Obama - Best President Ever?

[TripleSkeet]

just a link (http://www.cnn.com/2010/POLITICS/11/18/obama.gm/index.html?eref=mrss_igoogle_cnn)

Good link. Cant wait to see how its spun.

[WRESTLINGFAN]

There were millions in the private sector who saw pay freezes as well. I feel no pity for anyone in the Fed gov't who dodnt get a pay raise. While the private sector has been bleeding the federal gov't has expanded over the past 2 years. We all hear about shared sacrifice so its time for the redundant bean counters and paper pushers to start pitching in

[TripleSkeet]

I actually agree with you on that. I never understood how people can claim to not be able to live without a yearly raise. If you made ends meet in 2010 making a certain amount of money, you should be able to make it in 2011 with the same amount. Its not like they are freezing pay raises forever.

[A.J.]

There were millions in the private sector who saw pay freezes as well. I feel no pity for anyone in the Fed gov't who dodnt get a pay raise. While the private sector has been bleeding the federal gov't has expanded over the past 2 years. We all hear about shared sacrifice so its time for the redundant bean counters and paper pushers to start pitching in

So why not trim the fat and eliminate the "redundant bean counters and paper pushers" instead of broadly punishing the valuable employees who might have actually earned a raise?

[Barnaby Jones]

So why not trim the fat and eliminate the "redundant bean counters and paper pushers" instead of broadly punishing the valuable employees who might have actually earned a raise?

Logic has no place when WF is going off on one of his usual dumb ass tirades about groups of people he blindly hates!

[Barnaby Jones]

I actually agree with you on that. I never understood how people can claim to not be able to live without a yearly raise. If you made ends meet in 2010 making a certain amount of money, you should be able to make it in 2011 with the same amount. Its not like they are freezing pay raises forever.

He's proposing at least two years, which can be a long ass time if you're not making much! People talk about federal jobs like anyone who gets one is automatically making good money and that's simply not true! Why not look to actually cut redundant positions and freeze pay above a certain level?

[WRESTLINGFAN]

Logic has no place when WF is going off on one of his usual dumb ass tirades about groups of people he blindly hates!


Youre practicing selective reading again BJ. Guess you havent seen the numerous times I posted about triming down the Pentagon for example? Its bloared with thousands of GS level workers


You didnt see the word redundant in my previous post?

[Barnaby Jones]

Just explain why every single federal worker deserves to have their pay frozen for at least two years! EVERY SINGLE ONE, WF! Come on, we'll wait for it! Guess you'll finally have to figure out that they're not all nearly as well off as you think they are!

This is stupid, cowardly, overreacting crap that hurts more people than it helps!!!

[Snacks]

Just explain why every single federal worker deserves to have their pay frozen for at least two years! EVERY SINGLE ONE, WF! Come on, we'll wait for it! Guess you'll finally have to figure out that they're not all nearly as well off as you think they are!

This is stupid, cowardly, overreacting crap that hurts more people than it helps!!!

because they are paid with tax dollars and the people who are paying those tax dollars (private sector) is taken pay freezes, pay cuts or losing their jobs. THATS WHY.

[TripleSkeet]

He's proposing at least two years, which can be a long ass time if you're not making much! People talk about federal jobs like anyone who gets one is automatically making good money and that's simply not true! Why not look to actually cut redundant positions and freeze pay above a certain level?

Its a great idea, just not realistic. Seriously, when do you EVER hear of that really happening? I agree it would be great, but I realize its not going to happen, so the realistic alternative is everyone pitches in, tightens the belt a little, and do what they have to for the betterment of the country.

Theyve had similar problems here with the teachers in NJ. Everyone wants to criticize the governor for laying off teachers, even though he gave the union a choice that would eliminate layoffs if they would take a pay freeze for one year and contribute 1.5% of their earnings to their own medical insurance. They shot it down because they are fucking greedy and dont want to sacrifice for the greater good.

[WRESTLINGFAN]

Just explain why every single federal worker deserves to have their pay frozen for at least two years! EVERY SINGLE ONE, WF! Come on, we'll wait for it! Guess you'll finally have to figure out that they're not all nearly as well off as you think they are!

This is stupid, cowardly, overreacting crap that hurts more people than it helps!!!

THEY HAVE JOB SECURITY!!!!!!

If we start outsourcing IRS tax processors to India then there might be a cause for concern

As much as I want all these agencies scaled back and trimmed down its a pipe dream and its never going to happen even under a GOP President , majority House and Senate.

[Crispy123]

because they are paid with tax dollars and the people who are paying those tax dollars (private sector) is taken pay freezes, pay cuts or losing their jobs. THATS WHY.

Federal workers don't pay taxes? I need to talk to Nancy in personnell!!!

[Barnaby Jones]

Federal workers don't pay taxes? I need to talk to Nancy in personnell!!!

Hahahaah! Perfect!

[Barnaby Jones]

Its a great idea, just not realistic. Seriously, when do you EVER hear of that really happening? I agree it would be great, but I realize its not going to happen, so the realistic alternative is everyone pitches in, tightens the belt a little, and do what they have to for the betterment of the country.

Theyve had similar problems here with the teachers in NJ. Everyone wants to criticize the governor for laying off teachers, even though he gave the union a choice that would eliminate layoffs if they would take a pay freeze for one year and contribute 1.5% of their earnings to their own medical insurance. They shot it down because they are fucking greedy and dont want to sacrifice for the greater good.

This "everyone pitches in equally nonsense" is such horse shit! You focus on the people making too much or not paying enough taxes! THAT'S fair, not spreading it around so that's "equal" for everyone because it never ever fucking ends up being equal! Everyone has their part to play and sacrifices to make, but how does it make sense to freeze the wages of someone making 40k year just the same as someone making 150k just because they technically have the same employer? Treating the people not making much like they're just as much as a problem as the people making way too much is nonsense! Freeze the wages of anyone working for the federal government making more than 60k! Give the people below that (and there's a LOT working for the fed who are way, way below that) a break, for fuck's sake!

[Barnaby Jones]

because they are paid with tax dollars and the people who are paying those tax dollars (private sector) is taken pay freezes, pay cuts or losing their jobs. THATS WHY.

Oh, so we do it out of spite now? Revenge? How petty and childish! Nothing gets done, as per usual, and shit just gets made worse! Brilliant!

[Bob Impact]

This "everyone pitches in equally nonsense" is such horse shit! You focus on the people making too much or not paying enough taxes!

Who get's to decide who is making "too much"?

[Barnaby Jones]

Who get's to decide who is making "too much"?

ME!!!

Though really, I don't know how much is too much, but I do know that thinking that someone that if you have one person making like 5 times as much as someone else and they're both approached as if they both need to have their wages frozen for it to be "fair" it's wrong! That's bullshit logic! I'm all for cutting unnecessary federal jobs and trimming bloated federal salaries, but we don't have to put the clamp down on every single federal worker for that to happen!

[TripleSkeet]

This "everyone pitches in equally nonsense" is such horse shit! You focus on the people making too much or not paying enough taxes! THAT'S fair, not spreading it around so that's "equal" for everyone because it never ever fucking ends up being equal! Everyone has their part to play and sacrifices to make, but how does it make sense to freeze the wages of someone making 40k year just the same as someone making 150k just because they technically have the same employer? Treating the people not making much like they're just as much as a problem as the people making way too much is nonsense! Freeze the wages of anyone working for the federal government making more than 60k! Give the people below that (and there's a LOT working for the fed who are way, way below that) a break, for fuck's sake!

Evcer watch someone with a federal or state job actually work? Those lazy fucks dont deserve a raise in the best of times, let alone when we are trying to cut costs.

[Barnaby Jones]

Brilliant analysis there! Unbelievable that this is the kind of mentality that Obama is spinelessly catering to!!!

[Bob Impact]

ME!!!

Though really, I don't know how much is too much, but I do know that thinking that someone that if you have one person making like 5 times as much as someone else and they're both approached as if they both need to have their wages frozen for it to be "fair" it's wrong! That's bullshit logic! I'm all for cutting unnecessary federal jobs and trimming bloated federal salaries, but we don't have to put the clamp down on every single federal worker for that to happen!

OK, so until you can tell me what is too much I (as the boss in this scenario) have decided that $1 is "too much". Easy enough.

Let me put it to you this way: I make more than the guys who work for me because I'm worth more to the company, simple as that. What non-bullshit logic justifies me taking a freeze and them not? The fact that you feel bad for someone doesn't make your logic sound. It isn't.

[Crispy123]

OK, so until you can tell me what is too much I (as the boss in this scenario) have decided that $1 is "too much". Easy enough.

Let me put it to you this way: I make more than the guys who work for me because I'm worth more to the company, simple as that. What non-bullshit logic justifies me taking a freeze and them not? The fact that you feel bad for someone doesn't make your logic sound. It isn't.

Heres a problem, you are assuming public companies don't use bullshit logic in their pay strucutres. What justifies a CEO, CFO ,and hundreds of VP's getting millions in stock options and bonuses while hourly workers are laid off and lose benefits, when the company doesn't even make a profit?

The federal government has many different departments and pay structures. Including an "executive" pay structure that STARTS in the 6 figure range. It would be more than possible to target some instead of freezing everyone.

And Im sure the military appreciates your assesment of there work ethic TS

[Barnaby Jones]

OK, so until you can tell me what is too much I (as the boss in this scenario) have decided that $1 is "too much". Easy enough.

Let me put it to you this way: I make more than the guys who work for me because I'm worth more to the company, simple as that. What non-bullshit logic justifies me taking a freeze and them not? The fact that you feel bad for someone doesn't make your logic sound. It isn't.

Who makes too little? What's the point of a poverty line? Aren't all of this types of decisions ultimately arbitrary designations?!?! Yes!!! There is no magic answer as to what is actually too much or too little!!! What I'm expecting Obama to do is take a firm stance on this instead of being a wishy-washy wimp!!! Set the level of frozen salaries at $85k and up, or have it that people below a certain point will only have frozen salaries for 18 months or 12 months or 6 months instead of everyone getting hit with 2 years!!! Is $85k "too much?" I have no idea, but in the end it's more fair then acting like someone making $35k a year needs to be "punished" as much as someone making $200k or more!!!! Stagger the periods of frozen wages based on who makes what (which I think is the right way to do it) or set a cut off point as to who is frozen and who isn't, but freezing everyone's salaries for at least 2 years is just dumb!!!

[epo]

Evcer watch someone with a federal or state job actually work? Those lazy fucks dont deserve a raise in the best of times, let alone when we are trying to cut costs.

This is exactly what true monied republicans want. The working class blaming the each other for the nation's budgetary problems and not blaming the lowest taxes rates EVER on the wealthy.

Next they'll want us blaming old people for Social Security expenses.

[Pitdoc]

This is exactly what true monied republicans want. The working class blaming the each other for the nation's budgetary problems and not blaming the lowest taxes rates EVER on the wealthy.

Next they'll want us blaming old people for Social Security expenses.

Not quite the lowest. Reagan lowered it to 28% BUT , that was only in the last 2 years of his 8 year presidency .
Before that, it was 50%!! Still the lunacy of the wealthy using the line that "If you raise our taxes 4.5%, small business will go under " My response to that is "Where were the jobs you created when you had those cuts for EIGHT FUCKING YEARS ?" If Obama relents & gives these bastards their money, he truly is spineless.

[WRESTLINGFAN]

It will never happen but they should repeal the 16th ammendment. Close to 100 years of a progressive income tax and look where it has gotten us. Think about it, no deductions, tax shelters etc.

