Obama - Worst President Ever?

[underdog]

Im not part of the recipient class. Im one of the millions paying for the deadbeats.

How do you provide without a job?

[WRESTLINGFAN]

How do you provide without a job?


Wait what? I do have one.

[underdog]

Wait what? I do have one.

Sure you do.

[SonOfSmeagol]

Sure you do.

You keep trying to bait and ridicule him, yet in every case he honestly answers your belittling questions. It's an interesting dynamic.

[razorboy]

You keep trying to bait and ridicule him, yet in every case he honestly answers your belittling questions. It's an interesting dynamic.

Awwwww. You're defending your man. How cute.

[WRESTLINGFAN]

Its all about Barry, The man is so full of himself its sickening.

Im sure this is another lie

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RunisGgIAqI

[Serpico1103]

You keep trying to bait and ridicule him, yet in every case he honestly answers your belittling questions. It's an interesting dynamic.

Face, heel, carny, rubes.
They are putting on a show for us.

[WRESTLINGFAN]

Face, heel, carny, rubes.
They are putting on a show for us.

Your show of being a victim of Big Bad corporations, and needing a President , Federal Gov't as a father figure is quite a show for us

[Serpico1103]

Your show of being a victim of Big Bad corporations, and needing a President , Federal Gov't as a father figure is quite a show for us

I want to sit on the lap of my daddy, federal government, and be protected from all the evils of the world.

Why do you think our government is so fucked up? Because even true patriots like yourself have no power, when compared to corporate donors and lobbyists.
Corporate boogey man is coming for us.

[underdog]

You keep trying to bait and ridicule him, yet in every case he honestly answers your belittling questions. It's an interesting dynamic.

I just don't think he has a job. Usually the people the loudest are the ones lying. Like the loud, anti-gay preachers who end up fucking male prostitutes.

[underdog]

I just don't think he has a job. Usually the people the loudest are the ones lying. Like the loud, anti-gay preachers who end up fucking male prostitutes.

I also just like antagonizing people.

[SonOfSmeagol]

Awwwww. You're defending your man. How cute.

No, actually. We disagree on many things. It was just an observation, which now would appear to extend to you.

[WRESTLINGFAN]

I also just like antagonizing people.

Is Ted Haggard your pastor?

[underdog]

Is Ted Haggard your pastor?

I'm the guy he used to buy meth off of.

[Serpico1103]

Its all about Barry, The man is so full of himself its sickening.
Im sure this is another lie.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RunisGgIAqI

I remember the good ole days of humble, meek presidents.

You are a libertarian?
"The political platform of the Libertarian Party reflects that group's particular brand of libertarianism, favoring minimally regulated, laissez-faire markets, strong civil liberties, minimally regulated migration across borders, and non-interventionism in foreign policy that respects freedom of trade and travel to all foreign countries."

Seems they disagree with your major issue.

[zildjian361]

gas has already gone up in 45cents in the last month. it' a start.

Larry the cable guy said in the last issue of steppin out, that everything so fare Obama's touched has turned to shit.:laugh::smoke::drunk:

[WRESTLINGFAN]

I remember the good ole days of humble, meek presidents.

You are a libertarian?
"The political platform of the Libertarian Party reflects that group's particular brand of libertarianism, favoring minimally regulated, laissez-faire markets, strong civil liberties, minimally regulated migration across borders, and non-interventionism in foreign policy that respects freedom of trade and travel to all foreign countries."

Seems they disagree with your major issue.

Not as pompous as Barry

I do not follow EVERY principle. So does that mean if you were alive in the 50's and 60's you would have celebrated the use of firehoses being a staunch Democrat?

[Serpico1103]

Not as pompous as Barry

I do not follow EVERY principle. So does that mean if you were alive in the 50's and 60's you would have celebrated the use of firehoses being a staunch Democrat?

I am not a dem., but when in Rome.

You are right, GWB was never accused of being arrogant. Like when he wiped his glasses on the woman's skirt on the Letterman Show. "Sure, you are a person, a person whose purpose is being a mobile glass cloth."

It is a major principle. Not just one of their principles.
Admit it. You are an shamed Republican.

[WRESTLINGFAN]

I am not a dem., but when in Rome.

You are right, GWB was never accused of being arrogant. Like when he wiped his glasses on the woman's skirt on the Letterman Show. "Sure, you are a person, a person whose purpose is being a mobile glass cloth."

It is a major principle. Not just one of their principles.
Admit it. You are an shamed Republican.

When all else fails follow your leader and cry about dubya

[Serpico1103]

When all else fails follow your leader and cry about dubya

Sorry, should I have referenced Taft or maybe Madison.
Who should I compare Obama to? Seems the last president would be the logical choice.

But you kept posting silly links while hiding behind your libertarianism.

[WRESTLINGFAN]

Sorry, should I have referenced Taft or maybe Madison.
Who should I compare Obama to? Seems the last president would be the logical choice.

But you kept posting silly links while hiding behind your libertarianism.

BHO is the new Carter

[Serpico1103]

BHO is the new Carter

Now comparisons are allowed? Please forward me the rule book on comparisons to past presidents.
How does this work? I'll take a new Carter over the old GWB.
Or.
I'll take a new Carter over McCain/Palin.

[Syd]

Carter was the last honest president. He might have been a milquetoast, center-right Democrat but at least he spoke the truth. Ever since we've had a bunch of two-faced scum that would have been up against the wall if America had any pride left.

[WRESTLINGFAN]

Its all about Barry, The man is so full of himself its sickening.

Im sure this is another lie

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RunisGgIAqI

So the lady would have been considered too young under the Dems plan to get a breast cancer screening

[LordJezo]

The attempted Cheney assassination that went down last night is being compared to the silencing of critics by the French in the 1790s by people in my circles.

At least he managed to survive the hit, for now.

[keith richard]

Christ!! I 'd rather have Jimmy Carter back!!! Lord Jesus!!

[Syd]

The attempted Cheney assassination that went down last night is being compared to the silencing of critics by the French in the 1790s by people in my circles.

At least he managed to survive the hit, for now.

pretty sure you don't really grasp what the the reign of terror was about

[WRESTLINGFAN]

From the war on Turr to the war on fishing



http://sports.espn.go.com/outdoors/saltwater/news/story?id=4975762

[WRESTLINGFAN]

This President is truly historic. Another thing hes better than dubya at, SPENDING MONEY!!!


http://money.cnn.com/2010/03/10/news/economy/federal_deficit/index.htm?hpt=T2

[jleewach]

he's absolutely the worst president ever. Coming from an Illinois native, he was useless as my Senator, and he's even more useless as the president.

[Dude!]

Bret Baier exposed Obama tonight
for the liar he is

[underdog]

Bret Baier

Who?

[razorboy]

Bret Baier should be more concerned with his awful hairpiece.

[JPMNICK]

Bret Baier exposed Obama tonight
for the liar he is

where and when did this happen?

edit: found it, here is a rough transcript

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,589589,00.html

[WRESTLINGFAN]

Our constitutional scholar, Harvard graduate can't spell Syracuse. I'm worried that he's drinking too much.


http://media.eyeblast.org/newsbusters/static/2010/03/Obama-Sycacuse-ABC-2010-03-17-360x280.jpg

[A.J.]

Our constitutional scholar, Harvard graduate can't spell Syracuse. I'm worried that he's drinking too much.


http://media.eyeblast.org/newsbusters/static/2010/03/Obama-Sycacuse-ABC-2010-03-17-360x280.jpg

He should have put "Cuse" down instead....LIKE EVERYBODY ELSE.

[WRESTLINGFAN]

Truly historic. Only took 421 days. Congrats BHO

http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-503544_162-20000576-503544.html

[Serpico1103]

Truly historic. Only took 421 days. Congrats BHO

http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-503544_162-20000576-503544.html

All praise to BHO. Beat GWB's debt record!!

[Crispy123]

Obama owned Fox news! Silly left wing media machine.

[Bob Impact]

All praise to BHO. Beat GWB's debt record!!

I know you're joking but holy fuck are there some scary ass numbers in that article.

[SonOfSmeagol]

Obama owned Fox news! Silly left wing media machine.

If you're talking about Bret Baier, I read the transcript and I'm not seeing that. At all.

[Serpico1103]

I know you're joking but holy fuck are there some scary ass numbers in that article.

I think our debt is one of our biggest problems. Unfortunately, it doesn't have the glamor of terrorism. People can ignore government debt like they ignore their own, especially when the numbers get into billions and trillions, might as well be written in Sanskrit.

[SonOfSmeagol]

I think our debt is one of our biggest problems. Unfortunately, it doesn't have the glamor of terrorism. People can ignore government debt like they ignore their own, especially when the numbers get into billions and trillions, might as well be written in Sanskrit.

$1,000,000,000,000

A million millions.

A billion thousands.

In $1 bills laid end-to-end would stretch one hundred million miles.

A fuck of a lot of money.

[WRESTLINGFAN]

I was listening to the Thom Hartmann show , he had some backbencher guest hosts on and as usual they called Baier Racist because he didn't suck up like Brian Williams did

[WRESTLINGFAN]

$1,000,000,000,000

A million millions.

A billion thousands.

In $1 bills laid end-to-end would stretch one hundred million miles.

A fuck of a lot of money.

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[keithy_19]

Obama owned Fox news! Silly left wing media machine.

If by owned you mean avoided answering the questions than yes, her certainly did own Fox news.

[Crispy123]

he certainly did own Fox news.


exactly!

Face to you FOX news.

[Recyclerz]

Our constitutional scholar, Harvard graduate can't spell Syracuse. I'm worried that he's drinking too much.


http://media.eyeblast.org/newsbusters/static/2010/03/Obama-Sycacuse-ABC-2010-03-17-360x280.jpg

Obama in Top 2% of all brackets at the moment (http://games.espn.go.com/tcmen/en/entry?entryID=3288143) :wink:

[WRESTLINGFAN]

Why does BHO hate Catholic and Private schoolers?


http://www.cnsnews.com/news/article/63267

[underdog]

Why does BHO hate Catholic and Private schoolers?


http://www.cnsnews.com/news/article/63267

Because everyone does.

[WRESTLINGFAN]

Dan Rather has no faith in Bho


http://newsbusters.org/blogs/geoffrey-dickens/2010/03/08/dan-rather-articulate-obama-couldnt-even-sell-watermelons

[WRESTLINGFAN]

Keep spending money BHO don't worry youre pathetic lemmings will still believe all your schemes.


http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2010/mar/26/cbos-2020-vision-debt-will-rise-to-90-of-gdp/

[Furtherman]

Dan Rather has no faith in Bho


http://newsbusters.org/blogs/geoffrey-dickens/2010/03/08/dan-rather-articulate-obama-couldnt-even-sell-watermelons

This is what it has come down to... far-righters quoting Dan Rather, a man they loathe? I saw another one today quote Castro because he called the bill a "victory". Two weeks ago they'd spit on either of them, now they're raising them up as examples for their misguided gripes. Unbelievable.

