Do You Believe in God?

[reeshy]

I know I do ...I was brought up a Roman Catholic, as my parents and grandparents were....I know you are a product of your upbringing.

With that said, I truly believe that there is a God....I have sought solace in his words over the years and I have also seen people change through him.


I'm not a Bible thumper nor a a streetcorner preacher...I was simply a NYC civil servant who has seen God in action...I have seen people in homacidal rages calm down when God's name was mentioned...I have seen people dying in the hosptal come back to life!!!


Do any of you believe in God?

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[Bama]

I think it's better to believe and be wrong then to not believe and be wrong.

Athiesm is for people who are bad at statistics.

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[canofsoup15]

No.

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[Lumber]

I`m also a filthy fornicator

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[HBox]

I think it's better to believe and be wrong then to not believe and be wrong.

Then I'll pose a question: Can one actually choose to believe?

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[McNabbShouldDie]

Yeah, I believe.

Not much more to say.

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[NewYorkDragons80]

Absolutely. To deny the existence of God is tantamount to saying that if all pieces of a clock are laid out on a blanket and thrown in the air, eventually, you will have a fully assembled, fully functioning clock.

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[ChickenHawk]

Yes.

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[IrishAlkey]

[quote]I think it's better to believe and be wrong then to not believe and be wrong.

Then I'll pose a question: Can one actually choose to believe?

Yes.

The definition of choice inherently implies that there are options you may or may not feel compelled to believe. Your cranky, tired-of-life replies to most topics is gay and you should just buy some rope and a step stool and put the rest of this board out of its misery.

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[reeshy]

The definition of choice i


Choice is what God gave you in the first place!!

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[SatCam]

In short... no.

And as long as we're making blank statements, if you believe in God you're dumb.

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[reeshy]

And as long as we're making blank statements, if you believe in God you're dumb


You just proved to me that you're a high school asshole...thanks for insulting me SatCam!!

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[Reephdweller]

I believe in God, though many times I question my faith. I was also raised as a Roman Catholic. Though I'm not a devout follower of the church.



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[TheMojoPin]

I believe there's something out there that's some kind of higher power.

I don't know if he/she/it listens or even cares about us.

They might even be a righteous asshole. All the prayer stuff, if that's what they want, seems kinda egotistical for an all-powerful being.

Whatever it is, it's out there.

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1979 << December boys got it BAD >> "You can tell some lies about the good times we've had, but I've kissed your mother twice...and now I'm working on your dad..."

[fiestygal]

i think that is a very personal question-



but YES i do

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Its time to party.... Italian Style

[fluffernutter]

What do you mean, "I don't believe in God"?
I talk to him every day.


Just simply said, yes, I believe. I also believe in prayer as well.

Questions like this are a very fine line because as Fiesty said, it is quite personal. The last thing I would want to see is a beating down of those who believe and those who don't. A you should do this or you should do that kind of thing. Seems pretty civil so far so hopefully the sensitivity of this issue (if it is sensitive at all) can be respected and finger pointing and name calling can be avoided. I have just seen religious/political threads derail badly here before.


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[reeshy]

think that is a very personal question-


then why did you answer it...this is a message board for christ's sake...hey I just made a joke!!!

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[ADF]

Not in the slightest.

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[badorties]

don't really care one way or another ...



<img src="http://scripts.cgispy.com/image.cgi?u=badorties"><br>

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[Mike Teacher]

don't really care one way or another ...


I had hope with the thread title, but seeing the direction it went, thats how I feel...

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[furie]

yes i do. i was brought up roman catholic and I'm a bit of a foundationist.


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[FollowThisLogic]

Absolutely. To deny the existence of God is tantamount to saying that if all pieces of a clock are laid out on a blanket and thrown in the air, eventually, you will have a fully assembled, fully functioning clock.
If you had pieces from trillions upon trillions of clocks, and repeatedly threw them around for 13 billion years.... yes, eventually you would end up with a working clock.

That being said, my answer is no.

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[Furtherman]

You cannot choose where you are born.

The spiritual direction you are given as you grow takes root in your mind, just as it did your parents and their parents before.

That is why there are so many gods and religions.

Look back in history and you'll find that any god was all a nice story to spread a little fear and a little hope to keep people under control. There is no basis, there is no proof and it is not logical.

Man created god.

But if it helps you through the day - cheers!

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[Yerdaddy]

My higher power is Al Roker's taint.

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Fuck it from behind.

[blakjeezis]

To deny the existence of God is tantamount to saying that if all pieces of a clock are laid out on a blanket and thrown in the air, eventually, you will have a fully assembled, fully functioning clock.