Deficits and debts are the problem, but the 800lb gorilla is the undunded liabilities.

[epo]

It will never happen but they should repeal the 16th ammendment. Close to 100 years of a progressive income tax and look where it has gotten us. Think about it, no deductions, tax shelters etc.

Flat-tax fans are mentally unstable.

[Bob Impact]

What I'm expecting Obama to do is take a firm stance on this instead of being a wishy-washy wimp!!! Set the level of frozen salaries at $85k and up, or have it that people below a certain point will only have frozen salaries for 18 months or 12 months or 6 months instead of everyone getting hit with 2 years!!! Is $85k "too much?" I have no idea, but in the end it's more fair then acting like someone making $35k a year needs to be "punished" as much as someone making $200k or more!!!! Stagger the periods of frozen wages based on who makes what (which I think is the right way to do it) or set a cut off point as to who is frozen and who isn't, but freezing everyone's salaries for at least 2 years is just dumb!!!

I wouldn't mind the idea of shorter times for the lower salary ranges, ostensibly the idea is that someone making $50K cannot afford to plan as far ahead as someone making $150K.

My issue with all of these things is this: I can't be angry at or judge somebody based on what they make, I can only judge a person based on their merits.

I think the biggest issue is that this is considered a blanket punishment, specifically the idea of compulsory step increases where everyone gets a certain percentage raise every year whether deserved or not. For those who don't get a raise and deserve one it is a punishment, but they are lumped in with those who don't deserve a raise. The simple solution is to not put a freeze in place, but to cut bloated salaries as you and others have mentioned several time before and to shift away from blanket "cost of living" raises. Annual raises should be between the employer and the individual employee based on performance.

[Barnaby Jones]

I think the biggest issue is that this is considered a blanket punishment, specifically the idea of compulsory step increases where everyone gets a certain percentage raise every year whether deserved or not. For those who don't get a raise and deserve one it is a punishment, but they are lumped in with those who don't deserve a raise. The simple solution is to not put a freeze in place, but to cut bloated salaries as you and others have mentioned several time before and to shift away from blanket "cost of living" raises. Annual raises should be between the employer and the individual employee based on performance.

I could not agree more! I understand and agree with much of the sentiment driving the idea, but I find the execution to be too broad and lazy!!!

[WRESTLINGFAN]

Whats behind curtain # 1 ?


http://news.yahoo.com/s/nm/20101205/pl_nm/us_usa_taxes_congress_1


This is for Obama supporters does this break the camels back? Will this make you lose all support for him now? and should there be a Dem primary for '12? He was renegged on some key issues. I think that this was one of his campaign promises in that people with incomes of 250K and up will pay more, even though this might be a temporary extension, some of my progressive friends are heated about this. Do you believe this makes him weak? He did not get the public option, the left wanted that big time. Do you think he becomes a Clintonite going forward?

[Bob Impact]

Oh god the comments section of that story is absolutely priceless.

[pennington]

Oh god the comments section of that story is absolutely priceless.

There's one comment that goes on for 37 lines. It's all one sentence.

[WRESTLINGFAN]

OK so who is the priamry challenger? Kucinich oe Hillary?

[Dude!]

OK so who is the priamry challenger? Kucinich oe Hillary?

ha ha...
probably not clinton, now
as it looks like obama has
"gone clintonian"

feingold...
with epo as his
campaign manager

[WRESTLINGFAN]

ha ha...
probably not clinton, now
as it looks like obama has
"gone clintonian"

feingold...
with epo as his
campaign manager

I hope Obama nails a better looking intern.

[Dude!]

I hope Obama nails a better looking intern.

i heard he keeps
a fleet of young men

[WRESTLINGFAN]

i heard he keeps
a fleet of young men

Not going to happen, Barney Frank has them all

[Dudeman]

http://www.nytimes.com/2010/12/24/opinion/24krugman.html?_r=1&partner=rssnyt&emc=rss

Gives some insight into why WF and the rest of the rubes on the right are so mis-informed.

[booster11373]

http://www.nytimes.com/2010/12/24/opinion/24krugman.html?_r=1&partner=rssnyt&emc=rss

Gives some insight into why WF and the rest of the rubes on the right are so mis-informed.

This comment on the article says it all for me


1.
pdxtran
Minneapolis
December 24th, 2010
2:11 am
Thanks to thirty years of right-wing PR rarely subjected to vigorous (as opposed to wimpy and half-hearted) challenges in the mainstream press, thanks to schools that emphasize job training and getting THE right answer instead of broad general knowledge and critical reasoning, thanks to entertainment media that glorify the mean and dumb, a lot of Americans are so indoctrinated that they don't know they're indoctrinated.

They have their talking points; they don't need no stinkin' facts.

All their talking points have to do with meanness, selfishness, greed, and disdain for anyone who doesn't follow their line.

Projection plays a huge role as well. Fox News and AM radio have been spewing insane accusations and epithets for over twenty years, and yet one of the right-wing talking points is that liberals are "hate-filled."

Right-wingers also accuse the left of practicing "the politics of envy" because of wanting to make the tax code more progressive or to rein in the banksters, but look what happens when the topic turns to public employees, especially public school teachers. "All those public employees have benefits that the rest of us don't have! They should suffer like those of us in the private sector! They're the reason governments are going broke!"

If that isn't the politics of envy, I don't know what is, and of course, the non-reflective consumer of right-wing media never stops to think, "If public employees have those benefits now, and my parents had those benefits in the 1950s and '60s, why don't I have them, too?"

No, it's all about those "greedy" and "incompetent" schoolteachers, protected by their "corrupt" and "overly demanding" unions, and evidently solely responsible for both state deficits and the inability of many schoolchildren to overcome appalling home lives and desperate social conditions.

The same right-wingers who think schoolteachers are overpaid also think that hedge fund managers earn hundreds of millions of dollars a year because "they work harder than other people."

When confronted by facts, unintelligent right-wingers just repeat their talking points louder or start flinging irrelevant insults. Their more intelligent ideological kin try to deflect the discussion and goad the other party into overreacting or giving up. (An online troll once admitted that this was his tactic.)

The Democrats have been co-opted from within by factions such as the Democratic Leadership Council (politicians who are Republicans at heart but too embarrassed by the stupidity and Puritanism of the Republican base to join the G.O.P.) and have been unable to oppose the Republican attacks on the middle class and the poor.

Now the Republicans are back in power, and their claques are going to be insufferable.

[WRESTLINGFAN]

http://www.nytimes.com/2010/12/24/opinion/24krugman.html?_r=1&partner=rssnyt&emc=rss

Gives some insight into why WF and the rest of the rubes on the right are so mis-informed.

Paul Fucking Krugman...Is that the best you got? And you call me a rube?

Most of the banksters dnated to the Obama campaign. That alone makes this article laughable

Fucking Keynsians


:lol::lol::lol::lol::lol::lol::lol::lol::lol::lol: :lol::lol::lol::lol::lol::lol::lol::lol::lol::lol: :lol::lol::lol::lol::lol::lol::lol::lol::lol::lol: :lol::lol::lol::lol::lol::lol::lol::lol::lol::lol: :lol::lol::lol::lol::lol::lol::lol::lol::lol:

[WRESTLINGFAN]

http://www.nytimes.com/2010/12/24/opinion/24krugman.html?_r=1&partner=rssnyt&emc=rss

Gives some insight into why WF and the rest of the rubes on the right are so mis-informed.

Thankfully not every commenter is some rube living in a cocoon on the Upper West Side.


"When is the penalty for being a saver and productive person ever going to stop. Yes attitudes on public policy havent changed - but today our tax dollars are supposed to fund everything from inner-city chess clubs to in-state tuition for illegal aliens. You already have a progressive tax regime in place and massive welfare state with social safety nets for every single drug addict and the children they produce - what else can a lefty ask for?

Seriously after paying income corporate taxes on fed/state and city level, then personal fed income/state/city and then property and sales tax. I am looking at taking home less then 30% of earned income.

Not to mention that the federal reserve dilutes the power of the US dollar by 95% over the course of the past 60 years (another back door tax, that enriches leveraged finance industry). "

[WRESTLINGFAN]

Krugman fails to realize that the supporters of the 16th Ammendment said that it would never tax more than 10% of income, well that pesky WWI changed all that and look what happened ever since.

He wants to talk about greed? Of course his masters at the federal government aren't greedy at all. Of course 100 years of progressivism does not constitute greed. Massive bloated bureaucracies arent greedy no, thats all some racist neocon bible thumping fallacy.


Krugman is another sheltered hack who lives in a bubble.



Krugman has zero credibility.

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424052748703977004575393353665119526.html


http://www.lewrockwell.com/anderson/anderson229.html

[Zorro]

Never impressed by the guy. Thought he did more harm than good to Obama as President. Was he pushed or did he leave on his own?

[Crispy123]

Krugman fails to realize that the supporters of the 16th Ammendment said that it would never tax more than 10% of income, well that pesky WWI changed all that and look what happened ever since.

He wants to talk about greed? Of course his masters at the federal government aren't greedy at all. Of course 100 years of progressivism does not constitute greed. Massive bloated bureaucracies arent greedy no, thats all some racist neocon bible thumping fallacy.


Krugman is another sheltered hack who lives in a bubble.



Wow, dodge the points of the article and call names. You sure proved he is a hack!

[Dudeman]

Wow, dodge the points of the article and call names. You sure proved he is a hack!

Yeah, there was no reason at all to respond to his rambling response to a simple article.

[WRESTLINGFAN]

Never impressed by the guy. Thought he did more harm than good to Obama as President. Was he pushed or did he leave on his own?

Really a non issue. Dubya went thru a lot of Press secs.

[underdog]

Really a non issue. Dubya went thru a lot of Press secs.

You're right. Being the press secretary must be a tough job, lying constantly. It's to be left to trained politicians.

[Zorro]

Really a non issue. Dubya went thru a lot of Press secs.

Disagree...Track Bush's poll numbers when Fleischer & Snow were Press Sec and see the tumble as the blonde who's name escapes me took over. It may not be a direct relationship, but I would guess a good Pres Sec can make your life in Washington easier.

[WRESTLINGFAN]

You're right. Being the press secretary must be a tough job, lying constantly. It's to be left to trained politicians.

McClellan was the worst, the amount of sweat than man produced, He looked so uncomfortable up there

[Dudeman]

You're right. Being the press secretary must be a tough job, lying constantly. It's to be left to trained politicians.


A press sec leaving is only relevant if they turn around a write a book calling the president and his closest advisors liars. Sometimes the press secretary is lied to...

Former White House press secretary Scott McClellan names names in a caustic passage from a forthcoming memoir that accuses President Bush, Karl Rove and Vice President Cheney of being "involved" in his giving the press false information about the CIA leak case.
(http://www.politico.com/news/stories/1107/6994.html)

Former White House press secretary Scott McClellan writes in a new memoir that the Iraq war was sold to the American people with a sophisticated "political propaganda campaign" led by President Bush and aimed at "manipulating sources of public opinion" and "downplaying the major reason for going to war."
(http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2008/05/27/AR2008052703679.html)

[TripleSkeet]

A press sec leaving is only relevant if they turn around a write a book calling the president and his closest advisors liars. Sometimes the press secretary is lied to...