[WRESTLINGFAN]

This is what it has come down to... far-righters quoting Dan Rather, a man they loathe? I saw another one today quote Castro because he called the bill a "victory". Two weeks ago they'd spit on either of them, now they're raising them up as examples for their misguided gripes. Unbelievable.

Not at all its the double fucking standard all the time. Where are Olbermanns special comments on that? Im sure there were chuckles when Condi was called a house negro. But when Imus said what he said there were pitchforks and torches by the race baiters like Sharpton et al.

[high fly]

This is what it has come down to... far-righters quoting Dan Rather, a man they loathe?

Suddenly Rather is a reliable source.
Likewise for the New York Times, L.A. Times and Washington Post if you listen to Limpbaugh, Manatee, LeVin, etc.
All day long they cite those sources to validate their opinions and to rely upon for accurate information.
Then they turn around and claim those same media outlets are not to be believed and the glassy-eyed zombies in the audience never notice the incongruity....

[SonOfSmeagol]

http://jeffpicard.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2008/06/rim-shot-johnny-utah.thumbnail.jpg

[WRESTLINGFAN]

way to go BHO. Snub your nose at one of our only allies in the mid east. Stay classy


http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/world/us_and_americas/article7076431.ece

[Serpico1103]

way to go BHO. Snub your nose at one of our only allies in the mid east. Stay classy


http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/world/us_and_americas/article7076431.ece

Good. Biny is snubbing his nose at us. His insistence on continuing settlements is against our foreign policy.
Let Israel handle its own troubles. They never help us just add to our middle east problems. Is Biny a citizen? Why are you concerned about his feelings?

[Dude!]

Good. Biny is snubbing his nose at us. His insistence on continuing settlements is against our foreign policy.
Let Israel handle its own troubles. They never help us just add to our middle east problems. Is Biny a citizen? Why are you concerned about his feelings?

why do you hate jews
so much?

[WRESTLINGFAN]

why do you hate jews
so much?

Serpico thinks any Jew who lives outside the limits of the Upper East Side really isnt a Jew

[SonOfSmeagol]

Good. Biny is snubbing his nose at us. His insistence on continuing settlements is against our foreign policy.
Let Israel handle its own troubles. They never help us just add to our middle east problems. Is Biny a citizen? Why are you concerned about his feelings?

Yeah, let a tiny nation of 7M pretty much surrounded by hostile enemies, some of which who openly declare to wipe them off the earth, handle it. They’ve got nukes and planes and tanks and stuff, after all. Great call there.

bho has now officially treated our longest and best friend in the region, the most stable democracy in the region, worse than he has Iran.
bho = big time douche on this one.

[Ogre]

Good. Biny is snubbing his nose at us. His insistence on continuing settlements is against our foreign policy.
Let Israel handle its own troubles. They never help us just add to our middle east problems. Is Biny a citizen? Why are you concerned about his feelings?

ummm..Jerusalem is the Capital of Israel not an outpost or settlement. Obama and Co. are getting bent out of shape to what amounts to a condo development in Washington DC.

So it's OK to still pussy out and let Iran develop a Nuke, but Heaven forbid the Jews build a condo in their capital city. Some foreign policy.

East Jerusalem was captured and occupied by Jordan in 1948 then Jordan was kicked out in 1967 and East Jerusalem was properly annexed back to the capital city.

[Recyclerz]

Serpico thinks any Jew who lives outside the limits of the Upper East Side really isnt a Jew

It's the Upper WEST Side!! Any UES-living Jews are self-hating. :innocent:

Yep, Obama sure does hate the Jews. (http://www.nytimes.com/2010/03/28/us/politics/28seder.html?hp)

Netanyahu is leading a coalition that includes some Ultra-Orthodox parties as well as the party of recent emigres (mostly from Russia) that envisions a "Greater Israel" geographically. It's similar to the coalition of nationalists and Christianists that Rove put together here to get Bush into office by a nose hair two times. "Bibi" is trying to ignore the demographic reality that Israel cannot continue to be both a democracy and a Jewish state given the birth rates of the Palestinians in the occupied territories and Israeli Arabs. Every Israeli leader (including Ariel Sharon) recognized this; the current Likud coalition has its fingers in its ears and is going "LA-LA-LA, I can't hear you." In order to make headway on other Middle-Eastern problems (like containing or defeating Iran) the US has to (at least be seen to be trying to) make progress on the Israeli-Palestinian front.
Admittedly, it isn't easy because Hamas is intransigent and Abbas doesn't seem able to get control over them so Israel doesn't have a willing negotiating partner but they also can't publicly piss on the US efforts and expect us to ignore it.

[Dude!]

"Bibi" is trying to ignore the demographic reality that Israel cannot continue to be both a democracy and a Jewish state given the birth rates of the Palestinians in the occupied territories and Israeli Arabs. Every Israeli leader (including Ariel Sharon) recognized this; the current Likud coalition has its fingers in its ears and is going "LA-LA-LA, I can't hear you."

wouldn't it be a wonderfully
ironic twist of history
if the jews took care of this
by having a 'final solution'
of their own,
and gassing all those people

[Crispy123]

Suddenly Rather is a reliable source.
Likewise for the New York Times, L.A. Times and Washington Post if you listen to Limpbaugh, Manatee, LeVin, etc.
All day long they cite those sources to validate their opinions and to rely upon for accurate information.
Then they turn around and claim those same media outlets are not to be believed and the glassy-eyed zombies in the audience never notice the incongruity....

Thats what the left wing media wants.

[high fly]

Good. Biny is snubbing his nose at us. His insistence on continuing settlements is against our foreign policy.
Let Israel handle its own troubles. They never help us just add to our middle east problems. Is Biny a citizen? Why are you concerned about his feelings?

Yeah, this craven business of allowing Israel to control American foreign policy is something I do not like.
Arms-for-hostages - - - - Israeli idea...

[high fly]

ummm..Jerusalem is the Capital of Israel not an outpost or settlement. Obama and Co. are getting bent out of shape to what amounts to a condo development in Washington DC.

So it's OK to still pussy out and let Iran develop a Nuke, but Heaven forbid the Jews build a condo in their capital city. Some foreign policy.

East Jerusalem was captured and occupied by Jordan in 1948 then Jordan was kicked out in 1967 and East Jerusalem was properly annexed back to the capital city.

That reminds me.
Bush43 said in the 2000 election he would move the U.S. embassy to Jerusalem as soon as he got in office.
He pussied out without a peep from the conservatives....

[A.J.]

Yeah, let a tiny nation of 7M pretty much surrounded by hostile enemies, some of which who openly declare to wipe them off the earth, handle it. They’ve got nukes and planes and tanks and stuff, after all. Great call there.

bho has now officially treated our longest and best friend in the region, the most stable democracy in the region, worse than he has Iran.
bho = big time douche on this one.

Our best friend that spies on us? Yeah, they're awesome.

Israel invites trouble on itself for the shitty way it treats the Palestinians. Then when it gets called on said treatment, it conveniently plays the victim card. Fuck them.

And we've had longer relations with the evil Saudis.

ummm..Jerusalem is the Capital of Israel not an outpost or settlement. Obama and Co. are getting bent out of shape to what amounts to a condo development in Washington DC.

So it's OK to still pussy out and let Iran develop a Nuke, but Heaven forbid the Jews build a condo in their capital city. Some foreign policy.

East Jerusalem was captured and occupied by Jordan in 1948 then Jordan was kicked out in 1967 and East Jerusalem was properly annexed back to the capital city.

Not really. It's a means of gentrification with the goal of driving the Palestinians out the the part of the city they were originally promised back in 1947.

[Crispy123]

Yeah, this craven business of allowing Israel to control American foreign policy is something I do not like.
Arms-for-hostages - - - - Israeli idea...

Hollywood, banking, foreign policy, what don't they control?

[WRESTLINGFAN]

On a side note Israeli women are beautiful. Much better than the Jappy whores on Long Island and the UES

[SonOfSmeagol]

Our best friend that spies on us? Yeah, they're awesome.

Israel invites trouble on itself for the shitty way it treats the Palestinians. Then when it gets called on said treatment, it conveniently plays the victim card. Fuck them.

And we don’t “spy” on every one of our allies, with the remotely possible exception of the Brits, and vice versa?

The Israelis long ago gave up “playing the victim card”, and decided instead not to be fucked with. This was in no small part due to the great majority of the world saying “fuck them”, so by no means are you alone in your sentiment.

[Ogre]

That reminds me.
Bush43 said in the 2000 election he would move the U.S. embassy to Jerusalem as soon as he got in office.
He pussied out without a peep from the conservatives....

One. Do you feel this is good foreign policy? If so then why has not Obama decided to commit to this ?

Two. Speaking of Obama let's talk about unfulfilled campaign promises shall we?

Earmarks
Lobbyist Influence
No Tax increase for the middle class (Obamcare will take care of that)
Transparency
Closing of Gitmo (kinda glad the facts overcome the hyperbole there)
Dumping Patriot Act (now he can spy on who HE deems a threat)
Promise to Renegotiate NAFTA

This are just a few. As you may notice some of these piss off the Left more than the Right.

[Ogre]

Not really. It's a means of gentrification with the goal of driving the Palestinians out the the part of the city they were originally promised back in 1947.

When Jordan annexed it it destroyed Synagogues and the bulldozed Jewish Quarter, wiping away centuries of the existence of Jewish heritage in this area. Consequently when Israel reclaimed it in '67, from thence forward ALL peoples including Arabs and Jordanians were allowed to exist there were allowed to continue to worship freely and without fear.

Who's driving whom?

[WRESTLINGFAN]

One. Do you feel this is good foreign policy? If so then why has not Obama decided to commit to this ?

Two. Speaking of Obama let's talk about unfulfilled campaign promises shall we?

Earmarks
Lobbyist Influence
No Tax increase for the middle class (Obamcare will take care of that)
Transparency
Closing of Gitmo (kinda glad the facts overcome the hyperbole there)
Dumping Patriot Act (now he can spy on who HE deems a threat)
Promise to Renegotiate NAFTA

This are just a few. As you may notice some of these piss off the Left more than the Right.

Its not as important as the ones above but he also promised no signing statements. That promise was broken too

[Serpico1103]

why do you hate jews
so much?

