National Health Care Debate

[CountryBob]

I had no idea that McDonald's fries were so much better than Nathan's. I might go get me a large order after hitting the gym.

[foodcourtdruide]

FRENCH FRIES ARE FATTENING!!!!!!!!!!

Yes. And that's exactly what we were discussing. That french fries are fattening. That's EXACTLY what our debate was about. Thanks for clearing that up.

[CurseoftheBambi]

maybe i can say it simpler so he'll understand :

if jon has 5 apples and eats 2 how many apples does jon now have?

[Serpico1103]

OH MY GOD

I'M NOT TALKING ABOUT TWO DIFFERENT TYPES OF FOOD. THESE ARE BOTH FRENCH FRIES.

I give up. I give up. I give up. I give up. I give up. I give up.

Now, as a liberal, you cry racism.

[WRESTLINGFAN]

maybe i can say it simpler so he'll understand :

if jon has 5 apples and eats 2 how many apples does jon now have?

None because the guhbmint took the other 3 because its a human right to have apples

[foodcourtdruide]

Now, as a liberal, you cry racism.

No, I accuse you of accusing ME of racism.

[Furtherman]

WRESTLINGFAN has won the debate. Congratulations. Please make that my modquote. I'm going to agree with him 100% for now on. underdog, serpico, furtherman.. I hate you all.

No, he hasn't. He hasn't provided anything to debate but his own opinion, which is only a notch above The Bends anyway.

[CurseoftheBambi]

OH MY GOD

I'M NOT TALKING ABOUT TWO DIFFERENT TYPES OF FOOD. THESE ARE BOTH FRENCH FRIES.

I give up. I give up. I give up. I give up. I give up. I give up.

Silly liberal you give up and want the government to take care of you now...see see just want obama wants !!!!!:nono:

[WRESTLINGFAN]

Yes. And that's exactly what we were discussing. That french fries are fattening. That's EXACTLY what our debate was about. Thanks for clearing that up.

Why post calories then?

If youre going for the fries its a good chance youre having that monster burger.

[foodcourtdruide]

No, he hasn't. He hasn't provided anything to debate but his own opinion, which is only a notch above The Bends anyway.

I just can't keep going in circles. He's not going to understand it, so why disagree? I may as well live blissfully agreeing with him. I wonder if we all became neo-con's if he'd become a liberal?

[WRESTLINGFAN]

No, he hasn't. He hasn't provided anything to debate but his own opinion, which is only a notch above The Bends anyway.

I can't fucking believe I have to debate people that fries are high in fat and calories its not my opinion

[Serpico1103]

FRENCH FRIES ARE FATTENING!!!!!!!!!!
So, if I look at a fry I get fat? If I touch one, I get fat? If I eat one? How abut two?

NO FOOD IS FATTENING PER SE! YOU GET FAT FROM TOO MANY CALORIES. WHETHER IT IS CELERY OR WHOPPERS.

[underdog]

WRESTLINGFAN has won the debate. Congratulations. Please make that my modquote. I'm going to agree with him 100% for now on. underdog, serpico, furtherman.. I hate you all.

Get a job.

I can't fucking believe I have to debate people that fries are high in fat and calories its not my opinion

:wallbash:

[CurseoftheBambi]

None because the guhbmint took the other 3 because its a human right to have apples yeah its a human right to have clean drinking water or maybe its not

:furious:DAMN THE DEP!!!!!!!!!!! GOVERNMENT OVERLORDS MAKING SURE I DRINK WATER THAT WONT KILL ME!!!!!!!!DAMN THEM FOR VIOLATING MY RIGHTS!!!!!: ITS NOT IN THE CONSTITUTION THAT THEY SHOULD GIVE A DAMN IF I DRINK CLEAN WATER!!!!!!!:furious:

[WRESTLINGFAN]

I just can't keep going in circles. He's not going to understand it, so why disagree? I may as well live blissfully agreeing with him. I wonder if we all became neo-con's if he'd become a liberal?

Why do people who arent progressives all grouped as neocons? I don't fall into that group.

[foodcourtdruide]

Why post calories then?

If youre going for the fries its a good chance youre having that monster burger.

Calories are still calories. Not everyone is dieting on a strict 1600 calorie diet, but some people may not want to exceed 2200. Some people may not see much of a difference in the taste of both fries, so may choose the less unhealthy one instead.

[WRESTLINGFAN]

yeah its a human right to have clean drinking water or maybe its not

:furious:DAMN THE DEP!!!!!!!!!!! GOVERNMENT OVERLORDS MAKING SURE I DRINK WATER THAT WONT KILL ME!!!!!!!!DAMN THEM FOR VIOLATING MY RIGHTS!!!!!: ITS NOT IN THE CONSTITUTION THAT THEY SHOULD GIVE A DAMN IF I DRINK CLEAN WATER!!!!!!!:furious:

Clean drinking water? With all the flouride and other garbage you call that clean or are you just too cheap to get a water purifier?

[foodcourtdruide]

I can't fucking believe I have to debate people that fries are high in fat and calories its not my opinion

I don't understand how you've taken from my posts that I believe french fries are not high in fat and calories. You are seriously having a different debate than the one I intend too. I don't totally blame you for this, I must be to blame too, right?

[WRESTLINGFAN]

I don't understand how you've taken from my posts that I believe french fries are not high in fat and calories. You are seriously having a different debate than the one I intend too. I don't totally blame you for this, I must be to blame too, right?

With all this talk on fries. Im fuckin starvin!!!

[CurseoftheBambi]

Clean drinking water? With all the flouride and other garbage you call that clean or are you just too cheap to get a water purifier?

How do you know that you should get a water purifier socialist! getting that fancy education!!!!!! who told you that your water i dirty...its a con-spriacy of the government to get you to pay for money you dont need to spend!!! i say drink water from everywhere...ad if you die that's just God's will you socialist!!!! commie athiest!:furious:

and dont ever put use the government flouride they said it was to help stop cavities but it's really to put us under their control to depend on them !!!!!!! SAY NO TO FLOURIDE!!!!!!

[Furtherman]

I can't fucking believe I have to debate people that fries are high in fat and calories its not my opinion

Is that what you're doing? I had no idea.

[Serpico1103]

Why do people who arent progressives all grouped as neocons? I don't fall into that group.

Neo-douche doesn't have a good ring to it.

Some regulations make the market more efficient. Something a pro-business person would want.
Otherwise, every person has to buy the fries. Bring them to a lab. Have them analyzed. Then consume the appropriate amount. And do this every time.
Or, McD's, since they are quality controlled, publish the nutritional facts.

It is why the women won money for the hot coffee.
Imagine if every time you bought coffee you had to hold the cup with an oven mitt until you were assured it was safe to handle. Or when you reached into the freezer at a supermarket to get ice cream, but the freezer was set to absolute zero.

Uniformity makes the market more efficient. Allows for more transactions. Benefits businesses and :ohmy: society.

[The Bends]

Yeah, I cry for the guidos paying an extra 10% to tan I wonder if you have the same balls to call a black person a derogatory term when expressing an opinion.....

I'm guessing not....

The point is, silly small minded person, that the tanning industry is just the begining.....

[Bob Impact]

WRESTLINGFAN has won the debate. Congratulations. Please make that my modquote. I'm going to agree with him 100% for now on. underdog, serpico, furtherman.. I hate you all.
I really would have expected a guy with "foodcourt" in his name to have done better here. :lol:

Neo-douche doesn't have a good ring to it.

Some regulations make the market more efficient. Something a pro-business person would want.
Otherwise, every person has to buy the fries. Bring them to a lab. Have them analyzed. Then consume the appropriate amount. And do this every time.
Or, McD's, since they are quality controlled, publish the nutritional facts.

It is why the women won money for the hot coffee.
Imagine if every time you bought coffee you had to hold the cup with an oven mitt until you were assured it was safe to handle. Or when you reached into the freezer at a supermarket to get ice cream, but the freezer was set to absolute zero.