Former White House press secretary Scott McClellan names names in a caustic passage from a forthcoming memoir that accuses President Bush, Karl Rove and Vice President Cheney of being "involved" in his giving the press false information about the CIA leak case.
(http://www.politico.com/news/stories/1107/6994.html)

Former White House press secretary Scott McClellan writes in a new memoir that the Iraq war was sold to the American people with a sophisticated "political propaganda campaign" led by President Bush and aimed at "manipulating sources of public opinion" and "downplaying the major reason for going to war."
(http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2008/05/27/AR2008052703679.html)

Im calling shananigans. The government doesnt lie. Ive learned this recently.

[spoon]

Wow, dodge the points of the article and call names. You sure proved he is a hack!

Yep. I find it funny the proof sources WF always uses too. It's like using what Rush says against Obama as fact, or Keith Oberman versus Bush. I'd much rather take in both POVs and make a call on these things myself. I can't say Krugman is unbiased either, but I do agree with a ton of what he says in the end.

First WF hits us with a WSJ Opinion Section piece by James Taranto hitting Krugman for using some hyperbole here and there on points even the author admits his point is valid overall. Funny stuff in the end, as his next article is all about Palin so be sure to read that riveting piece on "Trig-truther crackpottery" too!

Next WF gives us Frostburg State University's William L. Anderson blog the William Anderson Archives! Put out there via the LewRockwell.com and it's motto, "Anit-State, Anti-War, Pro-Market". Here Anderson states, "he (Krugman) does not believe in laws of economics". What the fuck that actually means I have no clue?! I take it as he sees things differently, so he's wrong according to Anderson views. Great proof source buddy. Another opinion piece. I guess it's a little up from a random blog you have hit us with in the past. I'm sure nobody could find the opposite view on this...not even worth the effort really.

[spoon]

Yeah, there was no reason at all to respond to his rambling response to a simple article.

Oops, I tried...again. :wacko:

[WRESTLINGFAN]

Yep. I find it funny the proof sources WF always uses too. It's like using what Rush says against Obama as fact, or Keith Oberman versus Bush. I'd much rather take in both POVs and make a call on these things myself. I can't say Krugman is unbiased either, but I do agree with a ton of what he says in the end.

First WF hits us with a WSJ Opinion Section piece by James Taranto hitting Krugman for using some hyperbole here and there on points even the author admits his point is valid overall. Funny stuff in the end, as his next article is all about Palin so be sure to read that riveting piece on "Trig-truther crackpottery" too!

Next WF gives us Frostburg State University's William L. Anderson blog the William Anderson Archives! Put out there via the LewRockwell.com and it's motto, "Anit-State, Anti-War, Pro-Market". Here Anderson states, "he (Krugman) does not believe in laws of economics". What the fuck that actually means I have no clue?! I take it as he sees things differently, so he's wrong according to Anderson views. Great proof source buddy. Another opinion piece. I guess it's a little up from a random blog you have hit us with in the past. I'm sure nobody could find the opposite view on this...not even worth the effort really.



Krugman's a Keynesian. That's not opinion its fact. He wants to talk about Republican greed. Yes there is but he says nothing about government greed.


Then again he was an economic consultant to Enron. He has zero credibility

[spoon]

Krugman's a Keynesian. That's not opinion its fact. He wants to talk about Republican greed. Yes there is but he says nothing about government greed.


Then again he was an economic consultant to Enron. He has zero credibility

Or he's seen things from both sides?

[spoon]

Krugman's a Keynesian. That's not opinion its fact.

And? That proves your point how?

[underdog]

And? That proves your point how?

He had a point?

[Zorro]

Krugman is the smartest guy in the room that no one pays attention. He a known self promoter and expected to have a big spot in the Clinton White House and was denied. Same thing happened this time around. He's well regarded in academia, but in the actual application of policy; required as a member of government he is not looked upon as a team player and is famously known to have a bitter streak. Smart guy no personality skills

[spoon]

He had a point?

good point ^ see how it's done WF! :lol:

[WRESTLINGFAN]

Well its because hes an awful at giving presents.


http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1358965/Obamas-invited-Prince-William-Kate-Middletons-Royal-wedding.html

[Crispy123]

We are about to be in an Air War in Africa...

Obama sends U.S. aircraft for Libyan airlift. (http://www.reuters.com/assets/print?aid=USTRE7226FG20110303)

[hanso]

Airlift, sounds like a humanitarian mesure.

[Crispy123]

Airlift, sounds like a humanitarian mesure.

From the article:

Calls for a "no-fly" zone over the oil-producing North African nation have also come from several senior members of the U.S. Congress.

Obama said he had asked his military and diplomatic advisers to examine "a full range of options" and that a no-fly zone was one of those.



and then:

Defense Secretary Robert Gates on Wednesday warned against "loose talk" about a no-fly zone.

"Let's just call a spade a spade. A no-fly zone begins with an attack on Libya to destroy the air defenses," Gates said.

He and other officials have listed logistical and diplomatic hurdles to such action.



So it is starting out as humanitarian but if Gadaffi don't cut the shit (which isn't likely) we WILL find ourselves in ANOTHER conflict.

[A.J.]

We are about to be in an Air War in Africa...

Obama sends U.S. aircraft for Libyan airlift. (http://www.reuters.com/assets/print?aid=USTRE7226FG20110303)

Fuck that. Let the Europeans handle it.

[spoon]

Fuck that. Let the Europeans handle it.

100% agree

[WRESTLINGFAN]

100% agree

I second that.

Unfortunately I don't think thats going to happen.


Gas has hit $4 a gallon in Suburban NYC TODAY :thumbdown::thumbdown::thumbdown:

[hanso]

The Dutch tried to rescue some refugees and got into some shit.

http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2011/03/03/501364/main20038752.shtml

[WRESTLINGFAN]

Energy expert Obama might say this again


<iframe title="YouTube video player" width="480" height="390" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/XzZNP4tTfV0" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

[Dude!]

Energy expert Obama might say this again


<iframe title="YouTube video player" width="480" height="390" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/XzZNP4tTfV0" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

what a lying sack o'shit

[WRESTLINGFAN]

We will be seeing the lemmings carry these naive signs like this again.


http://wwwp.dailyclimate.org/tdc-newsroom/2010/03/03photos/green-jobs-408.jpg/image_preview

[A.J.]

We will be seeing the lemmings carry these naive signs like this again.


http://wwwp.dailyclimate.org/tdc-newsroom/2010/03/03photos/green-jobs-408.jpg/image_preview

I hope those signs were made on recycled paper with eco-friendly inks.

[underdog]

http://thechive.files.wordpress.com/2009/05/youre-an-idiot-4.jpg?w=499&h=860

[spoon]

nice work udog

love the fact his t-shirt is topical

ICED EARTH

[WRESTLINGFAN]

I hope those signs were made on recycled paper with eco-friendly inks.

They were probably made in China

[jonyrotn]

http://thechive.files.wordpress.com/2009/05/youre-an-idiot-4.jpg?w=499&h=860
I didn't even know Jay Leno had a son..

[jonyrotn]

I hope those signs were made on recycled paper with eco-friendly inks.
and by green, they mean money..

[jonyrotn]

I hope those signs were made on recycled paper with eco-friendly inks.
I meant..
and by green THEY mean money...

[jonyrotn]

We will be seeing the lemmings carry these naive signs like this again.


http://wwwp.dailyclimate.org/tdc-newsroom/2010/03/03photos/green-jobs-408.jpg/image_preview What I REALLY meant was...
and by green, THEY meant money..





I hope I got it right this time..

[jonyrotn]

What I REALLY meant was...
and by green, THEY meant money..





I hope I got it right this time..
YES!!!!
*saturday night fever finger point dance*

[WRESTLINGFAN]

Obama and Sheen can star in a new show.


2 and a half Kilos


http://townhall.com/political-cartoons/natebeeler/2011/03/02/81618

[WRESTLINGFAN]

YOU LIE !!!!!




http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20110314/ap_on_go_pr_wh/us_sunshine_week_foia

[Bob Impact]

NO HE DIDN'T!!!!!

http://www.data.gov/

Seriously, go after him for shit that matters.

[WRESTLINGFAN]

Keep hitting the links Obama. He will have plenty of time after 1/20/13


http://blogs.abcnews.com/politicalpunch/2011/03/just-warm-enough-for-golf-obama-back-on-the-course.html


Or maybe he can be an analyst for ESPN with his NCAA Brackets

[Crispy123]

Good point WF, he really is the best president at golf. I also agree that in his second term he will only improve.

[A.J.]

Good point WF, he really is the best president at golf.

No way.

http://robertfagan.com/files/2010/07/Fordputting-green-1975.jpg

[WRESTLINGFAN]

Good point WF, he really is the best president at golf. I also agree that in his second term he will only improve.

Yup jes better than Dubya at golf and ruining en economy. If he gets a 2nd term, we deserve to be taken over by the Chinese


And BTW. So far no one for the GOP isn't looking any better. So far theres a serial adulterer and a dopey pastor who tossed their hats in

[Crispy123]

Yup jes better than Dubya at golf and running en economy.

Totally agree. The Dems are just better all the way around. Glad you are finally making sense for once!

[Furtherman]

The NCAA excuse is pathetic. Where have I heard it before... oh yea, March 2010... and wait... March 2009!!

I can't wait to get all angry about it in March 2012.



Last night the President hosted a dinner for veterans. VETERANS?! Has the man have no soul???

[Crispy123]

Last night the President hosted a dinner for veterans. VETERANS?! Has the man have no soul???

Seriously, veterans are overrated. Only veterans that work with chimpanzees should be allowed to use the term Dr. The rest of those guys are just quaks.

[WRESTLINGFAN]

The NCAA excuse is pathetic. Where have I heard it before... oh yea, March 2010... and wait... March 2009!!

I can't wait to get all angry about it in March 2012.



Last night the President hosted a dinner for veterans. VETERANS?! Has the man have no soul???

I know Presidents do things like this. However the fawning and slobbering over this is pathetic. If dubya did this, there would be special comments that he doesnt care, or that hes out of touch with reality and that he was acting in a dazed, self indulgent manner.


Obama gave a speech on Gender equality and goes to play golf probably at an all mens club


You will be very angry when hes doing his picks as a civilian

[WRESTLINGFAN]

The NCAA excuse is pathetic. Where have I heard it before... oh yea, March 2010... and wait... March 2009!!

I can't wait to get all angry about it in March 2012.



Last night the President hosted a dinner for veterans. VETERANS?! Has the man have no soul???

How many Corpse-men were in attendence ?

[WRESTLINGFAN]

Totally agree. The Dems are just better all the way around. Glad you are finally making sense for once!

Yup running an economy.


INTO THE GROUND!!!

[Crispy123]

Yup running an economy.


INTO THE GROUND!!!

Yes ground level is an improvement over the GOP way! I am so happy we are getting positive WF for a change.

[WRESTLINGFAN]

Yes ground level is an improvement over the GOP way! I am so happy we are getting positive WF for a change.

Positive that Obama will be 1 and gone

[Crispy123]

Thats right 1 win after another for the president.

Short Term Budget Bill Passes (http://firstread.msnbc.msn.com/_news/2011/03/15/6274913-54-gopers-buck-leaders-as-short-term-budget-bill-passes-house)
and
Congress to work out 2011 spending (http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/42106970/ns/politics-capitol_hill/)

[WRESTLINGFAN]

Thats right 1 win after another for the president.

Short Term Budget Bill Passes (http://firstread.msnbc.msn.com/_news/2011/03/15/6274913-54-gopers-buck-leaders-as-short-term-budget-bill-passes-house)
and
Congress to work out 2011 spending (http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/42106970/ns/politics-capitol_hill/)

When he wins, we all lose

[Crispy123]

When he wins, we all love it

Again, 100% correct!