Oh man, I live for this stuff. In an infinite universe with infinite clock parts, by definition, it has to happen. Not just once, but an infinite number of times. That is the nature of infinity. But I think that to not at least believe in some kind of underlying, universal intelligence is a little shortsighted.

The real problem is that science and religion, more specifically a huge majority of the people who practice each discipline, think the 2 are mutually exclusive. The universe is made up of both concrete and abstract, real(HA HA!) and imagined. Every scientist and, let's just say, religionist is searching for THE TRUTH. I don't know if there's some guy in robes in the sky, but I do firmly believe that eventually both disciplines will intersect at the ultimate answer.

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This message was edited by blakjeezis on 7-31-04 @ 12:43 PM

[DarkHippie]

I'm not really sure what I believe. Every time I come up with a good theory, I disprove it and try to come up with a better one.

Maybe then, the highest power is Thought itself.

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[blakjeezis]

http://www.detnews.com/pix/2001/09/28/e01tenaciousd.jpg

I believe . . . I believe in God . . . I believe in God.

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[HBox]

Yes.

The definition of choice inherently implies that there are options you may or may not feel compelled to believe. Your cranky, tired-of-life replies to most topics is gay and you should just buy some rope and a step stool and put the rest of this board out of its misery.

What the fuck was that about!? I wasn't trying to attack anyone else's religion here. I was just asking a damn question. In my personal view, you can't choose to believe. Sure, I could go to church everyday. I could practice a religion perfectly. But I just don't BELIEVE. And, IMO, that means I'd be a fraud. I was just confronting Bama's way of making choosing Belief as a logical choice. I was not accusing him of believing because of that; I don't know. And I don't have some superior attidtude that people who believe are stupid. I've met people far smarter than I who believe. I ditched that stupid stereotype a while ago.

If you knew what I had to live through, and what my future looks like, and what my damn mental state is on most days, you'd avoid those suicide comments.

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[ChickenHawk]

What do you mean, "I don't believe in God"?
I talk to him every day.
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This message was edited by ChickenHawk on 7-31-04 @ 2:35 PM

[TheMojoPin]

"Hello, ME! It's ME again!"

Dave seems a little confused...

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1979 << December boys got it BAD >> "You can tell some lies about the good times we've had, but I've kissed your mother twice...and now I'm working on your dad..."

[fezident]

I don't believe in God because I dont believe in Magic.

If there WAS a magical being with magic powers there wouldnt be so many horrible horrible things happening to innocent humans and animals. The suffering that happens to some of the living things on this planet would not be permitted by a benevolent (sp?) being with infinite power.

I do respect those that think otherwise. It's clearly a personal issue.
Thanks.

Fez 4 Prez!!

[bigbaldirish]

god is what you make "it/him/her"
God is whatever you believe and have faith in.
if your an atheist you have faith in yourself. your god.
christian of any sect- you have faith that jesus will lead you to god.
if you believe that science will find the meaning of life (which is a silly belief to have, considering if there was no god, there would be no meaning) science is god.

even true satanists, believe that satan is god.
true satanists do not believe in the dark evil satan. satanists follow a book very similar to the bible.



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[sleepyeyed_Jynx]

There is a God, his son, Jesus is coming back soon. Accept Jesus and turn away from sin. That's all I have to say.

Jesus - The Source of my Strength!
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[Yerdaddy]

What if David Koresh really was Jesus and Janet Reno killed him? Wouldn't we feel stupid!

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Fuck it from behind.

This message was edited by Yerdaddy on 7-31-04 @ 10:20 PM

[SatCam]

I don't believe in God because although without a God there are so many unanswered questions (like how were people created) when you add a God into the equation you may answer those questions but you add even more!
Like: does God exist on other planets or universes?
is heavan's location relative to the earth?
how does one get into heavan (or hell)?

If beliefs differs from religion to religion, it then makes people point fingers saying "hey, you're wrong!" Obviously God can never be proven if everyone has differing opinions. It may be comforting to believe in something, but I'd rather leave those questions unanswered rather than putting in outrageous impossible answers (like "some guy in the sky waved his wand and Earth was created")

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[Tazz]

There is a God, his son, Jesus is coming back soon. Accept Jesus and turn away from sin. That's all I have to say.


It has been 2000 years. Where the F is he? It's all bullshit. Besides, the last minute confession will save us anyway.



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[sr71blackbird]

I believe in God, but I have a bit of a twist in my belief. See, I imagine God as being everything we are not, and since our existance is predicated on reality, I dont "require" God to exist in order to be real. I also dont "require" God to be male or female, but rather both and neither at once. I figure this gives God even more power, as a truly omnipotant being would have to be in order to be God.