Ratting out the son of G-d was enough for me.

Serpico thinks any Jew who lives outside the limits of the Upper East Side really isnt a Jew
Actually outside of Williamsburg.

Yeah, let a tiny nation of 7M pretty much surrounded by hostile enemies, some of which who openly declare to wipe them off the earth, handle it. They’ve got nukes and planes and tanks and stuff, after all. Great call there.

bho has now officially treated our longest and best friend in the region, the most stable democracy in the region, worse than he has Iran.
bho = big time douche on this one.
Tiny nation handles it? Oh, so they don't rely on our help? Ok. Need a new bedtime story?

ummm..Jerusalem is the Capital of Israel not an outpost or settlement. Obama and Co. are getting bent out of shape to what amounts to a condo development in Washington DC.
East Jerusalem was captured and occupied by Jordan in 1948 then Jordan was kicked out in 1967 and East Jerusalem was properly annexed back to the capital city.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/8591461.stm
Biny downplays tension. But, I'll take your word for it.
"Nearly half a million Jews live in more than 100 settlements built since Israel's 1967 occupation of the West Bank and East Jerusalem.
They are considered illegal under international law, although Israel disputes this. "
But, I am sure you are more knowledgeable.

[WRESTLINGFAN]

Dubya appointed John Bolton via recess and then Senator BHO was the most vocal. President BHO appoints 15 via recess

[Serpico1103]

Dubya appointed John Bolton via recess and then Senator BHO was the most vocal. President BHO appoints 15 via recess

BHO 15 times more gooder than GWB!!!!

[Ogre]

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/8591461.stm
Biny downplays tension. But, I'll take your word for it.
"Nearly half a million Jews live in more than 100 settlements built since Israel's 1967 occupation of the West Bank and East Jerusalem.
They are considered illegal under international law, although Israel disputes this. "
But, I am sure you are more knowledgeable.

International Law means a made up UN resolution from a toothless tiger.

In the 1980 Basic Law Israel declared Jerusalem the Capital and that it should be undivided. Thus all the while maintaining their sovereign right. The UN Security Council passed a non binding resolution declaring Israel's Law to be null and void. (A Carter Administration United States Abstained from that vote). So that is the International Law you speak of. A third party trying to interfere in matters of Israeli sovereignty and the US abstained.

IN 1990 The US Senate adopted a resolution "acknowledging Jerusalem as Israel's capital." also stating that "it strongly believes that Jeruselum should remain an undivided city."

In 1995 Congress passed the Jerusalem Embassy Act that among other things stated that Jerusalem should remain undivided and should be Israel's capital. It was also in this act that Congress established that the U.S. Embassy be moved from Tel Aviv to Jerusalem no later than May 31, 1999. As you will note High Fly this is well before GWB's campaign, so the charge that this is is a promise that Bush broke in a specious argument at best.

[Serpico1103]

International Law means a made up UN resolution from a toothless tiger.
In the 1980 Basic Law Israel declared Jerusalem the Capital and that it should be undivided. Thus all the while maintaining their sovereign right. The UN Security Council passed a non binding resolution declaring Israel's Law to be null and void. (A Carter Administration United States Abstained from that vote). So that is the International Law you speak of. A third party trying to interfere in matters of Israeli sovereignty and the US abstained.
IN 1990 The US Senate adopted a resolution "acknowledging Jerusalem as Israel's capital." also stating that "it strongly believes that Jeruselum should remain an undivided city."
In 1995 Congress passed the Jerusalem Embassy Act that among other things stated that Jerusalem should remain undivided and should be Israel's capital. It was also in this act that Congress established that the U.S. Embassy be moved from Tel Aviv to Jerusalem no later than May 31, 1999. As you will note High Fly this is well before GWB's campaign, so the charge that this is is a promise that Bush broke in a specious argument at best.
Israel can do what they want.
But, if they want (and need) our help, they must consider our feelings towards their actions.

[Dude!]

he is now on a surprise
visit to afghanistan

i imagine it was no surprise
to his masters at al-qaida
who probably instructed him
to come
for a planning session

[Serpico1103]

he is now on a surprise
visit to afghanistan

i imagine it was no surprise
to his masters at al-qaida
who probably instructed him
to come
for a planning session

Should I flee in NYC in panic?
Where
should I hide,
under your
skirt?
How does Obama the Messiah have masters?

[brettmojo]

Should I flee in NYC in panic?
Where
should I hide,
under your
skirt?
How does Obama the Messiah have masters?
Hope this gif helps to answer your questions...

http://i234.photobucket.com/albums/ee103/brettmojo/71195718.gif

[Serpico1103]

Hope this gif helps to answer your questions...

http://i234.photobucket.com/albums/ee103/brettmojo/71195718.gif

I always look for answers in GIFs.
Thanks.

[Bob Impact]

I always look for answers in GIFs.
Thanks.

I'm really glad to hear that because people who look for answers in PNGs are psychopaths.

[Serpico1103]

I'm really glad to hear that because people who look for answers in PNGs are psychopaths.

I heard from my liberal friends that they are racists too.

[Ogre]

I heard from my liberal friends that they are racists too.

You got Liberal friends that are racists ? Oh that's right the whole No Negro dialect thing. Clean and articulate I think it was Joe ?

[Serpico1103]

You got Liberal friends that are racists ? Oh that's right the whole No Negro dialect thing. Clean and articulate I think it was Joe ?

All liberals are racists. We have a paternalistic attitude towards other races because they are inferior to us humans, I mean whites.

[A.J.]

Who's driving whom?

More importantly:

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[A.J.]

he is now on a surprise
visit to afghanistan

i imagine it was no surprise
to his masters at al-qaida
who probably instructed him
to come
for a planning session

Is he taking all of the U.S. troops back home when he leaves?

[Serpico1103]

Is he taking all of the U.S. troops back home when he leaves?
No, after passing obamacare he has to beg them to come back. Afghanistan will look like paradise compared to the future of the US with all its socialist programs.

[Dude!]

Is he taking all of the U.S. troops back home when he leaves?

no, he probably provided
classified info to the taliban
to aid them in destroying
our troops

he sent more troops over
so that more could be killed
by his friends

[WRESTLINGFAN]

Oil closed at over $82 per bbl. So that make BHO in cahoots with the oil companies?

[Serpico1103]

Oil closed at over $82 per bbl. So that make BHO in cahoots with the oil companies?

Yes, he plans on nationalizing them.

[WRESTLINGFAN]

Yes, he plans on nationalizing them.

Wait your turn in line Barry


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[A.J.]

Oil closed at over $82 per bbl. So that make BHO in cahoots with the oil companies?

Better them than those filthy A-rabs!

[foodcourtdruide]

Remember all those green initiatives we were promised?

http://www.cnn.com/2010/POLITICS/03/31/obama.energy/index.html?hpt=T1

Yeah... drill baby drill!

Pretty awful to hear Obama is on board with domestic drilling. Though, to be fair I do recall he never shot these ideas down during his campaign (could be wrong about this?). I think it's a bandaid on a knife wound.

My hopes are he's trying to pass a big energy proposal, which will include TONS of green energy (I wish the U.S. would be THE leader for this, jobs jobs jobs), and he's just trying to make sure republicans will be on board. It will be odd if republicans suddenly vote against domestic drilling.

[Dude!]

Remember all those green initiatives we were promised?

http://www.cnn.com/2010/POLITICS/03/31/obama.energy/index.html?hpt=T1

Though, to be fair I do recall he never shot these ideas down during his campaign (could be wrong about this?).

wow...you didn't pay
very close attention then

he was pandering to florida
all the time on this issue

no drilling off the US Coast he said
MANY TIMES

i'm all for it
but don't pretend he didn't
lie to get florida votes

[foodcourtdruide]

wow...you didn't pay
very close attention then

he was pandering to florida
all the time on this issue

no drilling off the US Coast he said
MANY TIMES

i'm all for it
but don't pretend he didn't
lie to get florida votes

What do you think about this?

http://elections.nytimes.com/2008/president/issues/energy.html

Senator Obama said he believes oil companies should exploit existing leases on public lands and off the coasts before new areas are opened to drilling. Like Mr. McCain, he opposes drilling in the Alaska refuge. Unlike Mr. McCain, he supports a windfall profits tax on oil companies. Mr. Obama does not oppose expansion of nuclear power in principle, but says it must be done safely and economically, considerations that for decades have halted construction of nuclear plants. Mr. Obama advocates spending $15 billion a year for the next 10 years to develop alternative-energy businesses, which he says will produce millions of new jobs. Mr. Obama, who is from Illinois, a big corn-producing state, supports federal subsidies for ethanol production. He also supports requiring utilities to produce about 20 percent of their electricity from renewable sources by 2020. And he backs higher fuel-efficiency standards for cars and trucks.

[WRESTLINGFAN]

Its either grandstanding. BHO is going to need Jim Webbs support for Amnesty or maybe he wants to nationalize another industry

[underdog]

Its either grandstanding.

Either implies two choices.

[high fly]

Dubya appointed John Bolton via recess and then Senator BHO was the most vocal. President BHO appoints 15 via recess


How consistent were you, WF?
If we go back and look, will we find posts from you opposing Bolton's appointment?

[WRESTLINGFAN]

How consistent were you, WF?
If we go back and look, will we find posts from you opposing Bolton's appointment?

Your boy ran on a platform of change and how things would be different. Just admit that hes just nothing more than another fucking politician

[high fly]

Your boy ran on a platform of change and how things would be different. Just admit that hes just nothing more than another fucking politician

Good idea.
Change the subject.
I take it you had no objection to Bolton's recess appointment, eh?

[WRESTLINGFAN]

Good idea.
Change the subject.
I take it you had no objection to Bolton's recess appointment, eh?

Youre changing the point!!! Your hero was the most vocal. What does he do? Recess appointments.

Whatever BHO does is perfect. He can do no wrong

[high fly]

Youre changing the point!!! Your hero was the most vocal. What does he do? Recess appointments.

Whatever BHO does is perfect. He can do no wrong

Apparently you supported the recess appointment of Bolton, now bitch when Obama does it, and bitch further when you see an aspect of yourself reflected in Obama.
Ok, we get it.
You don't want Obama to be like you.
You are probably not the only one around here to share that view....

[Bob Impact]

Apparently you supported the recess appointment of Bolton, now bitch when Obama does it, and bitch further when you see an aspect of yourself reflected in Obama.
Ok, we get it.
You don't want Obama to be like you.
You are probably not the only one around here to share that view....

You either didn't read his post or you're intentionally ignoring it.