[WRESTLINGFAN]

The professional left isn't happy either


http://thehill.com/homenews/administration/149823-as-president-throws-bones-to-base-liberal-anger-wanes

[Crispy123]

The professional left isn't happy either


http://thehill.com/homenews/administration/149823-as-president-throws-bones-to-base-liberal-anger-wanes



The change in the political winds has been surprising, especially in the wake of historic GOP gains in the midterm elections. Many political pundits predicted that the rift between the left and Obama would intensify as he and his administration moved right, talking about reducing the deficit, extending the Afghanistan war and pursuing trade deals.

But the exact opposite has happened, and Obama’s approval ratings — as well as his chances for winning reelection — have improved.

By and large, liberal criticism of Obama has been notably missing in recent weeks, something Democrats on Capitol Hill acknowledge.


Your link would seem to indicate the opposite of what you posted. I am absolutely sure you read the article, so this must be an attempt at HUMOR. Bravo!!! This really is a red letter day!

[underdog]

I know Presidents do things like this. However the fawning and slobbering over this is pathetic. If dubya did this, there would be special comments that he doesnt care, or that hes out of touch with reality and that he was acting in a dazed, self indulgent manner.


Obama gave a speech on Gender equality and goes to play golf probably at an all mens club


You will be very angry when hes doing his picks as a civilian

I'm sick of you and your fellow regressives bringing up Bush every chance you get. WE GET IT. He was a terrible president. You don't need to mention him all the time. Move on. It's 2011.

[underdog]

Seriously, veterans are overrated. Only veterans that work with chimpanzees should be allowed to use the term Dr. The rest of those guys are just quaks.

I'm sorry Crispy, but if WF can equate all immigrants with the shitty actions of a few, I have to assume all veterans are like WF.

[Crispy123]

I'm sorry Crispy, but if WF can equate all immigrants with the shitty actions of a few, I have to assume all veterans are like WF.

That is just wrong, sir. Its illegal immigrants that he says are the problem, and all the brown ones. So I could only understand it if you didn't like illegal veterans, and all the brown ones.

[WRESTLINGFAN]

I'm sick of you and your fellow regressives bringing up Bush every chance you get. WE GET IT. He was a terrible president. You don't need to mention him all the time. Move on. It's 2011.

Agreed Dubya was terrible , but so is current president.


You regressives have been parroting, the last 8 years,

[WRESTLINGFAN]

That is just wrong, sir. Its illegal immigrants that he says are the problem, and all the brown ones. So I could only understand it if you didn't like illegal veterans, and all the brown ones.

The illegal Irish are also a problem and they sure as hell aint brown.


And BTW they are not immigrants. The feds even classify them as aliens

However speaking about illegal aliens. One thing the administration has done better than the previous one is....


More have been shown the door

[WRESTLINGFAN]

Your link would seem to indicate the opposite of what you posted. I am absolutely sure you read the article, so this must be an attempt at HUMOR. Bravo!!! This really is a red letter day!

Obama's chances for winning improving?

http://www.israpundit.com/2008/wp-content/uploads/2008/05/obama_carter.jpg

[underdog]

Agreed Dubya was terrible , but so is current president.


You regressives have been parroting, the last 8 years,

No, we're progressives.

And I'm pretty sure you're basically the only person on this board who still brings up Bush, and you bring him up quite a bit.

[WRESTLINGFAN]

No, we're progressives.

And I'm pretty sure you're basically the only person on this board who still brings up Bush, and you bring him up quite a bit.

Im not the only one.

[Dude!]

Obama's chances for winning improving?

http://www.israpundit.com/2008/wp-content/uploads/2008/05/obama_carter.jpg


obama is so inept and lazy
that most people are now praying
that he leaves the country
in the same shape carter did

[Crispy123]

the Retard! has entered the fray
he has to bash Obama
so no one will notice he's gay
not that theres anything
wrong with that per se
except when that Retard!
rapes a shar pei

[WRESTLINGFAN]

obama is so inept and lazy
that most people are now praying
that he leaves the country
in the same shape carter did

I wonder how he is with building houses and slobbering over Hamas

[Crispy123]

I wonder how he is with building houses and slobbering over Hamas

Come on now, we are all progressives here. You two don't have to hide your lovers talk behind rascist psuedo-poltical banter.

[Jujubees2]

I wonder how he is with building houses and slobbering over Hamas

Who wouldn't slobber over a good plate of hummus?

https://www.examiner.com/images/blog/EXID24837/images/hummus.jpg

[WRESTLINGFAN]

Come on now, we are all progressives here. You two don't have to hide your lovers talk behind rascist psuedo-poltical banter.

Wanting white Irish illegals booted out is racist?


Hilarious

[Crispy123]

Wanting white Irish illegals booted out is racist?


Hilarious

Sure, why not?



Confusing

[WRESTLINGFAN]

Sure, why not?



Confusing

Well I am caucasian

[Crispy123]

thats impressive. how did you do it?

[WRESTLINGFAN]

Dollar record low against the Yen

http://online.wsj.com/article/BT-CO-20110316-714778.html

Home building down sharply

http://www.washingtonpost.com/business/economy/level_of_us_home_construction_drops_sharply/2011/03/16/AB3U09g_story.html?wprss=rss_homepage

Deficit rises the most ever. Feb only has 28 days

http://news.yahoo.com/s/nm/20110310/bs_nm/us_usa_budget_7



Dont worry the economy is in a recovery.


http://gulagbound.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/03/Baghdad-Bob.jpg


Whatever happened to Baghdad Bob? He should be the WH Press sec

[Syd]

1) Yen is about to experience inflation

2) housing has zero demand, most of the demand was from second homes or first time homeowners based on bullshit loan credentials

3) better cut our taxes more!

[spoon]

1) Yen is about to experience inflation

2) housing has zero demand, most of the demand was from second homes or first time homeowners based on bullshit loan credentials

3) better cut our taxes more!

STOP MAKING SENSE and not just drawing simple conclusions based on blind hate!

[WRESTLINGFAN]

STOP MAKING SENSE and not just drawing simple conclusions based on blind hate!

1. Ever hear of QE2 ? How about the fed now buying Mortgages, not just T bills

2. Housing has not bottomed because the gov't meddled in with the 8000 tax credit, mortgage modification and artifically increasing prices during the tax credit program.
As long as gov't interferes, there will not be a bottom

3. The buck stops with him. He agreed to keep taxes at Bush levels. Plus spending is still out of control. The Democrats cry when a measly 60 billion wants to be cut. (Still not enough)

I'll add gas at $4.00 a gallon which is a hidden tax. Could go to $5 by the summer


Net job creation since stimulus is a deficit. Obama rescued the economy though right?


Is the country better off now than 2 years ago? Of course not.


Your blind faith is troublesome

[spoon]

Figuring he took over an economy with progressively bad outcomes over the next few years no matter what way you looked at it yes. So far he helped stave off a much worse recession, job losses and possibly another depression. I'm not one to agree on all his policy, especially his tax cut extension garbage, but he can only work from where he started.

Not to many Presidents have started from such a low/sinking point. It doesn't change over night and we'll surely need to make longer lasting changes to keep this from happening again. This is where OBama is truly failing in my mind. It's as if nobody had a part in this huge dismantling of our financial system to be exploited by some truly disgusting people. Pretty much nothing has come from it, but yet we put Martha Stewart in jail for fucking pennies on the dollar or less.

[epo]

WrestlingFan claims that an Irishman can't be brown. Tell that to Phil Lynott.

Racist.

[WRESTLINGFAN]

The Yen is down because Japans Central bank is doing what we do. They pumped billions of Yen into the economy after the earthquake. In times of disasters the money supply needs to be contracted not expanded. Japan has about 900 billion of US treasuries they can sell to pay for the cleanup and reconstruction.


As for our garbage currency, dont shut off those printing presses yet. There could be QE3

[Syd]

They're going to shut off the presses because there's finally some inflation in the market. I don't think you get how most of the economy in America is completely imaginary and based on infinitely leveraged money, and how the only way printing money would be bad is if it somehow became real (i.e. giving it out to citizens)

[Jujubees2]

As for our garbage currency, dont shut off those printing presses yet. There could be QE3

Will it be bigger than the QE2?
http://www.worldshipny.com/images/qe2atsea2b.jpg

[Furtherman]

Dollar record low against the Yen

http://online.wsj.com/article/BT-CO-20110316-714778.html

Home building down sharply

http://www.washingtonpost.com/business/economy/level_of_us_home_construction_drops_sharply/2011/03/16/AB3U09g_story.html?wprss=rss_homepage

Deficit rises the most ever. Feb only has 28 days

http://news.yahoo.com/s/nm/20110310/bs_nm/us_usa_budget_7



Dont worry the economy is in a recovery.



Wait... you mean it didn't recover in 24 hours?!

Well that's bullshit.

[WRESTLINGFAN]

Wait... you mean it didn't recover in 24 hours?!

Well that's bullshit.

Youre like the Neo Cons talking about Iraq Circa 2004-05

[Furtherman]

Youre like the Neo Cons talking about Iraq Circa 2004-05

Am I?

[WRESTLINGFAN]

Am I?



You sound like them. 2 years into his presidency and what does he have to show for it?


On taxes, it's all on him he cut the deal to keep the levels at what they are

[Furtherman]

No... I was joking on your post. Thanks for playing.

[WRESTLINGFAN]

No... I was joking on your post. Thanks for playing.



Neo lib ?

[WRESTLINGFAN]

Bye bye Obama school


http://www.app.com/article/20110317/NJNEWS/110317060/State-monitor-orders-Asbury-s-Barack-Obama-School-closed?odyssey=tab|topnews|text|Frontpage


mmm mmmm mmmmove to another school

[high fly]

Criticize all you want, but there is no one out there right now who could beat Obama if the election were held today.

[WRESTLINGFAN]

Criticize all you want, but there is no one out there right now who could beat Obama if the election were held today.

The election isn't today. He has time to fuck up even more.


You are right though, Newt sure as hell would not win if it were held today

[A.J.]

You are right though, Newt sure as hell would not win if it were held today

Newt's not going to win no matter what day it was held.

[WRESTLINGFAN]

Newt's not going to win no matter what day it was held.

Agreed!!!


I was using him as an example for if the election was today since he was the 1st one to form an exploratory cmte.

[hush]

Obama's tenure as President could be most summed up by one action...

Publicly voicing his support for Mike Vick.

[Rube]

Boy..it must be a hard job being President. No matter what party you come from.

[WRESTLINGFAN]

FLOTUS better get her district moving


http://www.nbcchicago.com/news/local/First-Ladys-Ill-District-Last-in-Healthy-Behavior-118940874.html?dr

[WRESTLINGFAN]

Let the waivers continue


http://news.yahoo.com/s/ac/20110324/pl_ac/8135546_ny_rep_anthony_weiner_may_seek_obamacare_w aiver_1

[Zorro]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VIA5aszzA18

The Fake then the real (in no particular order)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f-VZLvVF1FQ

[WRESTLINGFAN]

As Jon Liebowitz stated on the daily show in regards to Obama 2012, everyone looks exhausted

2012 With the Obama symbol.... Really? That brand fizzled in 2009, Its gone the way of the Edsel

[keithy_19]

As Jon Liebowitz stated on the daily show in regards to Obama 2012, everyone looks exhausted

2012 With the Obama symbol.... Really? That brand fizzled in 2009, Its gone the way of the Edsel

This one is much better suited for him.

http://www.moonbattery.com/obama_hammer_sickle.jpg

[WRESTLINGFAN]

Obamas nutrition nannies are here to protect us from the big bad burgers and fries. Clearly the citizens can not be trusted to make informed decisions on their own


http://articles.latimes.com/2011/apr/02/news/sc-dc-0402-fda-nutrition-labels-20110402

[A.J.]