Uniformity makes the market more efficient. Allows for more transactions. Benefits businesses and :ohmy: society.

I wasn't even going for this angle but to a certain extent I agree with you (ohmigod I know I was shocked too!) While I don't agree with the government forcing it (if the consumer demanded it, it would show up, kinda the way these things work) I do agree that if you're selling a good product you have nothing to worry about.

I wonder if you have the same balls to call a black person a derogatory term when expressing an opinion.....

I'm guessing not....

The point is, silly small minded person, that the tanning industry is just the begining.....
As an Italian I have no issue with the word guido, it represents a style, this particular one:
http://i94.photobucket.com/albums/l119/laura235_2006/guido.jpg
These people call themselves that.

This certainly doesn't represent most Italians, certainly not me.

[Serpico1103]

I wonder if you have the same balls to call a black person a derogatory term when expressing an opinion.....

I'm guessing not....

The point is, silly small minded person, that the tanning industry is just the begining.....

When they put a tax on jerry curl juice maybe she will.

You are a racist!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Bob Impact]

When they put a tax on jerry curl juice maybe she will.

You are a racist!!!!!!!!!!!!

inb4 "Silly liberal"

[Serpico1103]

I really would have expected a guy with "foodcourt" in his name to have done better here. :lol:
I wasn't even going for this angle but to a certain extent I agree with you (ohmigod I know I was shocked too!) While I don't agree with the government forcing it (if the consumer demanded it, it would show up, kinda the way these things work) I do agree that if you're selling a good product you have nothing to worry about.


I know I am a crazy liberal.
But, I am not for banning bad food, cigarettes, firearms, alcohol and all other fun things.
I just think they need to regulated and people need to be given information.
You want a gun. Great. Take a training course, go through a background check, have a waiting period, register it, maybe every two years update with the government your inventory to prevent against selling guns in black market. You have to jump through many hoops to drive. (I know driving is a privilege)

WF did people in the '20's, 30's, 40's, etc, know cigarettes were bad? It seems common sense to me that inhaling smoke is unhealthy. How were that many people stupid?
Oh that is right. They weren't given information to make an informed choice.

[WRESTLINGFAN]

I know I am a crazy liberal.
But, I am not for banning bad food, cigarettes, firearms, alcohol and all other fun things.
I just think they need to regulated and people need to be given information.
You want a gun. Great. Take a training course, go through a background check, have a waiting period, register it, maybe every two years update with the government your inventory to prevent against selling guns in black market. You have to jump through many hoops to drive. (I know driving is a privilege)

WF did people in the '20's, 30's, 40's, etc, know cigarettes were bad? It seems common sense to me that inhaling smoke is unhealthy. How were that many people stupid?
Oh that is right. They weren't given information to make an informed choice.

Anyone who thinks inhaling tar and carbon monoxide is healthy is an idiot in any decade

[The Bends]

I really would have expected a guy with "foodcourt" in his name to have done better here. :lol:



I wasn't even going for this angle but to a certain extent I agree with you (ohmigod I know I was shocked too!) While I don't agree with the government forcing it (if the consumer demanded it, it would show up, kinda the way these things work) I do agree that if you're selling a good product you have nothing to worry about.


As an Italian I have no issue with the word guido, it represents a style, this particular one:
http://i94.photobucket.com/albums/l119/laura235_2006/guido.jpg
These people call themselves that.

This certainly doesn't represent most Italians, certainly not me. First off, Guido is a douche, eat coast thing.....

Second....black people use the word nigger in their communities.....

[Serpico1103]

First off, Guido is a douche, eat coast thing.....

Second....black people use the word nigger in their communities.....

TRUTH BOMB!

[Serpico1103]

Anyone who thinks inhaling tar and carbon monoxide is healthy is an idiot in any decade

So, you know what causes cancer?
I would think, maybe not medical school, but some formal education would be required to find what causes cancer.
Or, warning labels.

Cigarette companies should be allowed to say that cigarettes are healthy because only an idiot would believe it.

[Recyclerz]

FRENCH FRIES ARE FATTENING!!!!!!!!!!

Exactly! Now Freedom Fries were both healthy AND delicious!

[angrymissy]

Anything deep fried is unhealthy. Thats my point. No medical school is needed to come up to that conclusion.

Burger King flame Broils their food but a loaded steakhouse whopper isnt a healthy alternative to a big mac

Yeah, but the thing is, it helps to know EXACTLY what is in there.

When I was dieting last summer, I allowed myself a certain amount of calories/fat. That was it XXX calories XXX fat.

So if I had a light day, I would occasionally allow myself a burger from Wendys or something like that. Being able to see calories/fat allowed me to do so and see how it would fit into my diet plan.

Also, as I said before, what about people who have health issues and need to watch intake of sodium/carbs/cholesterol, etc?

There used to be an Atlanta Bread Company by my old job and we would all get a "healthy" smoothie (not an ice cream one, just fruit/ice/milk) when we went. On a whim, I looked it up online one day and it was like 500 calories, loaded with sugar. And the grilled chicken sandwich I got was something like 800. If you don't know what goes into the food, even something you think is healthy and seems healthy can be LOADED with calories.

Now I really think you're just regurgitating what you hear on talk radio and online, because this topic was one of the latest "outrages" on most of them. Out of everything to criticize, it's this?

[WRESTLINGFAN]

Why does tax dollars have to be used to inform people on calories/fat we can pick this up for a lot less


http://blogs.dallasobserver.com/cityofate/Eat%20This,%20Not%20That%20Book%20Cover.jpg

[SonOfSmeagol]

Get a job.

You ALL should get a real job. If you had been my employees I would've fired your lazy, web-surfing asses by lunchtime today. Then you could've gone out and eaten whatever the fuck you want.

j/k. kinda.

[Ogre]

Yeah, but the thing is, it helps to know EXACTLY what is in there.

When I was dieting last summer, I allowed myself a certain amount of calories/fat. That was it XXX calories XXX fat.

So if I had a light day, I would occasionally allow myself a burger from Wendys or something like that. Being able to see calories/fat allowed me to do so and see how it would fit into my diet plan.

Also, as I said before, what about people who have health issues and need to watch intake of sodium/carbs/cholesterol, etc?

There used to be an Atlanta Bread Company by my old job and we would all get a "healthy" smoothie (not an ice cream one, just fruit/ice/milk) when we went. On a whim, I looked it up online one day and it was like 500 calories, loaded with sugar. And the grilled chicken sandwich I got was something like 800. If you don't know what goes into the food, even something you think is healthy and seems healthy can be LOADED with calories.

Now I really think you're just regurgitating what you hear on talk radio and online, because this topic was one of the latest "outrages" on most of them. Out of everything to criticize, it's this?

Maybe this is going to shock you, but I agree. I look at the labels when picking stuff out in the store. I also enjoy reading the articles that divulge the nutritional information on the TGIF cheese fries and the Outback Onion thingy and foods such as those. I do not do this for the collective good or any Orwellian philosophy. I do it for my family. I dont want to be a burden on them when I am 70 with health problems that could have been avoided by correct choices at 45. (the sugar beetes runs in my family) It is also worth noting that this is a smart plan because I am not so sure I WILL be able to get the medical care that might be necessary in the future.

There is absolutely nothing wrong about be able to get the nutritional information on prepared foods and dishes. If it takes a regulation to get that done..so be it. The problem is when foods start getting banned. The line gets crossed when it goes from freedom of information to infringing on free will.

BTW I read that the BK Whopper Junior without cheese hold the mayo comes in under 290 cal and 20 g of fat. (and they are only a buck)

[Ogre]

Anyone who thinks inhaling tar and carbon monoxide is healthy is an idiot in any decade

I think the point there was that the Surgeon's General Warning wasn't mandatory until the 70s (I think?)...Anyhoo, thru WWII I doubt much focus was put on the actual chemical compounds in Cigarettes. Smoking was portrayed as glamorous and cool, not potentially hazardous to your health.

Yeah Yeah evil tobacco companies blah blah blah. As much as it pains me to say this I would have to agree with Serpico on this one point regarding the information on smokes.

