

The Javin thing for instance is really ballsy in that from what I have read the content is on the disk when bought, you are paying to just unlock it

DLC should expand and enhance what I worry about is companies making a game then removing aspects and charging for the so called extra content later it just seems wrong

And Bioware doesnt need to clarify the ME 3 ending they need to change it entirely
DLC is a fine line, but if you dont feel short changed that the game on the disk cost what it did I dont see hwo you can be mad that the entire time they planned to release DLC. The fact that they developed it from early on makes the DLC better. They said 'what tells this story the way we want to tell it, what amount of gameplay is worth what we will ask for this game.' and they chopped out what's extra and I'm fine with that.

It's mathimatical, how many playing hours were ME:1 and 2? Does ME:3 compare? If so you didn't get short changed just because the company has something optional to sell you.
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Old 04-05-2012, 09:10 PM   #55
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Yeah, the response from Bioware I was hoping for wasn't a longer version of their shitty fucking ending. I'm not interested.
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Old 04-06-2012, 05:51 PM   #56
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The fucking line for the panel was so long that even getting there an hour early didn't get me in. I hope I can read about it online
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Old 04-06-2012, 10:16 PM   #57
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The fucking line for the panel was so long that even getting there an hour early didn't get me in. I hope I can read about it online
The most interesting thing that happened was that they refused to put down the indoctrination theory. Other than that, nothing.
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Old 04-07-2012, 12:43 AM   #58
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still playing. love exploding head shots.
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Old 04-07-2012, 06:42 AM   #59
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Did anyone maintain a romance with Liara through the 3 games? from what I read and talked about with others she was the uncommon choice with people mostly choosing Ash or Tali

I dont see how you would choose anyone but Liara but still just asking
Tali
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Old 04-09-2012, 07:35 AM   #60
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I watched a youtube video on why Shepard was Indoctrinated...... whatever

The point is wasn't ME 3 supposed to be the end of the Shepard story?

I expect DLC but I thought it would be stuff like what happened on Earth with Anderson
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Old 04-23-2012, 08:48 AM   #61
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From a story telling standpoint I like how the game ended. It really ends that shit, like for real. It's kindof ironic that people get their hackles up over DLC when the end of the game pretty much slaps the shackles on what they'll ever be able to do with ME from here on out.

I do understand frustration that all of the endings are essentially the same. My instinct is to want more endings so I can be told the story in different ways. But in a recent review of another game Yahtzee makes a really good point, if you're just going to fuck around and change the ending and the history and all that does the story you're telling really mean anything? Does it have any value or risk if I can just boot a save and totally get the opposite outcome 5 minutes after I finish the game?

I think there's a subtle grey area maybe they could've dug around in a little more, which they just sortof hinted at. Is Shephard doing the right thing by stopping the reapers? It will stop the lower species from developing. Are the salarians, who were tadpoles when the protheans were wiped out, all that upset that the protheans didn't finish the crucible and beat the reapers? At their most evolved the species are capable of their most evil. You find out the protheans werent a race of super evolved, benevolent beings. Your own cycle has participated in the genophage and depending on your decisions a geth holocaust.

I think people wanted a return to the status quo. They want things to go back to being how they were before the reapers, which is impossible. That's why the conflict is good in the story, you can only move forward. Every story you see where the goal is to get back to where you were before the conflict happened is about moving backwards and isn't worth telling.

The overarching tropes of Shephard are sacrifice, dedication, and dealing with tough decisions. Thats what the ending is about. As to your decisions not mattering, I dont think this is a fair assessment. Your combat readiness and your paragon/renegade score impact your options through the game and at the end. I didn't have all three outcomes open to me and I had conversation choices locked off with the illusive man.

I can understand how someone might have wished the ending to a really great game trilogy was a little different but allow that the ending is not the game and you have 3 really fantastic games filled with really good story and character to play, what I dont understand in the slightest is the rage. Buncha nerd babies.
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Old 04-23-2012, 10:30 AM   #62
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Buncha nerd babies.
That sums it up quite well. The loudest complaints about this game are from the same type of people who cry that Michael Bay and George Lucas are raping their childhood. They'll never be satisfied with any outcome because they live just to bitch about one thing or another in their beloved franchises that are so terrible to them, yet they still will pay for the DLC.
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Old 04-23-2012, 11:12 AM   #63
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That sums it up quite well. The loudest complaints about this game are from the same type of people who cry that Michael Bay and George Lucas are raping their childhood. They'll never be satisfied with any outcome because they live just to bitch about one thing or another in their beloved franchises that are so terrible to them, yet they still will pay for the DLC.
I think even those people have a little more to work off of, because atleast that's something that existed before and is just being exploited for name recognition instead of coming up with a new idea. This is an original idea so acting like they've somehow been wreckless with their own idea is just insane.