Obamas nutrition nannies are here to protect us from the big bad burgers and fries. Clearly the citizens can not be trusted to make informed decisions on their own


http://articles.latimes.com/2011/apr/02/news/sc-dc-0402-fda-nutrition-labels-20110402

Sorry, but I'm going to support Obama on this one. If the government is going to come after smokers like me, then it can go after the fat asses as well.

[Crispy123]

Clearly the citizens can not be trusted to make informed decisions on their own




I agree 100%. Although, it is always disastrous to arm the citizens with information. I won't tolerate this behavior from The Federal Government and The President.

[Zorro]

Obamas nutrition nannies are here to protect us from the big bad burgers and fries. Clearly the citizens can not be trusted to make informed decisions on their own


http://articles.latimes.com/2011/apr/02/news/sc-dc-0402-fda-nutrition-labels-20110402

This is "true capitialism" by providing as much information as available people will truly be able to act in their own self-interest.

[WRESTLINGFAN]

People make choices, if someone wants to load up on fast food and slowly kill themselves they are free to choose. With all the information already out there, the food police do not have to tell us that having a salad is healthier than a stuffed burrito

[WRESTLINGFAN]

This is "true capitialism" by providing as much information as available people will truly be able to act in their own self-interest.

True capitalism would not have a central gov't mandating on caloric charts. Leave it up to the individual business/franchise

[Crispy123]

True capitalism would not have a central gov't mandating on caloric charts. Leave it up to the individual business/franchise

So for you, government is supposed to regulate people and give corporations free reign? Can't wait for robocop to get here!!!

[WRESTLINGFAN]

So for you, government is supposed to regulate people and give corporations free reign? Can't wait for robocop to get here!!!

Government caused the free rein. Why do you think GE paid zero taxes? Kill all the loopholes tax shelters, have a flat corp tax and there would be some revenue generated.


Obama's a corporatist

[Zorro]

True capitalism would not have a central gov't mandating on caloric charts. Leave it up to the individual business/franchise

Actually it would. Read a little Adam Smith. Buried not so deep in his works he talks about free information.

This is where people on the extreme right like you lose me. There is nothing wrong with something like this. The calorie counts should be easy to provide and give citizens a chance to compare and contrast. This to me would only be a problem if you required Buger King, but not McDonalds. It's pretty evenly spread and I have no problem.

As a matter of fact we've had similar legislation in NYC for a couple of years. I consider myself a pretty smart guy, but had no idea a muffin at DD was 550 calories until I saw it. Now whether I choose to get it is up to me. As long as the gov't is not telling me I can't buy I'm all for it.

[Jujubees2]

http://ziegz.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/04/featured-syms.jpg

[Syd]

Obama's a corporatist

you're finally coming around :thumbup:

[WRESTLINGFAN]

Actually it would. Read a little Adam Smith. Buried not so deep in his works he talks about free information.

This is where people on the extreme right like you lose me. There is nothing wrong with something like this. The calorie counts should be easy to provide and give citizens a chance to compare and contrast. This to me would only be a problem if you required Buger King, but not McDonalds. It's pretty evenly spread and I have no problem.

As a matter of fact we've had similar legislation in NYC for a couple of years. I consider myself a pretty smart guy, but had no idea a muffin at DD was 550 calories until I saw it. Now whether I choose to get it is up to me. As long as the gov't is not telling me I can't buy I'm all for it.

Adam Smith favored a progressive income tax. I agree more with Bastiat. I am not on the extreme right. What makes you think that?


Citizens can already compare and contrast. BK flame broils and McDonalds fries its meat. Besides when someone is going out for fast food, calories are the furthest thing from their mind as the amount of fat and sodium in one of those value meals exceeds whats required for minimal daily intake.

This calorie counter law only opens more of a slippery slope. I wouldnt be surprised if in the future, movie theatres will be required to show decibel levels.


This top down 1 size fits all government is not what is needed. This isn't a national government like many Western European countries, well at least it should not be one.

[Syd]

in more bizarre news, I do agree with WF to a point. There should be completely free information -- you should know that a Whopper has 800 calories and a Big Mac has 730 or whatever it is. Granted people don't go to fast food restaurants and watch what they eat, but, it should be available regardless. I don't agree with anything more than that. Forcing the label of a Big Mac to tell you unhealthy isn't going to stop most people from eating it. They just don't give a fuck for one reason or another. So long as the information is available somewhere -- that's good enough. We've tried to change opinions about unhealthy foods by pointing out the calories, fat and so on and so forth but it hasn't done shit. 1 in 4 Americans are obese, with it trending worse and worse.

http://www.cdc.gov/obesity/data/trends.html

We need to figure out a new way, just forcing companies to tell people what they already know or don't care about isn't going to help much.

[WRESTLINGFAN]

You can put warning labels on fast food containers and the people will continue to devour them down. Its all about personal responsibility.


Being poor doesnt exclude people from having responsibility. A sack of potatoes and lean ground beef isnt that expensive at the supermarket. A lot of farmers markets now accept food stamps, many of these markets are in big cities.


Theres no excuse for being fat whether someone lives in Camden NJ or Scarsdale

[Bob Impact]

Government caused the free rein. Why do you think GE paid zero taxes? Kill all the loopholes tax shelters, have a flat corp tax and there would be some revenue generated.


Obama's a corporatist

It figures you would believe that GE paid no taxes, and that the government has a revenue generation problem. GE paid tax, the government took in a trillion dollars in income tax revenue alone in 2010. Want corporations to stop taking deductions? Change the tax code so those deductions don't exist anymore. Whether you want to look at it as a loophole or not is your choice, but the fact of the matter is that taxes are a formula. You tell a company "you can write off A, B and C but not D" and it's patently irresponsible for the company to waste it's stock holders money by NOT deducting A, B and C.

Also, please never speak about capitalism as if you're in favor of it while decrying people "not paying taxes" it makes the fact that you're bringing it up even more obviously a way to say "I'm so fair and balanced!" when you're going to try and attack Obama.

Also, in the interest of fairness and full disclosure: I work for GE.

[Bob Impact]

Also, the government does NOT have a revenue problem, they have a SPENDING problem.

[Bob Impact]

Actually it would. Read a little Adam Smith. Buried not so deep in his works he talks about free information.

This is where people on the extreme right like you lose me. There is nothing wrong with something like this. The calorie counts should be easy to provide and give citizens a chance to compare and contrast. This to me would only be a problem if you required Buger King, but not McDonalds. It's pretty evenly spread and I have no problem.

As a matter of fact we've had similar legislation in NYC for a couple of years. I consider myself a pretty smart guy, but had no idea a muffin at DD was 550 calories until I saw it. Now whether I choose to get it is up to me. As long as the gov't is not telling me I can't buy I'm all for it.

oooohhh, [citation needed] on this. To say Smith would be in favor if this is a stretch I don't see. To say this is "true capitalism" is absolutely wrong, it's not.

That said, If people walked away from restaurants that did not post health information in droves you would see this naturally take place (gasp, this is EXACTLY why I don't eat that horrible food).

The fact of the matter is in this case is that this being "free" information is categorically false. The fact is that this will become just another thing that is required to be printed, posted and maintained by the companies, checked for compliance by the government and utterly ignored by the consumer just like the warnings on cigarettes. As long as people are content to be fat they're going to eat whatever they want and die young.

[WRESTLINGFAN]

It figures you would believe that GE paid no taxes, and that the government has a revenue generation problem. GE paid tax, the government took in a trillion dollars in income tax revenue alone in 2010. Want corporations to stop taking deductions? Change the tax code so those deductions don't exist anymore. Whether you want to look at it as a loophole or not is your choice, but the fact of the matter is that taxes are a formula. You tell a company "you can write off A, B and C but not D" and it's patently irresponsible for the company to waste it's stock holders money by NOT deducting A, B and C.

Also, please never speak about capitalism as if you're in favor of it while decrying people "not paying taxes" it makes the fact that you're bringing it up even more obviously a way to say "I'm so fair and balanced!" when you're going to try and attack Obama.

Also, in the interest of fairness and full disclosure: I work for GE.

GE Used an army of accountants to get thru loopholes. Had billions in tax credits and received a hefty return.

As far as the corporate tax structure, Youre preaching to the choir, The tax codes are bloated and have more red tape every year. Simplification with a flat rate, no loopholes deductions etc

As for Obama your CEO is on his economic forum , GE will get the contract for medical records under Obamacare and in 2008 got free and positive press from MSNBC.

The talk of outsourcing always comes into topic in which GE has the market cornered. Nothing GE is made in the US anymore. They just closed down the last lightbulb factory so now we will be buying chinese lightbulbs filled with mercury.

Bailouts. GE Capital got TARP funds.

Agreed this country does have a spending problem. 5 Trillion in new debt since Obama was sworn in. A weaker dollar and now theres inflation

[Bob Impact]

I'm not going to engage you point for point on this because I frankly don't have the energy nor the inclination.

What I will say is that this
The talk of outsourcing always comes into topic in which GE has the market cornered. Nothing GE is made in the US anymore.

is all anyone needs to read to get the essence of your post. The first sentence makes absolutely no sense and the second is absolutely and categorically wrong.

[PapaBear]

Nothing GE is made in the US anymore. They just closed down the last lightbulb factory

the second is absolutely and categorically wrong.
I can back up Bob on this. One of my brothers worked in that "last" US factory. He managed to qualify for retirement when that factory closed, and is now taking advantage of a Government program that is training him for a new career. His best friend, who worked in the same plant, just missed the retirement cutoff date. He is now working in a GE jet engine plant (IN THE US), and earning even more than he did in the light bulb factory.

[WRESTLINGFAN]

I'm not going to engage you point for point on this because I frankly don't have the energy nor the inclination.

What I will say is that this


is all anyone needs to read to get the essence of your post. The first sentence makes absolutely no sense and the second is absolutely and categorically wrong.

I know GE is a conglomerate involved in many different areas like defense for example. When most people think GE they think of appliances and light bulbs, but the huge majority of those arent made here anymore. There are 2 GE Offices within a 5 min drive of where I live but I think those are the GE Capital divisions

[WRESTLINGFAN]

Obama kisses the ring


http://latimesblogs.latimes.com/washington/2011/04/obama-budget-shutdown-energy-al-sharpton.html

[Zorro]

oooohhh, [citation needed] on this. To say Smith would be in favor if this is a stretch I don't see. To say this is "true capitalism" is absolutely wrong, it's not.

That said, If people walked away from restaurants that did not post health information in droves you would see this naturally take place (gasp, this is EXACTLY why I don't eat that horrible food).

The fact of the matter is in this case is that this being "free" information is categorically false. The fact is that this will become just another thing that is required to be printed, posted and maintained by the companies, checked for compliance by the government and utterly ignored by the consumer just like the warnings on cigarettes. As long as people are content to be fat they're going to eat whatever they want and die young.

We've gone from 70% of people smoking to somewhere around 20%... how do you get the warnings are "utterly ignored" from that?

