I didn't defend my country today

[Judge Smails]

<p>I had free tickets to the Nets-Pacers game today so I thought it would be a good idea to have a multi-generational outing so I took my dad, my 7 year old son and 5 year old daughter.&nbsp; Let me preface my story by stating that I'm not racist and I'm trying hard to raise my kids the same way.&nbsp; My dad on the other hand makes Archie Bunker look like Michael Moore.&nbsp; He's the classic red stater, Hannity/O'Reilly/Limbaugh fan.&nbsp; Turns out, he wasn't too happy to be going to the game and only did it to spend time with the grandkids.&nbsp; In retrospect it wasn't such a good idea to bring him on Martin Luther King day either, as the crowd was even more African-American than usual and every other time out was a MLK tribute.&nbsp; I can only describe the people sitting in front of us as seeming pissed at the world.&nbsp; They seemed angry throughout the entire game and barely even spoke to each other.&nbsp; The only time they even applauded was during a Showtime at the Apollo talent show that they did at half-time.</p><p>So, it's time for the national anthem and this group in front of us does not stand.&nbsp; There's two guys, on either end, in their twenties wearing ball caps that they also did not remove, a girl in her twenties, three kids in the 8-13 age range, and a big momma type (not being racist - just trying to paint a picture).&nbsp; Right off the bat, my dad looks pissed to all hell.&nbsp; Out of the whole fucking arena that seemed to be standing, these people have to be sitting right in front of my dad of all people.&nbsp; My dad is seething.&nbsp; It's one of those real long national anthems too (like the Simpsons' baseball episode).&nbsp; He motions to me that he's going to say something to them.&nbsp; Ordinarily I'm not averse to having a confrontation at a game but I have my kids with me and this is not the type of confrontation I want to have, particulary not in front of them.&nbsp; So, I give my dad a dirty look and tell him to chill out.&nbsp; He's pissed at me for the rest of the game and barely talks to me the rest of the night.&nbsp; My kids pick up on the bad vibes and the whole family outing thing is shot to hell.</p><p>I keep&nbsp; running it through my head but I can't think of how I might have handled it differently.&nbsp; It was a no win situation any way I look at it.</p><p>&nbsp;</p>

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[TheQuestion]

I think you did the right thing. You were there for your kids, not your country. No need to have them see grandpa and maybe even daddy get in a scrap.

As far as the people not standing for the anthem, I don't condone it but it is their right. I wouldn't get too upset about it.

Like my dear old dad always used to say - "A hundred years from now it won't make no difference."

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<font color=black>This message was edited by TheQuestion on 1-16-06 @ 11:21 PM</font>

[HBox]

My first reaction is &quot;who cares?&quot; IMO, it's none of my business and, frankly, I think it would be even more disrespectful to start a fight or confrontation about the national anthem, either during or afterwards, for something as trivial as that anyway.<br />

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[FUNKMAN]

<p>sorry to hear you all couldn't have a good time at the game. not your fault so don't beat yourself up, you had good intentions. it's a tough situation with your dad's way of thinking towards race but i can understand his feelings about how people should show respect towards the national anthem. i think as years pass us by there is gonna be less and less patriotism all around...&nbsp;</p>

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[bobrobot]

IMO, you handled it perfectly! You can't control you're father's emotions, yet you properly influenced his potentially inappropriate behavior!

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[Judge Smails]

<p>Thanks for the support,&nbsp;all.&nbsp; I'd mentioned to my father afterwards that they had the right to act anyway they wanted during the anthem.&nbsp; So he shoots back that he should have the right to speak his mind and let them know what he thinks about it and that I stood up for the rights of strangers over my own father and what an example I set for my kids, yada yada yada.&nbsp; </p><p>Having lived with my dad my whole life, I know what to expect.&nbsp; I'm still bummed that it pretty much ruined the game for me and my kids, to the degree that they were aware that something was up.</p><p>&nbsp;</p>

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[DowntownRazr]

<p>Haven't you heard in Bush's America it's all about fascist gov&nbsp;pukes wiretapping citizens&nbsp;all&nbsp;while calling themselves patriots.</p><p>&nbsp;</p><p>Image over substance these days and people better wake up or your dad will have more to worry about than singing songs at a baseball game.&nbsp; There won't BE an America.</p><p>&nbsp;</p><p>You did the patriotic thing by letting other people do whatever the HELL they wanted to without putting on your jackboots and&nbsp;trying to force them into lockstep.</p>

[Steels]

Considering your children were there it was the only choice you had.&nbsp; Your father even considering a confrontation with his grandchildren there is the most dissapointing event of the day, IMO.&nbsp; I find it to be selfish.&nbsp;

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[A.J.]