The Gun regulation nonsense that he was spouting is utter crazytalk.

[SatCam]

BTW I read that the BK Whopper Junior without cheese hold the mayo comes in under 290 cal and 20 g of fat. (and they are only a buck)

they should be cheaper than that if youre not getting cheese or mayo..... or is the extra 10 cents a TAX on us HEALTHY people??? Those fat cats in washington never stop

[SonOfSmeagol]

http://img2.timeinc.net/health/images/slides/moredoxsmokeluckies-notext-400x400.jpg

[The Bends]

Yeah, I cry for the guidos paying an extra 10% to tan

Maybe you didn't see my question.....

Would you have the same balls/ovaries to call black people a negative racial slur?

[tanless1]

No registraition !!! Austrlia registerd , look what happend. Katrina ? Registraition didn't work so well there.

[Dude!]

Maybe you didn't see my question.....

Would you have the same balls/ovaries to call black people a negative racial slur?

NY jewish girls are hardly
in a position to disparage
other ethnic groups

the chutzpah!

[angrymissy]

NY jewish girls are hardly
in a position to disparage
other ethnic groups

the chutzpah!

I'm not a Jew!

I'm a filthy mick!

[The Bends]

I'm not a Jew!

I'm a filthy mick!
I'm just pointing out how you and other liberals work...as proof that you don't see black people as equals....

You can use an Italian racial slur without thinking.....but would NEVER dare use a black racial slur in describing a black person....

You do so because you look at black people as a lowly group who constantly needs your help and excuses, so your elitism allows you to be sensitive to black people......you do not see black people as a normal, capable group.....because you believe they are lower than you....

Let me set you straight.....Black people and white people are the SAME....capeable of the SAME things, both good and bad......stop treating black people as a weak race, full of can't do's.....

Calling you on your shit has gotten way too easy....

[foodcourtdruide]

[QUOTE=The Bends;2692375]

Let me set you straight.....Black people and white people are the SAME....capeable of the SAME things, both good and bad......stop treating black people as a weak race, full of can't do's.....

[QUOTE]


This is my favorite quote from anyone ever. There is an entire thread where you are screaming that one race is better than another at baseball. I love that you put "SAME" in all caps.

[The Bends]

I'm not a Jew!

I'm a filthy mick!

PS: I love your shitty attempt at an alibi

You used the old "Look at me...I called my ethnicity a negative term, so it's OK..."

Weak!

[foodcourtdruide]

Let me set you straight.....Black people and white people are the SAME....capeable of the SAME things, both good and bad......stop treating black people as a weak race, full of can't do's.....




This is my favorite quote from anyone ever. There is an entire thread where you are screaming that one race is better than another at baseball. I love that you put "SAME" in all caps.

Aw man, The Bends is on vacation. I'll never get the answer to the clear hypocrisy here.

[Furtherman]

Aw man, The Bends is on vacation. I'll never get the answer to the clear hypocrisy here.

You wouldn't have gotten one anyway, he was just trolling.

[Ogre]

Aw man, The Bends is on vacation. I'll never get the answer to the clear hypocrisy here.

I could use a Vacation

[foodcourtdruide]

I could use a Vacation

Me too. From my problemmmms!

[WRESTLINGFAN]

Hope you enjoy higher phone bills

http://www.marketwatch.com/story/att-to-take-1-bln-charge-on-health-care-bill-2010-03-26-1411190?siteid=bnbh

Who knows? Maybe the I Phone will be a basic human right

Caterpillar is going to take at least a 100mm hit. Med tronic might have to lay off 1,000 workers. Isn't change great?

[underdog]

You do so because you look at black people as a lowly group who constantly needs your help and excuses, so your elitism allows you to be sensitive to black people......you do not see black people as a normal, capable group.....because you believe they are lower than you....

So I don't go around saying nigger because I think black people need my help?

[Syd]

Hope you enjoy higher phone bills

http://www.marketwatch.com/story/att-to-take-1-bln-charge-on-health-care-bill-2010-03-26-1411190?siteid=bnbh

Who knows? Maybe the I Phone will be a basic human right

Caterpillar is going to take at least a 100mm hit. Med tronic might have to lay off 1,000 workers. Isn't change great?

whew good thing none of those people working for them needed healthcare

[StanUpshaw]

So I don't go around saying nigger because I think black people need my help?

I don't know about you personally, but let's not pretend that paternalism doesn't exist, especially on the left.

[WRESTLINGFAN]

whew good thing none of those people working for them needed healthcare

Its going to eat into their costs!! Also they might have to renegotiate their plans with retirees as well. Verizon is also facing huge costs, but its all about uncle barry providing you with everything you want.

[foodcourtdruide]

Its going to eat into their costs!! Also they might have to renegotiate their plans with retirees as well. Verizon is also facing huge costs, but its all about uncle barry providing you with everything you want.

I hate it when American workers get healthcare.

[WRESTLINGFAN]

I hate it when American workers get healthcare.

Do you also hate when your politicians fail to read all 2700 pages they sign onto?

[Death Metal Moe]

Its going to eat into their costs!! Also they might have to renegotiate their plans with retirees as well. Verizon is also facing huge costs, but its all about uncle barry providing you with everything you want.

You're funny. You make it sound like there's a bunch of people just waiting to receive flat screen TVs. We're talking about improving and extending people's lifespans.

I really don't see that as a frivolous expenditure. I see that as something we should have been budgeting a long time ago. Before most of the programs we waste money on now.

[Jujubees2]

Its going to eat into their costs!! Also they might have to renegotiate their plans with retirees as well. Verizon is also facing huge costs, but its all about uncle barry providing you with everything you want.

And yet upper management will still take home huge salaries and big bonuses.

[WRESTLINGFAN]

You're funny. You make it sound like there's a bunch of people just waiting to receive flat screen TVs. We're talking about improving and extending people's lifespans.

I really don't see that as a frivolous expenditure. I see that as something we should have been budgeting a long time ago. Before most of the programs we waste money on now.

Actually there are many who say fuck it!! Let the gov't take care of everything so why should be there any motivation on their part when the taxpayer will provide everything for them

[WRESTLINGFAN]

And yet upper management will still take home huge salaries and big bonuses.

So should upper management make $ 7.15 an hour? If you want that, let the Key Grip , best boy and others on a set get paid the same as George Clooney.

Legal contracts mean shit to you

If A Rod doesnt get his 30 and 100 reduce his pay by 50%

[Furtherman]

Actually there are many who say fuck it!! Let the gov't take care of everything

No, there's not.

[WRESTLINGFAN]

No, there's not.

Really?


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[Furtherman]

If you're going to take a few examples of people not knowing what they're talking about, then what about these people:

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[WRESTLINGFAN]

Or these people!!!!


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[foodcourtdruide]

So should upper management make $ 7.15 an hour? If you want that, let the Key Grip , best boy and others on a set get paid the same as George Clooney.

Legal contracts mean shit to you

If A Rod doesnt get his 30 and 100 reduce his pay by 50%

It's a strange thing to me. You're against people in the middle and at the bottom trying to get their fair share of wealth (they want health insurance, how dare they), but you have no problems with people who are extremely wealthy. You don't want George Clooney, who's a multi-millionare that could afford to get sick 100x, to reduce his pay. However, you're fine with the Key Grip, Best Boy, etc. being in a position where they cannot afford health care. I have a new theory about you. You're a billionaire. It's the only way this all makes sense.

[WRESTLINGFAN]

It's a strange thing to me. You're against people in the middle and at the bottom trying to get their fair share of wealth (they want health insurance, how dare they), but you have no problems with people who are extremely wealthy. You don't want George Clooney, who's a multi-millionare that could afford to get sick 100x, to reduce his pay. However, you're fine with the Key Grip, Best Boy, etc. being in a position where they cannot afford health care. I have a new theory about you. You're a billionaire. It's the only way this all makes sense.