I had not watched the indoctrination theory, which makes sense and I have to say pushes me from 'was fine with the ending' to 'the ending is an amazing acheivment in active storytelling.'
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Old 04-23-2012, 12:52 PM   #64
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From a story telling standpoint I like how the game ended. It really ends that shit, like for real. It's kindof ironic that people get their hackles up over DLC when the end of the game pretty much slaps the shackles on what they'll ever be able to do with ME from here on out.

I do understand frustration that all of the endings are essentially the same. My instinct is to want more endings so I can be told the story in different ways. But in a recent review of another game Yahtzee makes a really good point, if you're just going to fuck around and change the ending and the history and all that does the story you're telling really mean anything? Does it have any value or risk if I can just boot a save and totally get the opposite outcome 5 minutes after I finish the game?

I think there's a subtle grey area maybe they could've dug around in a little more, which they just sortof hinted at. Is Shephard doing the right thing by stopping the reapers? It will stop the lower species from developing. Are the salarians, who were tadpoles when the protheans were wiped out, all that upset that the protheans didn't finish the crucible and beat the reapers? At their most evolved the species are capable of their most evil. You find out the protheans werent a race of super evolved, benevolent beings. Your own cycle has participated in the genophage and depending on your decisions a geth holocaust.

I think people wanted a return to the status quo. They want things to go back to being how they were before the reapers, which is impossible. That's why the conflict is good in the story, you can only move forward. Every story you see where the goal is to get back to where you were before the conflict happened is about moving backwards and isn't worth telling.

The overarching tropes of Shephard are sacrifice, dedication, and dealing with tough decisions. Thats what the ending is about. As to your decisions not mattering, I dont think this is a fair assessment. Your combat readiness and your paragon/renegade score impact your options through the game and at the end. I didn't have all three outcomes open to me and I had conversation choices locked off with the illusive man.

I can understand how someone might have wished the ending to a really great game trilogy was a little different but allow that the ending is not the game and you have 3 really fantastic games filled with really good story and character to play, what I dont understand in the slightest is the rage. Buncha nerd babies.
Having a conversation option blocked off is a dynamic ending based on your choices over the course of 3 games and 7 years, it's having a choice blocked because you didn't get enough of a paragon/renegade score in this game. Aside from that the bigger issue is that
they only difference between the 3 endings is the color of the explosion
. That's not the "your choices matter" ending they promised but failed to deliver. Which is a shame because the rest of the series, and even most of ME3 was insanely well written.
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Old 04-23-2012, 03:20 PM   #65
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Having a conversation option blocked off is a dynamic ending based on your choices over the course of 3 games and 7 years, it's having a choice blocked because you didn't get enough of a paragon/renegade score in this game. Aside from that the bigger issue is that
they only difference between the 3 endings is the color of the explosion
. That's not the "your choices matter" ending they promised but failed to deliver. Which is a shame because the rest of the series, and even most of ME3 was insanely well written.
But you couldn't have endings that rely on you having played all three games and still having your save. People would flip shit if the game withheld content that could only be unlocked by franchise long saves.

If we're to believe the indoctrination video, and I think it's plausible, the endings were visually similar but hugely different. Maybe the cinematics they release will help satisfy this for you.

But decisions between saves did change gameplay. I started a new campaign because I wanted to play a different class, which I later regretted because I saved everyone at the end of ME 2 and did not run into them in ME 3, because they were dead. Now I'm going back to replay from my save because I want to get those interactions I missed.
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Old 04-23-2012, 04:13 PM   #66
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But you couldn't have endings that rely on you having played all three games and still having your save. People would flip shit if the game withheld content that could only be unlocked by franchise long saves.

If we're to believe the indoctrination video, and I think it's plausible, the endings were visually similar but hugely different. Maybe the cinematics they release will help satisfy this for you.

But decisions between saves did change gameplay. I started a new campaign because I wanted to play a different class, which I later regretted because I saved everyone at the end of ME 2 and did not run into them in ME 3, because they were dead. Now I'm going back to replay from my save because I want to get those interactions I missed.
Yes you can, particularly when Bioware always marketed the games as just that, a trilogy where the choices you make in every game determine the final outcome.

ME2 had DLC (free) that simulated the choices from ME1 for your save. Similarly if you start a new save in ME3 it asks you questions to set the important things from ME1 & 2. The indoctrination video isn't something BW put out, it's fans reaching blindly for some kind of deeper meaning to the rushed mess of the ending. That's the real reason for all of this, the old creative lead left in the middle of this game (hence the awesome Quarian/Geth & Genophage storylines being mixed in with the nonsensical Miranda storyline) and EA was pushing to get a product out the door with a new creative lead, that's really it. If the indoctrination videos turn out to be true it's only because Bioware watched them and decided that was a better idea for an ending than they had.
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Old 04-23-2012, 04:24 PM   #67
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More than any of that what bugged me was the fact that all of that running around and gathering war assets amounted to nothing more than a sum that set whether or not a conversation choice was available at the end. Hell, the rachni almost destroyed the entire galaxy at one point you before the krogran were uplifted to kill them into extinction, so after I found a queen, brought them back from extinction only to get a single email about them later in the game and that's it, you would think I would have seen them fighting in the last level, or the primes that aligned with me, or Samara, or any one of the war assets I spent the entire game recruiting. But instead we got nothing, literally no difference, they did a shitty, shitty job with the ending.