<p> They seemed angry throughout the entire game and barely even spoke to each other.&nbsp;</p><p>That's because they weren't in a movie theater.</p>

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Red Sox Nation

[Judge Smails]

<p>Maybe the apple really doesn't fall too far from the tree because I have to be honest&nbsp;and say that, on some level, it did bother me that they didn't stand for the anthem; particularly because I think that the PA announcer made some comment about honoring our service men and women.&nbsp; </p><p>I've had countless heated arguments with my father in the past about the fact that though I'd never burn a flag myself, I believe that it's everyone's right to do it.&nbsp; I think that part of what disturbed me tonight (besides the averted confrontation and resultant ill feelings) was the fact that I had strong mixed emotions over the fact that I believed that these people had the right to do what they&nbsp;did and a gutteral feeling of disgust that I had at the same time.</p>

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[Greggie44]

<p>I'd never burn a flag.&nbsp; They provide so little heat.</p><p>Confronting them wouldn't solved anything.&nbsp; It could have turned into a&nbsp; bad scene and I don't think any minds would have been changed.</p>

I'm not a bad person, I just do bad things.

[Steels]

<font face="Verdana" style="font-size: 9px;">quote:</font><p>&nbsp;</p><font face="Verdana" style="font-size: 9px;">quote:</font> They seemed angry throughout the entire game and barely even spoke to each other. <p>&nbsp;</p><p>That's because they weren't in a movie theater.</p>

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<font color="Red"><strong>Red Sox Nation</strong></font><br />That's really funny.&nbsp; <br />


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[zentraed]

<p>&nbsp;</p><font face="Verdana" style="font-size: 9px;">quote:</font><p>Let me preface my story by stating that I'm not racist and I'm trying hard to raise my kids the same way... the crowd was even more African-American than usual... The only time they even applauded was during a Showtime at the Apollo talent show that they did at half-time.</p><p>So, it's time for the national anthem and this group in front of us does not stand. <br /></p><br />So, where does the fact that they were black come in? Only black people wouldn't stand for the national anthem? If they had been white, would you have let your dad say something to them? Would he have been less angry? I think you get this:<p>&nbsp;</p><p><img width="200" height="304" border="0" src="http://web.newsguy.com/zentraed/ronfez/ani.jpg" />&nbsp;</p>

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[torker]

<font style="font-size: 9px" face="Verdana">quote: </font><p>&nbsp;</p><font style="font-size: 9px" face="Verdana">quote: </font>They seemed angry throughout the entire game and barely even spoke to each other. <p>&nbsp;</p><p>That's because they weren't in a movie theater.</p><p><img src="http://img40.photobucket.com/albums/v124/Canofsoup15/Sigs/AJinDC-Sig.jpg" border="0" /> </p><p>A Skidmark/canofsoup15 production. </p><p><font color="#ff0000"><strong>Red Sox Nation</strong></font> </p><p><br />That's really funny.&nbsp; <br /></p><p>Agreed.</p>

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[bobrobot]

<p><font style="font-size: 9px" face="Verdana">quote: </font></p>So, where does the fact that they were black come in? Only black people wouldn't stand for the national anthem? If they had been white, would you have let your dad say something to them? Would he have been less angry? <p>&nbsp;</p><p><strong><font color="#000099">I think the purpose of acknowledging that they were Black adds an undercurrent of racial tension to the political tension. Sadly, the U.S. IS a segregated society, Blacks &amp; Whites, for all intents &amp; purposes, ARE separate nations, progressively moreso in the older generations of the populace.</font></strong> <br /></p>

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[ShelleBink]

<p>I find it amusing that you brought your somewhat-racist father to a basketball game... not exactly my first choice :oP</p><p>&nbsp;But to go back to the subject at hand, I believe you handled it well and as stated above, because of having your kids there.&nbsp; Hopefully your kids realize the meaning of respect in seeing how this family behaved when asked for a few moments to honor the country they live in.&nbsp; I think starting a confrontation would have been rather useless... after all, its a tradition to stand during the National Anthem.&nbsp; Besides, how can you be confused about it when everyone else in the arena is standing?&nbsp; </p><p>The only remote possibility ((and a minute one at that)) is that they are not American citizens.&nbsp; IMO, I think it woud be okay to not stand during the National Anthem in that case... but it probably still would bug me.<br /></p>

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[kevcala]

<p>&nbsp;</p><font face="Verdana" style="font-size: 9px;">quote:</font><p>&nbsp;Let me preface my story by stating that I'm not racist and I'm trying hard to raise my kids the same way. </p><p>&nbsp;</p><p>He's the classic red stater, Hannity/O'Reilly/Limbaugh fan. </p><p>&nbsp;</p><p>&nbsp;So it's ok to Stereotype every person from Arkansas, but not Africa.</p><p>&nbsp;Don't pussy foot around this whole 'accepting everyone' stance.</p><p>&nbsp;</p><p>&nbsp;</p>

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I'm rolling a big donut,
and a snake wearing a vest . ."