Yup youre right. I do hate puppies and babies too. I light my cigars with $1000 bills

Now you want people to be FORCED to reduce their pay? I want people to get out of being extras ona set and one day being the A list celebrity. As much as I disagree with many celebrities politically, they worked the shitty jobs and lived in the studio apts. What makes you think the key grip and cameramen are living in crack houses in West Hollywood? Youre using extremes

[underdog]

I don't know about you personally, but let's not pretend that paternalism doesn't exist, especially on the left.

I don't deny that, but that's not the reason people don't say nigger as freely as they say stuff like guido. His point was just a weird one that didn't really make sense to me.

[underdog]

You're a billionaire. It's the only way this all makes sense.

If he's a billionaire, it's because his parents are rich. And it explains why he doesn't have a job.

[foodcourtdruide]

Yup youre right. I do hate puppies and babies too. I light my cigars with $1000 bills

Now you want people to be FORCED to reduce their pay? I want people to get out of being extras ona set and one day being the A list celebrity. As much as I disagree with many celebrities politically, they worked the shitty jobs and lived in the studio apts. What makes you think the key grip and cameramen are living in crack houses in West Hollywood? Youre using extremes

So, I say that the key grip and cameramen want health insurance, and you said that I think they are living in crack houses. And I'm using extremes?

Why would you prefer to protect the wealth of the rich, as oppose to provide things like health care to the middle class? These aren't the lazy class you have convinced yourself covers 3/4 of the United States. These are hard working people who can't afford to go to the doctor.

Why do you want to ensure George Clooney makes his salary, as opposed to ensuring workers are receiving a fair wage and able to go to the doctor?

[WRESTLINGFAN]

If he's a billionaire, it's because his parents are rich. And it explains why he doesn't have a job.

What makes you think I dont have a job? And are you working in a coal mine 15 hours a day?

[WRESTLINGFAN]

So, I say that the key grip and cameramen want health insurance, and you said that I think they are living in crack houses. And I'm using extremes?

Why would you prefer to protect the wealth of the rich, as oppose to provide things like health care to the middle class? These aren't the lazy class you have convinced yourself covers 3/4 of the United States. These are hard working people who can't afford to go to the doctor.

Why do you want to ensure George Clooney makes his salary, as opposed to ensuring workers are receiving a fair wage and able to go to the doctor?

Are these workers on the sets dying in the gutters of Hollywood Blvd? Maybe they have to sell a kidney to go see the doctor

[foodcourtdruide]

Are these workers on the sets dying in the gutters of Hollywood Blvd? Maybe they have to sell a kidney to go see the doctor

Huh?

[StanUpshaw]

So, I say that the key grip and cameramen want health insurance, and you said that I think they are living in crack houses. And I'm using extremes?

Why would you prefer to protect the wealth of the rich, as oppose to provide things like health care to the middle class? These aren't the lazy class you have convinced yourself covers 3/4 of the United States. These are hard working people who can't afford to go to the doctor.

Why do you want to ensure George Clooney makes his salary, as opposed to ensuring workers are receiving a fair wage and able to go to the doctor?

This is all I can hear when people make arguments like this:

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[WRESTLINGFAN]

Huh?

Youre using anecdotal stories about people. Guess what? This new plan still won't cover everybody!!!

Think theres fraud in Medicare/aid? Wait till you hear the stories of fraud in this bill.

[Bob Impact]

It's a strange thing to me. You're against people in the middle and at the bottom trying to get their fair share of wealth (they want health insurance, how dare they), but you have no problems with people who are extremely wealthy. You don't want George Clooney, who's a multi-millionare that could afford to get sick 100x, to reduce his pay. However, you're fine with the Key Grip, Best Boy, etc. being in a position where they cannot afford health care. I have a new theory about you. You're a billionaire. It's the only way this all makes sense.

If they didn't earn it, it's not their fair share... it's not their unfair share, it's not theirs at all.

[foodcourtdruide]

Youre using anecdotal stories about people. Guess what? This new plan still won't cover everybody!!!

Think theres fraud in Medicare/aid? Wait till you hear the stories of fraud in this bill.

Ok, WF. If you won't acknowledge that there are poor and middle class hard working people that can't afford health care then we can stop this discussion, because you are living outside the realm of reality.

[foodcourtdruide]

If they didn't earn it, it's not their fair share... it's not their unfair share, it's not theirs at all.

This goes back to our original discussion. Who dictates who "earns" anything? Society does. Society has the right to determine what is and isn't their fair share. If society determines that their fair share is good health insurance, then guess what? They have earned it.

[Bob Impact]

Youre using anecdotal stories about people. Guess what? This new plan still won't cover everybody!!!

Think theres fraud in Medicare/aid? Wait till you hear the stories of fraud in this bill.

Wait, you can't say "You're using anecdotal stories" and then use an anecdotal argument directly afterwards.

[Bob Impact]

This goes back to our original discussion. Who dictates who "earns" anything? Society does. Society has the right to determine what is and isn't their fair share. If society determines that their fair share is good health insurance, then guess what? They have earned it.

No.

Person A has $10 dollars and needs a haircut.
Person B will cut Person A's hair for $10.

Society has nothing to do with it. In your case it would be:
Person A has $10 dollars and needs a haircut.
Person B will cut Person A's hair for $10.
Person's C & D decide that Person A doesn't really need a haircut and each take 5 dollars.

Meanwhile person E is getting Person F'd by Person G.

What was I getting at again?

Ah, yes, SILLY LIBERAL!

[WRESTLINGFAN]

Ok, WF. If you won't acknowledge that there are poor and middle class hard working people that can't afford health care then we can stop this discussion, because you are living outside the realm of reality.

And there are already existing programs for these situations. Youre living in a fantasyland if you think the streets are littered with dead bodies. Like I said a fucking illegal alien doesnt get turned away

[WRESTLINGFAN]

Wait, you can't say "You're using anecdotal stories" and then use an anecdotal argument directly afterwards.

Billions of dollars of fraud and waste isn't anecdotal

[Bob Impact]

Billions of dollars of fraud and waste isn't anecdotal

Right, and there's more than anecdotal evidence that there are quite a few hardworking people who can't afford healthcare. It's just a silly argument to be having.

[underdog]

What makes you think I dont have a job? And are you working in a coal mine 15 hours a day?

You're always here yelling about illegal immigration.

[foodcourtdruide]

And there are already existing programs for these situations. Youre living in a fantasyland if you think the streets are littered with dead bodies. Like I said a fucking illegal alien doesnt get turned away

Ok, WF. Anyone, anywhere has access to health care at anytime. No one has ever gone bankrupt from having a sick kid or being sick themselves. We already have Universal Healthcare.

[foodcourtdruide]

No.

Person A has $10 dollars and needs a haircut.
Person B will cut Person A's hair for $10.

Society has nothing to do with it. In your case it would be:
Person A has $10 dollars and needs a haircut.
Person B will cut Person A's hair for $10.
Person's C & D decide that Person A doesn't really need a haircut and each take 5 dollars.

Meanwhile person E is getting Person F'd by Person G.

What was I getting at again?

Ah, yes, SILLY LIBERAL!

I don't know, but your scenario suddenly got hot :) What was Person E wearing?

[WRESTLINGFAN]

Ok, WF. Anyone, anywhere has access to health care at anytime. No one has ever gone bankrupt from having a sick kid or being sick themselves. We already have Universal Healthcare.


You can thank all the illegal aliens who dont pay a fucking dime for this mess. The mope from Guatemala doesn't have to worry about getting a bill for popping out another kid

[WRESTLINGFAN]

I don't know, but your scenario suddenly got hot :) What was Person E wearing?

Always blaming the victim

[TripleSkeet]

My father came here from Italy when he was 17, unable to read or write english. He busted his ass for 30 years. He worked 7 days a week at an oil refinery, worked every major holiday, never turned down a shift, because he wanted us to have a good life. My mom stayed home and raised 4 kids.