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[Duke]

i belive in god

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[A.J.]

I can't decide between Zeus or Jupiter.

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[Iamnotatool]

No, but I believe in Alannis Morrisette

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[grlNIN]

Yes.

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[Aggie]

Yes, I do. It's my choice and I'm a better person because of it in my opinion.

I don't mind talking about religion for those who ask me but it's so frustrating that nowadays this topic can almost instantly start a yelling match. Can't we just have an intelligent discussion?? I'm just talking in general but that is usually what ends up happening here too.

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[SatCam]

I don't mind talking about religion for those who ask me but it's so frustrating that nowadays this topic can almost instantly start a yelling match. Can't we just have an intelligent discussion??

NO!!!! No no non nonon ono nono!!111!!!1!!!!! go to heck!!!!1111!1!!!!2111!!!1!!!!!!2@@22!!!!!!!11!

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[FollowThisLogic]

I don't mind talking about religion for those who ask me but it's so frustrating that nowadays this topic can almost instantly start a yelling match. Can't we just have an intelligent discussion??
Most religious people can't.

But I've always got to question someone's logical thought skills when they think that some big dude in the sky got up one day, stretched his big ol god-arms and decided hey, I'm bored, I'm gonna make a planet today.

I question the logic of people who think evolution is a sham and the world is TWELVE THOUSAND years old. Not that you're necessarily one. But if you don't believe that... and they do.... they're reading the same book you are. Shouldn't there be one definite answer?

Which reminds me.... I've really got to question the logic of people who build a belief structure around a fictional book written 2000 years ago as a way to explain things that people just did not have the knowledge to be able to explain on their own. And while they're at it, they decided to impose what they believed was right and wrong, by scaring people into believing that the same big guy who had all the power to create the things that they couldn't explain any other way, would severely punish you if you didn't follow their way.

BTW, eating meat on Friday is a mortal sin. You're going to hell. :)

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This message was edited by FollowThisLogic on 8-2-04 @ 10:38 PM

[ChickenHawk]

Wait, but FollowThisLogic, I don't follow your logic. So, because evolution is true and most religions are shitty, there's no God? I don't see the correlation.

Religion, science, and God have nothing to do with each other. One does not prove or disprove the other.

Yes, evolution occured.
Yes, religion can be destructive.

But those two things have nothing to do with the question of whether or not God exists.

It seems I see too many people saying "Oh, come on. Religions cause war, and there's that whole evolution thing, so God can't exist."

...makes no sense.

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[keithy_19]

BTW, eating meat on Friday is a mortal sin. You're going to hell.


I know this was in jest, but a lot of things in the Catholic relgion are more tradion then spirtual. I don't believe it says anything in the Bible about not eating meat on friday.

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The things I would do to her...

[grlNIN]

I know this was in jest, but a lot of things in the Catholic relgion are more tradion then spirtual. I don't believe it says anything in the Bible about not eating meat on friday.


Code of Canon Law was officially made in 1983:

Canon 1251 Abstinence from eating meat or another food according to the prescriptions of the conference of bishops is to be observed on Fridays throughout the year unless they are solemnities; abstinence and fast are to be observed on Ash Wednesday and on the Friday of the Passion and Death of Our Lord Jesus Christ.


The law of abstinence starts when a Catholic turns 14 until they die, to forgo meat on every Friday of the year and once they turn 18((law of fasting starts)) to fast from then on(not completely cut food out of their diet but minimize intake as a whole).

Wow, church really did teach me stuff.

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[TheMojoPin]

You better have been wearing a plaid jumper when you typed all that.

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[Melrapuo]

I want to, but sometimes I get the feeling that it wouldn't make sense if it were true. So I'm caught in the middle.

A lotta Roman Catholics. I feel alone as a Lutheran.

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[Late2party]

I feel alone as a Lutheran.

Quick, someone perk some coffee in the basement.

[Mike Teacher]

I question the logic of people who think evolution is a sham and the world is TWELVE THOUSAND years old.


So do I, but I question everything.

I will say, I don't think that belief in evolution and belief in a God are mutually exclusive.

Gould called science and religion 'non-overlapping magesteria'; which is the five dollar way of saying they don't mix. I disagree.

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[FollowThisLogic]

Disproving god's existence is easy. Because I don't need to.

In order to disprove something, there has to be proof of it first. There's no proof that god exists.

This, I can prove.

Proof of god eliminates the need for faith in god, and without faith, god is nothing.

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[jeffdwright2001]

Disproving god's existence is easy. Because I don't need to.

In order to disprove something, there has to be proof of it first. There's no proof that god exists.