Obama was very outspoken about Bolton's recess appointment, rightfully so, now he's appointing during recesses, instead of addressing that point, where Obama is wrong, you've decided to attack WF's credibility.

Just want to make sure the point is clear.

[Ogre]

Remember all those green initiatives we were promised?

http://www.cnn.com/2010/POLITICS/03/31/obama.energy/index.html?hpt=T1

Yeah... drill baby drill!

Pretty awful to hear Obama is on board with domestic drilling. Though, to be fair I do recall he never shot these ideas down during his campaign (could be wrong about this?). I think it's a bandaid on a knife wound.

My hopes are he's trying to pass a big energy proposal, which will include TONS of green energy (I wish the U.S. would be THE leader for this, jobs jobs jobs), and he's just trying to make sure republicans will be on board. It will be odd if republicans suddenly vote against domestic drilling.

Doubt that would happen. President Obama's move seems pragmatic and makes sense on the surface, but maybe the endgame is increased domestic production on the way to nationalization of the energy sector.

[Syd]

Doubt that would happen. President Obama's move seems pragmatic and makes sense on the surface, but maybe the endgame is increased domestic production on the way to nationalization of the energy sector.

Plus jobs. They're 10-15 years out but that is a lot of new jobs created not only servicing and working on the rigs but building and designing them. I could care less about what paltry ass amount of energy they extract, but it's going to be a decent number of jobs created.

[underdog]

Doubt that would happen. President Obama's move seems pragmatic and makes sense on the surface, but maybe the endgame is increased domestic production on the way to nationalization of the energy sector.

Making sense has never stopped either side from voting against something.

[foodcourtdruide]

Plus jobs. They're 10-15 years out but that is a lot of new jobs created not only servicing and working on the rigs but building and designing them. I could care less about what paltry ass amount of energy they extract, but it's going to be a decent number of jobs created.

I feel it's inside-the-box thinking. It would be great to create new jobs on oil rigs, etc. However, we have (or maybe had) the chance to really be the leaders in an entire new industry. My hope is that the drilling off the coast of Virginia is just a temporary fix to get republicans in line with aggressively trying to be the forerunner for green energy.

I find two things amazing with this:

1. That Obama is doing this at all, completely going against what he campaigned for.
2. That some republicans are truly the "party of no" and have shown that they care more about diagreeing with Obama than anything else.

[foodcourtdruide]

Doubt that would happen. President Obama's move seems pragmatic and makes sense on the surface, but maybe the endgame is increased domestic production on the way to nationalization of the energy sector.

I really doubt this, because:
1. Oil companies are doing just fine on their own.
2. There's no perceived dire need for this (ie health care)

[Crispy123]

You either didn't read his post or you're intentionally ignoring it.

Obama was very outspoken about Bolton's recess appointment, rightfully so, now he's appointing during recesses, instead of addressing that point, where Obama is wrong, you've decided to attack WF's credibility.

Just want to make sure the point is clear.

Ill go ahead and take a stab at it...

The objections many had from both parties were with the individual, John Bolton. The appointment of a diplomat had never been made through a recess appointment before this. Mr Obama and many others brought this up and made the case that this would weaken our already damaged credibility with the UN. From what I understand the argument was not with the recess apointment procedure in general.

[foodcourtdruide]

Ill go ahead and take a stab at it...

The objections many had from both parties were with the individual, John Bolton. The appointment of a diplomat had never been made through a recess appointment before this. Mr Obama and many others brought this up and made the case that this would weaken our already damaged credibility with the UN. From what I understand the argument was not with the recess apointment procedure in general.

Shades of grey have no place in our political process, especially the media.

[Jujubees2]

Shades of grey have no place in our political process, especially the media.

That's right. It's all BLACK and white!

[CaptainBlowhole]

I thought this was pretty interesting. I thought at one point I was about to hear "Who says white men cant shoot, yo?"

<embed src='http://cnettv.cnet.com/av/video/cbsnews/atlantis2/player-dest.swf' FlashVars='linkUrl=http://www.cbsnews.com/video/watch/?id=6354605n&releaseURL=http://cnettv.cnet.com/av/video/cbsnews/atlantis2/player-dest.swf&videoId=50085721&partner=news&vert=News&si=254&autoPlayVid=false&name=cbsPlayer&allowScriptAccess=always&wmode=transparent&embedded=y&scale=noscale&rv=n&salign=tl' allowFullScreen='true' width='425' height='324' type='application/x-shockwave-flash' pluginspage='http://www.macromedia.com/go/getflashplayer'></embed><br/><a href='http://www.cbsnews.com'>Watch CBS News Videos Online</a>

[Gunner S]

Obama is the worst president. Besides Bush.
They both were elected based on completely horseshit reasons.
Bush = Ignore the Politics, Let's have a beer
Obama = Ignore the Politics, Look at his skin. and "Change"

How fucking vague. Change, for the worst.

The Overhaul Bill is by far one of the WORST thing government has thought up.

[high fly]

Obama is the worst president. Besides Bush.
They both were elected based on completely horseshit reasons.
Bush = Ignore the Politics, Let's have a beer
Obama = Ignore the Politics, Look at his skin. and "Change"

How fucking vague. Change, for the worst.


Obama was not "fucking vague" during the campaign about national health care.

Obama was not "fucking vague" during the campaign about getting us out of Iraq.

Obama was not "fucking vague" during the campaign about changing the focus and priorities to emphasize the war effort in Afghanistan.

Obama was not "fucking vague" during the campaign about ending torture as a matter of national policy.

Obama was not "fucking vague" during the campaign about reducing nuclear arsenals.

[Serpico1103]

Obama Breaks Promises!
http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-meter/promises/browse/

Rush is a Liar!!
http://www.politifact.com/subjects/pundits/

[WRESTLINGFAN]

BHO Cant throw for shit.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wxZfxcEQM2k

[Bob Impact]

Obama Breaks Promises!
http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-meter/promises/browse/

Rush is a Liar!!
http://www.politifact.com/subjects/pundits/

Did you actually read the list of his kept promises?

The list of "In Progress" and "Broken" aren't much better, but jesus, they give him credit for the Healthcare bill and then several sections within it. Then they give him credit for keeping such groundbreaking promises such as "Champion the importance of arts" "Appoint a republican" and "Get his daughters a puppy."

Also, the majority of their list of liars seems to all have something in common

[badmonkey]

Did you actually read the list of his kept promises?

The list of "In Progress" and "Broken" aren't much better, but jesus, they give him credit for the Healthcare bill and then several sections within it. Then they give him credit for keeping such groundbreaking promises such as "Champion the importance of arts" "Appoint a republican" and "Get his daughters a puppy."

Also, the majority of their list of liars seems to all have something in common

Did you not see that the word "fact" is part of the name of the website? How can you possibly suggest impartiality when their very name has the word fact in it? It's not like the site is called politopinion.com or something. You seem paranoid Bob. Maybe you'd like to speak with one of the doctors under our new health care plan. They may be able to prescribe some medicine that might assist you with your delusions and make you feel better about all of this. :drunk:

[Serpico1103]

Did you actually read the list of his kept promises?

The list of "In Progress" and "Broken" aren't much better, but jesus, they give him credit for the Healthcare bill and then several sections within it. Then they give him credit for keeping such groundbreaking promises such as "Champion the importance of arts" "Appoint a republican" and "Get his daughters a puppy."

Also, the majority of their list of liars seems to all have something in common

I thought it was interesting, not necessarily proof of any one thing in particular.
Anyway, I think "trying to keep a promise" is a better measure than "keeping a promise." Obama, while being a god, is not a dictator.

Majority of liars on the list? Are white men. There goes my self-hatred again.

[Bob Impact]

I thought it was interesting, not necessarily proof of any one thing in particular.
Anyway, I think "trying to keep a promise" is a better measure than "keeping a promise." Obama, while being a god, is not a dictator.

Majority of liars on the list? Are white men. There goes my self-hatred again.

Well us whiteys are known liars and thieves. As far as the "Trying to" vs. Actually keeping a promise, in that context I agree with you 100%, I'm just saying that the list they use there is a little off... seems like they had that # of "500 promises" in their head that they then built the list to match.

[high fly]

The whole unachieved promise mantra cracks me up because Obama still has 2, and probably 6 years to fulfill his promises.
It's as dopey as the questions that began about a week after he was sworn in, demanding to know why the economy had not completely recovered.

I'm just glad McCain and Palin are not in office, getting ready to select the next Supreme Court justice........

[Syd]

The whole unachieved promise mantra cracks me up because Obama still has 2, and probably 6 years to fulfill his promises.
It's as dopey as the questions that began about a week after he was sworn in, demanding to know why the economy had not completely recovered.

I'm just glad McCain and Palin are not in office, getting ready to select the next Supreme Court justice........

Fox News would be so much more better though. I liked them more when they were the cheerleaders. This whole white man's burden act they're running now isn't as entertaining.

[high fly]

Fox News would be so much more better though. I liked them more when they were the cheerleaders. This whole white man's burden act they're running now isn't as entertaining.

Maybe they'll sign up LeVin.
I'd like to see him get all purple-faced during the rants he goes on daily. Incredible someone can sustain that much unbridled rage for hours on end each day....

[scottinnj]

Yes, he is

[A.J.]

There he goes again...blocking traffic in my neighborhood so he can go to Ray's Hell Burger for lunch with Dmitry Medvedev (http://www.nydailynews.com/news/politics/2010/06/25/2010-06-25_world_leaders_say_to_hell_with_diplomacy_lets_e at_burgers.html).

[El Mudo]

There he goes again...blocking traffic in my neighborhood so he can go to Ray's Hell Burger for lunch with Dmitry Medvedev (http://www.nydailynews.com/news/politics/2010/06/25/2010-06-25_world_leaders_say_to_hell_with_diplomacy_lets_e at_burgers.html).

Arlington? Are you one of those guys in brown flip flops?

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[A.J.]

Arlington? Are you one of those guys in brown flip flops?

No. Nor am I one of those popped-collar wearing douchebags.

The thing about the Starbucks is scary true. There must be five just within a mile of my house.

[El Mudo]

No. Nor am I one of those popped-collar wearing douchebags.

The thing about the Starbucks is scary true. There must be five just within a mile of my house.

I've spent most of this afternoon watching that video and laughing because all of it is so, so true.

[A.J.]

<---------- Courthouse Representin', Yo!

[El Mudo]

Clizzle Dizzle!!!!!!!!!!!


Best part is the "why don't we take the Green Line??!!"

[pause]

".....so then we took a taxi...."