[Bob Impact]

I know GE is a conglomerate involved in many different areas like defense for example. When most people think GE they think of appliances and light bulbs, but the huge majority of those arent made here anymore. There are 2 GE Offices within a 5 min drive of where I live but I think those are the GE Capital divisions

Yes GE is a conglomerate, and yes appliances & lightbulbs are a drop in the bucket these days. Largest segment by profit is now is (if I recall correctly) Technology Infrastructure (Aviation, Healthcare, Transportation) then Energy.

US Employment is actually up over the past decade when you don't count jobs "lost" by the company divesting subsidiaries (those people don't lose their jobs, they just work for someone else). I don't claim to understand all the nuance of it but Fortune has a good article up explaining everything: http://features.blogs.fortune.cnn.com/2011/04/04/the-truth-about-ges-tax-bill/



We've gone from 70% of people smoking to somewhere around 20%... how do you get the warnings are "utterly ignored" from that?
cum hoc ergo propter hoc

[WRESTLINGFAN]

cum hoc ergo propter hoc

SPAMMER!!!!! :lol:


Had a question about GE's appliance division. Was that spun off into subsidiaries or is it still actually an arm of GE ?

I know a few people who work for IBM, They got out of the PC business about 10 years ago in which ot was sold entirely to Lenovo

[Bob Impact]

SPAMMER!!!!! :lol:


Had a question about GE's appliance division. Was that spun off into subsidiaries or is it still actually an arm of GE ?

I know a few people who work for IBM, They got out of the PC business about 10 years ago in which ot was sold entirely to Lenovo

Still a part of GE, they looked at spinning it off of moving it to a partnership a few years back right before the economy tanked but never really found any compelling deals.

[hush]

Obama meeting with Sharpton...

Yeah, because you wanna be known associating with a race divider, like him.

[WRESTLINGFAN]

Obamas ATF arming Mexican drug cartels


<iframe title="YouTube video player" width="480" height="390" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/GrBbt6yxvFE" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

[foodcourtdruide]

Obamas ATF arming Mexican drug cartels


<iframe title="YouTube video player" width="480" height="390" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/GrBbt6yxvFE" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

I think we'd accept a scene from a Michael Bay movie as a better source than this.

[WRESTLINGFAN]

I think we'd accept a scene from a Michael Bay movie as a better source than this.

CBS good enough for you?


http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2011/02/23/eveningnews/main20035609.shtml

[epo]

Also, the government does NOT have a revenue problem, they have a SPENDING problem.

They have a revenue problem, a revenue source % problem and a spending problem. Lets be honest about it.

[Bob Impact]

They have a revenue problem, a revenue source % problem and a spending problem. Lets be honest about it.

You're right, let's be honest, they should be taking a smaller percentage from everyone, up and down the line. When you're taking in revenue in the trillions you have absolutely no excuse to need more from anybody.

[Syd]

We've gone from 70% of people smoking to somewhere around 20%... how do you get the warnings are "utterly ignored" from that?

Simple, you hit people where it hurts: sin taxes. The skyrocketing cost of cigarettes has done more to curb the national habit than any warnings.

Should there be a sin tax on junk food? It's not quite as deadly as cigarettes but awfully close. It should be considered.

[WRESTLINGFAN]

How's that recovery working out?

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20110408/ap_on_bi_ge/oil_prices#mwpphu-container


Inflation? what inflation

[WRESTLINGFAN]

They have a revenue problem, a revenue source % problem and a spending problem. Lets be honest about it.

You know my stand on the 16th ammendment

Saying that, since it will probably never get repealed


The spending problem is way more troublesome.

[WRESTLINGFAN]

Sure its that easy, just buy a hybrid.


This piece of shit doesnt have to worry, him and his entourage get to use a fancy 747, use up thousands of gallons of jet fuel and then burn gasoline with his SUV motorcade. Arrogant out of touch fuckbag


<iframe title="YouTube video player" width="640" height="390" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/1RV8aIXm4DY" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

[Bob Impact]

Wow, I was gonna come on here and get on WF for being overly angry, and he is, but still, this video is offensive just based on the double speak he's throwing out there, and what is evidently either a complete misunderstanding of how the oil market actually works or an intentionally deceitful misrepresentation of how it works.


First he explains that the oil market is purely driven by supply and demand as if the oil cabals and price speculators have no part in the price per barrel.

Then he goes on to explain that we have 2-3% of the world oil reserves and that we account for 25% of the current usage, as if those numbers are actually related, they aren't.

Plus, he really comes across like a very unfunny stand up in this clip to me.

[Syd]

the numbers are related for all the hurfin and durfin about opening up the areas that are off limits for drilling. Even if the reserves turn out to be true, it's only about a few months of oil at current usage rates.

and not to mention the decade or so lag time between opening up drilling and when the wells would actually come online.

[Bob Impact]

the numbers are related for all the hurfin and durfin about opening up the areas that are off limits for drilling. Even if the reserves turn out to be true, it's only about a few months of oil at current usage rates.

and not to mention the decade or so lag time between opening up drilling and when the wells would actually come online.

I'm not arguing politics here, I'm arguing mathematics. There isn't a spin on what I'm saying, these two numbers LITERALLY do not connect to each other, current usage and total reserves are not the same thing. I can't even find a good metaphor to explain to you how much these are not the same numbers in any way shape or form but they just aren't.

[Syd]

well, I didn't listen to the video because fuck Obama, just throwing that the numbers are sort of connected out there when you isolate them out of context.

[WRESTLINGFAN]

In regards to the latest budget battle and the prevention of the shutdown of the gov't I really dont know who rally was on the winning end.


However, Obama has failed miserablly at changing how things are done in the beltway and bringing both parties together

These cuts didnt go deep enough. 38 Billion dollars is only about 1 weeks worth of interest on the debt

[Syd]

Debt really doesn't matter in the grand scheme of things. Crying about the budget deficits is just a ruse to get people to fork over more rights to private, unaccountable corporations instead of elected officials.

[WRESTLINGFAN]

People have a choice in the private sector, they can choose not to buy their products, However the policies of elected officials who believe they are the ruling class takes decades to unwind and in some cases can never be repealed


Its not just debt and deficits, the bigger problem is unfunded liabilities. With an ever decreasing tax base there is no way to deliver the false promises made

[Syd]

People have a choice in the private sector, they can choose not to buy their products, However the policies of elected officials who believe they are the ruling class takes decades to unwind and in some cases can never be repealed


Its not just debt and deficits, the bigger problem is unfunded liabilities. With an ever decreasing tax base there is no way to deliver the false promises made

Do you really have a choice? Here's Koch industries, for example:

Invista:

Lycra
Coolmax
Tactel
SolarMax
Polarguard
Dacron
Thermolite
Comforel
Antron Carpet Fiber
Stainmaster Carpet
Cordura

Georgia-Pacific:

VanityFair
AngelSoft
Quilted Northern
Sparkle
Brawny
MardiGras
Dixie
DensArmorPlus
Platinum Plywood
ToughRock

International Brands:

Demak Up
KittenSoft
Lotus
Moltonel
Tenderly
Nouvelle Recycling
Okay
Colhogar
Delica
Inversoft
Tutto


That's pretty fucking difficult.

Now, if the tax base is decreasing that is more the issue of capitalism than taxation. If taxation is down, that means capitalism is untenable because one of the things the GOP worships is that the economy will continue growing and growing forever. If that's true, then, by all means we should go with the guy that invented capitalism and stick with his ideas of taxation.

[WRESTLINGFAN]

Do you really have a choice? Here's Koch industries, for example:

Invista:

Lycra
Coolmax
Tactel
SolarMax
Polarguard
Dacron
Thermolite
Comforel
Antron Carpet Fiber
Stainmaster Carpet
Cordura

Georgia-Pacific:

VanityFair
AngelSoft
Quilted Northern
Sparkle
Brawny
MardiGras
Dixie
DensArmorPlus
Platinum Plywood
ToughRock

International Brands:

Demak Up
KittenSoft
Lotus
Moltonel
Tenderly
Nouvelle Recycling
Okay
Colhogar
Delica
Inversoft
Tutto


That's pretty fucking difficult.

Now, if the tax base is decreasing that is more the issue of capitalism than taxation. If taxation is down, that means capitalism is untenable because one of the things the GOP worships is that the economy will continue growing and growing forever. If that's true, then, by all means we should go with the guy that invented capitalism and stick with his ideas of taxation.



People can shop at tons of other stores and not buy Koch products. The tax system needs to be overhauled, 1st thing is to repeal the 16th ammendment but unfortunately that will never happen. Too many special interests on both sides.

Not the biggest fan of Smith

[Bob Impact]

No offense guys, and Syd I'm going to invent a reason for you in my head, but the last 5 posts read like an account of a debate between two squirels, there's no substance at all.

Also Syd, I don't use a single brand on your list, and I haven't heard of 90% of them.

[Dude!]

Also Syd, I don't use a single brand on your list, and I haven't heard of 90% of them.

oh come on...
like you don't use
Colhogar
every day

[Syd]

Also Syd, I don't use a single brand on your list, and I haven't heard of 90% of them.

So you don't directly purchase any consumer goods by them, that's a start.

Do you eat food? Chances are Koch industries were involved with the fertilizing of it.

Drive a car? It might use gas refined by Flint Hill, a Koch company. Drive that car on asphalt? Now you're using two products by the Kochs.

Boycotts are impossible unless it's a marginal company that's about to get fucked on its own.

[Zorro]

Do you really have a choice? Here's Koch industries, for example:

Invista:

Lycra
Coolmax
Tactel
SolarMax
Polarguard
Dacron
Thermolite
Comforel
Antron Carpet Fiber
Stainmaster Carpet
Cordura

Georgia-Pacific:

VanityFair
AngelSoft
Quilted Northern
Sparkle
Brawny
MardiGras
Dixie
DensArmorPlus
Platinum Plywood
ToughRock

International Brands:

Demak Up
KittenSoft
Lotus
Moltonel
Tenderly
Nouvelle Recycling
Okay
Colhogar
Delica
Inversoft
Tutto


That's pretty fucking difficult.

Now, if the tax base is decreasing that is more the issue of capitalism than taxation. If taxation is down, that means capitalism is untenable because one of the things the GOP worships is that the economy will continue growing and growing forever. If that's true, then, by all means we should go with the guy that invented capitalism and stick with his ideas of taxation.

What's interesting is that all those domestic companies you listed are union shops.
The Koch's unlike other multi-nationals has committed a shit load of monet to expand right here in the US. Just the type of well paid manufacturing jobs this country needs.
In case you missed it that great American Manufacturer Harley-Davidson is building plants in India.
So, who's the enemy is there an enemy or are the "targets" picked because a few buzzwords about the Koch's are really easily understood ansd Americans love easy.

Hell GE almost singlehandedly destroyed the Hudson River, but hey you pay off the elite, chummy up to the President and "woof" no problems no protestors. send your jobs to totalitarian China and you'll get invited to a state dinner.

Carnies and Rubes...it's all we are

[WRESTLINGFAN]

Dont forget obamas other stepchild GM

http://economics.about.com/b/2008/12/18/gm-is-expanding-and-increasing-production.htm

[brettmojo]

No offense guys, and Syd I'm going to invent a reason for you in my head, but the last 5 posts read like an account of a debate between two squirels, there's no substance at all.

Also Syd, I don't use a single brand on your list, and I haven't heard of 90% of them.
Just the last five posts? That's generous.