On the other hand, there are folks in China that have no proof that I exist. And yet, I do.


This, I can prove.

Proof of god eliminates the need for faith in god,

A case could be made for this


and without faith, god is nothing.

Not so sure you've made a case for this one though.

Faith (or the lack of it) in something has very little to do with it's validity or substance.

A person can have no faith that a lake covered in 3 feet of ice can support their weight, but it doesn't change the ability of the ice to do so.

Conversely, a person can have all the faith in the world that a lake covered with a 1/4" piece of ice will support them.

Neither amount of faith in the above examples changes the properties of the ice.

Whether or not God exists is not determined by faith, nor (if he exists) does God's intrinsic value change. The thing that changes is our thoughts and perceptions.


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[Mike Teacher]

Not so sure you've made a case for this one though.


Or,

We didnt know what the atom was until less then 100 years ago. In fact, we couldnt prove it's existance. Also, for the vast majority of human time on earth radio, X-rays, all, had Absolutely No proof for them whatsoever.

Well, as said 'there has to be proof of it first' There is no proof Neutrons exist. This was true 100 years ago, no proof, or even evidence, or it.

If science follows it's path, it will find new energies and forms of matter that as now we are Utterly aware of, and have absolutely Zero evidence for. Do these not exist, even though there is no proof of them?

This would be a valid Q to ask, say anyone alive 200 years ago as to said radio, X-rays. and they did exist then. Jupiter is a frickin Radio Subwoofer.



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This message was edited by Mike Teacher on 8-3-04 @ 9:10 AM

[SatCam]

Fact is, if you have time to think about if God exists, you have time to go to church on Sundays. I don't have that kind of time.

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[FollowThisLogic]

Not so sure you've made a case for this one though.

Faith (or the lack of it) in something has very little to do with it's validity or substance.

Hebrews 11:6
"And without faith it is impossible to please God, because anyone who comes to Him must believe that He exists and that He rewards those who earnestly seek Him."

Time to re-think your point when your own book disproves you.

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[Zipgun]

God needs your money
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This message was edited by skidmark on 8-3-04 @ 8:34 PM

[FUNKMAN]

i'll truly believe in him when he officially introduces himself with a handshake, smile, and a 'how you doing?'...

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[jeffdwright2001]

Not so sure you've made a case for this one though.

Faith (or the lack of it) in something has very little to do with it's validity or substance.

Hebrews 11:6
"And without faith it is impossible to please God, because anyone who comes to Him must believe that He exists and that He rewards those who earnestly seek Him."

Time to re-think your point when your own book disproves you.

I think you misunderstood me (or more likely, I put forth a poor effort of communicating my thoughts). My comment was directed towards the idea that God's existence isn't validated by someone's belief.

The scripture you quoted speaks to a person's "salvation" in relation to their belief in God and their subsequent efforts to seek him out.

I use the term "seek out" because in this instance the greek word used isn't the normal one used for seek - zeteo - but rather a compound word - ekzeteo - which is a more intense version meaning to seek out. At first it seems a minor distinction, but zeteo is often used when dealing with things that are more abstract in nature such as joy, bliss, or contentment. But ekzeteo is used when you are seeking something that is tangible/concrete, such as a lost sheep or loved one.

In the first instance, you are seeking something that is elusive (or even non existent), but in the second instance, what you are seeking IS, but hasn't necessarily been found.

I'll stand by my statement that IF there is a God, then his existence does not hinge on someone's faith or belief in the deity, any more than my existence is determined by whether or not you believe I am real.

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Thanks to Reefy for the sigpic!

[Mike Teacher]

I think you misunderstood me (or more likely, I put forth a poor effort of communicating my thoughts). My comment was directed towards the idea that God's existence isn't validated by someone's belief.


It wasn't you Jeff. I read your post and it was quite clear; Belief in something doesn't make it so. And disbelief in something does not make it not so. What a bible quote on salvation has to do with that? Beats me.



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[reeshy]

What a bible quote on salvation has to do with that? Beats me.


Maybe because any quote from the Bible is inspired by God...or so I believe!!!!

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[center]I know karate....voodoo too!![center]

[Mike Teacher]

Well that could beg the question as to which bible; as there are several dozen major versions and hundreds of others. If it's the KJV, what might be inspired by God was what was allowed to be translated and printed in 1611. Tynsdale tried an English translation before that; the church didn;t like it, so, they burned him to death.

There's the KJV, the NIV, New Revised Standard Edition, The Living Bible...

There is much debate in the church as to which books even belong in the bible, some argue the Apocrypha belongs, others said no.

the church also punted with the authors. The Gospel authors are second century guesses by the Church.