[WRESTLINGFAN]

18 months into Barry's stimulus scam and its still dismal news. Now he has the circus clown Biden doing the summer recovery tour. Even the Euro's and ChiComs are telling BHO quit spending so much money playa


http://www.marketwatch.com/story/weekly-jobless-claims-climb-13000-to-472000-2010-07-01?siteid=bnbh

[Syd]

People need to stop thinking recovery and start thinking stemming the tide. Job losses from this recession are going to be rather permanent and more and more suburbs become isolated from businesses. Spending is the only way you fix that -- lower taxes won't inspire businesses to open up in isolated areas with limited traffic nor will it cause people to magically be able to install track lighting to increase the value of their home by $50k and then take a loan out on it. The whole economy from 1996 onward has been based entirely on immensely untenable ideas. Capitalism can't guide an economy to grow forever.

The point of the spending was to keep states from going bankrupt. It wasn't a stimulus, it was a bankruptcy prevention plan.

[SinA]

http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2010/jul/1/survey-finds-fdr-best-president/

Siena College Research Institute's (SRI) Survey of U.S. Presidents finds that experts rank Franklin D. Roosevelt as the top all time chief executive

George W. Bush, who ranked 23rd in the 2002 survey, plummeted into the bottom five (39th place) in the 2010 survey. Mr. Bush was ranked especially poorly in categories of handling the economy, communication, ability to compromise, foreign policy accomplishments and personal intelligence.

[A.J.]

http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2010/jul/1/survey-finds-fdr-best-president/

Siena College Research Institute's (SRI) Survey of U.S. Presidents finds that experts rank Franklin D. Roosevelt as the top all time chief executive.

I guess FDR's massive expansion of the Executive Branch helped.

[WRESTLINGFAN]

People need to stop thinking recovery and start thinking stemming the tide. Job losses from this recession are going to be rather permanent and more and more suburbs become isolated from businesses. Spending is the only way you fix that -- lower taxes won't inspire businesses to open up in isolated areas with limited traffic nor will it cause people to magically be able to install track lighting to increase the value of their home by $50k and then take a loan out on it. The whole economy from 1996 onward has been based entirely on immensely untenable ideas. Capitalism can't guide an economy to grow forever.

The point of the spending was to keep states from going bankrupt. It wasn't a stimulus, it was a bankruptcy prevention plan.

Its kicking the can down the street. More and more people are going to have no federal tax liability. It will eventually happen when 51% have no liability and the 49% will be carrying them on their backs. With an ever expanding entitlement system and if 20 million people become legalized with an overwhelming majority not making enough to pay federal taxes it will lead to economic collapse

[Syd]

Its kicking the can down the street. More and more people are going to have no federal tax liability. It will eventually happen when 51% have no liability and the 49% will be carrying them on their backs. With an ever expanding entitlement system and if 20 million people become legalized with an overwhelming majority not making enough to pay federal taxes it will lead to economic collapse

Then let us do something about it: if a state receives more than $1.50 in spending for every $1 it pays in revenue, kick it out. It's an nonviable state that doesn't have a place in the free market. Without the drain on taxes that is Alaska, North Dakota, Virginia, West Virginia, Mississippi, Alabama, New Mexico and South Dakota the country will be in much more ripe shape.

Also, your numbers are wrong. Speaking of just income taxes, the top 5% income earners which control roughly 2/3rds of the wealth in the nation pay for about half of all income tax revenue. It isn't anywhere near half and half, but then again no one wants to be reminded of how little they actually are worth.

[WRESTLINGFAN]

Then let us do something about it: if a state receives more than $1.50 in spending for every $1 it pays in revenue, kick it out. It's an nonviable state that doesn't have a place in the free market. Without the drain on taxes that is Alaska, North Dakota, Virginia, West Virginia, Mississippi, Alabama, New Mexico and South Dakota the country will be in much more ripe shape.

Also, your numbers are wrong. Speaking of just income taxes, the top 5% income earners which control roughly 2/3rds of the wealth in the nation pay for about half of all income tax revenue. It isn't anywhere near half and half, but then again no one wants to be reminded of how little they actually are worth.

The problem is not just debt and deficits its unfunded liabilities. With a decreasing population of taxpayers to the feds and an increasing recipient class taxes will have to be raised and entitlements cut. The fed printing funny money just cant catch up. Austrian school of economics will be our only way back to solvency but thats going to take a long time

Here is a dismal report from the CBO regarding Obamacare

http://www.news-medical.net/news/20100701/CBO-Director-Potential-health-law-savings-not-enough-to-reduce-long-term-deficits.aspx


Even more bad news.

http://www.zerohedge.com/article/cbo-issues-most-dire-warning-us-budget-yet-warns-us-debt-will-swiftly-be-pushed-unsustainabl

[Syd]

So is it more important to spend the nearly $1tn every year on military funding or is it more important to provide healthcare to the population (through private means)

If you're for smaller government, you start at the biggest possible waste of money in the world: the US military. It has doubled since 2000 and continues to gain with no end in sight. We spend roughly half the total amount of money spent on defense budgets. We account for more military expenditures than all of Asia.

Say what you will about Obamacare, but it's predicted to cost us what, $1trillion total? We've spent that nearly every single year since 2003 in defense expenditures and the wars in Iraq and Afghanistan.

This is more petulant 'wah wah wah BUDGET DEFICIT!" stuff from people who are too focused on what people tell them is the problem and not enough time looking at the worthless stuff we spend money on.

Is the F-22 going to help you in your daily life instead of something that helps provide you with healthcare, even if you're laid off?

Before you answer remember that the F-22 costs just about the median income of a house in the US to fly PER HOUR. If one very average family dedicated every cent to an F-22, it could allow it to fly for one hour. Supposing it doesn't rain of course since it more or less can disintegrate in it.

What about the war in Iraq? Does that help you more than having better guarantees for unemployment insurance?

Before you answer remember that in order 2 people with a masters will have to contribute every single cent they earn over their lifetime to pay for one single hour of the US being in Iraq. Supposing, of course, they don't get a crippling injury and are denied healthcare coverage for having a pre-existing injury which causes them to be forced out of the workforce.

Really, it's like lighting a big stack of money on fire and rushing to put out the $10 bills while the stack of $100s burns to a fucking crisp.

[Syd]

Let us look at entitlement programs next:

Social Security. Is there a reason people shouldn't have saved money for their own retirement? No, cut it. Let the seniors fend for themselves. That cuts our budget by 1/5th.

Medicare/Medicaid. About 50% of your entire healthcare costs will come in the last 5 years of your life. 80-90% of seniors are on Medicare, let them buy private insurance and pay for it themselves. I am sure their rates will be reasonable. That cuts about $3-400bn out of our budget per year.

If we're looking at getting rid of "Obamacare" I don't see any reason everyone else in the US shouldn't have to fend for themselves.

[booster11373]

Let us look at entitlement programs next:

Social Security. Is there a reason people shouldn't have saved money for their own retirement? No, cut it. Let the seniors fend for themselves. That cuts our budget by 1/5th.

Medicare/Medicaid. About 50% of your entire healthcare costs will come in the last 5 years of your life. 80-90% of seniors are on Medicare, let them buy private insurance and pay for it themselves. I am sure their rates will be reasonable. That cuts about $3-400bn out of our budget per year.

If we're looking at getting rid of "Obamacare" I don't see any reason everyone else in the US shouldn't have to fend for themselves.

We can finally change the name of the country to Thunderdome!

[WRESTLINGFAN]

So is it more important to spend the nearly $1tn every year on military funding or is it more important to provide healthcare to the population (through private means)

If you're for smaller government, you start at the biggest possible waste of money in the world: the US military. It has doubled since 2000 and continues to gain with no end in sight. We spend roughly half the total amount of money spent on defense budgets. We account for more military expenditures than all of Asia.

Say what you will about Obamacare, but it's predicted to cost us what, $1trillion total? We've spent that nearly every single year since 2003 in defense expenditures and the wars in Iraq and Afghanistan.

This is more petulant 'wah wah wah BUDGET DEFICIT!" stuff from people who are too focused on what people tell them is the problem and not enough time looking at the worthless stuff we spend money on.

Is the F-22 going to help you in your daily life instead of something that helps provide you with healthcare, even if you're laid off?

Before you answer remember that the F-22 costs just about the median income of a house in the US to fly PER HOUR. If one very average family dedicated every cent to an F-22, it could allow it to fly for one hour. Supposing it doesn't rain of course since it more or less can disintegrate in it.

What about the war in Iraq? Does that help you more than having better guarantees for unemployment insurance?

Before you answer remember that in order 2 people with a masters will have to contribute every single cent they earn over their lifetime to pay for one single hour of the US being in Iraq. Supposing, of course, they don't get a crippling injury and are denied healthcare coverage for having a pre-existing injury which causes them to be forced out of the workforce.

Really, it's like lighting a big stack of money on fire and rushing to put out the $10 bills while the stack of $100s burns to a fucking crisp.


As far as defense spending youre preaching to the choir. Do we really have to worry about dogfights with members of the Taliban or AlQaeda? I dont think the Russians will be selling them MiGs anytime soon. Obama is no dove when it comes to defense spending this FY is about 600 billion. He is extending an impossible situation in Afghanistan. We really don't need 700+ bases around the world, time to dismantle the empire. Why are troops needed in Germany? Put about half that amt on the southern border and the immigration problem is solved. We were warned about the military industrial complex 55 years ago. This is where both fiscal conservatives and progressives are in almost 100% in agreement with

Obamacare is going to cost more that a trillion. Probably more like 2-3 trillion plus the CBO said it will not bring costs down.

Not all debt is bad, for example someone making 100k with a 175K mortgage can make the payments on that. What this country has is a national debt reaching 100% of GDP and the unfunded liabilities are unsustainable

[WRESTLINGFAN]

More reason to see that BHOs 787 billion dollar scam is a failure





http://money.cnn.com/2010/07/02/news/economy/economic_stimulus_impact/index.htm

Get ready for a double dip recession. Our social experiment BHO is proving to be a huge mistake.

The stupid SOB still insists that legalizing 20 million people will be great for the country. More welfare recipients added to a shrinking tax base. This guy is as dumb as dubya

[spoon]

More reason to see that BHOs 787 billion dollar scam is a failure





http://money.cnn.com/2010/07/02/news/economy/economic_stimulus_impact/index.htm

Get ready for a double dip recession. Our social experiment BHO is proving to be a huge mistake.