Big Ass #22981

[FUNKMAN]

<p><strong><font color="#000099">I think the purpose of acknowledging that they were Black adds an undercurrent of racial tension to the political tension</font></strong></p><p>this reminded me of a story on Yahoo yesterday. AP had done a poll and determined that blacks were more likely to celebrate Martin Luther King Day than whites. My first reaction was &quot; No Fucking Shit &quot; and questioned why the heck would they even hold a poll on something that was 'fairly' obvious to me. It's almost as if they were looking to create a little tension for no good reason.</p><p>my thoughts are you respect the man and the holiday if you're not black but you're not gonna necessarily &quot;celebrate it&quot;...&nbsp; maybe it's me but i wasn't sure what they were getting at with the poll</p>

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[Bulldogcakes]

<p>&nbsp;</p><font face="Verdana" style="font-size: 9px;">quote:</font><strong><font color="#000099">I think the
purpose of acknowledging that they were Black adds an undercurrent of
racial tension to the political tension. Sadly, the U.S. IS a
segregated society, Blacks &amp; Whites, for all intents &amp;
purposes, ARE separate nations, progressively moreso in the older
generations of the populace.</font></strong> <br />


<br />
<a href="http://www.bobogolem.com"></a><br />Nonsense.
You obviously dont live in NYC, which is increasingly losing
neighborhoods based on ethnicity. Nowadays, a neighborhood might have
half the population of one origin, if that. Whites are moving into
Harlem, Blacks are living wherevever they want to (including formerly
all-white areas) and you can barely get enough Jews to hold prayers on
the Lower East Side. Nobody cares who you are anymore when it comes to
real estate, they're just happy to find anyone who can afford the
prices around here. <br />
<p>&nbsp;</p><p>And where we are segregated, we're SELF segregated. People will
tend to want to live with people they're fimiliar with, so they have
someone they <em>know </em>to complain about. I think that makes for a less interesting life, but thats their loss. <br />
</p>

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"Never argue with an idiot. They drag you down to their level and beat you with experience." - Anon

[Furtherman]

<p>Do you know why you are white?</p><p>Because&nbsp;your black ancestors left Africa, migrated to Europe and an ice age trapped your ancestors in Western Europe for thousands of years.&nbsp; </p><p>&nbsp;</p><p>But as for the game... you did the right thing.&nbsp; No need to bother your children with such nonsense.</p>

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[FUNKMAN]

<p><font size="1"> </font></p><p>Do you know why you are white?</p><p>Because&nbsp;your black ancestors left Africa, migrated to Europe and an ice age trapped your ancestors in Western Europe for thousands of years</p><p>&nbsp;</p><p>doesn't Dennis Hopper tell this same story to Chris Walken in True Romance?</p><p><img height="150" src="http://www.ojaiwan.net/cwimages/romance.jpg" width="200" border="0" /></p>

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[suggums]

<p><br />Two mice fell into a bucket of milk...<br /></p>

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[FUNKMAN]

I like simple pleasures, like butter in my ass, lollipops in my mouth. That's just me. That's just something that I enjoy

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[bobrobot]

<p><font style="font-size: 9px" face="Verdana">quote: </font></p>I like simple pleasures, like butter in my ass. That's just me. That's just something that I enjoy <br /><p>&nbsp;</p><p><img height="533" src="http://images.art.com/images/-/Last-Tango-In-Paris-Style-A--C10132874.jpeg" width="345" border="0" /></p><br />

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[TheMojoPin]

I hope the title of this thread was sarcastic.

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[FUNKMAN]

<p><font size="1">I hope the title of this thread was sarcastic. </font></p><p><img height="315" src="http://blog.cyberbrahma.com/wp-images/foolishestface.jpg" width="421" border="0" /></p>

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[Judge Smails]

<font style="font-size: 9px" face="Verdana">quote: </font>I hope the title of this thread was sarcastic. <p>Yes it was.&nbsp; I was just parroting some of the guilt trip bullshit that my dad layed on me which managed to ruin my day.&nbsp; However, as I have admitted previously, there was some deep recess of my psche which was genuinely disturbed and bothered that this group of people sitting in front of me did not stand up for the anthem.</p><p><br />&nbsp;</p>

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[Yosammity]

<font style="font-size: 9px" face="Verdana">quote: </font><p>Haven't you heard in Bush's America it's all about fascist gov&nbsp;pukes wiretapping citizens&nbsp;all&nbsp;while calling themselves patriots.</p><p>&nbsp;</p><p>Image over substance these days and people better wake up or your dad will have more to worry about than singing songs at a baseball game.&nbsp; There won't BE an America.</p><p>&nbsp;</p><p>You did the patriotic thing by letting other people do whatever the HELL they wanted to without putting on your jackboots and&nbsp;trying to force them into lockstep.</p>You're silly!<br />

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