When I was 13 my dad got severely hurt at work, 3 herniated discs in his back, because someone didnt listen to him when he warned them about something they were doing. Since then hes settled his case against the company, and has been able to live comfortably. His medical care is fully covered. Unfortunately my mothers is not. Neither is my brother, who is 25 years old and HIV positive.

My mom kills herself now in a shitty job for shitty pay just so she can have healthcare now. But this job, especially with the way things are in Jersey right now, could be gone tomorrow. She never knows. If this bill means that if something eventually happens to her job my mom can still get healthcare, and that my brother can also get healthcare, then I dont mind paying extra taxes, and personally dont give a fuck if you have to also.

For all the bullshit this country taxes its people to pay for, this is the one cause that actually doesnt bother me. Even if my mom werent in that situation. It bothers me a hell of alot less then paying taxes so some kids can be sent halfway around the war to fight some fucking people that pose as much of a fucking threat to the American people as lightning and great white sharks. Yet less people bitch about paying for that. The cruelty and selfishness of some of the people crying about this thing is just amazing.

Bottom line, the bill passed, you lost, get over it.

[Bob Impact]

Always blaming the victim

:lol:

[WRESTLINGFAN]

My father came here from Italy when he was 17, unable to read or write english. He busted his ass for 30 years. He worked 7 days a week at an oil refinery, worked every major holiday, never turned down a shift, because he wanted us to have a good life. My mom stayed home and raised 4 kids.

When I was 13 my dad got severely hurt at work, 3 herniated discs in his back, because someone didnt listen to him when he warned them about something they were doing. Since then hes settled his case against the company, and has been able to live comfortably. His medical care is fully covered. Unfortunately my mothers is not. Neither is my brother, who is 25 years old and HIV positive.

My mom kills herself now in a shitty job for shitty pay just so she can have healthcare now. But this job, especially with the way things are in Jersey right now, could be gone tomorrow. She never knows. If this bill means that if something eventually happens to her job my mom can still get healthcare, and that my brother can also get healthcare, then I dont mind paying extra taxes, and personally dont give a fuck if you have to also.

For all the bullshit this country taxes its people to pay for, this is the one cause that actually doesnt bother me. Even if my mom werent in that situation. It bothers me a hell of alot less then paying taxes so some kids can be sent halfway around the war to fight some fucking people that pose as much of a fucking threat to the American people as lightning and great white sharks. Yet less people bitch about paying for that. The cruelty and selfishness of some of the people crying about this thing is just amazing.

Bottom line, the bill passed, you lost, get over it.


How do you you feel about all the people who slithered across the border and overstayed their visa and demand citizenship and all the entitlements provided by the taxpayer. As far as greed and selfishness thats definitely not me. I dole out federal state and local property taxes. Please don't call me greedy when im doing my fair share

[keithy_19]

How do you you feel about all the people who slithered across the border and overstayed their visa and demand citizenship and all the entitlements provided by the taxpayer. As far as greed and selfishness thats definitely not me. I dole out federal state and local property taxes. Please don't call me greedy when im doing my fair share

SHHHHHHHHHHHHH

I'm trying to lay low...

[WRESTLINGFAN]

SHHHHHHHHHHHHH

I'm trying to lay low...

Living in the shadows?

[StanUpshaw]

No.

Person A has $10 dollars and needs a haircut.
Person B will cut Person A's hair for $10.

Society has nothing to do with it. In your case it would be:
Person A has $10 dollars and needs a haircut.
Person B will cut Person A's hair for $10.
Person's C & D decide that Person A doesn't really need a haircut and each take 5 dollars.

Meanwhile person E is getting Person F'd by Person G.

What was I getting at again?

Ah, yes, SILLY LIBERAL!

Don't worry, Person A can still get a haircut as long as China, Japan and OPEC are willing to front him some cash.

[underdog]

How do you you feel about all the people who slithered across the border and overstayed their visa and demand citizenship and all the entitlements provided by the taxpayer. As far as greed and selfishness thats definitely not me. I dole out federal state and local property taxes. Please don't call me greedy when im doing my fair share

So we can call you greedy?

[WRESTLINGFAN]

So we can call you greedy?

No you can call the fucking illegals greedy and cheap while youre at it. They dont pay for shit. They make the mess, the taxpayers have to clean it up

[Crispy123]

Don't worry, if you don't like the silly liberal "socialists" and them voting to give poor people and sick kids health care... then you can support the conservative patriotic party that voted to tap our phones, read our emails, medical records, and library records.

I wonder if those guys read that bill entirely? Funny how Glenn Beck and these tea baggers let that shit slide without even a wimper.

[WRESTLINGFAN]

Don't worry, if you don't like the silly liberal "socialists" and them voting to give poor people and sick kids health care... then you can support the conservative patriotic party that voted to tap our phones, read our emails, medical records, and library records.

I wonder if those guys read that bill entirely? Funny how Glenn Beck and these tea baggers let that shit slide without even a wimper.

There's already SCHIP and Medicaid. St Judes hospital doesn't turn anyone away regardless of financial situation

Its the mostly Democrat Congress and Dem president who want the patriot act extended. I say repeal it.

Beck doesn't speak for me. He's the white Jeremiah Wright

[Crispy123]

There's already SCHIP and Medicaid. St Judes hospital doesn't turn anyone away regardless of financial situation

Its the mostly Democrat Congress and Dem president who want the patriot act extended. I say repeal it.

Beck doesn't speak for me. He's the white Jeremiah Wright

Yes SCHIP and Medicaid were going broke under the Republican leadership. Thankfully someone in Washington decided to take action, and make a change, now their is hope for these poor people and sick kids.

The fact that thePatriot Act hsn't been repealed is a very valid argument for voting out the Democrats. Now if you throw in the words socialist or muslim then you can go fuck yourself in the ass.

Although we may disagree on the issues WF, know that I would defend your right to express your ideas and Mr Beck's right for that matter. I chalk up your hardheadedness to the fact that youre a jarhead. :wink::smile::bye:

[WRESTLINGFAN]

Yes SCHIP and Medicaid were going broke under the Republican leadership. Thankfully someone in Washington decided to take action, and make a change, now their is hope for these poor people and sick kids.

The fact that thePatriot Act hsn't been repealed is a very valid argument for voting out the Democrats. Now if you throw in the words socialist or muslim then you can go fuck yourself in the ass.

Although we may disagree on the issues WF, know that I would defend your right to express your ideas and Mr Beck's right for that matter. I chalk up your hardheadedness to the fact that youre a jarhead. :wink::smile::bye:

SCHIP and Medicaid should be streamlined, another trillion plus entitlement program is not the end all cure all to this problem. I wont be too rough on your opinions even though you were an air winger :lol:

[epo]

Face it Republicans, its over.

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[StanUpshaw]

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[WRESTLINGFAN]

Face it Republicans, its over.

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For the dems

[high fly]

Face it Republicans, its over.



They will be trying to argue this for decades as if it has yet to be voted on or something.
I had fun on other boards bumping up Scott Brown threads where they declared health care dead...

[high fly]

For the dems


Yeah, the GOP is going to campaign declaring they will be taking health insurance away from 30 million Americans.
Sounds like a winner.

[WRESTLINGFAN]

Yeah, the GOP is going to campaign declaring they will be taking health insurance away from 30 million Americans.
Sounds like a winner.

REPEAL AND REPLACE

[StanUpshaw]

Let's not get ahead of ourselves. Let's see if it even survives the courts.

[high fly]

REPEAL AND REPLACE

Sucker.
In 1993, they claimed we should not adopt the plan the Clinton administration proposed because the GOP had a better one that would meet the saim aims - get everyone health care and address the fact costs were rising faster than incomes.
Once they defeated the Clinton plan, the GOP plan went into hibernation, never to arise again.
They had plenty of opportunity to do something and have not.
If they repeal, they will not replace with anything.

They will not repeal anything, either.
It's done.
Your side lost.
It's all over but the whining.....