The stupid SOB still insists that legalizing 20 million people will be great for the country. More welfare recipients added to a shrinking tax base. This guy is as dumb as dubya

not even close, but it's ok if you disagree with his policy.

funny thing is, he ran on this platform so he's doing exactly what he said he would

[WRESTLINGFAN]

Its definitely a 3rd Bush term. Endless war. Extending the patriot act, Open Borders. Looting the treasury

[Serpico1103]

Its definitely a 3rd Bush term. Endless war. Extending the patriot act, Open Borders. Looting the treasury

Obama needs to start two wars to catch up to Bush. Well, according to Steele, Obama and Bush are 1 and 1 in starting unwinable wars.

[WRESTLINGFAN]

Obama needs to start two wars to catch up to Bush. Well, according to Steele, Obama and Bush are 1 and 1 in starting unwinable wars.

He's declared Jihad on the taxpayer and he's winning that one. Spending trillions of dollars, he's definitely outdoing W

[spoon]

He's declared Jihad on the taxpayer and he's winning that one. Spending trillions of dollars, he's definitely outdoing W

I paid less taxes this year, check again. Also, it's called digging out and staying out of a depression. Then again, why include facts. Post away.

[Serpico1103]

He's declared Jihad on the taxpayer and he's winning that one. Spending trillions of dollars, he's definitely outdoing W

Atleast Jezo is a funny character. "Jihad"- really?

Get a grip.

Steele, McCain, Cheney, Palin- national faces of the Republican Party. Good Luck.

[Dude!]

Steele, McCain, Cheney, Palin- national faces of the Republican Party. Good Luck.

obama, reid, pelosi
barney frank, henry waxman
faces of the democrat party
Good Luck

[Syd]

He's declared Jihad on the taxpayer and he's winning that one. Spending trillions of dollars, he's definitely outdoing W

Spending is how you get out of recessions. Given how low inflation is (we're trending toward deflation again) and how unemployment is still pretty rough, why not keep spending?

[StanUpshaw]

Clearly the way to recover from the last bubble is to furiously work on creating a newer, bigger one.

[hanso]

Make John Travolta the czar.

[Serpico1103]

obama, reid, pelosi
barney frank, henry waxman
faces of the democrat party
Good Luck

Psst, they won.
But, they appreciate the belated sentiment.

[Syd]

Clearly the way to recover from the last bubble is to furiously work on creating a newer, bigger one.

you figured at capitalism, congratulations!

[WRESTLINGFAN]

Atleast Jezo is a funny character. "Jihad"- really?

Get a grip.

Steele, McCain, Cheney, Palin- national faces of the Republican Party. Good Luck.

like trained seals. Anyone opposed Obama worships those useless hacks. Why don't you throw in Karl Rove!!!

[WRESTLINGFAN]

I paid less taxes this year, check again. Also, it's called digging out and staying out of a depression. Then again, why include facts. Post away.



In a way you're right!!! Since the stimulus scam more people have paid less taxes because they are fucking unemployed!!!! Hint!!! Obama didn't rescue us from anything he's leading the country into a depression!!!

[Rhah]

In a way you're right!!! Since the stimulus scam more people have paid less taxes because they are fucking unemployed!!!! Hint!!! Obama didn't rescue us from anything he's leading the country into a depression!!!

Yep, two useless wars won't do that at all, especially when the war contracts go to companies that probably outsource their shit... wartime manufacturing doesn't help the US anymore like WW2.

[WRESTLINGFAN]

Yep, two useless wars won't do that at all, especially when the war contracts go to companies that probably outsource their shit... wartime manufacturing doesn't help the US anymore like WW2.

1 useless war that BHO is foolishly continuing. Check the defense budget under him he isn't exactly slashing it

[epo]

In a way you're right!!! Since the stimulus scam more people have paid less taxes because they are fucking unemployed!!!! Hint!!! Obama didn't rescue us from anything he's leading the country into a depression!!!

Shut up, seriously. The average tax rate for a strong majority is lower than its been since 1950 (http://www.usatoday.com/money/perfi/taxes/2010-05-10-taxes_N.htm).

But then again, why like little things like facts get in the way of your mindless drivel.

[WRESTLINGFAN]

Shut up, seriously. The average tax rate for a strong majority is lower than its been since 1950 (http://www.usatoday.com/money/perfi/taxes/2010-05-10-taxes_N.htm).

But then again, why like little things like facts get in the way of your mindless drivel.

Close to half have no tax liability whatsoever!!!
Enjoy that extra 13 bucks a week

In 1950 we didn't have a bloated welfare state and huge unfunded liabilities!! Saint Baracketh of Chicago is piling onto the shitstorm

[epo]

Enjoy that extra 13 bucks a week

In 1950 we didn't have a bloated welfare state and huge unfunded liabilities!! Saint Baracketh of Chicago is piling onto the shitstorm

28 of the last 41 years, this nation has had a Republican as President. Any bitching you do about structural government programs lies at their feet.

[StanUpshaw]

Shut up, seriously. The average tax rate for a strong majority is lower than its been since 1950 (http://www.usatoday.com/money/perfi/taxes/2010-05-10-taxes_N.htm).

But then again, why like little things like facts get in the way of your mindless drivel.

"The BEA classifies Social Security taxes as insurance payments and excludes them from the tax calculation."

There's also that.

[Rhah]

Close to half have no tax liability whatsoever!!!
Enjoy that extra 13 bucks a week

In 1950 we didn't have a bloated welfare state and huge unfunded liabilities!! Saint Baracketh of Chicago is piling onto the shitstorm

Btw, not sure which half you are talking about, but half the income of the whole nation is made by the top 1% of the companies and rich folks end up paying no income tax due to loopholes and shit and hiring expensive accountants.

Exxon paid almost zero income tax on its record profit year a little while ago (what was it? like 30 billion?)

[WRESTLINGFAN]

28 of the last 41 years, this nation has had a Republican as President. Any bitching you do about structural government programs lies at their feet.

And most of those 41 years was a majority Democrat congress. They hold the purse strings!!!!

[epo]

And most of those 41 years was a majority Democrat congress. They hold the purse strings!!!!

So the President has no blame?

Then this entire thread is useless.

[StanUpshaw]

Then this entire thread is useless.

Finally, a sensible post from epo.

[PapaBear]

Then this entire thread is useless.
It was actually a joke thread to begin with. He had been President for 5 days when it was started.

[epo]

It was actually a joke thread to begin with. He had been President for 5 days when it was started.

Obviously any political thread started by Gvac is a joke.

[PapaBear]

Obviously any political thread started by Gvac is a joke.
Who was that guy, anyway? He had a lot of posts, but I don't recall who he is.

[epo]

Who was that guy, anyway? He had a lot of posts, but I don't recall who he is.

I heard he was a hairy, sausage-fingered savage.

[underdog]

The stupid SOB still insists that legalizing 20 million people will be great for the country. More welfare recipients added to a shrinking tax base. This guy is as dumb as dubya

I thought one of your problems with illegals was that they were on welfare. So if they're already on welfare and get legal, how would that add to the "shrinking tax base"?

I paid less taxes this year, check again. Also, it's called digging out and staying out of a depression. Then again, why include facts. Post away.

I think like 98% of the US paid less in taxes this past year. It's much easier to ignore facts, though.

[underdog]

like trained seals. Anyone opposed Obama worships those useless hacks. Why don't you throw in Karl Rove!!!

http://farm5.static.flickr.com/4018/4427324850_d6e9381d8a.jpg

Exxon paid almost zero income tax on its record profit year a little while ago (what was it? like 30 billion?)

They paid zero in taxes last year. If I remember correctly, GM actually got a refund. (<-- I might remember GE, instead)

[StanUpshaw]

I only paid the monthly minimums on my my credit card last year.

Therefore, my credit card bills were the lowest they've been in over a decade!

Right?

[underdog]

I only paid the monthly minimums on my my credit card last year.

Therefore, my credit card bills were the lowest they've been in over a decade!

Right?

What? You're reaching into wrestlingfan non-sequitur territory.

[scottinnj]

Yes, he is.

[WRESTLINGFAN]

All we hear is "WE GOTTA SPEND MONEY"

The depression of 1920 is hardly ever brought up. Stimulus and government spending was not needed and we got out of it.


Keynesian economics wasnt needed then or during the 1930s or needed now.

http://www.lewrockwell.com/woods/woods125.html

[Barnaby Jones]

All we hear is "WE GOTTA SPEND MONEY"

The depression of 1920 is hardly ever brought up. Stimulus and government spending was not needed and we got out of it.


Keynesian economics wasnt needed then or during the 1930s or needed now.

http://www.lewrockwell.com/woods/woods125.html

Are you high? One of the biggest knocks against Hoover is that he stuck strictly to his "small government" guns when government intervention was desperately needed in the wake of the Depression!

LOL! Great source!

homas E. Woods, Jr. [visit his website; send him mail] is the author of nine books, including two New York Times bestsellers: Meltdown: A Free-Market Look at Why the Stock Market Collapsed, the Economy Tanked, and Government Bailouts Will Make Things Worse and The Politically Incorrect Guide to American History. Read Congressman Ron Paul's foreword to Meltdown.

LOLOLOLOLOLOL!!!!

[WRESTLINGFAN]

Are you high? One of the biggest knocks against Hoover is that he stuck strictly to his "small government" guns when government intervention was desperately needed in the wake of the Depression!

LOL! Great source!



LOLOLOLOLOLOL!!!!

And your point is Spening 787 billion dollars of borrowed money was a great investment to make unemployent go from about 7.8% to 10% with no downtick of the rate for years to come?


Lets take Paul Krugmans advice and piss away more on Stimulus. Keep drinking the kool aid given to you by the media. People like Gerald Celente who have been warning about this unsustainable debt you thumb your nose at. Hussein and his secret stash of cash will solve everything

[Barnaby Jones]

That wasn't my point at all! Jesus Christ, you are ridiculous! You respond to almost every post as if something completely different was posted! What delusions! You made a stupid statement claiming that government spending and assistance wasn't needed during the Depression when most historians and economists worth a damn will say that Hoover wanting to keep things as hands off as possible was one of the worst possible decisions he could have made and almost certainly made things much, much worse!

Silly Mr. Libertarian only when it's convenient!

[hanso]

And your point is Spening 787 billion dollars of borrowed money was a great investment to make unemployent go from about 7.8% to 10% with no downtick of the rate for years to come?




Bush had already spent a trillion. What do we have to show for this?

[Rhah]

We're never gonna get lost jobs back because employers who cut payrolls now aren't hiring back and making their current workers pick up the slack. The current workers are scared shitless of doing anything to get canned as well and just do the work and keep their mouths shut. Workers' rights are a thing of the past.

[Syd]

The depression of 1920 is hardly ever brought up. Stimulus and government spending was not needed and we got out of it.

I looooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo oooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo oooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo oooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo oooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo oooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo oooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo oooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo oooooooooooooooooooove when you "free market" people bring up the 20-21 depression as some great laissez faire victory. All it did was trigger the Great Depression from the fucked up fiscal policies during the early 20s as well as give up a shitload of economic independence to the Federal Reserve. Every fucking shithead Republican lauds that as a victory but they don't have any goddamn clue that the Federal Reserve gained its true autonomy during that depression. Keep on fighting for them though, you're doing a wonderful job.

[Syd]

Bush had already spent a trillion. What do we have to show for this?

Few thousand new shiny crosses in a field across the Potomac?

[WRESTLINGFAN]

I looooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo oooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo oooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo oooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo oooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo oooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo oooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo oooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo oooooooooooooooooooove when you "free market" people bring up the 20-21 depression as some great laissez faire victory. All it did was trigger the Great Depression from the fucked up fiscal policies during the early 20s as well as give up a shitload of economic independence to the Federal Reserve. Every fucking shithead Republican lauds that as a victory but they don't have any goddamn clue that the Federal Reserve gained its true autonomy during that depression. Keep on fighting for them though, you're doing a wonderful job.


Theres no such thing as a free market. Want to see one? go to Mogadishu. It was the fed which caused many bubbles and bursts including the tech bubble in 2000 and the current housing crisis.


Anyone with any sanity would want an audit of the fed.

[WRESTLINGFAN]

Bush had already spent a trillion. What do we have to show for this?

BHO is outspending him and what do we have to show?

[Dudeman]

BHO is outspending him and what do we have to show?

some people say the recession would have been even worse. but i really don't know... i'm not an economic expert.

[WRESTLINGFAN]

2.2 million jobs lost under this administration and no end in sight.

He rewards the UAW and expands an already bloated government. There is no motivation for investment or creating businesses.


Trillions of dollars in spending but what do we have to show for it. A biracial cool hip dude in the whitehouse?

[Syd]

There is no motivation for investment or creating businesses.

There's no money left for the middle class to consume like they used to. Having the tax burden shifted off of the upper class to the middle and lower class over the past 2-3 decades tends to have that effect. The middle class is what drives the economy, especially a consumption economy like America.

[Syd]

He rewards the UAW and expands an already bloated government.

And this is why you reward those who create, rather than slowly distribute wealth upward:

http://bilbo.economicoutlook.net/blog/?p=5537

[WRESTLINGFAN]

Heres a report of the failures of Keynesian economics and how it inhibits economic growth as well as other factors including the failure of the new deal

http://dailycapitalist.com/tag/keynesian-economics/

[Rhah]

Corporate big wigs are gonna start to learn what it means to freeze wages for 10 years straight and have the middle class have no actual buying power.

Profits and economy down...

oh but, globalization will save us, we will sell retarded gadgets to China and India... until they realize that people there are used to being poor and don't waste their money on retarded shit like us americans do.

Maybe when CEOs have to start foreclosing on their yachts, they will get the idea that they actually have to hire and pay US workers.

[Syd]

Heres a report of the failures of Keynesian economics and how it inhibits economic growth as well as other factors including the failure of the new deal

http://dailycapitalist.com/tag/keynesian-economics/

if the New Deal didn't work, it only failed because of the lack of scope. People like to peg WW2 as what brought America out of the depression but they forget that over 50% of the GDP of the nation was government spending. Any time people want to argue that, just go ahead and call them communists for wanting that much government control of the economy. Watch their little Republican heads spin as they come to terms with it.

[Syd]

Corporate big wigs are gonna start to learn what it means to freeze wages for 10 years straight and have the middle class have no actual buying power.

We're finding it out now. Since 1980, no one really has had any money to spend on stupid shit outside of the few bubbles that were created in the 90s and now 00s. Stagnation is here as the middle class has been eroded to little more than fucking serfs. However, the voracious appetite for profit leaves people like WF sitting around yelling that businesses need more breaks and the people should get shit on even more in order for the glorious corporations to come save our asses.

[WRESTLINGFAN]

We're finding it out now. Since 1980, no one really has had any money to spend on stupid shit outside of the few bubbles that were created in the 90s and now 00s. Stagnation is here as the middle class has been eroded to little more than fucking serfs. However, the voracious appetite for profit leaves people like WF sitting around yelling that businesses need more breaks and the people should get shit on even more in order for the glorious corporations to come save our asses.

You fail to mention that eventually 51% of the people will have no federal tax obligation so the 49% will have to carry the burden.

Theres no way we can survive being a consumption based economy, but yet the shills in DC still dont get it. We don't make anything here anymore.

[Rhah]

Maybe the top 1% should carry a little more of the burden considering they have 43% of all money in the US (back in 2007, I am sure the gap is even wider now)

http://sociology.ucsc.edu/whorulesamerica/power/images/wealth/Figure_1.gif

[StanUpshaw]

Vote Luddite in 2012?

[Serpico1103]

You fail to mention that eventually 51% of the people will have no federal tax obligation so the 49% will have to carry the burden.

Theres no way we can survive being a consumption based economy, but yet the shills in DC still dont get it. We don't make anything here anymore.

And you proudly produce what?

[WRESTLINGFAN]

And you proudly produce what?

Hard earned tax dollars for the recipient class

[Jujubees2]

Hard earned tax dollars for the recipient class

On behalf of the recipient class, I thank you.

[Dude!]

On behalf of the lazy class, I thank you.

that was nice of you

[Jujubees2]

On behalf of the recipient class, I thank you.

that was nice of you

Now Dude, why'd you have to go and do that?

[Serpico1103]

Nothing.

Fixed.

[WRESTLINGFAN]

Fixed!!!!

And I proudly contribute nada

[Syd]

You fail to mention that eventually 51% of the people will have no federal tax obligation so the 49% will have to carry the burden.

Theres no way we can survive being a consumption based economy, but yet the shills in DC still dont get it. We don't make anything here anymore.

I fail to mention it because I have no idea where those numbers come from, the top 5% ($150k/year household or higher, though its arguably quite higher for these purposes) pays about half the US income tax but they also control roughly half of the wealth of the nation. That's pretty fair, if you put that much strain on society you are obligated to pay that much.

As far as the other numbers though, if 51% of the people have no federal tax obligation that means there are households bringing in up to around $50k/year that don't contribute. Do you know that many illegal immigrants making that much money? Minimum wage is like $15k/year. I know a lot of people that are only bringing in 50/year and I can guarantee they're pretty damn white. You wouldn't even need to ask for their papers.

You might want to re-direct your hate to the ridiculous tax breaks people get instead of simply re-writing the tax code to bring the tax rate down but eliminate exemptions.

[Dude!]

flat-tax, no exemptions
fair to all

[Syd]

flat-tax, no exemptions
fair to all

flat tax isn't fair to all -- you have to spend a great deal more of your income on necessities than someone who makes twice as much as you.

The only time a flat tax is fair is if it is a VAT tax that exempts foodstuffs and other household sundries. I can have WF show up here and talk about how great VATs are. We throw one of those on, we can really start reducing income tax rates. I'd rather get smashed on a TV purpose but have had money used to invest that would have otherwise gone into income taxes.

[Dude!]

flat tax isn't fair to all -- you have to spend a great deal more of your income on necessities than someone who makes twice as much as you.

how do you define fair?

under a flat-tax
someone who has a huge income
might pay $50,000 a year
for police protection
while a person who has
a small income might pay $10
for the same protection

is that fair?

[Syd]

how do you define fair?

under a flat-tax
someone who has a huge income
might pay $50,000 a year
for police protection
while a person who has
a small income might pay $10
for the same protection

is that fair?

Fair is progressive, preferably property taxation or luxury taxation. Income taxes are somewhat regressive, even with tiered tax rates.

And on to the next point:
Why do you think when someone who pays $50k a year has an issue with crime they get preferential treatment compared to someone who pays $10 a year?

[Dude!]

And on to the next point:
Why do you think when someone who pays $50k a year has an issue with crime they get preferential treatment compared to someone who pays $10 a year?

then substitute
"sewer and water"
for "police protection"

no preferential treatment there

and 'progressive'
does not mean 'fair'
you made up that definition

[Syd]

What is your definition of fair then?

[WRESTLINGFAN]

Barack Hussein Obamas DOJ hates white people


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mN67KJdd6Mw&feature=related

Then again Obamas own Words from his book Dreams od My father. "White Mans greed puts the world in need"

The title of the book should have been Dreams of my Father... Who abandoned me


NASAS job is to make Muslims feel good?

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/science/space/7875584/Barack-Obama-Nasa-must-try-to-make-Muslims-feel-good.html

This is a great line
Byron York, a conservative columnist for the Washington Examiner, characterised Mr Obama's space policy shift as moving "from moon landings to promoting self-esteem"

[WRESTLINGFAN]

What is your definition of fair then?

www.fairtax.org

[Syd]

www.fairtax.org

That isn't fair though, it's a flat tax. Flat taxes benefit those at the extreme end of the wealth scale while punishing the middle class and ravaging the lower classes.

[Syd]

And what is fair, to me? Progressive income taxation.

Why should the rich pay more?
Some say, for the same reason reason John Dillinger robbed banks: because that's where the money is. There is some logic to that, the richest 2% control in the ballpark of 40% of the private wealth in the USA. Others say; "Because they can afford it." Others who complain about progressive taxes say it's because people want "revenge on the rich", or it's "class envy". Or they say, "Why should the successful people be penalized?" That is an interesting take on reality.

But there is one argument that is not often seen, the "follow the money", or follow the tax money argument. Simply put, it says you get what you pay for. It says that if you eat a gourmet meal, you have purchased an entire different meal (not just more of it) than for a McDonald's Happy Meal. We claim that progressive taxes buys Rich Boy toys, regressive taxes buy Poor Boy toys. We say fair is fair. To test this idea, we follow the tax money.

Progressive taxes (such as income taxes) pay mostly for Rich Boy toys: Desert Storm, Cold War, gunboat diplomacy, the Fed's infinite labor pool (WANTED: unemployment) and any related poverty, NAFTA, GAT, free trade agreements, interstate freeways, National Parks, FBI, CIA, a hot-shot standing military, etc. And regressive taxes: (mostly local sales taxes and fees) go for Poor Boy toys: local roads, hospitals, schools, local parks, libraries, cops, city/county councils, fire fighting, etc.

If "toys" sounds too flippant, feel free to swap with a term that rings true for you, such as "tools of the trade", or "economic infrastructures."