[hanso]

People have a choice in the private sector, they can choose not to buy their products, However the policies of elected officials who believe they are the ruling class takes decades to unwind and in some cases can never be repealed


Its not just debt and deficits, the bigger problem is unfunded liabilities. With an ever decreasing tax base there is no way to deliver the false promises made

You just got done posting that folks live longer. Over S.S ( that is solvent for at least the next 30 yrs) btw.

So which is it?

As far as policies being undone. It happens every election. Obama gave in on the Bush taxes. Where did that get him? Cuts to middle/lower classes now? Screw that put it back on the table.

[WRESTLINGFAN]

You just got done posting that folks live longer. Over S.S ( that is solvent for at least the next 30 yrs) btw.

So which is it?

As far as policies being undone. It happens every election. Obama gave in on the Bush taxes. Where did that get him? Cuts to middle/lower classes now? Screw that put it back on the table.

Unintended consequences. People in the 1930s didn't live into their late 70s so today there are millions of baby boomers eligible. The Feds did not factor it in. SS is not solvent. Again they are using bonds that must be redeemed.


When I'm talking about winding down programs it would take decades to unravel Medicare and SS if they were ever repealed

[hanso]

Unintended consequences. People in the 1930s didn't live into their late 70s so today there are millions of baby boomers eligible. The Feds did not factor it in. SS is not solvent. Again they are using bonds that must be redeemed.


When I'm talking about winding down programs it would take decades to unravel Medicare and SS if they were ever repealed

Medicare will be in talks of going private soon on the hill. SS was almost tied to stocks. Which crashed like they always do when the right is running the country.

It's nothing more than social policies guised as monetary measures. Especially considering these are paid into by workers throughout their careers.

[Zorro]

Medicare will be in talks of going private soon on the hill. SS was almost tied to stocks. Which crashed like they always do when the right is running the country.

It's nothing more than social policies guised as monetary measures. Especially considering these are paid into by workers throughout their careers.

Medicare is essentially a private plan already. If you know wnayone on it you know that they have to buy a supplement to make it effective. Why do you think the AARP is so wealthy. They make so much money off their insurance products they want you to buy buy buy.

The problem with Social Security has nothing to do with stocks, it was mismanagement pure and simple. You had this huge pot of money reserved for retirees that congress just couldn't keep its hands off. So you lend all that money with "Bonds" guaranteeing that they have to repaid. Except the money to repay them doesn't exist. A scheme worthy of that great Italian inventor Charles Ponzi

[WRESTLINGFAN]

http://news.yahoo.com/s/yblog_thelookout/20110413/ts_yblog_thelookout/key-from-the-speech-whats-in-obamas-deficit-reduction-plan#mwpphu-container




:lol::lol::lol::lol::lol::lol::lol::lol::lol::lol: :lol::lol::lol::lol:

[WRESTLINGFAN]

Hows this for transparency


http://www.politico.com/news/stories/0411/53072.html

[WRESTLINGFAN]

So much for that great success story of GM

http://www.google.com/hostednews/afp/article/ALeqM5iQ772RYgyZRuijNjN58Syvf8HExw?docId=CNG.86219 6b5b90a6d3e5734cc272997d1cd.a51


"The government sale would "almost certainly" mean that US taxpayers would take a loss from a politically controversial $50 billion rescue of the auto giant in 2009, according to the paper."

[hanso]

That's odd my local paper today had them selling big time to China no less.

[WRESTLINGFAN]

Barack H Obama doesnt care about white people

http://www.whitehousedossier.com/2011/04/20/obama-skips-tornado-destruction-heads-west-raise-money/



Obama lied about the bridge collapse

http://www.politico.com/blogs/bensmith/0411/A_bridge_in_Minnesota.html?showall

Maybe one of those Doctors at his staged Obamacare press conference let little Barack wear a white lab coat. Paging Dr Obama

http://weaselzippers.us/2011/04/19/chain-smoking-nicotine-saturated-black-lunged-president-who-is-responsible-for-turning-the-entire-us-healthcare-system-on-its-head-claims-coal-causes-asthma/


Hows that Libyan war going Mr President

http://abcnews.go.com/Politics/obama-libya-war-criticism-grows-abc-news-poll/story?id=13420329

[foodcourtdruide]

I'm an Audible listener of the show, and I was listening to an old show today how Fez was against a former KKK Grand Wizard being represented on a license plate, and how gay sex AND sex with a robot should be accepted. A caller and Ron were saying how Fez doesn't see any shades of grey on issues. He just looks at it in black and white and doesn't think about the opposing side and catagorizes his position by a very simple belief.

This reminded me SO much of WF, then I started thinking.. he's JUST like Fez politically, but on the opposite end of the spectrum. WF is constantly posting articles on illegal immigrants just like Fez is constantly bringing up gay rights on the show. Neither of them want to logically see the other sides point of view, and make their arguments extremely black and white: "illegal immigration is illegal, therefore we must enforce the law", "gay people should have the same rights as straight people, therefore they must be allowed to marry eachother".

When confronted with reasons the issue isn't so black and white, they just repeat their basic point, as if gay marriage will ever be solved just becasue it's "right" and there's some magical cure-all for illegal immigration that WF knows about.

[foodcourtdruide]

Obama lied about the bridge collapse

http://www.politico.com/blogs/bensmith/0411/A_bridge_in_Minnesota.html?showall



From the post THIS GUY MADE, that you probably didn't read:

The bridge was designed and built in an era when engineers thought that redundant systems were both unnecessary and inefficient.

So, the design of the bridge was inherently flawed. Hm, what is a possible thing that could have solved this?

Let's play mad libs:

The bridge was designed and built in an era when engineers thought that redundant systems were both unnecessary and inefficient. Gusset plates installed at the time of the bridge’s building were too thin, and without any redundancy to account for a major failure on a single point, had there been proper __________________, this defect would have been noticed and fixed in time, and the bridge collapse would have never occurred.

WF, you go first.

[WRESTLINGFAN]

From the post THIS GUY MADE, that you probably didn't read:

The bridge was designed and built in an era when engineers thought that redundant systems were both unnecessary and inefficient.

So, the design of the bridge was inherently flawed. Hm, what is a possible thing that could have solved this?

Let's play mad libs:

The bridge was designed and built in an era when engineers thought that redundant systems were both unnecessary and inefficient. Gusset plates installed at the time of the bridge’s building were too thin, and without any redundancy to account for a major failure on a single point, had there been proper __________________, this defect would have been noticed and fixed in time, and the bridge collapse would have never occurred.

WF, you go first.

I read it, but I see youre covering for the President

According to the National Transportation Safety Board (NTSB), the collapse was due to a design flaw, not to a lack of maintenance.


So Obama just makes things up saying it was deteoriating infrastructure

[WRESTLINGFAN]

I'm an Audible listener of the show, and I was listening to an old show today how Fez was against a former KKK Grand Wizard being represented on a license plate, and how gay sex AND sex with a robot should be accepted. A caller and Ron were saying how Fez doesn't see any shades of grey on issues. He just looks at it in black and white and doesn't think about the opposing side and catagorizes his position by a very simple belief.

This reminded me SO much of WF, then I started thinking.. he's JUST like Fez politically, but on the opposite end of the spectrum. WF is constantly posting articles on illegal immigrants just like Fez is constantly bringing up gay rights on the show. Neither of them want to logically see the other sides point of view, and make their arguments extremely black and white: "illegal immigration is illegal, therefore we must enforce the law", "gay people should have the same rights as straight people, therefore they must be allowed to marry eachother".

When confronted with reasons the issue isn't so black and white, they just repeat their basic point, as if gay marriage will ever be solved just becasue it's "right" and there's some magical cure-all for illegal immigration that WF knows about.

Ive listened to the other sides point of view and they want to reward people for breaking the law. I backed off my support to round them up because it would cost too much. Instead my solution is to starve them out and cut off all the entitlements, welfare etc and they will go home. No Jobs, no benefits etc and they will leave .

You want to make things more complicated when in fact it doesnt have to be. Just enforce the laws on the books. It doesnt take a 3000 page bill to solve everything

[Dudeman]

Just enforce the laws on the books. It doesnt take a 3000 page bill to solve everything

i love slogan based solutions :wub:

[Dudeman]

I'm an Audible listener of the show, and I was listening to an old show today how Fez was against a former KKK Grand Wizard being represented on a license plate, and how gay sex AND sex with a robot should be accepted. A caller and Ron were saying how Fez doesn't see any shades of grey on issues. He just looks at it in black and white and doesn't think about the opposing side and catagorizes his position by a very simple belief.

This reminded me SO much of WF, then I started thinking.. he's JUST like Fez politically, but on the opposite end of the spectrum. WF is constantly posting articles on illegal immigrants just like Fez is constantly bringing up gay rights on the show. Neither of them want to logically see the other sides point of view, and make their arguments extremely black and white: "illegal immigration is illegal, therefore we must enforce the law", "gay people should have the same rights as straight people, therefore they must be allowed to marry eachother".

When confronted with reasons the issue isn't so black and white, they just repeat their basic point, as if gay marriage will ever be solved just becasue it's "right" and there's some magical cure-all for illegal immigration that WF knows about.

THis is an Obama thread.

Here is your WF commentary thread:

http://ronfez.net/forums/showthread.php?t=89739&highlight=wrestlingfan

I'll post your post there.

[WRESTLINGFAN]

i love slogan based solutions :wub:

Path to citizenship ?

out of the shadows ?

[StanUpshaw]

Viva la raza, gringos?

[WRESTLINGFAN]

Si se puede

[Dudeman]

Path to citizenship ?

out of the shadows ?

Here's the big difference: (It is a common mistake you make.)

I didn't say those things. I quoted you. You responded with things I never said.

You always take anything from the opposite side and label everyone as having that position. If any blogger or Kucinich or MSNBC or local democratic official or sharpton say something, you label everyone else as having that same position.

On the other hand, you do the exact opposite for yourself. Even when you have the exact same position as the Cato Institute or Pat Buchanan or Hannity, you completely reject the comparison because on some other issue you may disagree with them.

You lump all of the opposition in one group, but narrowly define yourself.

Nevermind your politics, you need to take a class in Rhetoric or debate.

(I'll post this in the WF thread, since this is really an obama thread.)

[WRESTLINGFAN]

Here's the big difference: (It is a common mistake you make.)

I didn't say those things. I quoted you. You responded with things I never said.

You always take anything from the opposite side and label everyone as having that position. If any blogger or Kucinich or MSNBC or local democratic official or sharpton say something, you label everyone else as having that same position.

On the other hand, you do the exact opposite for yourself. Even when you have the exact same position as the Cato Institute or Pat Buchanan or Hannity, you completely reject the comparison because on some other issue you may disagree with them.

You lump all of the opposition in one group, but narrowly define yourself.

Nevermind your politics, you need to take a class in Rhetoric or debate.

(I'll post this in the WF thread, since this is really an obama thread.)

Have a coke and a smile

I wont make a dudeman thread but Ill bring up Obama. Time and time again the American people have said no to amnesty, no to a path to citizenship and no to the dream act. But he insists on having left wing mayors, Al Sharpton and left leaning police chiefs who do not want to enforce the law.


What is so difficult about enforcing the laws? What part of no doesnt Obama and the open borders amnesty crowd understand? What makes the illegals special that they get a free pass?


Your president needs to do his homework before making comments about bridges and asthma. It shows that he doesnt give a fuck about tornado and storm victims, fuck them hayseeds in the south lets go kiss the facebook founders ass and do some more campaigning he only cares about the rich whites. His Libya strategy? What exactly is it?