[WRESTLINGFAN]

Sucker.
In 1993, they claimed we should not adopt the plan the Clinton administration proposed because the GOP had a better one that would meet the saim aims - get everyone health care and address the fact costs were rising faster than incomes.
Once they defeated the Clinton plan, the GOP plan went into hibernation, never to arise again.
They had plenty of opportunity to do something and have not.
If they repeal, they will not replace with anything.

They will not repeal anything, either.
It's done.
Your side lost.
It's all over but the whining.....

Youre the sucker who thinks this massive new entitlement will actually bring down costs and reduce the deficit. Welcome to Medicare on steroids!!!!

BHO got his bill passed, the SOB still needs to campaign for it? Didnt the fucker tell McCain that the campaign was over back on 2/25 at the pow wow at blair house?

[high fly]

Yeah, I like the way he stands in the middle of the ring like Ali over the crumpled figure of Liston....

[high fly]

Face it Republicans, its over.



Kinda sad, isn't it?

[WRESTLINGFAN]

Yeah, I like the way he stands in the middle of the ring like Ali over the crumpled figure of Liston....

BHO couldnt shine Ali's shoes

[high fly]

BHO couldnt shine Ali's shoes

He could have, because he is at least conscious.
Liston was seeing stars, the same way the losers in the health care debate are, and Barack Obama is doing a victory lap....

You lost, get over it.

[StanUpshaw]

You lost, get over it.

Yes, that's how government works, doesn't it.

[WRESTLINGFAN]

He could have, because he is at least conscious.
Liston was seeing stars, the same way the losers in the health care debate are, and Barack Obama is doing a victory lap....

You lost, get over it.

BHO had to use loaded gloves to get the victory. Ali did it with talent something BHO lacks. Enjoy the political little big horn in November when Pelosi loses the speakers gavel

[Bob Impact]

Yes, that's how government works, doesn't it.

^.

[epo]

REPEAL AND REPLACE

That's the rube trap of fundraising for the next cycle. Republicans literally cannot overturn this bill and they know it, but they'll fire up their severe minority by claiming they'll repeal a bill they literally don't have the political muscle to overturn.

Sort of like their claim of overturning abortion for the past 38 years. Nothing more than a shiny toy for the rubes.

[WRESTLINGFAN]

That's the rube trap of fundraising for the next cycle. Republicans literally cannot overturn this bill and they know it, but they'll fire up their severe minority by claiming they'll repeal a bill they literally don't have the political muscle to overturn.

Sort of like their claim of overturning abortion for the past 38 years. Nothing more than a shiny toy for the rubes.

The new Rubes are BHO supporters

[epo]

The new Rubes are BHO supporters

Back up your claim.

[WRESTLINGFAN]

Back up your claim.

"The stimulus is working"
BHO stays up all night worrying about the uninsured
Afghanistan is not a clusterfuck

ENOUGH SAID!!!!!

[epo]

"The stimulus is working"


Prove that claim.

[Bob Impact]

Would the two of you make out and get it over with already?

Alternatively... anyone wanna make out?

[WRESTLINGFAN]

Prove that claim.

http://www.businessweek.com/news/2010-03-26/unemployment-climbs-in-27-u-s-states-falls-in-seven-update2-.html


http://enr.ecnext.com/coms2/article_bmwf100217Unemployment

HOWS THAT FOR SHOVEL READY?

[WRESTLINGFAN]

Would the two of you make out and get it over with already?

Alternatively... anyone wanna make out?

Ewww!! And Brewers fans to boot?

[epo]

http://www.businessweek.com/news/2010-03-26/unemployment-climbs-in-27-u-s-states-falls-in-seven-update2-.html


http://enr.ecnext.com/coms2/article_bmwf100217Unemployment

HOWS THAT FOR SHOVEL READY?

Those are two random numbers. I want a solid, rational explanation from you on your bullshit claim.

[WRESTLINGFAN]

Those are two random numbers. I want a solid, rational explanation from you on your bullshit claim.

Making excuses for Facts? The claim has evidence to back it up!!!!!!


All of BHO's handlers like Plouffe, Axelrod etc go on the Sunday shows venerating the stimulus but the fucking numbers don't lie!!!

Here's another one.

"obama is a centrist"

[Bob Impact]

Making excuses for Facts? The claim has evidence to back it up!!!!!!


All of BHO's handlers like Plouffe, Axelrod etc go on the Sunday shows venerating the stimulus but the fucking numbers don't lie!!!

Here's another one.

"obama is a centrist"


You still haven't provided concrete numbers as to why the stimulus hasn't worked.

[Dude!]

You still haven't provided concrete numbers as to why the stimulus hasn't worked.

how do you prove a negative?

[epo]

how do you prove a negative?

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[Bob Impact]

how do you prove a negative?

Good point, and poor wording on my point.

You could start by proving detrimental economic effects that the stimulus has had. I don't take unemployment as a valid indicator of that, there are too many variables involved.

[WRESTLINGFAN]

Good point, and poor wording on my point.

You could start by proving detrimental economic effects that the stimulus has had. I don't take unemployment as a valid indicator of that, it's too far disconnected.

The 4th qtr '09 GDP had to be revised down. In order for the unemployment rate to go down 1% GDP will have to be at least 5.5% for an entire year, Heard that on Bloomberg news today

Sure there will be a million jobs added for the census but once thats over those numbers vanish and its back to the same numbers

[TripleSkeet]

No you can call the fucking illegals greedy and cheap while youre at it. They dont pay for shit. They make the mess, the taxpayers have to clean it up

If by cheap you mean inexpensive, I agree. Those guys do yardwork for peanuts. Something that helps me out greatly in the summer.

[hanso]

I can’t say much more if you refuse to accept factual information. The right has “painted” nothing – there’s no need to.

The Budget and Economic Outlook: Fiscal Years 2010 to 2020 (http://www.cbo.gov/ftpdocs/108xx/doc10871/01-26-Outlook.pdf)

Not only that, but even with your math the .4 T makes no sense. The stimulus will cost .842 T (see above link – up from .787 T) and it was PURE deficit spending under bho in FY09. There was also actually a lot more actual deficit spending under bho in FY09. But anyway, hHow can you possible reconcile that figure with “.4 T”.

Keep projecting. I'm bailing out of this chat now. As my point is money spent. Get back at the end of 2010.

In another word: it ignores the fact that something like 40k+ people die every year needlessly due to lack of healthcare insurance (America has something like 110k preventable mortalities a year, most other civilized countries have more like 60k preventable mortalities a year.)

I know we all must worship corporate interests, but even if you stop 10% of those preventable deaths a year its a pretty good bill.

http://newamerica.net/blog/new-health-dialogue/2009/quality-us-leads-industrialized-world-preventable-deaths-15167

The numbers I saw was 4k every day.

[hanso]

WF loves fries.

Just Freedom fries

Ok, WF. Anyone, anywhere has access to health care at anytime. No one has ever gone bankrupt from having a sick kid or being sick themselves. We already have Universal Healthcare.

Has been at the top of reasons for being bankrupt. And more than likely still is

Yeah, the GOP is going to campaign declaring they will be taking health insurance away from 30 million Americans.
Sounds like a winner.

:lol:

BHO had to use loaded gloves to get the victory. Ali did it with talent something BHO lacks. Enjoy the political little big horn in November when Pelosi loses the speakers gavel

A jarhead patriot supporting a consensus war objector. The more a read your posts the more I think of archie bunker.

[hanso]

You're funny. You make it sound like there's a bunch of people just waiting to receive flat screen TVs. We're talking about improving and extending people's lifespans.

I really don't see that as a frivolous expenditure. I see that as something we should have been budgeting a long time ago. Before most of the programs we waste money on now.

You mean you don't go on marketwatch.com. And have bitch fits over costs hikes. With all the other neocons?

[WRESTLINGFAN]

You mean you don't go on marketwatch.com. And have bitch fits over costs hikes. With all the other neocons?

psst

Opposing BHO doesn't make someone a "neocon". I don't subscribe to the weekly standard

[hanso]

psst

Opposing BHO doesn't make someone a "neocon". I don't subscribe to the weekly standard

I was envisioning what they do on that site.