To oversimplify a bit, a carpenter does not require the Rich Boy toys, and the CEO of GM does not require the Poor Boy toys. And progressive (mostly federal income) taxes soak the rich, regressive (mostly local sales) taxes soak the poor.

So each Boy is largely paying for his own meal.

This guy summed it up rather exactly for me.

[Dude!]

And what is fair, to me? Progressive income taxation.

and under a flat tax
the rich pay more....
much much much more

it is very progressive

[Syd]

and under a flat tax
the rich pay more....
much much much more

it is very progressive

sweet good thing no one has to pay for food or transportation or anything else, just income taxes

[WRESTLINGFAN]

sweet good thing no one has to pay for food or transportation or anything else, just income taxes


under the fairtax necessities like groceries won't be taxed. Plasma TVs will but then again progressives believe TV is a human right

[WRESTLINGFAN]

Eric Holder and BHO 2 pieces of shit. If there wew 2 Klansmen intimidating black voters the gates of hell would have been unleashed on them

[Syd]

under the fairtax necessities like groceries won't be taxed. Plasma TVs will but then again progressives believe TV is a human right

Income is still taxed. There's a minimum amount of money it takes to live and it's easier to infringe upon that minimum amount with a flat tax than with a progressive tax.

[StanUpshaw]

Fairtax™ is a consumption tax, so they could declare food and shit exempt if they wanted to.

[Syd]

So they exempt a certain amount of a person's salary to pay for basic goods? Isn't that admitting progressive taxation is better?

[StanUpshaw]

"Fairtax" and "Flat tax" are two different schemes. Fairtax is essentially just a national sales tax, and you only pay based on what you buy. So if Bill Gates decided to live in his van and eat ramen all day, he'd be paying as much tax as me.

[PapaBear]

I thought Fairtax was where Fez wants to be buried.

[Syd]

I thought the flattaxers usurped fairtax, but if it is a national VAT I am wildly in favor of it so long as it exempts the usual suspects (groceries) as well as transportation costs (vehicle costs, maintenance costs but not gas tax or mass transportation costs)

[hanso]

Doom & gloom = 3 quarter economic growth at 3.5 percent with no inflation.

Service sector growth 6 months running.

Unemployment fell even with census jobs over.

[A.J.]

I thought Fairtax was where Fez wants to be buried.

I thought it was Manass.

[Dude!]

Unemployment fell even with census jobs over.

because 600,000 people
stopped looking for jobs!

yeah, you're right
this economy is rockin'

[WRESTLINGFAN]

because 600,000 people
stopped looking for jobs!

yeah, you're right
this economy is rockin'

And private sector jobs tanked last month

[WRESTLINGFAN]

Welcome to Husseins recovery

http://www.usatoday.com/money/economy/employment/2010-07-06-jobs06_ST_N.htm

I guess we are all wealthy now.

http://finance.yahoo.com/taxes/article/110005/how-the-expiring-bush-tax-cuts-affect-you?mod=taxes-advice_strategy

[high fly]

Doom & gloom = 3 quarter economic growth at 3.5 percent with no inflation.

Service sector growth 6 months running.

Unemployment fell even with census jobs over.

Yep, and notice the righties aren't talking about where the Dow is compared to where it was when Obama took over.
No matter what progress is made, conservatives can be counted on to ignore the good news and dwell on the bad.
Any good economic news for America is bad news for conservatives and they seek to impose their gloomy outlook on others.
No one can look at what they post and fail to conclude they want America to do poorly.
When do we ever see conservatives pleased about economic indicators rising?
Their instinctive reaction is to find the worst aspects they can because good news for America is bad news for conservatives.

The nightmare for conservatives continues as Warren Buffet says he sees a recovery and says we are on the right course (http://news.yahoo.com/s/yblog_upshot/20100708/bs_yblog_upshot/buffett-we--re-coming-back-no-question-in-my-mind)

[WRESTLINGFAN]

Yep, and notice the righties aren't talking about where the Dow is compared to where it was when Obama took over.
No matter what progress is made, conservatives can be counted on to ignore the good news and dwell on the bad.
Any good economic news for America is bad news for conservatives and they seek to impose their gloomy outlook on others.
No one can look at what they post and fail to conclude they want America to do poorly.
When do we ever see conservatives pleased about economic indicators rising?
Their instinctive reaction is to find the worst aspects they can because good news for America is bad news for conservatives.

The nightmare for conservatives continues as Warren Buffet says he sees a recovery and says we are on the right course (http://news.yahoo.com/s/yblog_upshot/20100708/bs_yblog_upshot/buffett-we--re-coming-back-no-question-in-my-mind)


Wild fluctuatios of the stock market is a sign of an unstable economy. Before yesterday the dow shed about 600 points since the end of June

This economy is in the tank and still tanking. This isn't about wanting America to fail. Jimmy Buffet has more credibility than Warren Buffet

Things aren't turning around, they will not get better any time soon

http://www.youtube.com/user/geraldcelentechannel?blend=1&ob=4#p/u/0/aeiqLubw78o

[Crispy123]

Wild fluctuatios of the stock market is a sign of an unstable economy. Before yesterday the dow shed about 600 points since the end of June

This economy is in the tank and still tanking. This isn't about wanting America to fail. Jimmy Buffet has more credibility than Warren Buffet

Things aren't turning around, they will not get better any time soon

http://www.youtube.com/user/geraldcelentechannel?blend=1&ob=4#p/u/0/aeiqLubw78o

Thanks Bush and the GOP!!!!

[WRESTLINGFAN]

Thanks Bush and the GOP!!!!

Hussein and the Dems are continuing stupidity. We have ourselves a 3rd Bush Term

[Serpico1103]

Hussein and the Dems are continuing stupidity

I can't want until the constitutionalists and libertarians take over. All my problems will be solved.

[WRESTLINGFAN]

I can't want until the constitutionalists and libertarians take over. All my problems will be solved.

You will have your civil liberties back and there wont be troops in Iraq/Afghanistan

Cindy Sheehan is still protesting against the wars and has been critical of Hussein but you hardly hear a peep in the news about her. Now that Hussein is Commander in Chief, nothing out of the watercarriers like Matthews, Olbermann, Williams, Couric and others

[Crispy123]

Just dont have the nerve to get yourself raped or want to go to school.

[WRESTLINGFAN]

The economy is on solid ground. Hussein saved the day. HAAAAAAAA


http://www.youtube.com/user/schiffreport?blend=1&ob=4#p/a/u/2/olqXGmr_LUU

[high fly]

Yep, and notice the righties aren't talking about where the Dow is compared to where it was when Obama took over.
No matter what progress is made, conservatives can be counted on to ignore the good news and dwell on the bad.
Any good economic news for America is bad news for conservatives and they seek to impose their gloomy outlook on others.
No one can look at what they post and fail to conclude they want America to do poorly.
When do we ever see conservatives pleased about economic indicators rising?
Their instinctive reaction is to find the worst aspects they can because good news for America is bad news for conservatives.

The nightmare for conservatives continues as Warren Buffet says he sees a recovery and says we are on the right course (http://news.yahoo.com/s/yblog_upshot/20100708/bs_yblog_upshot/buffett-we--re-coming-back-no-question-in-my-mind)


.................................................. ...........like I said.............................

[WRESTLINGFAN]

Why are we still in Afghanistan? There is no strategy, not enough troops and a virtually unwinnable situation. Thats not rooting for America to fail at all

Haven't we learned our lessons about nation building? The Afghans do not want a modern society.

Why does the patriot act keep being renewed for 8 years we heard that Bush was shredding the constitution and he was at fault with that. Obama extends it not a peep.

[Crispy123]

There have been protests going on since the Patriot Act was voted in. They are particularly notable on and around 9/11 every year.

President Obama has not been the agent of change that he campaigned on and I think everyone is in agreement on that one, but he is a politician so what do you expect?

I also think that everyone but the GOP or rascist Tea Partiers (yes I know this is redundant) will admit he is infinitley better than GWB.

[WRESTLINGFAN]

There have been protests going on since the Patriot Act was voted in. They are particularly notable on and around 9/11 every year.

President Obama has not been the agent of change that he campaigned on and I think everyone is in agreement on that one, but he is a politician so what do you expect?

I also think that everyone but the GOP or rascist Tea Partiers (yes I know this is redundant) will admit he is infinitley better than GWB.

In many ways he is just like dubya. Supported TARP, Continuing wars, trashing the constitution by not honoring bankrputcy laws and screwing over Chrysler bondholders while rewarding the UAW, A huge bloated spending spree, Open borders and pushing Amnesty. Everyone was worried that if McCain was elected it would be a 3rd Bush term, but that honor goes to BHO

[Serpico1103]

You will have your civil liberties back and there wont be troops in Iraq/Afghanistan

Cindy Sheehan is still protesting against the wars and has been critical of Hussein but you hardly hear a peep in the news about her. Now that Hussein is Commander in Chief, nothing out of the watercarriers like Matthews, Olbermann, Williams, Couric and others

Unless you want to labeled and treated as a wacko, why don't you call him "Obama?"

Or, do you want to be treated as a wacko, so you can then claim victimization?

Did you call GWB, "Walker?"

Being right or wrong isn't the only thing that matters in a debate, it is how you express it, and whether you allow the other side to accept your position without making them feel stupid.

[WRESTLINGFAN]

Things are really looking bright. I wonder if the suits on CNBC will be reporting about this


http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2010/jul/7/us-marks-3rd-largest-single-day-debt-boost/

A few key warning signs in that report

Daily debt calculations jump and fall, and big shifts are common. But all three of the biggest one-day debt increases have occurred under the tenure of President Obama, and all of the top six have been in the past two years - an indication of just how quickly the pace of deficit spending has risen under Mr. Obama and President George W. Bush.

"What matters is the overall trend line, and the overall trend line is shooting up," said Robert Bixby, executive director of the Concord Coalition, a bipartisan deficit watchdog group, who said it is one more reason for a fiscal wake-up call.

[Syd]

Yeah, pretty surprising two wars and idiotic tax cuts are leaving the country in debt.

[WRESTLINGFAN]

Yeah, pretty surprising two wars and idiotic tax cuts are leaving the country in debt.

Was that 787 billion dollars for the phony stimulus from his secret stash or pulled out of his ass?

[WRESTLINGFAN]

LeBron just gave Obama a big F.U. by not going to the Bulls:thumbup:


I can hear Robert Gibbs tomorrow and blame it on the past 8 years of the Bush admin.

Obama should stick to shredding the constitution, making the economy worse and continuing an unnecassary war

[Syd]

Was that 787 billion dollars for the phony stimulus from his secret stash or pulled out of his ass?

stimulus money goes back into the economy, war money goes directly into other countries via explosives