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[reeshy]

Well that could beg the question as to which bible; as there are several dozen major versions and hundreds of others. If it's the KJV, what might be inspired by God was what was allowed to be translated and printed in 1611. Tynsdale tried an English translation before that; the church didn;t like it, so, they burned him to death. There's the KJV, the NIV, New Revised Standard Edition, The Living Bible... There is much debate in the church as to which books even belong in the bible, some argue the Apocrypha belongs, others said no. the church also punted with the authors. The Gospel authors are second century guesses by the Church.


Mike,

I can see you don't beleive..I do...let's leave it at that..no one wins these arguments!

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[center]I know karate....voodoo too!![center]

[Mike Teacher]

I can see you don't beleive..


Completely and utterly incorrect. I'll add here if you think I'm an atheist or something; my shelves groan with those different bibles, and the list of books on biblical study, incuding those by theologans, and books on comparative religions? With hand-written notes in margins? That to me, if I didnt know the person, like someone who feels a resonance with the subject matter, and is eager to see where this exploration might take them.

I too was raised in the Roman Catholic religion. Baptized, Religious studies after school, CCD, Communion, Confirmation, and married in a church by a Deacon, by my choosing. I insisted on the church, and chose the Bible readings.

I take my middle name from he who is popularly called the person who created the christian religion.

=

And maybe it's arguing for you. For me, I'm discussing it in a friendly fashion. :)

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This message was edited by Mike Teacher on 8-4-04 @ 10:27 AM

[jeffdwright2001]

Mike,

I can see you don't beleive..I do...let's leave it at that..no one wins these arguments!

Wow. I don't see how that connection was made.

There are several different "versions" of the Bible being used by individuals in both Catholic and Protestant churches by their members.

How does Mike's comments concerning versions (and even iterations of the KJV) speak to his belief or disbelief?

It's one thing to be sure of one's own beliefs, it's presumptuous to be sure of someone else's.

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Thanks to Reefy for the sigpic!

[FUNKMAN]

though i walk in the valley of darkness, i shall fear no evil...

unless I'm in LA at like 3 in the morning...

<img src="http://www.grandfunkrailroad.com/images/mdm100.gif">

[reeshy]

It's one thing to be sure of one's own beliefs, it's presumptuous to be sure of someone else's.


if you have ever readany of his other answer's in other threads...he's always contrary to the belief system!

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[center]I know karate....voodoo too!![center]

[reeshy]

my shelves groan with those different bibles, and the list of books on biblical study, incuding those by theologans, and books on comparative religions? With hand-written notes in margins?


I'm really impressed!! I just have the one book!!

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This message was edited by reeshy on 8-4-04 @ 11:18 AM

[Furtherman]

The human mind is hardwired to accept beliefs that are molded into our young minds. Every child at one time or another believes in far away tales of magic and wonder that comes alive to them in a book or a story told by a kind grandparent or loving parent at bedtime.

Those warm memories stay with us our whole lives. Who doesn't smile when you think of those Christmas Eves you listened for sleigh bells? Or when Hanukkah drew near a time for celebrating was close?

These feelings and memories exist in our minds yet the human conscience can see them outside the physical body... when you daydream or are deep in thought, you can feel like you are there again. The notion surrounds you.

But it is all invisible. It's not really there. You can feel it, maybe even smell and taste the memories. Our ego places this outside our body, a feeling that our intelligence can exist outside.

The same is with the god notion. We create this picture, this memory in our mind of an all powerful being, told to us when we are young - with some powerful rules - screws - that are latched onto our young minds and held in place. I still have those screws in place in my mind, even though I fully know that if I were born in a different place, even around the corner, I would not have these same beliefs.

We see god as something bigger than us. An intelligent entity, with a plan for all its children. We look up into the sky and feel that something is looking back at us.

What you feel in your mind, your heart, is little electromagnetic pulses from your brain, nothing more. A feeling of peace, warmth, and being loved - your brain, nothing more.

But it is a good thing - it helps millions across this speck in the universe live a good life.

But it also affects millions more, who put those electromagnetic pulse before another human being's feelings.



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...with thanks to JustJon

[Mike Teacher]

if you have ever readany of his other answer's in other threads...he's always contrary to the belief system!


incorrect yet again. Instead of making others go read my past posts, you seem to be interested enough to be following them closely, so copy and paste a few example. Me, I'm gonna get back to the discussion, instead of having the thread descend into personal attacks.

As to being contrary to 'the' belief system, I didn't know there was only one.

Anyway... I'm getting back to the fun debate

=





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This message was edited by Mike Teacher on 8-4-04 @ 8:09 PM