That said, the remaining 90% of the game was really great, and I'm enjoying the multiplayer, they did that stuff perfectly IMO.
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Old 04-23-2012, 04:33 PM   #68
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On one level, the indoctrination theory is interesting. But I think it's only interesting IN CONTRAST to the poorly thought out regular ending. The main point it has in its favor is that, unlike the actual ending, it actually follows from some central, genuine themes throughout the games, unlike the unconnected and pulled out of the ass feeling from the real ending.

But it comes with a gigantic point against it: IT IS NOT AN ENDING. If it was actually true the game ended when running towards conduit, or perhaps earlier or later depending what version of he theory you believe. It actually magnifies some of the worst faults of the real ending. Instead of having no clue what happens to most of your companions, the fleets surrounding earth and not knowing why the Normandy is high tailing its way far away from you, you have nothing. You don't know what happened to them, how the war ends, if the war ends, who survives, who dies, there's nothing. No closure whatsoever.

Unless they finished it with more DLC, which sets an EVEN WORSE precedent. You have a developer shipping one of the biggest games of the year without an ending, and perhaps even charging for it later. There's a big enough problem with shit being stripped out of games and sold as DLC. We don't need to have that start happening with endings.
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Old 04-24-2012, 08:46 AM   #69
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Yes you can, particularly when Bioware always marketed the games as just that, a trilogy where the choices you make in every game determine the final outcome.

ME2 had DLC (free) that simulated the choices from ME1 for your save. Similarly if you start a new save in ME3 it asks you questions to set the important things from ME1 & 2. The indoctrination video isn't something BW put out, it's fans reaching blindly for some kind of deeper meaning to the rushed mess of the ending. That's the real reason for all of this, the old creative lead left in the middle of this game (hence the awesome Quarian/Geth & Genophage storylines being mixed in with the nonsensical Miranda storyline) and EA was pushing to get a product out the door with a new creative lead, that's really it. If the indoctrination videos turn out to be true it's only because Bioware watched them and decided that was a better idea for an ending than they had.
I think the indocrination theory is too sound to say it's fans 'reaching blindly' or to speculate that Bioware would retcon the game to match up with it. For starts if you could prove you originated the theory which was then appropriated by Bioware you could probably sue their balls off, especially if Bioware couldn't provide scripts, storyboards etc showing that the idea originated with them.

I dont think the point of the game is to wind up with a half hour of cut scenes at the end. That isn't fun at all to me. And there is material there during the participation of the actual events that to me removes the need to revisit it at the end. I dont need to see the Krogan fighting because there was plenty of Krogan story during the Krogan missions etc.

If they were going for subtlety you're in a tight spot. Video games aren't traditionally about subtlety. I do know I felt that the best moral option to choose at the end was maybe not as moral as I originally thought now that I'm sitting with it.
I chose to 'take control' of the reapers which is 1- what I was telling the illusive man is impossible, 2- does not destroy the reapers. It goes against the idea that soliders sacrifice themselves and commanders need to make those decisions (ending all artificial life) which is a feature of your own and 2 or 3 other characters archs. And there's also using the language 'ascending' and the decidedly christ like imagery of that ending. Even considering that the game could have 'indoctrinated' me as a player have made me enjoy the ending 10 x more than most other games.
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Old 05-26-2012, 10:45 AM   #70
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Just finished playing both Mass Effect 2 and 3 back to back, and I must say both games are fantastic. Easily one of the greatest games I ever played. As far as the ending goes for ME3, I thought it was okaaay, but definitely wasn't great way to end the game's story. I would've preferred some kind of epilogue. Hopefully the DLC extended cut will be just that.
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Old 06-15-2012, 07:22 PM   #71
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I forget about how much the ending of this game pissed me off, only to occasionally remember it, and get all pissed off again

It's summer, where's the DLC?
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Old 06-15-2012, 07:36 PM   #72
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I forget about how much the ending of this game pissed me off, only to occasionally remember it, and get all pissed off again

It's summer, where's the DLC?
I agree I must have replayed ME2 5 or 6 times, I have yet to replay ME3
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Old 06-22-2012, 01:12 PM   #73
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June 26th

http://www.masseffect.com/about/extended_cut/
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Old 06-22-2012, 01:20 PM   #74
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I'm so prepared for more disappointment that I almost don't want to even play it. But I will.
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Old 06-22-2012, 01:23 PM   #75
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I'm so prepared for more disappointment that I almost don't want to even play it. But I will.
It's almost 2gigs so I guess it will at least be pretty involved
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