[Bob Impact]

I was envisioning what they do on that site.

You have a vivid imagination.

[hanso]

You have a vivid imagination.

The link was posted with info on phone rates going up. You mean they don't do that there?

[TjM]

Yup youre right. I do hate puppies and babies too. I light my cigars with $1000 bills

Now you want people to be FORCED to reduce their pay? I want people to get out of being extras ona set and one day being the A list celebrity. As much as I disagree with many celebrities politically, they worked the shitty jobs and lived in the studio apts. What makes you think the key grip and cameramen are living in crack houses in West Hollywood? Youre using extremes

Yeah he's the only one

[TjM]

You can thank all the illegal aliens who dont pay a fucking dime for this mess. The mope from Guatemala doesn't have to worry about getting a bill for popping out another kid

JACKPOT BABY!

[WRESTLINGFAN]

JACKPOT BABY!

Illegals are like Private Pyle in Full Metal Jacket. They ruin it for all of us and then we have to pay for it while they are eating the Jelly donut

[A.J.]

Illegals are like Private Pyle in Full Metal Jacket. They ruin it for all of us and then we have to pay for it while they are eating the Jelly donut

So we get to Code Red the illegals?

[WRESTLINGFAN]

The poor have Medicaid. Seniors have medicare, Kids have SCHIP. Illegals don't deserve anything except a swift kick out of the country. Many of the uninsured opted to lease expensive cars instead of buying insurance. Im sick of the sob stories about someone not being covered yet they have the latest electronics equipment and a new BMW every 3 years dining out every night and going to Cabo every year.

[foodcourtdruide]

The poor have Medicaid. Seniors have medicare, Kids have SCHIP. Illegals don't deserve anything except a swift kick out of the country. Many of the uninsured opted to lease expensive cars instead of buying insurance. Im sick of the sob stories about someone not being covered yet they have the latest electronics equipment and a new BMW every 3 years dining out every night and going to Cabo every year.

You are Archie Bunker.

[booster11373]

You are Archie Bunker.

Archie Bunker made more sense and was funnier

[WRESTLINGFAN]

You are Archie Bunker.

Youre Meathead!!!!

What else are people entitled to? Satellite radio? Gucci Handbags, Grey Goose vodka?

[angrymissy]

The poor have Medicaid. Seniors have medicare, Kids have SCHIP. Illegals don't deserve anything except a swift kick out of the country. Many of the uninsured opted to lease expensive cars instead of buying insurance. Im sick of the sob stories about someone not being covered yet they have the latest electronics equipment and a new BMW every 3 years dining out every night and going to Cabo every year.

And then you have people like my brother who is working part time while going to school part time.

Not qualified for Medicaid. Not qualified to stay on my Dad's insurance. Needs his tonsils out. Tough shit for him. My sister and I have been helping him pay $75 a shot to go to walk in clinic when they flare up to get anitbiotics. The healthcare bill will allow him to go back on my Dad's insurance, thank god.

Or me when I was in my early 20's temping, barely making rent, but still making too much for any public assistance with healthcare.

You make some pretty wild generalizations about people who are uninsured... the majority of them are not driving BMWs and running around with iphones...

[TjM]

And then you have people like my brother who is working part time while going to school part time.

Not qualified for Medicaid. Not qualified to stay on my Dad's insurance. Needs his tonsils out. Tough shit for him. My sister and I have been helping him pay $75 a shot to go to walk in clinic when they flare up to get anitbiotics. The healthcare bill will allow him to go back on my Dad's insurance, thank god.

Or me when I was in my early 20's temping, barely making rent, but still making too much for any public assistance with healthcare.

You make some pretty wild generalizations about people who are uninsured... the majority of them are not driving BMWs and running around with iphones...

You mean poor people don't go to Cabo every year and drive Shelbys?

[underdog]

Youre Meathead!!!!

What else are people entitled to? Satellite radio? Gucci Handbags, Grey Goose vodka?

Yes, because those things are just like affordable health care. Exactly.

[Jujubees2]

Besides giving over 30 million people who previously didn't have it healthcare, the bill also helps college students with student loans and increases Pell Grants.

Obama signs health care ‘fixes,’ student aid bill (http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/36097649/ns/politics-white_house/)

[WRESTLINGFAN]

Oh yes, this will be another success story. As far as the student loan mess, it will be another Fannie/Freddie down the road


http://www.youtube.com/user/schiffreport?blend=1&ob=4#p/a/u/1/QnuQV8Od1Ns

[Syd]

So it was better to have the federal government back student loans, but have another company make money off of it?

[WRESTLINGFAN]

So it was better to have the federal government back student loans, but have another company make money off of it?

The government getting involved in any type caused the tuition rates to skyrocket

[Syd]

The government getting involved in any type caused the tuition rates to skyrocket

The rates are set by the individual companies that were previously offering them?

[tanless1]

The rates are set by the individual companies that were previously offering them?

I believe the rate he refers to is the ever increasing rate the educational institution is charging, not the rate of the lender.
The ed instu is fully aware of the money available to prospective stutdent and increase there rates accordingly.......very similiar to colusion.......I could be wrong

[Ogre]

I believe the rate he refers to is the ever increasing rate the educational institution is charging, not the rate of the lender.
The ed instu is fully aware of the money available to prospective stutdent and increase there rates accordingly.......very similiar to colusion.......I could be wrong

no I think you are correct in the price fixing scenario. where is the fake outrage at the amount of tuitions and maybe say Executive Board compensation for acedemia...oh that's right. Acedemia carries the water for the left so they escape scrutiny. The lenders, however, the evil evil lenders now THEY are the root of the problem why Johnny can't go to school.

[Crispy123]

no I think you are correct in the price fixing scenario. where is the fake outrage at the amount of tuitions and maybe say Executive Board compensation for acedemia...oh that's right. Acedemia carries the water for the left so they escape scrutiny. The lenders, however, the evil evil lenders now THEY are the root of the problem why Johnny can't go to school.

Come on down here to Florida and you will find people protesting the tuition hikes, I heard NPR doing a feature on California colleges and the tuition controversy a couple of weeks ago. Maybe turn off FOX and get the news?

[angrymissy]

no I think you are correct in the price fixing scenario. where is the fake outrage at the amount of tuitions and maybe say Executive Board compensation for acedemia...oh that's right. Acedemia carries the water for the left so they escape scrutiny. The lenders, however, the evil evil lenders now THEY are the root of the problem why Johnny can't go to school.

Plenty of protests on a regular basis on rising costs of tuition... there was a large nationwide one earlier this month, and I've seen protests on the news on a yearly basis for years now.

http://www.upi.com/Daily-Briefing/2010/03/05/Tuition-protests/UPI-63561267795713/

[Syd]

I believe the rate he refers to is the ever increasing rate the educational institution is charging, not the rate of the lender.
The ed instu is fully aware of the money available to prospective stutdent and increase there rates accordingly.......very similiar to colusion.......I could be wrong

Not really, state budget cuts usually go towards education first, especially college funding. Still, it's not like the colleges are going to turn away free money. What are we to do though? This is a bandaid on a bigger problem, but you don't want to not do anything and let it fester.

[Ogre]

Come on down here to Florida and you will find people protesting the tuition hikes, I heard NPR doing a feature on California colleges and the tuition controversy a couple of weeks ago. Maybe turn off FOX and get the news?

No not the lefty let's burn shit down and destroy private property protests (see U Cal "protesters" confront the University President at his residence). Funny how that's called protesting and activism, while little old ladies carrying a misspelled sign is a "domestic terrorist", but that hypocrisy is for another day.

I mean the outrage from Democrats in Congress. Or is that reserved for Banks, Oil and Insurance companies? I would venture to say Deans and Chancellors across academia make "obscene salaries" as do the CEOs.



The "you make too much so we're going to take it from you crowd". You don't hear any of them bitching about the amount these institutions fleece their students for.