And heres the latest gem by Obama. In regards to possibly lowering the AAA rating


http://www.foxbusiness.com/markets/2011/04/20/white-house-sought-stave-sp-downgrade/

[WRESTLINGFAN]

Too bad GM's stock isnt en fuego :lol::lol::lol::lol:


http://www.autoevolution.com/news/chevrolet-volt-bursts-in-flames-twice-34420.html

[foodcourtdruide]

I read it, but I see youre covering for the President

According to the National Transportation Safety Board (NTSB), the collapse was due to a design flaw, not to a lack of maintenance.


So Obama just makes things up saying it was deteoriating infrastructure

Not covering for the President, just concerned with the deteriorating infrastructure of this country. If there is a design flaw in a bridge, how do you think that would be detected prior to collapse other than proper maintenance?

[foodcourtdruide]

What is so difficult about enforcing the laws?




How could you possibly be asking this question? Seriously WF, you are Fez. We have repeatedly stated what is so difficult about enforcing the laws, and you have even agreed with us on some points. Why are you asking this? Fully enforcing the current laws around illegal immigration are as realistic as fully enforcing the current laws around speeding, or traffic violations. It's just too widespread of an issue to fully crackdown on, and if we did attempt to fully crackdown on it, the negatives of the crackdown would FAR (yes WF, it's not even close) outweigh the positives.

You keep saying America has rejected open borders, etc, however, the same argument can be made that America has rejected the draconian measures you'd like to see.

[WRESTLINGFAN]

How could you possibly be asking this question? Seriously WF, you are Fez. We have repeatedly stated what is so difficult about enforcing the laws, and you have even agreed with us on some points. Why are you asking this? Fully enforcing the current laws around illegal immigration are as realistic as fully enforcing the current laws around speeding, or traffic violations. It's just too widespread of an issue to fully crackdown on, and if we did attempt to fully crackdown on it, the negatives of the crackdown would FAR (yes WF, it's not even close) outweigh the positives.

You keep saying America has rejected open borders, etc, however, the same argument can be made that America has rejected the draconian measures you'd like to see.

Enforcing the laws isnt draconian and how can you compare illegal immigration to speeding?


If you want to make that arguement, what happens if youre driving 100 in a 65 zone? you get a ticket. How about if you drink a bottle of Jack and get behind a wheel? What should happen to an illegal committing a crime? They should be deported.

How would cracking down lead to negatives? Jobs would open up for Americans and legal immigrants and or migrant workers. Crime and overcrowding would go down and our entitlement system would stabilize.

Draconian measures would be just looking for short brown people, it would cost too much time and money. However cutting off the supply and killing the demand isnt draconian.


Do you really think giving them amnesty would not lead to more flooding of the borders? We all know that the 86 Amnesty bill was such a success

[WRESTLINGFAN]

Not covering for the President, just concerned with the deteriorating infrastructure of this country. If there is a design flaw in a bridge, how do you think that would be detected prior to collapse other than proper maintenance?

We can go back and forth on this, but the main question is, where is all this transportation money going to? Isnt the federal and state taxes suppose to go to maintaining infrastructure?

Clinton and Bush signed massive transportation bills in the hundreds of billions of dollars, Why wasn't that used for maintenance

[WRESTLINGFAN]

Does anyone want Obama to manage their portfolio ? Hows that GM rescue workin out?



http://www.torquenews.com/119/any-government-sale-gm-stock-right-now-saddles-taxpayers-loss

[foodcourtdruide]

Does anyone want Obama to manage their portfolio ? Hows that GM rescue workin out?



http://www.torquenews.com/119/any-government-sale-gm-stock-right-now-saddles-taxpayers-loss

Are you going to do a best/worst dressed list?

[WRESTLINGFAN]

Are you going to do a best/worst dressed list?

taxpayers ended up in the black from the GM debacle?





Since you brought up worst dressed


http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_orkXxp0bhEA/R8N7XhVDBLI/AAAAAAAAFDw/_Y27oKCZv_Y/s1600/080224-obama-muslim-garb.jpg

[Barnaby Jones]

WF is so scared! Poor little dear!

[WRESTLINGFAN]

WF is so scared! Poor little dear!

Look who's back

[Barnaby Jones]

It's OK, precious! You want your binky? I'll protect you from those scary progressives and illegals that have you pissing your pants!!! Hee-hee!!!

[WRESTLINGFAN]

It's OK, precious! You want your binky? I'll protect you from those scary progressives and illegals that have you pissing your pants!!! Hee-hee!!!

Wow your basement must be stacked like a trout pond

[Barnaby Jones]

Whoops, he had to bring the homophobia over here, too!!! Bet you really want to call me a "fag," don'tcha? Just let it alllllllll out, poopy-pants!!!

[Barnaby Jones]

Sorry, I can't stay and play any more today, fat stuff!!! Have fun realizing your idea of America has zero chance of ever becoming a reality and you're going to die as angry and impotent as you are now!!! Toodles!!!

[WRESTLINGFAN]

Team Obama is going to take care of things. Obama task force UNITE!!!!!


http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/us_obama;_ylt=AomvvDayuT7ZIGuJUidj_QSyFz4D;_ylu=X3 oDMTI5NGV1NGZjBGFzc2V0A2FwLzIwMTEwNDIxL3VzX29iYW1h BGNwb3MDMQRwb3MDMgRzZWMDeW5fdG9wX3N0b3J5BHNsawNvYm FtYXRvc3VwcG8

The dopes dont realize that theres been a 15% drop in the dollar hence higher commodities prices.


This is the smartest president ever???


A billion dollars buys us another 4 more years. No thanks

[WRESTLINGFAN]

Obamas speech the other day in regards to the budget was un presedential and full of fear mongering. It was nothing short of a campaign speech. Hes like a child when he keeps putting earners of 250K with billionaires

[spoon]

yawn

does anyone even click wf's links any longer?

[underdog]

yawn

does anyone even click wf's links any longer?

Have they ever?

[SonOfSmeagol]

yawn

does anyone even click wf's links any longer?

Probably more than still listen to and actually believe the words in any of bho's speeches.

[spoon]

Have they ever?

Honestly, some tried actual debate and conversation based on his links in the past, but now I'm convinced only Hush, Dude! and Smeagol actually click away to back their illogical fears and stances. The saddest part is that's half the board at this point. :sad:

[WRESTLINGFAN]

yawn

does anyone even click wf's links any longer?


You would make a great VP. Better yet an air traffic controller

[SonOfSmeagol]

Honestly, some tried actual debate and conversation based on his links in the past, but now I'm convinced only Hush, Dude! and Smeagol actually click away to back their illogical fears and stances. The saddest part is that's half the board at this point. :sad:

You don't like something I say then say so - save your general insults calling me out. That said though, you're pretty annoying yourself and I don't know if it's worth getting into. Generally speaking.

[WRESTLINGFAN]

Honestly, some tried actual debate and conversation based on his links in the past, but now I'm convinced only Hush, Dude! and Smeagol actually click away to back their illogical fears and stances. The saddest part is that's half the board at this point. :sad:


And whats wrong with having people like Dude Son of Smeagol and others who have a differing opinion. Face it Obama is not the politician many people voted for. The country is no better than it was when he was sworn in. If you happen to think that it is, then fine thats your view however his numbers prove that he is not the best thing that ever happened to this country. Sure he got thinkgs done like Obamacare but at what cost to him and the democrats? Our fiscal policy is in the shitter, inflation is here, food and fuel prices up, a debt of 100% of our GDP/ A losing effort in Afghanistan, A pourous border The bailout of GM as another failure, starting a new war without congressional approval and with no goal specified. He says idiotic things out of his ass like Coal plants cause Asthma when the NIH says that they do not know the cause of it. The Minn bridge collapse was a result of a structual flaw and he said it was lack of maintenance, and his own white house lobbying S&P not to give that warning about our bond rating. His justice department out of control sueing a state because its trying to do the job the federal government refuses to do as mandated in the constitution Sure some people may be better off than they were off 2 years ago, but the country as a whole, thats another story

[A.J.]

"Today, at my direction, the United States carried out that operation... they killed Osama Bin Laden and took custody of his body.

Thank you Mr. President.

[weekapaugjz]

Thank you Mr. President.

:thumbup:

[PapaBear]

Thank you Mr. President.
My son voted for our President, and made his decision to join the Army when he won. He's giddy as shit right now.

Edit: But he's soldier giddy. It's a more manly form of giddiness.

[A.J.]

My son voted for our President, and made his decision to join the Army when he won. He's giddy as shit right now.

Edit: But he's soldier giddy. It's a more manly form of giddiness.

He's home and safe. Thank God.

[weekapaugjz]

Edit: But he's soldier giddy. It's a more manly form of giddiness.

??? (http://www.lemonparty.biz/lemonparty.jpg)

[PapaBear]

He's home and safe. Thank God.
Home, but not safe. He's in Georgia. And... He recently was shot by his 1st Sargent, when the idiot left the clip in his sidearm while clearing it.

Don't worry. He's OK. He actually thinks it's kind of cool, that he still has half of a round in his upper arm. :wallbash:

[PapaBear]

??? (http://www.lemonparty.biz/lemonparty.jpg)
I hate you.

[weekapaugjz]

I hate you.

cum on? manly form of giddiness?

[A.J.]

Home, but not safe. He's in Georgia. And... He recently was shot by his 1st Sargent, when the idiot left the clip in his sidearm while clearing it.

Don't worry. He's OK. He actually thinks it's kind of cool, that he still has half of a round in his upper arm. :wallbash:

Jackass. All guns are always loaded!

[CurseoftheBambi]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xlOIy6QEbes

[WRESTLINGFAN]

Home, but not safe. He's in Georgia. And... He recently was shot by his 1st Sargent, when the idiot left the clip in his sidearm while clearing it.

Don't worry. He's OK. He actually thinks it's kind of cool, that he still has half of a round in his upper arm. :wallbash:

I would have expected a private to do that but a 1st Sgt? I wonder if he got demoted

[PapaBear]

I would have expected a private to do that but a 1st Sgt? I wonder if he got demoted
Get this... It was his first day as 1st Sgt!

[A.J.]

Get this... It was his first day as 1st Sgt!

And his last.

[jonyrotn]

And whats wrong with having people like Dude Son of Smeagol and others who have a differing opinion. Face it Obama is not the politician many people voted for. The country is no better than it was when he was sworn in. If you happen to think that it is, then fine thats your view however his numbers prove that he is not the best thing that ever happened to this country. Sure he got thinkgs done like Obamacare but at what cost to him and the democrats? Our fiscal policy is in the shitter, inflation is here, food and fuel prices up, a debt of 100% of our GDP/ A losing effort in Afghanistan, A pourous border The bailout of GM as another failure, starting a new war without congressional approval and with no goal specified. He says idiotic things out of his ass like Coal plants cause Asthma when the NIH says that they do not know the cause of it. The Minn bridge collapse was a result of a structual flaw and he said it was lack of maintenance, and his own white house lobbying S&P not to give that warning about our bond rating. His justice department out of control sueing a state because its trying to do the job the federal government refuses to do as mandated in the constitution Sure some people may be better off than they were off 2 years ago, but the country as a whole, thats another story
Well said.. Change as a rule happens gradually but the seeds of change haven't even made it out of the shed..Nobody wanted Obama's promises not to be bullshit more the me but it became clear pretty quickly that he was a wolf in sheep's clothing and seems to be working towards all the same goals as the previous adminstration..
This is the clearest it's ever been that the two party is a sham..