No they just go out and create a program that makes it easier to default on a student loan or be a slow pay. What the fuck do you even bother setting up a 529 for your kid for if the Government is going to let you be a deadbeat. But still NOTHING said by the Government. Nobody from academia getting summoned to Capitol Hill to explain themselves.

[high fly]

Maybe the idea is to hope conservatives act on their "principles" and refuse to take any of those "socialist" student loans, thus making more available to everyone else......

[high fly]

So it was better to have the federal government back student loans, but have another company make money off of it?

This is right-wing economics.
They think it costs more if you get services at cost instead of cost + profit.
What makes health care in America so inexpensive is hundreds of billions of dollars in insurance and pharmaceutical company profits every year.
Subtract those profits and you come up with a larger figure.
This is why all those other countries which spend half as much as we do on health care are burdened with such higher costs.
Don't let the smaller price tag or the superior results fool you....

[TeeBone]

http://www.orlandosentinel.com/news/local/breakingnews/os-florida-doctor-shuns-obama-supporters-20100403,0,2153100.story

This was big news on Orlando radio this week. Existing patients had a difficult time getting through to the office due to overwhelming inbound call volume. Everyone wants a piece of the Doctor, as you can well imagine. An unintended consequence of an otherwise funny political statement. Creepy Alan Grayson(D) http://t1.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:-4P9XRnl-XLnSM:http://images.politico.com/global/click/091029_alan_grayson_ap_392.jpgalready excoriated the Doctor. I work in Orlando but live in Tampa and both Congressman Grayson (D) and Congresswoman Kathy Castor (D) http://t1.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:WmaJlgbxo6d3pM:http://www.indianaprosperity.org/photos/31597.jpgare radical idiots who supported the health care farce. Collectivley, I refer to them as, 'The Ghost and the Darkness.'http://t0.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:p3wcY7fmHqcTXM:http://images.travelpod.com/users/shieldsontour/world_tour_2008.1212920040.2-lions-at-sunrise.jpg

[StanUpshaw]

This is right-wing economics.
They think it costs more if you get services at cost instead of cost + profit.
What makes health care in America so inexpensive is hundreds of billions of dollars in insurance and pharmaceutical company profits every year.
Subtract those profits and you come up with a larger figure.
This is why all those other countries which spend half as much as we do on health care are burdened with such higher costs.
Don't let the smaller price tag or the superior results fool you....

When you throw profit into the mix (more specifically, competition for profit), you also get these nifty things like efficiency, technological innovation and sustainability.

[epo]

http://www.orlandosentinel.com/news/local/breakingnews/os-florida-doctor-shuns-obama-supporters-20100403,0,2153100.story

This was big news on Orlando radio this week. Existing patients had a difficult time getting through to the office due to overwhelming inbound call volume. Everyone wants a piece of the Doctor, as you can well imagine. An unintended consequence of an otherwise funny political statement. Creepy Alan Grayson(D) already excoriated the Doctor. I work in Orlando but live in Tampa and both Congressman Grayson (D) and Congresswoman Kathy Castor (D) are radical idiots who supported the health care farce. Collectivley, I refer to them as, '[B][SIZE="4"]The Ghost and the Darkness

I've seen the interviews with that urologist...and quite frankly he's an asshole. There is no place for politics when you are supposed to be caring for parents.

I wouldn't care if he was protesting the war or the health care bill, that physician is completely out of line.

[hanso]

I saw this on cnn about this Dr. They showed the oath they take. The oath states politics are to be left out of it. This guy should be slapped on the wrist at the very least.

[high fly]

When you throw profit into the mix (more specifically, competition for profit), you also get these nifty things like efficiency, technological innovation and sustainability.

Single-payer countries trump us in those categories.
The result is health care that costs more and which gets better results in categorires such as:
life expectancy
infant mortality rate
maternal mortality rate
deaths from digestive diseases
deaths from respiratory diseases
number of doctors per 1,000 citizens
number of hospital beds per 1,000 citizens
percentage of children with immunizations
- and many others.
We are near the top in treating some cancers, but in many categories we are not even in the top 10 or even the 20. Overall, that efficiency thing just doesn't show up in the final results.


Back we go to Business 101.
Class, what is the purpose of a corporation?
The purpose of a corporation is to generate profit for shareholders.
How do health insurance companies accomplish this?
Health insurance companies deliver maximum profit by giving the least amount of service for the greatest price.


Bottom not-so-nifty line: We pay twice as much and get far worse results.

[Jujubees2]

Single-payer countries trump us in those categories.
The result is health care that costs more and which gets better results in categorires such as:
life expectancy
infant mortality rate
maternal mortality rate
deaths from digestive diseases
deaths from respiratory diseases
number of doctors per 1,000 citizens
number of hospital beds per 1,000 citizens
percentage of children with immunizations
- and many others.
We are near the top in treating some cancers, but in many categories we are not even in the top 10 or even the 20. Overall, that efficiency thing just doesn't show up in the final results.


Back we go to Business 101.
Class, what is the purpose of a corporation?
The purpose of a corporation is to generate profit for shareholders.
How do health insurance companies accomplish this?
Health insurance companies deliver maximum profit by giving the least amount of service for the greatest price.


Bottom not-so-nifty line: We pay twice as much and get far worse results.

Amen

[StanUpshaw]

We are also #1 in obesity, which I'd wager is the greatest causal factor in most of those statistics. I'll be interested to see how much further we sink in the rankings once the disincentives are removed, and they have to give you coverage even if you're a 400 lb. diabetic lump of goo.

[TeeBone]

...that physician is completely out of line.

That's twice I have agreed with you in two days. What the FUCK is happening?!?!?!?!

[Syd]

We are also #1 in obesity, which I'd wager is the greatest causal factor in most of those statistics. I'll be interested to see how much further we sink in the rankings once the disincentives are removed, and they have to give you coverage even if you're a 400 lb. diabetic lump of goo.

Comes with lack of forced healthcare. People aren't as knowledgeable about their health as they should be. More people should be forced to see doctors at least every few years.

[StanUpshaw]

Comes with lack of forced healthcare. People aren't as knowledgeable about their health as they should be. More people should be forced to see doctors at least every few years.

Hell, we should just do this thing right and issue everyone a government approved, well-balanced meal three times a day. No more. No less. No exceptions.

[Syd]

Hell, we should just do this thing right and issue everyone a government approved, well-balanced meal three times a day. No more. No less. No exceptions.

You say it in jest, but it's getting out of control. American's average caloric intake is something north of 3000 calories -- people pretty much steadily gain weight a half pound or so a week till they die of complications resulting from being overweight. For whatever reason, people just aren't capable of taking care of themselves. They eat out too often at restaurants that have 50% of your daily requirements for calories and then all the ridiculous fat and salt in it. Milkshakes that are 1k calories, Starbucks drinks that are nearly 1k. It adds up. Obesity isn't anything other than people not being informed of what they're doing to themselves. People want to look at skinny people and think its metabolism or they never eat. No, they just eat 2000 calories and eat a steady diet. People would rather convince themselves that it's genetic or some other excuse. Fact is, they just eat too goddamn many calories. They think exercising enough will offset eating garbage.

[StanUpshaw]

I have no doubt something like this will be appearing on our Telescreens before long:

http://img143.imageshack.us/img143/14/obamacise2.gif
http://www.imagebam.com/image/87099b74897119

[A.J.]

I have no doubt something like this will be appearing on our Telescreens before long:

http://img143.imageshack.us/img143/14/obamacise2.gif
http://www.imagebam.com/image/87099b74897119

As long as he's paying for the liposuction.

[WRESTLINGFAN]

Bye Bye Bart


http://www.cnn.com/2010/POLITICS/04/09/stupak.retiring/index.html?section=cnn_latest

[WRESTLINGFAN]

Michael Moore heading to fat camp. If he loved Cuba so much he could lose the weight in half the time at one of those luxorious Cuban prisons


http://www.news.com.au/entertainment/movies/michael-moore-fighting-the-flab-at-luxe-florida-health-spa/story-e6frfmvr-1225968767613